NY 142: Rolling in the Deep, WAIT WAT? PARTY OVER?!

[Slandaar]

@Slandaar: How is that "calling myself Town"? Town scumhunts, Scum scumhunts, even third party scumhunts. The only people that don't are people too wrapped up in themselves to do it.

Scum dont scumhunt, they pretend to scumhunt, you cant genuinely scumhunt when you know who the scum are already.

Scumhunting implies town.

[Beck]

So zelink deciding before game even began he wanted to lynch me on day 1 is fine, but me doing the same to him is scummy? Some quality contradictions there.

If his was page 1/2 than no, but when it's page 6/7 and he has votes on him already, than yes it's a tad scummy.

How is that a contradiction? His was obvious rvs, you missed rvs, its not the same.

@ pine, I'm attacking your play this game, not you as a person or based on my previous experience of you. Your play thus far is deserving of pressure. But I'll hold you to that, you can attack my play all day long, I can defend my playstyle. I can't defend adhom.

I'd like to know why you think aggressive play is scummy? I'd also like you to provide an example of how I have been distracting like you accused me of.

[Beck]

Ebwop, if it was page 1/2*

[Beck]

@Slandaar: How is that "calling myself Town"? Town scumhunts, Scum scumhunts, even third party scumhunts. The only people that don't are people too wrapped up in themselves to do it.

Scum dont scumhunt, they pretend to scumhunt, you cant genuinely scumhunt when you know who the scum are already.

Scumhunting implies town.

And this pretty much sums up pine's play, it is also how zde and revenous are playing too

Now if these 3 are all scum, I swear I'll die laughing but I honestly don't think all 3 would be THAT obvious. That being said, pressure on any if these 3 are acceptable for now

[DavidParker]

i'm quickly reminded why i don't enjoy these games and stopped playing them. People talking so much bollocks and they actually believe they are making sense. Oh dear.

[Pine]

Overly and unduly aggressive play can be seen in a scummy light, as it can be indicative of overcompensation; at this point of the game there's jack all that is solid enough to go after with the aggression you've shown.

I'm interested in a truce here, Beck. Your case on me is crap, as is mine on you. Both are fueled primarily from irritation and OMGUS, and picking every little thing an antagonist says apart. We're wasting a lot of time on each other, and playing right into the "but you're only focusing on me" argument. Walk away from your antagonism against me, and come back to it in a day or so. It doesn't really hold water. I fully intend to heed my own advice in this matter.

@Slandaar: How is that "calling myself Town"? Town scumhunts, Scum scumhunts, even third party scumhunts. The only people that don't are people too wrapped up in themselves to do it.

Scum dont scumhunt, they pretend to scumhunt, you cant genuinely scumhunt when you know who the scum are already.

Scumhunting implies town.

This is WIFOM. The above quote damns me in either direction; on one hand I could respond directly and explain how I feel I've been scumhunting, implying (not outright stating) that I am Town, and you "catch me" labeling myself again. On the other, I deny the tacit accusation, and "admit" to not scumhunting. This is an example of early confirmation bias on your part; you've already decided how you want to view me, so you don't actually engage in argument and investigation, you just blather seemingly-clever lines like the above and then go "Aha!"

Also, scum DO "scum"hunt. Speaking from plentiful experience as a member of mafias past, in these large games, the number one concern on their minds is hunting for slips and evidence of third party threats, an opposing team, and Town PRs. If you're going to try to claim that wise scum just sit back and observe, you're just flat out wrong. Good scum are hunting just the same as Town, and they're looking for many of the same things. They damn well don't "pretend" until they see flips confirming them to be in the clear. Which certainly doesn't happen on D1.

[Beck]

1. sure agressive play can be seen in a scummy light, but so can passive play, and you already know I am an agressive player based on the game where we played together, and you can look at all of my completed games and see i am agressive both as town and as scum. it's my playstyle so an attack on my agression is an attack on my playstyle which is un-warranted and un-necessary.

2. this is the second time you have accused me of being agressive, yet when I ask you to provide examples of my agressive play you don't post them, nor have you posted examples of my distracting play which you have accused me of also.

3. a true implies I am attacking you based on the previous game, which you have admitted is the reason for your attack on me, but I have said it isn't the reason for my attack on you. My attack(It isn't even an attak, it's pressure) on you is based on your lack of content and usefulness THIS GAME. If my case is crap like you say, explain why it is crap instead of trying to discredit it by saying it is fueled by irritation and omgus, because it isn't.

if my case is crap, please explain the following items
1. why do you originally say the case on zde is weak but than later say his actions were "suspicious" (your word not mine)? if his actions were suspicius, the wagon on zde would be justified right? you pressure suspicious people which is what that wagon was doing

2. You basically say "look at me I am scum hunting cause i am focusing on other people" but the person you were focusing on was somebody you just said committed a town slip and you don't think he is scum. How is this an example of you scum hunting and how does it prove your point?

3. I still woudl like you to post, at least 1 (more would be better) of you scum hunting


the problem I have with you pine is i keep asking you for info and you keep retreating saying i am attacking you for the same reasons you are attacking me, I have no previous biased towards you because you were scum in that other game and you won, your play was clearly better than mine.

my case on you may not be rock solid, but it certainly isn't "crap" (again your word, not mine)

If your next 3 posts don't contain the information I am asking of you, I will strongly urge you be lynched today because right now in my mind you look like caught scum and no my case isn't crap, neither of my cases have been crap.

[Beck]

ebwop - should be truce not true for number 3

[Beck]

God, imagine if I wasn't on v/la

I retract my v/la, I'm able to access on my phone so I'm fine

And here is a shout out to revenous

IM OBV TOWN
IM OBV TOWN

Please explain why you find this scummy?

[Pine]

The case was (and is) crap, because it was poorly explained. When elaborated upon, I saw what was being pointed out, and the actions were suspicious. The two statements are not mutually exclusive.

An example of undue aggression? The way you keep hammering at me again and again without changing your rhetoric or making any attempt to have a two-sided conversation. Please stop flooding the thread with the same things over and over again. I will concede any remaining points you have against me, and leave it to the other twenty players to decide. Let's move on.

[Slandaar]

I have never played a game with a 3rd party in a game so take that as you will.

Why did you feel the need to consider every option to choose your response? do you fear the response you give will out yourself?

You could have just responded with the second paragraph

This is WIFOM. The above quote damns me in either direction; on one hand I could respond directly and explain how I feel I've been scumhunting, implying (not outright stating) that I am Town, and you "catch me" labeling myself again. On the other, I deny the tacit accusation, and "admit" to not scumhunting. This is an example of early confirmation bias on your part; you've already decided how you want to view me, so you don't actually engage in argument and investigation, you just blather seemingly-clever lines like the above and then go "Aha!"

Now, heres the thing, I never asked him a question, there was never any WIFOM, there was never any need to answer as he is saying he could have. I stated the way he implied he was town was scummy, he asked how he did, i explained and now hes saying that its WIFOM because he is damned whatever he says. Well thats not the point, he is 'damned' (this is highly exaggerated at the time I was viewing him as slight scum read) because he did something I find scummy.

lets look at his examples

'I could respond directly and explain how I feel I've been scumhunting, implying (not outright stating) that I am Town'
Why would someone respond like this to my post? it makes no sense. Why does he feel the need to convince me hes town ?

'On the other, I deny the tacit accusation, and "admit" to not scumhunting.'
Again, why does he feel the need to respond like this? What was he responding to exactly?

PINE WAS LOOKING FOR A WAY TO GET ME TO THINK HE IS TOWN BUT COULD NOT FIND ONE!

Pine also was on zel for terribad reasoning, he needs to go here.

UNVOTE: theamatuer
VOTE: Pine

[Slandaar]

IM OBV TOWN

This is my read on beck

[Beck]

The case was (and is) crap, because it was poorly explained. When elaborated upon, I saw what was being pointed out, and the actions were suspicious. The two statements are not mutually exclusive.

An example of undue aggression? The way you keep hammering at me again and again without changing your rhetoric or making any attempt to have a two-sided conversation. Please stop flooding the thread with the same things over and over again. I will concede any remaining points you have against me, and leave it to the other twenty players to decide. Let's move on.

Asking you to provide evidence of your accusations against me is aggressive?

Asking you to respond to my requests to explain your reasonings for your posts is aggressive?

Than yes I'm aggressive, and you STILL ignore my requests. if you are town, why are you not willing to explain your actions?

I'm fine letting the other 20 people decide, unless something better pops up, I'm keeping my vote on you. From a town mentality, your play doesn't make sense.

We also have a shut load of people who need to post, and others who need to post content and not nonsensical horseshit (shattered this means you)

[Beck]

Slander, I still don't get your reasons for your amateur vote, can you explain better why you were pushing on him earlier and your thoughts of him currently.

[theamatuer]

One of beck/pine is probably scum. Of course, considering Beck's record, he's probably caught another townie again >.>
Also David? You'd probably find a lot of similarities with rev.

[Revenus]

I think beck and pine are both town personally.

[Revenus]

God, imagine if I wasn't on v/la

I retract my v/la, I'm able to access on my phone so I'm fine

And here is a shout out to revenous

IM OBV TOWN
IM OBV TOWN

Please explain why you find this scummy?

I told him I was going to vote him if he kept taunting me.


I don't actually think that's enough to indict him as scum, but I had to oblige him when he was asking for my vote. It will be moved off once I see someone I REALLY want to place my vote on. Also, I don't know why you keep putting an "o" in my username.


Would like to hear more from the more inactive players at the moment.

[Revenus]

For example, you guys are all trying to scumhunt to various degrees. Whereas people like iamausername have posted merely fluff like this

Post Post #15 (isolation #1) » Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:37 pm
ZeL1nk, how am I going to tell the difference between you and Zdenek?

Zdenek, same question.

[Revenus]

Or we have funkybike1, who in this case has skipped the "posting fluff" stage and is merely randomly throwing down votes

[Slandaar]

Slander, I still don't get your reasons for your amateur vote, can you explain better why you were pushing on him earlier and your thoughts of him currently.

I dunno how I can explain it better than I did previously, he hasnt really looked townier since, his last post isnt too good either so hes still slightly scummy to me.

Pine is the better vote right now.

[Slandaar]

One of beck/pine is probably scum. Of course, considering Beck's record, he's probably caught another townie again >.>

Explain why please

[Slandaar]

Revenus, do you find anyone scummy right now?

[Revenus]

Slandaar, Pine is not a good vote. I've been on a similar wavelength as him, and so I thnk that makes him town. He's a bad direction to pursue at least for day 1.


and to

Revenus, do you find anyone scummy right now?

.


I don't have "great" day ones, and generally I don't find town has a good track record for lynching scum day one, so I like to sit back and wait until later in the day to see all the less actives post and whatnot.

By "great" i mean I don't usually nail scum on day 1, and my reads drastically improve on day 2 when I'm able to go back and read flips and whatnot.



I find you, Pine, and Beck all pretty town in my eyes. I'd like to pursue some of the players (re:half) who have around 2-3 posts a piece, most of which don't have content.


If you want me to throw out names for the sake of throwing out names, maybe Bvoigt, iam, and funkybike.


Honestly, the inactives are going to have to post more.

[Beck]

One of beck/pine is probably scum. Of course, considering Beck's record, he's probably caught another townie again >.>
Also David? You'd probably find a lot of similarities with rev.

I can't help when towies do scummy things, if pine is town, that's on him, not me

But you have been quieter than normal, what do you have to add?

If You or somebody wants to point out how I'm wrong, I'm all ears. If pine isn't scum, somebody tell me why, since pine doesn't seem interested in doing it himself.

[Beck]

Revenous, what are your thoughts of salander?