Meadow of Sorrow Mafia - Game Over! Town Wins

[Skruffs]

I thought that the ashes were part of an innate part of someone's state; I guess I didn't look closely enough, since Primate was "cleared" on both levels. The beginning flavor text has the reverend incinerating his own mother, and since the reverend was killed night two, that kind of explains the non-ashes from the last night.
I'm guessing maybe ... the reverend was an SK, CPE was a vig, different kill styles, different motives. This might seem obvious to all of you but... I just wanted to kinda 'correct' what I see as an oversight in Zindaras' thing on Nixon up there.


Hey Thesp... I think Fritzler claimed. You said you would explain STDs alignment after he claimed, and I think knowing his real alignement would be pretty pro town since it will help us figure out more about the vigs and how and such. You're an admitted vote thief so while that's not inherently scummy my guess is that you are a criminal of some sort.. for someone who both wields twice as much power as everyone else and has the ability to prevent someone from having the power to vote, which is all that some people have, you seem to wield it pretty flippantly.

[Zindaras]

I don't get.

I'm doing this a bit from memory, but if I'm correct, you've claimed to have done something with the whole Damned Aligned thing, and something with Cop immunity, and whatnot. I don't get it. At all.

Don't worry. You aren't correct.
I claim to have given Fritzler protection from investigations. That's all.
I gave it to for two reasons:
1. So I could see that my ability worked as specified. At least Fritzler says he got it.
2. So I could be confirmed. I know it doesn't say anything about my alignment, but at least you know that I'm no regular scum (or townie).

The reason I gave it to Fritzler of all people is that he was already investigated by CPE and would probably not be targetted again by an investigation.

Have you claimed all your abilities? I'd like to see it all in a nicely wrapped package, as I can't put my finger on it this way.

wait, why are the crimminals related to the church?

Well this was TSQ's role:

7. Thestatusquo killed Night 2
Church Findings: Reverend, Town Aligned
Investigation Findings: Murderer, Criminal Aligned

Also, here's some more evidence against Fritz:

WAIT WAIT. Let me get rid of some confusion. When I use my cop, if they are scum

to the church

they turn into a pile of ash (STD). Thats where the kill came from. Right now, I doubt they are the same ashes, as I inspected Fritz N0, not primate

Emphasis mine.

If Fritz is a Criminal, which I do think he is, he would not have been killed by creampuffeater.

[Zindaras]

I'm guessing maybe ... the reverend was an SK, CPE was a vig, different kill styles, different motives. This might seem obvious to all of you but... I just wanted to kinda 'correct' what I see as an oversight in Zindaras' thing on Nixon up there.

No. You see, the problem with that is that it completely breaks the symmetry of the game.

Look at it. It's delicious symmetry. The church finds the Satanics as scum, and the Criminals as town. The Police finds the Satanics as town, and the Criminals as scum.

And if TSQ was a Serial Killer, then we should be getting fewer kills, which we aren't getting (the crucifixion kill may be gone, but since TSQ was also churchy, he couldn't be the crucifier).

[Skruffs]

You are right, I am still rereading and just piecing together what I have read (so far) and what is going on currently.
Thank you for showing me that about CPE.
I still think the reverend was an SK that incinerated people. There was no crucification, and there was no

ashes

. That's two forms of killing that were not included. That doesn't mean those killers are dead, it's just something to note.

[Zindaras]

You are right, I am still rereading and just piecing together what I have read (so far) and what is going on currently.
Thank you for showing me that about CPE.
I still think the reverend was an SK that incinerated people. There was no crucification, and there was no

ashes

. That's two forms of killing that were not included. That doesn't mean those killers are dead, it's just something to note.

cpe claimed to have been the source of the ashes.

[Fritzler]

Well this was TSQ's role:

7. Thestatusquo killed Night 2
Church Findings: Reverend, Town Aligned
Investigation Findings: Murderer, Criminal Aligned

then it would make perfect sense that crimminals would crucify if they're in charge of the church

and then there's scum that are against the church, the damned zombies or w/e

[Skruffs]

But the mod said the ashes weren't connected; and CPE had no reason to lie about who he investigated on one night, especially since he was a Good paladin. Would he?

[spectrumvoid]

I'm currently wondering whether there's a particular reason as to why some dead people have different results from different groups, while CPE shows up as town both ways. Any ideas?

[Zindaras]

I'm currently wondering whether there's a particular reason as to why some dead people have different results from different groups, while CPE shows up as town both ways. Any ideas?

Because he wasn't scum. Everyone sees town as town. Criminals are seen as town by Church and scum by Police. Satanic are seen as scum by Church and town by Police.

The only thing that doesn't fit in here is that damned (gawd, horrible pun) StD.

[Fritzler]

i told you, you show up damned if you're lynched while you take the extra cop results

take that into account after i die

[Thesp]

Investigation immunity might not be the most townly ability to give away, but there is a reason that will be appearant later.

I think you'd better make it apparent now. Let's see...

Don't worry. You aren't correct.
I claim to have given Fritzler protection from investigations. That's all.
I gave it to for two reasons:
1. So I could see that my ability worked as specified. At least Fritzler says he got it.
2. So I could be confirmed. I know it doesn't say anything about my alignment, but at least you know that I'm no regular scum (or townie).

The reason I gave it to Fritzler of all people is that he was already investigated by CPE and would probably not be targetted again by an investigation.

What...the...frick.

This

is the reason that would later be apparent? I don't see it.

FOS: dahen.

He's next.

Hey Thesp... I think Fritzler claimed. You said you would explain STDs alignment after he claimed, and I think knowing his real alignement would be pretty pro town since it will help us figure out more about the vigs and how and such. You're an admitted vote thief so while that's not inherently scummy my guess is that you are a criminal of some sort.. for someone who both wields twice as much power as everyone else and has the ability to prevent someone from having the power to vote, which is all that some people have, you seem to wield it pretty flippantly.

I am a pirate, and I rob people of their stuff. I steal night abilities, though some I can't steal. (I expect this is primarily with scum.) I would expect to be able to steal a vig's ability. Sometimes, with people with no night ability, I steal votes. I stole from Fritzler N0, Toaster Strudel N1, and Thok N2. I got nothing from Fritzler (!), a vote from Toaster Strudel on N1, and the coroner's ability from Thok on N2. I investigated STD, and I discovered he was town aligned, not Damned-aligned. I think the Damned-aligned bit is some scum ability playing with alignments. That makes me even more suspicious of dahen.

In short, I think Fritzler is scum because I think its likely I would have taken a vig ability from him if he was townie vig. I think dahen is scum because of some ofhis speculation, the fact that he even used his role, and that I think there is some alignment-playing going on.

[Zindaras]

dahen's role is waaaay out there.

But, seriously, Fritzler's the play.

[klebian]

I think you're the play, zindie.

[klebian]

(but i bet fritz would be a good play too)

[Zindaras]

Reasons or arguments would help, deary.

[Skruffs]

Ahhhh!
You make sense there Zindie
To: Police Church
Town Good Good
Crim. Bad Good
Satan Good Bad
Damned Bad Bad
That's symmetrical

My question now, is, do ALL the people who might show up bad to the police or the church have to eb exterminated? or *just* the evil evil group... if it's just the evil evil group and the game ends with them being destroyed (since I'm assumign the criminals were in town before this happened, and the people the church didn't like, etc). If this is a three way 'gang war' than I'm... scared. Really, really, scared.

[Zindaras]

I think that everyone who shows up as scum is scum and we need to kill them all. To assume that one of those groups is faux and the mod's lying to us would not be a good idea if that group suddenly turns out to be real and killing us.

[Skruffs]

I completely agree. I guess I was just being hopeful. I wasn't trying to say that some scum groups shouldn't be gone after, I was just wondering if the goal is to eliminate everyone who is a scum to everyone or just the group that came from the mines.

[Fritzler]

zindaras: do you think there is a vig in this game that can kill members of whatever group you think i belong to?

[Zindaras]

zindaras: do you think there is a vig in this game that can kill members of whatever group you think i belong to?

I believe there are anti-Criminal roles, yes. Either that or there are more Satanics than Criminals. There's a balancing factor in there somewhere, is my guess. The symmetry doesn't have to go up for the entire game.

[Fritzler]

zindaras: do you think there is a vig in this game that can kill members of whatever group you think i belong to?

I believe there are anti-Criminal roles, yes. Either that or there are more Satanics than Criminals. There's a balancing factor in there somewhere, is my guess. The symmetry doesn't have to go up for the entire game.

well, if there's a vig that can kill crimminals, won't they kill me tonight if im not killed?

[Zindaras]

That's not really an argument not to lynch you. That goes from the assumption that there is another vig, which we do not know, and that you don't have some silly godfather role, which, again, we do not know. Also, that would mean that vig is unable to vig other scum during the night.

[dahen]

Dahen: I was wondering why you decided to claim today, when I don't think you were under suspicion.

What is so hard to get? Fritz was getting votes. I wanted to see for myself (and yourselves) if my ability worked and. And that would be impossible when (if) Fritz was lynched.

There is always a down-side to reveal role information, but since I believe that more powerful roles claimed before this, I felt that it wasn't so bad after all.

Note that this is no full claim from me, and I intend so such thing. As SV said, I'm not (at least wasn't) a supsect. Note that I gave Fritz the option of keeping the effect of my gift a secret.

No-one has yet commented my post regarding Primate's ashing. I feel like there's a lot of posting but lack of reading at the moment. I don't think Fritz is the play today. Feel free to speculate in me being scum with him.

Thesp - a question for you: Since you are a pirate, do you have a feeling of turning up not-completely-innocent on investigations?

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

I think Fritz should be hammered.

[dahen]

I think that everyone who shows up as scum is scum

We know for a fact (by mod) that satanics are mafia-like scum. We don't know for a fact that those who are investigated by church as satanic are satanic. Maybe this is what you intend to say. Otherwise, this sentence doesn't say much, since no-one has shown up as scum.

I would like you to consider the fact that Thesp might show up as a criminal, since it's quite logical that pirates are considered criminals by the police. However, that doesn't mean that he is scum.

I'm actually wondering if this is a game of prejudice. That the church believes some to be satanic just because they are no believers, and that the police believes some to be killers just because they don't always follow the law.

This would of course require some roles to compensate for the confusion.
I want to hear if someone have had similar doubts before I continue this theory.