Open 11 - Pie C9 (Game over) - before 400

[bird1111]

ChannelDelibird, unvoting isn't required

Vote Count:

ChannelDelibird (2): Shadowlurker, Patrick
Patrick (1): Twito
Fircoal (1): ChannelDelibird

Not Voting: Fircoal, Ripley, Nightfall

7 alive, 4 to lynch.

[ChannelDelibird]

bird1111 - I'll probably keep doing it anyway out of habit.

Fircoal - what Patrick said.

[Ripley]

Ripley's case on Nightfall sort of disappeared - people basically said "Ripley looks protown" and then talked about whether that was a null tell for him. If it had been just one person doing that I would have FoSed them for trying to take the heat off a scumbuddy, but quite a few people did that, so I can't.

Quite a few people? It was

Twito and Fircoal

. The Spammer Twins. When one says "WEEEEEEE!" the other says "WOOOOOO!" To say a statement is more valid because it was made by both Twito and Fircoal is like saying it must be true because it was confirmed by both Laurel

and

Hardy.

Seriously. These two have never played in a completed game with me, and they don't really seem the kind to do extensive research, do they? They are both in one ongoing game with me, alas. Since their entire experience of me is limited to this game, and it's illegal to discuss current games, it's basically impossible for me to respond, other than to say it's misleading of them to have implied they have any wider knowledge of my play than that game, and that if they do claim to know that I play this way - by which I suppose they mean "reading the game and posting useful content" - as scum, they should back it up with admissable evidence.

Anyway, it's terrible play to evaluate a post by this means and not by actually dealing with the contents.

With regard to your comments about post 140, Ernie's confusion about so many things in this game has been such that I don't think it was unreasonable to consider that it might be, to some degree at least, faked or exaggerated.

I was unwilling to put Ernie at lynch -1 at that stage when so little content had been posted, yes. Especially as I had underlying doubts about Nightfall (and still do). Yes, I thought the game needed to gain some momentum, but I preferred to try and do that by a reread and trying to find some thoughts to discuss, rather than by voting in that situation.

[ChannelDelibird]

Meh, two people in a seven-player game is a fair proportion, but I take your point. I do think that the idea of defending a scumbuddy sort of goes out the window with two of them doing it though. I don't think you've entirely interpreted my post correctly, though - I'm not using their statements as evidence for confirming your pro-townness or anything. I'm just saying that if it had been only one of them I would have FoSed them for it.

Your expansion on not putting Ernie at -1 is fine by me. Just wanted to check.

[Fircoal]

I'm confused about that. Your last post doesn't make sense. It seems that you first said that you were disproved, then 5 posts later you asked what reasons there were for Nightfall/Ernie not being scumbuddies. Those two things don't make any sense together.

I gave some reasons for not thinking they're scumbuddies in my post 155.

My theory was posted on Post 152.

You disproved it on Post 155 or some post around there.

Until you disproved it, I believed in my theory.

[Patrick]

Just to comment on Ripley, since I haven't actually done so yet. I've seen him make decent posts as scum too, in fact he pretty much had me sold that time. Nonetheless, it would be pretty easy as scum to let a game like this one stagnate, so I tend to take his post at face value. I'm currently more interested in CDB and Fircoal than Nightfall. I don't think there's much going against him, though I think the mod should prod, maybe replace him. I know he's been struggling to keep up in certain other games.

CDB, elaborate on this please:

Ripley's case on Nightfall sort of disappeared - people basically said "Ripley looks protown" and then talked about whether that was a null tell for him. If it had been just one person doing that I would have FoSed them for trying to take the heat off a scumbuddy, but quite a few people did that, so I can't. Nightfall, could you go back and answer Ripley's post about you, please, and if you did, please tell me where it was as I must have missed it. Until then (and possibly after), FoS: Nightfall

If I understand right, you think there may have been some scum strategy to take heat off Nightfall (presumably scum in this scenrario) by talking about Ripley? Why would that distract us from Nightfall? It's not like anyone was making a case against Ripley for making a useful post, and with the lack of discussion, nothing would stop the town from talking about both things at once anyway.

[bird1111]

though I think the mod should prod, maybe replace him. I know he's been struggling to keep up in certain other games.

Nightfall's been prodded, will give a few days before I search for a replacement.

[Nightfall]

Sorry Still here, was intending to post today but ended up fealing under the weather.
I'll address all wuestions / issues tommorrow.

[ChannelDelibird]

CDB, elaborate on this please:

Ripley's case on Nightfall sort of disappeared - people basically said "Ripley looks protown" and then talked about whether that was a null tell for him. If it had been just one person doing that I would have FoSed them for trying to take the heat off a scumbuddy, but quite a few people did that, so I can't. Nightfall, could you go back and answer Ripley's post about you, please, and if you did, please tell me where it was as I must have missed it. Until then (and possibly after), FoS: Nightfall

If I understand right, you think there may have been some scum strategy to take heat off Nightfall (presumably scum in this scenrario) by talking about Ripley? Why would that distract us from Nightfall? It's not like anyone was making a case against Ripley for making a useful post, and with the lack of discussion, nothing would stop the town from talking about both things at once anyway.

The point I was making was that the case on Nightfall seemed to disappear because people were too busy discussing whether Ripley looked pro-town or not. I think it was worth exploring further, and if it had only been one person who was talking about it possibly being a null tell for Ripley, I would have accused them of trying to take the heat off Nightfall. As it was more than one, I'm not so sure it was a scum strategy.

[bird1111]

Prodded SL and Twito.

[Nightfall]

Sorry guys, a 13 hour work day kept me away yesterday.

I had some minor reservations about Nightfall before the whole Ernie thing started up (see post 82 for details). Reading through again, I still feel uneasy about him. The almost total lack of content is a problem, but in this particular game it hardly even stands out from everyone else. But I've been in a couple of games lately where a scum about to be lynched started saying "guys this is a terrible mistake if you lynch me it'll be down to lylo tomorrow and you don't want that..." - you know the kind of thing, where they completely avoid addressing any of the charges against them, and I just got that feel from a couple of Nightfall's posts.

I want to point out that I never made the arguement that lynching me "would be bad for the town" (although it would), and that my absence has been genuine. As for addressing charges placed against me, I'm not certain there really was anything substantial. Ripley random voted me. Patrick voted me because of a comment I made about trusting his decision making (which he overeacted/took the wrong way), and Ernie placed me one from lynch to see if I would get hammered.

Besides that stuff, the only reason I can think that I would be under the microscope is the fact that I haven't contributed that much game related content. It has been pointed out however that I am not the only one to really act this way. Truthfully I would find the one(s) who did the same thing, but posted in larger numbers to be the one(s) who are more more suspicious.

If there is any thing more specific any of you wish for me to address please post them, and I will answer.

[Patrick]

That response seems fine to me. What are your suspicions Nightfall?

[Twito]

*points to vac/no access thread*

[bird1111]

Gone until sometime Sunday, there better be more posting by the time I get back or else the deadline will be non-retractable

[Nightfall]

My thoughts :

ChannelDelibird (replacing Ernie) > Ernie seemed pretty scummy, Delibird seems townish. I'm not really sure yet where the two opinions meet.

Twito > This could be based on the game itself, but although his playstyle is as flashy as usual he seems to be grasping at a bit more straws than usual.

Fircoal > I usually find him scummy, and I am getting that from somewhere in this game too.

Patrick > I would say pro town, but I'm a little nervous about how he reacted to my comments earlier on.

ShadowLurker > I can't make enough of a call on him yet, but I'm leaning more towards protown.

Ripley > Ripley seems to be one of the more protown players.

[ShadowLurker]

CDB hasn't really alleviated my fears.

[bird1111]

Prodded everyone that has not posted since I left.

[Twito]

I really really think it's unfair to my other 25 games to post in particular one, that I'm not even modding as I've started to take care of my modding again, while still not having internet but I'll say something meaningless to make you all happy.
Wow that was easy.

[Fircoal]

You sure, I am you have to click a button, it can't be that easy.

[Ripley]

I don't really have anything new to say. Nightfall's list is pretty much entirely lacking in examples and evidence, and tells us only what his gut feelings are. I now know a great deal about the disposition of Nightfall's gut, but it hasn't really helped.

We have a deadline and we need to do something. I do agree with Nightfall where he says CDB's townishness has to be weighed against Ernie's scummishness. For me they probably just about cancel each other out, but given that CDB is the one we have now, I'd be against lynching him today. He's a player that puts some effort in and that would be very useful for tomorrow. Given the almost complete lack of a case against anybody at this stage, I'd be in favor of lynching somebody less likely to be useful. Both Twito and Fircoal have made a lot of posts that did nothing apart from clutter the thread with rubbish, which makes the game difficult to reread and makes it harder to get any sense of continuity. Since we have to lynch somebody, I'd prefer to go after one of those two or else ShadowLurker, who hasn't contributed a whole lot.

[Patrick]

Not much time to post now, though I'll probably see if there's ANYTHING meaningful I can dig up later. I feel that Shadowlurker may need replacing. If we are lynching one of the spammers my preference atm would be Fircoal.

[ChannelDelibird]

Post within the next 24 hours. Sorry about the delay.

[bird1111]

Nightfall and SL prodded.

[bird1111]

Shadowlurker has requested a replacement, will go searching for one.

[Patrick]

Unvote, vote: Fircoal

because I've had a few bad vibes from him and CDB does seem ok at this stage.

I'm pleased that we're getting a replacement for Shadowlurker, since at the moment I don't have the slightest idea about his alignment. Twito may also need replacing since I think he's having all sorts of problems with his connection.