Mini 472 - Cartman Mafia - Game Over

[Off the Mark]

Oh my, you just picked out Zeek's most ridiculous post and said "good point". I am feeling quite good about my suspicions!!

[ryan]

Oh come on now OTM, just because his argument was against you doesn't mean it's ridiculous.

[Off the Mark]

That's not why I thought it was ridiculous. His usage of the accusation "voting for one of your mafia buddies" in the early game made it ridiculous. I explained this already.

[ryan]

That's not why I thought it was ridiculous. His usage of the accusation

"voting for one of your mafia buddies" in the early game made it ridiculous

. I explained this already.

Well that's called "distancing" and there is no reason that can't happen early in a game

[Off the Mark]

whoosh

[Off the Mark]

To clarify, his accusation was that I considered the Earwig bandwagoners more suspicious than the J-man bandwagoners. His explanation for that is that Earwig and I are mafia buddies. This makes little sense, since I was the first to call out Earwig, but that wasn't even my problem with it.

My problem with it was that he is immediately making scum buddy connections in the early game, and he accused us with a confident attitude. I find that is a scum tell. When players try too hard to make connections, they're often scummy. And he's definitely trying too hard, since he's not even using good logic to do so. He should have at least taken into account the fact that I called out and voted for Earwig. If he wants to accuse me of early distancing, then fine, but he didn't even mention that. It just seems he was more concerned with accusations than logic and I find that very scummy.

Also, the J-man bandwagon made sense to me, as an initial probing bandwagon. I'd have to go back to make sure, but nothing stood out to me as players too eager to jump on. And J-man's been giving me town vibes, despite his aggressive style.

[ryan]

OtM: I guess I like a confident/agressive attitude in this game as it makes scum uneasy, and when scum is uneasy, they make mistakes.

[Off the Mark]

OK, fair enough. IGMEOY.

[ryan]

OK, fair enough. IGMEOY.

And I on you as well.

[ZeekLTK]

What's IGMEOY mean?

My problem with it was that he is immediately making scum buddy connections in the early game, and

he accused us

with a confident attitude.

Let's look at what happened: there was bandwagon against j-man in which you and earwig took part in, and then you called people out for doing the same thing the two of you did against j-man.

I think that the only reason you voted earwig was because you saw the bandwagon on j-man was going nowhere and earwig had made a stupid move by following your vote and trying to claim it was random when it wasn't. Then you got scared that all of a sudden people were voting for earwig, and you didn't want your mafia buddy to get lynched, so you tried to attack the people voting for him.

It's clear that you are mafia.

[Off the Mark]

No, it's not, because I am not mafia. Your confidence is making look scummy, particularly since you are wrong.

[ChaosOmega]

As for my thoughts on Earwig, I'm tempted to believe him. It was his first post of the game, he just picked something out that was kind of suspicious and voted. Heck, the person leading the vote charge against him (Off the Mark) didn't notice J-man was at L-3 until his second post after Earwig posted. I don't like the whole thing with him apologizing, so I'm still a little suspicious.

I still think Earwig is more suspicious than you, but he has enough votes on him without him having a chance to respond, and voting for you is better than keeping my random vote.

HUH? Why is voting somebody better than keeping a random? State a case on somebody and than follow through with a vote. Do you believe both to be scum? If so is it really a random vote?

State a case on somebody and than follow through with a vote. Do you mean like this?

I'm going to unvote, Vote: Estes

I didn't like that last post you made. You seemed way too cautious about not wanting to be on that bandwagon.

and

But you were going "I don't want to accidently start the bandwagon" when a bandwagon was already started. You just sounded overly cautious.

Granted, it wasn't a very strong case because we were only 3 pages into the game, but I made a case. You just conveniently forgot to quote that.

Also, ZeekLTK is acting pretty suspicious, first with the whole proclaiming my post was huge and wondering why nobody saw it when Off the Mark already addressed it. It could be a scum tell, but it could just be you not reading up fully. However, your post I find more suspicious.

What's IGMEOY mean?

My problem with it was that he is immediately making scum buddy connections in the early game, and he accused us with a confident attitude.

Let's look at what happened: there was bandwagon against j-man in which you and earwig took part in, and then you called people out for doing the same thing the two of you did against j-man.

I think that the only reason you voted earwig was because you saw the bandwagon on j-man was going nowhere and earwig had made a stupid move by following your vote and trying to claim it was random when it wasn't. Then you got scared that all of a sudden people were voting for earwig, and you didn't want your mafia buddy to get lynched, so you tried to attack the people voting for him.

It's clear that you are mafia.

Jump to conclusions much? Well, I don't mind the argument so much as I mind the "It's clear that you are mafia.". No it's not.

The problem I have with this is that I find Estes suspicious, and you and Estes were real buddy-buddy in the first few pages. I can't see 2 scum doing that. Well, Estes hasn't really posted anything else suspicious, mainly because he hasn't posted much useful information since then.

unvote, vote ZeekLTK

And ryan, why do you think ZeekLTK is town? Other than this argument:

As far as Zeek is concerned, I believe he's made valid arguments so far, called out scummy behavior and played pro town. Granted, we are only 5 pages in so that can change, but so far I haven't seen anything scummy, so I put him in the town slot so far.

Are we reading the same game? Up until that post, he's random voted, talked about a miscount, voted for Earwig when it was the hip thing to do, questioned the existence of a bandwagon, and assuredly accused someone of being mafia without much proof, which he has a habit of doing. So really, why do think he's town?

[Estes]

Me and Zeek know each other from another forum; we were just messing around like any friends would.

With that said, It's always hard to tell who's mafia when a few guys jump on one side and say, "such and such is mafia", and some more jump on another side and say the same thing about the others. As soon as we figure out one of them - from either side - it will help shape up the sides very well (although two mafia may be on different sides to throw off our town). Because we basically have Zeek & Ryan vs. OtM and ChaosOmega. And then of course we have me and Dean sorta stalemated at each other's throats.

Yes I realize I just wrote out what everyone already knows, I just wanted to write my thoughts out.

[J-man]

that was a good one estes you may have wrote out everyone elses thoughts but you made alot of sense to me who was still kinda confused from the Ryan and OTM thingie, just wondering where you think i am (using that idea as a springboard)?

[Earwig]

Several times so far, I've seen it said that my first post was "very shady", and I'd swear that I saw someone say it was "extremely suspicious", but I can't seem to locate that post right now. I can't see how placing a random vote on someone could be considered "very shady", even though it was the third vote. I've explained this already, but my vote truly was random. There hadn't been a vote count yet, and I hadn't gone through and done one myself. I've also heard it mentioned I'm acting paranoid. I can't help that - I'm paranoid by nature. Also, I try hard not to offend anyone - that's the reason I appologized. I am going to take Ryan's advice to heart though - give an explanation, then move on, no appology needed. I've got some suspicions, that I will post separately.

[Earwig]

I really have to wonder why ryan is so eager to put, and keep, Zeek on the town list.

…..

Scum List

Off the Mark
DeanWinchester
Earwig

Not Sure

J-Man
ChaosOmega
SorintheSeeker
GatorGuy

Townies

Estes
Me
ZeekLTK…..

My group of three:

Ryan
estes
zeek

Zeek because ryan put him in the town category for no real reason. I understand if ryan is a competent player he would do this also, but i'm not getting a smart vibe from him.

What reason is there to put Zeek in the scum category? And what reason have I given you to put me in the scum three? I mean you want to talk about no reasoning, your post screams that.

He tries to explain his reasoning here:

……..

As far as Zeek is concerned, I believe he's made valid arguments so far, called out scummy behavior and played pro town. Granted, we are only 5 pages in so that can change, but so far I haven't seen anything scummy, so I put him in the town slot so far.

Not quite enough for me to vote yet, but

FoS: ryan

@ZeekLTK: IGMEOY means I've Got My Eye On You.

[ryan]

I really have to wonder why ryan is so eager to put, and keep, Zeek on the town list.

…..

Scum List

Off the Mark
DeanWinchester
Earwig

Not Sure

J-Man
ChaosOmega
SorintheSeeker
GatorGuy

Townies

Estes
Me
ZeekLTK…..

My group of three:

Ryan
estes
zeek

Zeek because ryan put him in the town category for no real reason. I understand if ryan is a competent player he would do this also, but i'm not getting a smart vibe from him.

What reason is there to put Zeek in the scum category? And what reason have I given you to put me in the scum three? I mean you want to talk about no reasoning, your post screams that.

He tries to explain his reasoning here:

……..

As far as Zeek is concerned, I believe he's made valid arguments so far, called out scummy behavior and played pro town. Granted, we are only 5 pages in so that can change, but so far I haven't seen anything scummy, so I put him in the town slot so far.

Not quite enough for me to vote yet, but

FoS: ryan

@ZeekLTK: IGMEOY means I've Got My Eye On You.

I believe I've stated already that Zeek is on my town list for now. I never KEEP somebody on a certain part of my list as players change behaviors and I do as well with my thoughts on them, I have to wonder why you, the three people I've fingered as scum have deflected to Zeek being scummier, very interesting. Having you all three think Zeek was scummier (and one even placing a vote) I find very opportunistic, definetly makes me believe that one of you three is scum

[Earwig]

I didn't say I thought Zeek was scummier, I said I had to wonder why you (ryan) were so eager to keep someone (anyone for that matter) on a town list. You (ryan) even seemed a little steamed when someone else had Zeek on their scum list.

[Estes]

that was a good one estes you may have wrote out everyone elses thoughts but you made alot of sense to me who was still kinda confused from the Ryan and OTM thingie, just wondering where you think i am (using that idea as a springboard)?

As I stated on the last page...

For the moment I consider you a pro-town player; due to the fact you wrote out a lot of thoughts and ideas earlier. I my experience mafia doesn't

normally

write out very long posts of incite. All of this is subject to change of course, but at the moment I consider you a townie.

[Off the Mark]

I have to wonder why you, the three people I've fingered as scum have deflected to Zeek being scummier, very interesting. Having you all three think Zeek was scummier (and one even placing a vote) I find very opportunistic, definetly makes me believe that one of you three is scum

That's crazy talk. Maybe it's because, oh I don't know, Zeek is acting scummy?!?!?

[ryan]

I didn't say I thought Zeek was scummier, I said I had to wonder why you (ryan) were so eager to keep someone (anyone for that matter) on a town list. You (ryan) even seemed a little steamed when someone else had Zeek on their scum list.

I don't think I ever said he was 100% town, I said he was playing townie currently and as for being upset about somebody saying he was scummy? I'd be interested to see where I said that (a quote possible?) We're 6 pages into this game, my list is subject to change at any notice depending on tendencies and playstyle. I guess the only reason I'd be miffed is that people seem to think that I believe Zeek (or others) are town (or scum) and that's the way my opinion will always be, that just isn't true.

[ryan]

I have to wonder why you, the three people I've fingered as scum have deflected to Zeek being scummier, very interesting. Having you all three think Zeek was scummier (and one even placing a vote) I find very opportunistic, definetly makes me believe that one of you three is scum

That's crazy talk. Maybe it's because, oh I don't know, Zeek is acting scummy?!?!?

It's not crazy talk, it's an observation, just like yours is that he's scum, an observation.

[Earwig]

…………

What reason is there to put Zeek in the scum category?

(bold here added by earwig)And what reason have I given you to put me in the scum three? I mean you want to talk about no reasoning, your post screams that.

….

I believe I've stated already that Zeek is on my town list for now. I never KEEP somebody on a certain part of my list as players change behaviors and I do as well with my thoughts on them, I have to wonder why you, the three people I've fingered as scum have deflected to Zeek being scummier, very interesting. Having you all three think Zeek was scummier (and one even placing a vote) I find very opportunistic, definetly makes me believe that one of you three is scum

Upset might be a little strong. Concerned might be a better term to use here. I was wondering why you cared that someone had put Zeek on their scum list.[/b]

[ryan]

…………

What reason is there to put Zeek in the scum category?

(bold here added by earwig)And what reason have I given you to put me in the scum three? I mean you want to talk about no reasoning, your post screams that.

….

I believe I've stated already that Zeek is on my town list for now. I never KEEP somebody on a certain part of my list as players change behaviors and I do as well with my thoughts on them, I have to wonder why you, the three people I've fingered as scum have deflected to Zeek being scummier, very interesting. Having you all three think Zeek was scummier (and one even placing a vote) I find very opportunistic, definetly makes me believe that one of you three is scum

Upset might be a little strong. Concerned might be a better term to use here.

I was wondering why you cared that someone had put Zeek on their scum list

.

I was interested in why he was on their scum list is the best way I can put it. As I said, I believed he has played pro town and so when I saw somebody else disagree, I was interested why.

[Earwig]

fair enough, for now.