Mini 456: Ultimatum Mafia - Game Over!

[Yosarian2]

I don't think that's true, Fonz; you can't CHALLANGE more then twice, but I don't think there's any limit on how many times a person can be challanged. Basically, we have as many lynches as we have people; if someone gets modkilled, it's just shortining the game by a day.

But, whatever. Dosn't really matter, as VD's already claimed scum.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Do we kill VD as soon as possible or do we wait until the endgame ?

[The Fonz]

Ah, I see your point. The limit is on challenges made, not participated in. So we could demand that VD challenges someone he thinks is protown, to ensure his own death.

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'm still very suspicious of VD's claim. I've successfully used that tactic in the past, passing myself for the "lesser evil" and almost winning the game. I would just rather we kill the confirmed scum instead of the anti-town townie.

[Yosarian2]

However, there have been a number of positive points raised as to why Battle Mage might be scum. What do you think of those points? (This is the third time I have attempted to ask you that.)

Well, I do agree that the comment where BM seemed to "know" you were town is a small scum-tell. What other arguments were there against BM?

[pablito]

Underground news report.

Apparently the government is killing individuals who fail to come out of their houses and vote during the primary season despite the horrible weather over in the FSOCL. Plain madness ensues. We would like to announce the errata for the official government news reports. Since they have failed to point out their own errors, we feel it is our duty to revise their reports.

Errata:

Don't worry, we will give them hell for this, and make sure we continue to give you updated coverage on all relevant issues

.

No.

As for you who choose to live here, though

.

Someone chose to live in this country? With the strict immigration laws as they are and the failure to allow any exit for citizens, I doubt anyone has

.

Now the report on the current primary debate status:

Deadline to Lynch - 2359 EDT 24 June 2007

Votes to Save

Battle Mage

(1) - Albert B. Rampage

VanDamien

(2) - mneme, The Fonz

With 8 voters total, the first to four is saved! Failing to vote will result in modkill.

[Mr Stoofer]

I was going to wait a few days; but it seems that timing of the voting may be important in the case of a tie:

With 8 voters total, the first to four is saved!

So I am going to

Vote: VanDamien

now for the reasons I have already given in detail -- in summary:

• I think it worth trying to enforce the nominations system.
  
• I think Battle Mage is likely scum.
  
• If Battle Mage is not Scum then he is a loose cannon, a danger to the Town, and the sooner he is dead the better.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Stoofer:

Do we kill VD as soon as possible or do we wait until the endgame ?

[Mr Stoofer]

Albert:

As presently advised I want the following people dead in the following order:

1. Battle Mage
   - for the 3 reasons given above.
   
2. dylan
   - probably scum; definitely not Liberal.
   
3. VanDamien
   - definitely Scum, not sure of his alignment. Once we have killed the above, it will probably be time for him to die.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Yeah that's reasonable...

[Mr Stoofer]

Mod

: can you please confirm that the voting period will continue to the deadline, even after the result is not in doubt?

[Battle Mage]

why do you continue to compare this with MAD, when the games are very different in structure. Firstly, players in MAD had far more free reign to do as they liked. an awoll townie could instantly kill a player who he thought was scum. Here it is very different, as the closest thing anyone can get, is limitting the vote to 2-themselves and 1 other. In other words, it is far less necessary to enforce a disciplinary policy here, than it would have been there.
i agree totally that the nominations system is useful for identifying the scum later in the game, but there comes a point where you have to use your brain instead of being dictated to. You might call it 'taking your fate in your own hands'. Lets face it, if that wasnt a conceivable idea, we wouldnt have these games in the first place, as a result of lynch-happy mobs.

unfortunately Stoofer, you have done 1 of the following:

1. Chosen to kill me because of the obvious benefit to your Conservative scumbuddies.
2. Chosen to kill me because you really cannot see past your personal obsession with rules and regulations.
3. Chosen to kill me because you dont like me.

still, im virtually dead now. I dont have a great number of suspicions to pass on. The only advice i can give you is NOT to follow the policy of people like Stoofer and Mneme. Instead, make sure you kill the CONFIRMED scum tomorrow.

you never lynch someone because of "policy", you lynch them if you think they're scum.

Well, I fundamentally disagree with this.

All the sensible players in this game (including no doubt some of the Scum who knew better than to argue) agreed with some version of the nomination system -- for good reasons which we all know.

IMHO the Town has to enforce the use of that system. Otherwise the sort of Townies who lost M.A.D/Bad Idea for the Town would simply act as they would anyway. I guess its a question of how worried you are about this, but I think we have enough lynches to be able to afford policy lynches. Indeed, I think we can't afford

not

to policy lynch -- otherwise the system breaks down and we know where that always leads...

The reason I expressed surprise was because I got the impression that you, as the Mod of M.A.D., would be vehemently in favour enforcing the nominations system. I was surprised that you weren't and I guess I was just speculating as to what your motives are. As I have said, I am genuinely surprised that you do not share my views on this.

As it happens, this may well be moot, since I think there are good grounds for thinking that Battle Mage is indeed scum. What do you think about that?

[dylan41985]

vote: Van Damien

I think this is the fourth vote.

[dylan41985]

for some of the reasons Stoofer provided, but also, I think it is extremely useful to know the truth about one player in the game (I'm trusting you here Van Damien)

[Yosarian2]

Well, that's 4 on Van Damien, so he's going to be saved no matter what now. My vote dosn't really count anymore, so I'll probably vote soon just so I don't screw up and get modkilled.

That being said, I'd still like Stoofer to explain why he thinks Battle Mage is conservative scum; he's kept asking me "what do you think about the case on Battle Mage", but when I ask him what the arguments against Battle Mage are he ignores the question.

[Stewie]

I'll also

vote: vandamien

not so much to make an example of BM, but because BM went against what everyone in the town wanted while saying that's what he thought the town wanted. He keeps insisting that we need to get rid of the confirmed scum despite the fact that the numbers help us anyways. Also, in his defence he does not answer the questions addressed to him appropriately.

[Guardian]

You see on a gigantic government billboard:

Deadline to Lynch - 23:59 EDT 24 June 2007

Votes to Save

Battle Mage

(1) - Albert B. Rampage

VanDamien

(5) - mneme, The Fonz, Mr Stoofer, dylan41985, Stewie

With 8 voters total, the first to four is saved! Failing to vote will result in modkill.

[Battle Mage]

well that was possibly the most short-lived replacement ever.
lol
still, thanks to Guardian and Pablito for running this game. If there is a sequel, count me in
at least i can stop responding to some of the political poop that is being flung at me.
gl town
BM

[The Fonz]

Nah, the shortest replacement was me, in Bird1111's pie C9. I was lynched after, like, three posts.

[Battle Mage]

or maybe TCS in Stargate SG-1. he never even got the chance to post.

[The Fonz]

Now THAT's impressive.

[pablito]

Mod

: can you please confirm that the voting period will continue to the deadline, even after the result is not in doubt?

Yes. You must always vote before deadline no matter how the votes stack up.

As we saw in the first cycle, both Sparks and dylan were close in votes. With 10 voters, the first to five would have been saved. With an even number of voters, the tie vote can be broken by eliminating the last vote overall. So Carrotcake´s vote would not have mattered, but still was required to vote. Thus the voting period did continue to deadline even when the result was not in doubt.

[The Fonz]

Or, come to think of it, that guy in a newbie game whose first move replacing in as scum was to hammer and win the game. That was brilliant.

[Stewie]

I'd prefer you exposed them now, actually, before we see BM's alignment.

If you don't mind...

I do mind, mind you. I'm not going to distract the town when we are under deadline. I will challenge you tomorrow, and then I'll kill you.

Well, now the voting is essentially done, so I'd also like to hear your reasons before BM's alignment is revealed. I suggest yos and dean give him time to answer.

[Yosarian2]

(shrug)

vote:Battle Mage

, I guess, although it dosn't matter anymore.

I'd still like to hear Stoofer explain why he thinks battle mage is scum.