NY 174: Oldy Mafia 2 (Game Over)


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Post Post #1400 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:48 am

Post by petroleumjelly »

DrippingGoofball has sidestepped the
biggest
problems with her play in her post, and instead tries to focus on how she is "hunting scum" by focusing on players who lynched LoudmouthLee and players who are voting for her.

1.)
DrippingGoofball, how often -- as
Scum
-- have you pointed out in-thread that somebody
might
be a power role? How often do you do that as
Town
?

2.)
DrippingGoofball, please explain your Day One reasons for voting for Porochaz and Untrod Tripod. It seems you have still failed to give any.

3.)
DrippingGoofball,
why
would you prefer a No Lynch over a LoudmouthLee lynch? It is not like you don't understand basic mafia theory.

~

DrippingGoofball, you are
more
than free to post an analysis of the game. But I am not going to give you an extra game Day (or whatever) to do so -- no stalling will be permitted. In the meantime I am going to heartily encourage votes on you. Dance whatever dance you're going to dance.
"Logic? I call that flapdoodle."
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Post Post #1401 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:54 am

Post by chamber »

I really dislike that post.
Taking a break from the site.
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Post Post #1402 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:59 am

Post by Patrick »

Votecount

DrippingGoofball (5) -- Save the Dragons, CrashTextDummie, petroleumjelly, Green Crayons, Sotty7
Glork (4) -- VitaminR, undo, Kublai Khan, Albert B. Rampage
CrashTextDummie (1) -- inHimshallibe
Albert B. Rampage (2) -- DrippingGoofball, mathcam
undo (8) -- MrBuddyLee, Glork, chamber, Cogito Ergo Sum, Yosarian2, Porochaz, Untrod Tripod, Bookitty

Not voting: Nobody
20 alive, 11 to lynch
Primpod 11:13 pm
chamber can you please come to ukmeet
i would love to finally touch your face
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Post Post #1403 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:10 am

Post by Glork »

In post 1401, chamber wrote:I really dislike that post.
Which post?

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Post Post #1404 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:11 am

Post by chamber »

The one right above mine.
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Post Post #1405 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:13 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

Enough to vote?
Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards.
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Post Post #1406 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:14 am

Post by chamber »

Detracting from the undo wagon would likely just end in DGB getting lynched, but he's a serious consideration for a later date now, I want to review his older play.
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Post Post #1407 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:15 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

I'm willing to go the distance with you, and there will be others joining our cause as well.
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Post Post #1408 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:46 am

Post by Save The Dragons »

I'm honestly having trouble talking about DGB. This game is confrontational. I don't want her to be scum but I don't know how to respond to what she does without coming across as insensitive.

If DGB is town, I'm not sure why we have to jump through hoops to get information from her. If she wants to post it, fine. If not, fine. But blatantly declaring that she is withholding her analysis in exchange for some promise just seems disingenuous to me. It glorifies any analysis from her if we don't end up lynching her, which is harmful if we don't know her alignment.

That being said, if she is town, I'm more than happy to look through who she thinks is suspicious and why, if she hasn't already laid it out in thread. If I agree with her reads then I'd consider it. If she's scum, this is just a gambit to stay afloat.
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Post Post #1409 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:52 am

Post by DrippingGoofball »

In post 1400, petroleumjelly wrote:How often do you do that as Town?
Literally ALL THE TIME.
Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.

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Post Post #1410 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:52 am

Post by DrippingGoofball »

In post 1400, petroleumjelly wrote:explain your Day One reasons for voting for Porochaz and Untrod Tripod. It seems you have still failed to give any.
I did.
Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.

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Post Post #1411 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:53 am

Post by DrippingGoofball »

In post 1400, petroleumjelly wrote:why would you prefer a No Lynch over a LoudmouthLee lynch?
I believed his ATE. I don't care about theory.
Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.

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Post Post #1412 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:55 am

Post by DrippingGoofball »

In post 1408, Save The Dragons wrote:It glorifies any analysis from her
But it will glorify it MORE after I flip town. I want my analysis to be glorified.

Are you afraid that I will find you scum for the LML X-bus'ing, and after I flip town, you'll be lynched?
Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.

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Post Post #1413 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:56 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

I will vote for you in my next post if you make another post without analysis.
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Post Post #1414 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:02 am

Post by chamber »

In post 1412, DrippingGoofball wrote:I want my analysis to be glorified.
I'm sure you do. I'm sure everyone wants their own analysis to be glorified. Its not for the best of the whole town though.
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Post Post #1415 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:26 am

Post by Save The Dragons »

In post 1412, DrippingGoofball wrote:
In post 1408, Save The Dragons wrote:It glorifies any analysis from her
But it will glorify it MORE after I flip town. I want my analysis to be glorified.

Are you afraid that I will find you scum for the LML X-bus'ing, and after I flip town, you'll be lynched?
Is that what your analysis says? I'd love to see it. I even said that (on the stipulation that I'm completely wrong about you):
Save The Dragons wrote:That being said, if she is town, I'm more than happy to look through who she thinks is suspicious and why, if she hasn't already laid it out in thread.
What I was referring to was specifically if you are scum, you are calling attention to your analysis and saying it's a golden key to victory. I have no doubt that if you are town your analysis will be somewhat informative. In that light, I would consider it.

I mistrust the fact that you are holding "secret analysis" over our heads. If it's just "lynch the people I've been targeting" I mistrust it even more, since it's the same information we've already dissected, you're just trying to breathe new life into it. This seems like a gambit to me. I'm sorry if it isn't, but I'm not just seeing it the other way.
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Post Post #1416 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:35 am

Post by Glork »

In post 1413, Albert B. Rampage wrote:I will vote for you in my next post if you make another post without analysis.
Big threats coming from a guy who has jumped onto nearly half the game and neither said not accomplished anything.
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Post Post #1417 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:42 am

Post by MrBuddyLee »

@STD
, what do you think of mathcam?
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Post Post #1418 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:45 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

In post 1416, Glork wrote:
In post 1413, Albert B. Rampage wrote:I will vote for you in my next post if you make another post without analysis.
Big threats coming from a guy who has jumped onto nearly half the game and neither said not accomplished anything.
You interpretation of the game is so pathetically literal, it's shocking you've made it this far. Personally, I prefer throwing my support behind this wagon or that until the sound emerges from the noise, but, by all means, keep spouting your backwards rhetoric.
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Post Post #1419 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:37 am

Post by Glork »

In post 1418, Albert B. Rampage wrote:keep spouting your backwards rhetoric.
I'll admit, this line gave me a laugh.


You've floated between so many different causes that your posts and votes mean nothing.

Come back and talk to me about rhetoric when you've stopped dropping adverbs such as "laughably" and "pathetically" into what little content you've provided between Breaking Bad quotes and Survivor references.
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Post Post #1420 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:56 am

Post by VitaminR »

Let me get caught up. First, I wanted to respond to some things MBL said.
In post 1363, MrBuddyLee wrote:Also, if Bookitty comes up town, it'd be really hard to make the case that Glork was scum protecting her all day. You'd have to add that protection of a townie up against a scum wagon to his "spot" of the "bus" and his willingness to post and vote in a possible no-lynch situation to sink his scumpartner. Plus your(undo's) statements that LML's interactions with Glork make them look like unlikely scumpartners.
This is a fair enough and I remember noting it at the time also.
In post 1366, MrBuddyLee wrote:
@VitR
, you know LML decently well. Do you think he'd agree to give up and post a fake "bus" post for a teammate to catch, a few hours before deadline, with him not even in the vote lead (6-8), with what appears to be a decent shot at no-lynch?
I have no idea what was going on in LML's mind and what he was intending to do. I do know that his deadline play was really weird from the perspective of someone who thought a no-lynch was possible. His refusal to claim, slip, and then late soft PR claim do not seem like sensible moves if he was trying to stay alive for another day. Why not just claim VT right away?

I think it's pretty clear that LML was trying to engineer *something*. Whether it was to clear a teammate, to set up a future mislynch, or just to create enough confusion that we'd no-lynch out of indecisiveness is not obvious to me. But I don't think we can confidently rule out any of these options.

MBL, I think you also asked for my opinion of undo. It's not like I have strong reasons for thinking he's town, I just don't think he's done anything particularly scummy. Sure, the LML distancing analysis is bad, but I'm not sure I think scum is more likely to do that kind of busy work. I'm also not convinced him staying away from the LML wagon is that damning. It seems like you could easily wagon a bunch of other players in the game for not having had strong LML opinions and not having made a notably pro-town contribution.
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Post Post #1421 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:08 am

Post by VitaminR »

I agree with StD's and some others. I really don't like DGB's . I'm having some trouble seeing the pro-town mindset that would lead you to post that.
In post 1406, chamber wrote:Detracting from the undo wagon would likely just end in DGB getting lynched, but he's a serious consideration for a later date now, I want to review his older play.
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Post Post #1422 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:50 am

Post by undo »

4 Good Reasons to Vote Glork

An Anthology of New and Old Arguments*


*meaning that many have already been mentioned earlier


1. He hasn’t made one single case on Day 1

I invite you to ISO him and confirm this by yourself. He has voted six times during Day 1, not counting RVS (, , , , , ). Not one single vote was backed by a minimally in-depth case and, except for his vote on Yosarian (which only explanation was “Yos's switch from VitR to LML is particularly cringe-worthy and smells like scum trying to ride the tides to an easy lynch”), not one is accompanied by a solid justification. He pushes for PJ’s lynch (posts , ) without ever saying why he suspects him so much. He votes CES because he gets annoyed by him (post ). His second-to-last vote, on KK (post ), was simply to put pressure on him. And his vote on LML was because of his “bus post”, even though Glork didn’t believe that was a scumslip (see below).

2. He contradicts himself severely

Glork about “cop-out” replies:
  • Post (in response to PJ, who had asked him why he wasn’t voting VitaminR): “Because I don't feel like voting right now? Here, how about I answer these with one of your own lines from earlier: [quotes PJ] ‘Bluntly, I don't care what you'd like... I will pursue potential scum as I see fit.’ “

    Post (in response to me): “your response (saying you don't care about wagons, and that it's subjective) is like the biggest cop out ever”
Glork about Bookitty:
  • Posts , : “As much as it pains me to say, I'm pretty fine with a Bookitty lynch” ; “I'm like 80% sure that I will be voting to lynch Bookitty or PJ today. I just really can't decide which.”

    Post : “I've been by and large pretty fine with Bookitty's contributions.”
Glork about LML:
  • Post (before LML’s “bus post”; ~19h before deadline): “lynch anyone not named Glork, ABR, Bookitty, DGB, or Porochaz, and possibly LmL”

    Post (after LML’s “bus post”; ~8h before deadline): “Better than a Bookitty lynch, except that's going to be a distraction for a while probably.
    I'm not super convinced this will flip scum, unless LmL's slip is actually a scumslip
He first states he doesn’t want to lynch LML; then, after LML’s “bus post”, he VOTES HIM TO LYNCH, even though he says he’s not convinced he will flip scum (!). If he’s not convinced LML’s “bus post” was a scumslip, WHY THEN did he vote him because of that very same post?

Speaking of which…

3. He defended LML since early on

Glork has generally defended LML throughout the whole game. His first sympathy posts appear page 5, and on page 18 he openly expresses his dislike of LML’s wagon. And – I insist – even after LML’s bus post, and even after voting him to lynch, Glork continued to say he thought he would flip town.

Earlier I thought Glork and LML’s buddying was so obvious they couldn’t be scumpartners (since they are experienced players and all that). But what if that was precisely what they were going for? I realize it’s WIFOM territory, but they surely are proficient enough to try to pull it off.

4. The only case he made the whole game (the one against me) was dishonest and based on fallacious, sensationalist phrasing

No need to repeat myself on this one, my post makes it pretty clear how Glork dishonestly manipulated facts and used sensationalist formulations to attack me. Accusations of me “lurking through the thread doing nothing of value” come to mind (again, I invite Glork or anyone else to point out when exactly I have lurked).

Even if some may consider he was not that sensationalist (for those I'll leave another Glork quote: "You don't want a spread of votes. You don't want parity. You don't want to look elsewhere and discern multiple players' alignments"), no-one can possibly deny the enormous fallacy he committed in his last attack against me (because logic is not subjective).
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Post Post #1423 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:54 am

Post by undo »

In post 1366, MrBuddyLee wrote: Nah, I understood your post just fine. And you're avoiding the part where I pointed out that you "reduced the scope of analysis" just enough to leave mathcam out--you had a perfect opportunity to analyze him and you dodged it by drawing an imaginary line at 5 instead of 8. You have to understand how scummy that looks, considering you voted Bookitty day one while making handwavey motions about mathcam being scum:
I made that list to find and analyse NEW suspects. Why would I include mathcam if he was already on my suspect list?
In post 1384, Bookitty wrote: My primary reasons for voting Undo have to do with LML's attack on ABR based on Undo's "legitimate question" and Undo's questioning of ABR about their LML votes. He asks ABR repeatedly why he's voting LML and hunts that line of questioning much longer than I think is reasonable.
Come on, Bookitty, you are better than that.
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Post Post #1424 (ISO) » Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:33 pm

Post by Untrod Tripod »

I'm sorry undo but I have an oral contract with Glork to ignore him until 3p lylo

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