Mini 455 - Mafia in Theoville - Game Over who won?

[Battle Mage]

links to games in which i get 'shit' as you put it, would classify about 90% of my games on this site. Of course, i wont be complying with such a request, because it has absolutely no relevance to the game.

ah, so i DID know when the deadline was.
thanks for clearing that up.

have i, or have i not just been talking to you MeMe, within this game?
assuming i have, there is absolutely no excuse for some of the blatant opportunism you have exhibited. Im just glad i turned up when i did, otherwise you might have gotten away with it.

BM

@Yagami-actually, you too have made a mistake. :p
You are referring to the right bit, but you (and probably MeMe was aswell) are taking it in the wrong context. Yes, i did so those words in that order, but the meaning is completely different. If you think it matters atall, ill break it down for you later. i guess that proves i should use commas more...

rofl. an apology wouldnt go amiss. and yes, that does classify as opportunistic behaviour.

To be fair, I

requested

links to games in which you were getting shit -- you

provided

links for something else. I acknowledged the misunderstanding, but you either misinterpreted

my

post or made a deliberate choice to ignore my request. Should

I

be expecting an apology?

As for this:

but alright, ill bite. when is the deadline Sherlock? i mean, i obviously havent been paying attention, as i thought it was on Saturday. there again, i suppose you cant trust the mod eh? /sarcasm.

Actually, you can trust the mod. He's been giving us the hours to deadline (approximately 84.5 hours away now). For me, the deadline lands at 5 a.m. Sunday morning. For you in England, I think it'd be 11 p.m. Saturday. Since you've said you'd post Friday evening, that's right before the weekend, when participation dips. Just like I said before. Elementary enough for you?

And if this is serious:

My vote stands, and i reccommend others read the latest comments of MeMe, and cast your own vote.

…the irony should shame you. If it's truly only the latest comments of a game that matter, then you have no defense for your lack of contributions as you would've needed no more than five minutes to catch up!

You are silly, sir.

[Battle Mage]

It seems obvious to me that MeMe wasn't misrepresenting him. So I would have to say the only possible explanation would be that he did so on purpose, as he didn't show where the misrepresentation happened, so one would have to try guessing on where he meant.
Based on that I think I would like BM to confirm that the post i picked was the one he meant, and why he says MeMe misrepresented him.

ROFLMAO.
so now im scum, trying to misinterpret MeMe into looking like misinterpreting me? that makes a bundle of sense, especially in light of the fact you didnt even read what i was saying in the manner which it was intended.
way to jump to conclusions...

@MeMe-can you also do me a favour, and quit the rubbish about negligence? this is a game remember, that people try to enjoy. Amazingly, there are occassions when RL takes priority. Criticising someone for that is really stupid imo.

BM

[DogMom]

<quick zoom-by>
Hi everybody - I totally understand the whole RL thing getting in the way of posting and stuff, cause right now I'm up to my ass in alligators and won't have time to check in today at all, but will (it is to be hoped) have time tomorrow, so for now

UNVOTE

since I won't have time to check in again today.

In the quick skim I've taken of the last day or so of stuff, I see that Battle Mage has checked in several times, every single one of which has been pretty much shouting at MeMe about his participation in this game / other games / whatever.

I'm going to reiterate MeMe's request to BM, really.

BattleMage: If you have time to post to bunches of (OTHER) threads, could you maybe please put that on hold for just ONE TIME, and take that time instead to read this one and do some game-analysis in this one? I'm hoping when I check in tomorrow that you'll have that going (since you said you would on...um...Friday, I think).
I really just want to hear from you on pretty much any game-related topic except how you've been getting shit from everywhere and how you don't have time to read, analyze and post in this thread.
thanks.
</quick zoom-by>

[MeMe]

@MeMe-can you also do me a favour,

For you, Battle Mage?

Anything

.

[DogMom]

Buggers. My schedule isn't going to clear up anytime soon, it looks like, so I've just requested replacement.

I'm having a lot of fun with this one, so it really pains me to say this, but my schedule just got unexpectedly VERY busy, and I just won't have the time to devote to this game that I really should, and that it deserves. As much as I'm enjoying it, it just wouldn't be fair to everyone else for me to stay in the game. I am therefore requesting replacement ASAP.

Sorry, guys. I really wanted to play this one out.

[YagamiLight]

<snip>
@Yagami-actually, you too have made a mistake. :p
You are referring to the right bit, but you (and probably MeMe was aswell) are taking it in the wrong context. Yes, i did so those words in that order, but the meaning is completely different. If you think it matters atall, ill break it down for you later. i guess that proves i should use commas more...
<snip>

Could you break it down, because it does matter to me at least. I would like to see what you actually meant. Also the thing about you being scum was my attempt to try and make sense out of you saying MeMe misinterpreted you after I did the same way. It does not matter since I misinterpreted.

[Battle Mage]

ok, read this carefully:

I explained that the reason i had some games in which i could post, was that they didnt require a lot of detail or reading. After counting the games in which i was NOT posting, i pointed out that this was probably because of the "Lets Lynch BM-fest" thing.

MeMe seems to have mixed these 2 points together, and made something completely different out of it.

there might have been something else that required clarification, but you'll have to direct me to that specifically.

BM

About BM saying MeMe misinterpreted him...

I've just looked at his most recent posts elsewhere, though, and here's a quick list where it looks like he's not getting heat (of course, I'm just skimming), which is at odds with his claim that he's only contributing because "lazy townies have started a 'Lynch-BM Fest'" and in which he seems to be contributing more than his quote "im hardly posting 'content' in other games. Im simply posting responses to what i see," implies. <snip>

I'm assuming you mean here, and for the first part where MeMe says, "which is at odds with his claim that he's only contributing because "lazy townies have started a 'Lynch-BM Fest'"

actually, its only 4 i think. probably because lazy townies have started a "Lynch-BM Fest" Laughing <snip>

You did indeed say here that there were only four games for you to link due to the Lynch-BM fest.
And for MeMe saying, "in which he seems to be contributing more than his quote "im hardly posting 'content' in other games. Im simply posting responses to what i see," implies." You say that here...

oh and btw, im hardly posting 'content' in other games. Im simply posting responses to what i see, in contrast to games which require rereads, and thus i have not been awesomely active here. <snip>

[theopor_COD]

Jalyn has replaced DogMom effective of now. Deadline is 48 hours away. Votecount coming.

[Adel]

Battle Mage: I have a suggestion: drop the whole MeMe thing. She isn't even voting for you anymore. No one is basing a vote on your lengthy and probably time-consuming exchanges, yet.

Read the whole thread, weigh in on a couple of issues with the level of analysis you are obviously capable of. Cast a vote for someone other than MeMe and fling a couple of FoS's around. That is what would help the town. I don't see you convincing anyone into joining you on the MeMe wagon today. More noise along the lines of "I don't have time to post; I'm being mis-represented" doesn't help the town, and makes you look both scummy and insincere.

[MeMe]

Much appreciation, Jalyn.

[theopor_COD]

Votecount 11

Adel 4 - Guardian, YogurtBandit, Nanosauromo, ChaosOmega
Nanosauromo 3 - MeMe, Erotomachia, NanookTheWolf
MeMe 1 - Battle Mage
Battle Mage 1 - Adel

Not voting - Jalyn, YagamiLight, Streeflo.

7 to lynch although note this part of the rules "When a deadline falls the person with the most votes will be lynched".

Deadline hits at 11.00PM my time (GMT) approx 5.00PM states time on Saturday. Some 48 hours to go.

[Battle Mage]

lol so you would actually rather i voted for you?
unfortunately, you have me a bit wrong. You see, my vote on MeMe is based on more than just OMGUS. i am pretty sure that MeMe is scum. if there is one thing i have learnt in Mafia, it is to stand by your beliefs. I dont see how farsically pretending to go after others will help atall, especially when we are near a deadline.
Obviously, if it comes to a choice between lynch and no-lynch, i will choose the former, but there is still time to lynch MeMe scum.
BM

*oh and fyi-how the hell can the most honest comments i make be the most insincere? i mean, even if i WAS scum in this game, the fact that i dont have time to read is the truth.

**btw-if you are so keen that we avoid No-Lynching, why the heck are you voting for me???-(someone with equal votes to MeMe)

BM

Battle Mage: I have a suggestion: drop the whole MeMe thing. She isn't even voting for you anymore. No one is basing a vote on your lengthy and probably time-consuming exchanges, yet.

Read the whole thread, weigh in on a couple of issues with the level of analysis you are obviously capable of. Cast a vote for someone other than MeMe and fling a couple of FoS's around. That is what would help the town. I don't see you convincing anyone into joining you on the MeMe wagon today. More noise along the lines of "I don't have time to post; I'm being mis-represented" doesn't help the town, and makes you look both scummy and insincere.

[Adel]

lol so you would actually rather i voted for you?
unfortunately, you have me a bit wrong. You see, my vote on MeMe is based on more than just OMGUS. i am pretty sure that MeMe is scum. if there is one thing i have learnt in Mafia, it is to stand by your beliefs. I dont see how farsically pretending to go after others will help atall, especially when we are near a deadline.
Obviously, if it comes to a choice between lynch and no-lynch, i will choose the former, but there is still time to lynch MeMe scum.

I do not know what "farsically" means- I'll assume your typo doesn't change the meaning of your sentence. Yes, I would rather you vote for me than leave a meaningless vote on MeMe. If you did your homework for this game, and I suspect you have, you would have at least one other suspect worthy of your vote. I read your reaction as a ploy to distract the town, possibly from NanoS. That would account for the post he directed at you: an attempt to split the town vote further while feeding the distraction.

*oh and fyi-how the hell can the most honest comments i make be the most insincere? i mean, even if i WAS scum in this game, the fact that i dont have time to read is the truth.

Your posts prove that you

do

have time to read. Players with exams often post that they have exams and disappear for a few days, perhaps attracting a couple or three votes in the process. They don't log back in to type out pages of defense, day after day. You did. In more than one game.

**btw-if you are so keen that we avoid No-Lynching, why the heck are you voting for me???-(someone with equal votes to MeMe)

My vote, and posts directed at you seem to be having the desired effect- motivating you to post more. What effect is your vote and posts directed at MeMe having?

I have four people on my list of probable scum. I would love to remove you from that list and my vote from you. You could help with that. You really haven't been so far.

[Guardian]

Yes, I would rather you vote for me than leave a meaningless vote on MeMe.

How is his vote on MeMe any less meaningless than your vote on him?

[Adel]

Mine is generating evidence.

[Jalyn]

OK. I've done an initial read through of the thread but need to head to bed now. I understand that we are on a deadline, so I'll post something of substance as soon as possible in the morning.

Can I note a

bit

of sympathy for BM? It didn't take 30 minutes to get through this thread, it was closer to 4 hours.

(Also, thanks for the welcome)

Gah! This is taking forever to post and I need to sleep...

[Nanosauromo]

Deadline's nearly here, we should start deciding who we want to lynch. BM anyone?

[Guardian]

NanoS, do you still find Adel scummy? If so, why do you think she is pushing for BM votes?

[Streeflo]

Welcome Jalyn.
I'll do a reread tomorrow and place a vote on who I think the currently the scummiest before deadline.

[Nanosauromo]

NanoS, do you still find Adel scummy?

Yes, but I need to gather more evidence before I can continue my case against her.

If so, why do you think she is pushing for BM votes?

Perhaps she's Mafia and BM is a Serial Killer. (Or vice versa)

[Battle Mage]

lol Nanos-that is ridiculous. you deserve to die just for that.
Unfortunately, Adel is also making some equally wierd comments.

Why the hell would any townie choose to lie about their suspicions?
i am told that some players, like MoS, hide their true suspicions, so the scum dont realise he is onto them, and leave him for endgame.
I find that a weak policy. Id much rather make clear my views as early as possible. If it means me dying in the early stages of the scum, thats fine, AS LONG AS THE TOWN PAYS ATTENTION TO MY COMMENTS ONCE I AM GONE.

im starting to potentially see a MeMe-Adel scumpair. IOU 1 read and analysis today.

[YogurtBandit]

Jalyn has replaced DogMom effective of now. Deadline is 48 hours away. Votecount coming.

thats odd, Dogmom had just posted.Oh well.


Welcome Jalyn! Right now me and Guardian have both claimed Cop, fyi.

[Battle Mage]

wha? why didnt you say that when i replaced in! rofl.
Im rereading now btw. EXAMS ARE OVER!

[Jalyn]

Huh. I've been doing my reread and take notes on Adel so far this morning (most votes at the moment, seemed like a good place to start.)

After my initial read, I expected this to be a quick reread through and a "Like the posting style, think the multiple bad ideas were well intentioned, but seems like an easy "unusual posting style" lynch, not anything valid." I was highly surprised by the reread, when I kept finding things I found suspicious.

(I'm just going to hit the two low points here as I'd prefer not to write novels.)

There better be a Doc and he better not fall victim to a recursive logic bomb and protect a random townie rather than our (possible!) cop! We don't want to give scum any more ideas or point out any further clues to assist them in their NK.

I disagreed with the "direct the vig" plan, but hadn't noticed the explicit doc directions that were buried in one of the first reactions to Guardian's cop claim/outing. I certainly hadn't noticed the "don't even think of taking the chance that the mafia won't strike the claimed cop but hit someone else, but protect the claimed cop no matter what" stance. And then follows the "Hey, scum, don't try killing Gaurdian because the doc will be protecting him", with "don't give scum clues on who to night kill."

The mafia, in trying to predict the actions of the autonomous individuals playing our power roles will always run into a recursive logic error (WIFOM) so they will never be able to confidently predict who a P.R. will target. Once again, though the logical fallacy of over-simplification, you are overstating your case. That you didn't mention the possibility of there being a mafia roleblocker, the biggest hole in my plan, suggests that:

1. you are mafia and you know that there is a roleblocker
or
2. you are mafia and since there isn't a roleblocker you didn't think of the possibility.

It's been a while since my last logic course and I don't have any of my school books in the office with me, so I can't give this a name, but it's a definite falacy. False Dillema, maybe? Anyway, offering two alternative options when there are actually several=bad logic. For example, "Didn't think of mafia roleblockers because he doesn't have a clue why they would be problematic to your plan." Which, by the way "luck" is how they could mess up your plan? Er, because it would make more sense to randomly roleblock people in the hope of hitting the vig than to roleblock one of the claimed cops. And because that has anything to do with your plan and any roleblocker couldn't "luckily" roleblock a vig without the town following your plan. That whole exchange just confused me.

Moving on to Nanosauromo. I hope that one doesn't take me another three hours to slog through. (And no, that wasn't a shot at Adel, I'm working at the same time and can't devote all of my attention to the important things in life.)

[Adel]

Not a logical fallacy: I didn't place bounds on the choice. More precise language would read, "these additional choices, others may not have considered." If I presented a strict either/or choice you would be correct.

When it comes to

all

of my power role suggestions, what is the end effect? Noise. I felt that it would be noise effecting the scum worse than the town, and therefore is a pro-town action that just looks a little scummy to the other townies. Also, most people on here seem to have a problem evaluating recursive in an analytic way. The more "recursive logic bombs" we plant for scum the better. I thought the vig thing was a good idea, & I still do, and I think there are a couple of decent ideas in that doc quote you found. Do you think my posts are more confusing for the town, or for scum? Guardian is all spun out on me, and I think he is town, so I can only hope that my intended effects are as intense as the expected side-effects.

Mafia has a learning curve, and during this game my playstyle shifted from "total transparency/ wall of words" to "noise is anti-town: keep it down in there."

unvote: BM, vote:Nanosauromo

pending BM's IOU post.