Mini320: Urban Legends Mafia is over!

[broomhead]

but heres the thing, if the cop chooses people at random(yes, i know he doesn't) then that one

random

person will be confirmed innocent. then mafia will

not

choose a random person, they will choose the person the cop picked, then kill him. so in essence the mafia still kill a random person. but that argument is only saying that there is no downside to revealing innocents.

the upsides are good:

1) with the more innocents the town has, the less chance of a misguided bandwagon.

2)with more proven innocents, there may come a time where there are more confirmed, then un-confirmed. thus ending in a win(assuming no wrong confirmed.***)

3) the doc(i know we've got a doc, i have full confidence that is was a protection, and not a roleblock. ****). like i was saying, the doc can choose to take chances and try and outguess the mafia to stop their kill, or can just go the safe route(i recommend) and protect the cop. the cop is extremely vital to this plan.



oh and vismajor, maybe we just can understand each other, but when you quoted me and said:

I said:

the way i see it, the more innocents we get the better. then we can just kill off the non-proven people and win the game

then you said,

This is exactly why.

the way i understand it is that you didn't want the innocents revealed. i did. so when you say, "this is exactly why" it says to me that it makes it harder for the mafia, so we shouldn't do it.




***i feel the cop is proven sane, unless its a HUGE cover up witch at this point there are too many people involved to be a cover up.

****oh and don't get all over excited that i said i know we have a doc. its apparent to me through discussion that we do. and i'd prefer not to say anymore. this is no way constitutes that i claim or not claim doc, and try not to read so far into the doc comment that it gets out of hand

[VisMaior]

NOno, lets assume a theroretical situation.

1. cop always reveals innocents. Mafia always kills the innocents the cop pikced. We have at any time at most 1 confirmed innocent.

2.cop does not reveal innocents, only if necessary (eg. an innocent is about to strung up, or the doc dies)
Mafia cant surely pick the same target who got innocent. We could end up with multiple confirmed innocents. In worst case we are at the same situation as 1. But that is very unlikely.

So multiple confirmed innocents > 1 confirmed innocent. Thus, requesting instantly revealing innocents is an antitown move.

[Der Hammer]

Vote: VisMaior

Let the wagon proceed.

Unvote, Vote:Sentinel999

I feel uneasy about this post....

Very quick to vote on someone who was gathering a few votes.

[bluesoul]

I was too, but he's a Mason. I didn't want to look, well, like scum by voting a mason.

[broomhead]

NOno, lets assume a theroretical situation.

1. cop always reveals innocents. Mafia always kills the innocents the cop pikced. We have at any time at most 1 confirmed innocent.

2.cop does not reveal innocents, only if necessary (eg. an innocent is about to strung up, or the doc dies)
Mafia cant surely pick the same target who got innocent. We could end up with multiple confirmed innocents. In worst case we are at the same situation as 1. But that is very unlikely.

So multiple confirmed innocents > 1 confirmed innocent. Thus, requesting instantly revealing innocents is an antitown move.

according to #2 there are no benefits of withholding innocents.

and as i said, we can play doc games if the doc is confident enough, but the cop is so important.


this argument on innocents is going no where. and the cop hasn't even weighed in on it. he's heard both our arguments lets let him decide.

[VisMaior]

according to #2 there are no benefits of withholding innocents.

Gah! What? Having more confirmed innocents is no benefit? What is the benefit of #1 then? Are you reading what I wrote at all?

this argument on innocents is going no where

backing out eh? Is the debate not going the way you wish it did? You look scummyer by the minute.

[VisMaior]

In fact,

unvote, vote Broomhead

. You are either very dense, or plainly scum.

[Sentinel99]

Curses. Teaches me to think I'm invincible. That "wagon jumping post" was me pretty much screwing around. I do think that Vis seems a little scummy, but I can't really back it. Brizzy voted him, and I was feeling inclined to follow the cop at the time. All in all I'm happy with my vote placement.

[bluesoul]

Curses. Teaches me to think I'm invincible. That "wagon jumping post" was me pretty much screwing around. I do think that Vis seems a little scummy, but I can't really back it. Brizzy voted him, and I was feeling inclined to follow the cop at the time. All in all I'm happy with my vote placement.

The cop is not infallible. As a matter of fact, he got an innocent result. Blindly following someone else is good enough to merit a

Unvote, Vote Sentinel99

in my book. You're pushing awfully hard for someone that only has a dead guy to back you up.

[Osloboditelj]

If Sentinel wasn't relatively new and likely to be a mason considering his play, I'd definitely vote him for that incredibly dense couple of posts. Still, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt for the moment.

Broomhead's post 150 is possibly the scummiest thing I've seen in this thread, though. Ignoring the possibility of an investigationimmune GF? Ignoring the fact that any confirmed innocent (especially a power role like HIAB) is an instant target for scum? Ignoring the fact that, if a cop holds his innocents until they're almost lynched, we can look at who pushed hard against that person to possibly find scum? Claiming to know there's a doc but then being ambiguous on the insinuation that he's the doc? Then (Post 154) arguing completely backward? ugh.

Vote: Broomhead

.

[Yosarian2]

Yeah, Broomhead is pretty clearly wrong here.

Still, at the moment, the most suspicious thing I've seen is the way Bluesoul has been jumping back and forth on the audacesiuvat issue all day, contradicting himself at least once, so I think I'll keep my vote there for the moment.

[bluesoul]

Yeah, Broomhead is pretty clearly wrong here.

Still, at the moment, the most suspicious thing I've seen is the way Bluesoul has been jumping back and forth on the audacesiuvat issue all day, contradicting himself at least once, so I think I'll keep my vote there for the moment.

I made myself look pretty bad, it's true. I've gotten so confused on that issue that I'm pretty much ignoring it for now.

Osloboditelj (good lord, what's with these names?) makes a good case against Broomhead, though. Can we get a

Vote Count

, please?

[Sentinel99]

Unvote, Vote bluesoul

[broomhead]

fine, i can see that everyone else wants the results held as well. touche.

[Yosarian2]

fine, i can see that everyone else wants the results held as well. touche.

Basically,I've seen more then one of these minis get won by the town simply because of a cofirmed cop and two or three other confirmed innocents, all revealed at once, at a point when they together form enough of a pro-town voting block so that the town can not lose. So, I generally think it's best to hold back innocent results so long as is practical. There are exceptions, but I don't see how this is one of them right now.

[BrizzyBoi]

I now see the merits of withholding innocent investigations, and will only reveal guilty results unless absolutely necessary.

I can see why Broomhead could want them revealed, but after VisMaior's counter opinion, I can see why those reasons could easily be present in a scum player.

Unvote: VisMaior

However, something still doesn't sit right with me about Sentinel and hasn't for a long time, so I believe it is time to upgrade my FOS: Sentinel99 to a

Vote: Sentinel99

[broomhead]

wait, people, unless i am mistaken, a dead mason confirmed him as his counter mason? am i thinking of someone else? i mean its hard to be more confirmed. i think he's just a townie that thinks too much of himself

[bluesoul]

He claims to be the mason of the dead Farmer. We've got no confirmation from the deceased aside from some breadcrumbing. I still don't like his attitude in game.

[Drummer]

Sorry everyone, I had finals to worry over. But now they're done!

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

VisMaior--1(broomhead)

Sentinel99--4(help im a bug, Der Hammer, bluesoul, BrizzyBoi)

broomhead--1(VisMaior)
bluesoul--1(Sentinel99)

Not voting--3(Yosarian, Osloboditelj, audacesiuvat)

With ten alive, it's six to lynch.

MOD NOTE: ALERT ME TO ANY ERRORS IN THIS VOTECOUNT. SOMETHINGS SEEMS OFF TO ME.

[broomhead]

well just because you don't like him, i think the breadcrumming was pretty solid. voting for a pretty much confirmed role like that is extremely scummy and stupid at the same time! i mean its only 2 more to kill him! and as far as i am concerned, he's innocent!

[help im a bug]

unvote

[BrizzyBoi]

Just some random thoughts about who to lynch today -

Alright after rereading, Sentinel99 has defended Stikey from the start, couple this with the breadcrumbing and I now firmly believe that Sentinel99 is the mason he claimed and pro town.

UnVote: Sentinel99

Audacesiuvat is getting tested tonight over his postman type ability so I don't think that he is the play for today.

I'd like to think that I am off the suspect list

HIAB has been named innocent by my investigations, that is enough for me to take him off my suspect list.

VisMaior seems to have the towns best interests at heart and with nothing else to go on, I am going to

Vote: Broomhead

for so vehemently disagreeing with VisMaior.

That is all I can surmise at the moment, anyone elsehave any other insights?

[help im a bug]

I don't know, I just feel confused at the moment. I'm going to clear my head then take a reread.

[bluesoul]

Unvote, Vote Broomhead

Perhaps Sentinel is protown but his playstyle is just awful in this game, to the point of distracting the town. Broomhead is my most suspect after Sentinel due to sheer wrongheadedness so I don't have any problems with moving the vote from here to there.

[VisMaior]

I think sentinel is solid. The "breadcrumbing" is actually quiet impressive. (What I dont get why had sentinel not breadcrumbed stickey? Ah well. )

FOS bluesoul

I feel he is wishy-washy in his voting pattern.