Mini 470 - Some Guys Are Trying To Kill You (done)

[Oman]

I see Streeflo. So mason is bad choice for a fakeclaim for scum, why is that so?

I mean, two masons, two scum, the differences are slight. The only thing is, people are reluctant to lynch claimed masons, meaning it could be a successful gambit. I'm just thinking Mason theory here.

[Streeflo]

Town shouldn't be relying on powerroles to that extent anyway.

I'm sure that if two scum fakeclaimed mason, the town would eventually see that their "confirmed" masons were not doing crap with helping to lynch scum.

In the endgame, even those "confirmed" get a second-look. It'd be pretty cool to see a game where scum got away with a mason gambit though. Anyone have a link? XD

[ThaiBoxerShorts]

I've talked about why I liked your plan earlier, the fact I was working on the idea of a Day-vig not night-vig.

...except that you expressed approval long before Jenter triggered the whole vig discussion by claiming, which makes the above statement highly misleading at best, and an outright falsehood at worst.

[Oman]

Nah, this sure is interesting though.

[Jenter Brolincani]

I'm a nightvig.

Oman's looking distincly suspicious, I don't have time but it would be nice if someone would oblige witha pbpa of him. I'm busy today but should be fine come tomorrow, I willl most likely have 2-3 days away sometime this week, dates to be confirmed.

Machete count;

No votes...

[Oman]

Sorry Thai, I was writing as you posted, didn't see it.

You're right, I did express approval, at the time, it seemed like a good idea, the vig thing merely propagated it. I liked it simply for the numbers, as I explained. Narrowing the view of who was scum.

Or are you refering to the plan to lynch Gator anyway?

[Erotomachia]

Gatorguy and Jimmy are as good as confirmed in my eyes. Unfortunately that means I don't think they'll live long. It's more likely that Jenter is scum. But since we can direct his kills, I don't think we should lynch him today.

vote: Oman

Whoever we end up lynching, we should establish two plans for Jenter: one if the lynch turns up town, and one if the lynch turns up scum. These may or may not be the same.

We still need to hear from a few people before we proceed.

[ThaiBoxerShorts]

I'm not ready to cast a vote yet, but in light of recent events, I think I have more reason to suspect Oman than Gatorguy. So for now,

unvote

FoS Oman

...but I'm still not joining the Gatorguy fan club.

[Oman]

Whoever we end up lynching, we should establish two plans for Jenter: one if the lynch turns up town, and one if the lynch turns up scum. These may or may not be the same.

We still need to hear from a few people before we proceed.

Yes! I was just about to post the same plan! I was worried you'd have a big setup to hit "my scumbuddy" and when I came up town you'd be stuffed. I also suggest you don't lynch untill you have 3 people. Lynch, vig if lynch is town, vig if lynch is scum. That way we'll be set for the day.

[soupfly]

okay, i'm back and i must say there's lots of interesting developments so far. i only did a quick read cause its late but will look over it more carefully tomorrow.

i'd say that I believe those who have claimed. i'm keeping my vote on Niv for the time being because I found his PBPA of Jenter to be terrible. also, i can see him trying to defend the innocent who was playing so badly (gator the VI) that he was likely to get himself lynched.

i also don't like the idea of the double lynch that jenter suggested. i'll explain below.

Gatorguy and Jimmy are as good as confirmed in my eyes. Unfortunately that means I don't think they'll live long. It's more likely that Jenter is scum. But since we can direct his kills, I don't think we should lynch him today.

vote: Oman

Whoever we end up lynching, we should establish two plans for Jenter: one if the lynch turns up town, and one if the lynch turns up scum. These may or may not be the same.

We still need to hear from a few people before we proceed.

I'm a bit confused here Eroto...why u think jenter is scummy based on how simple it is to confirm his role...at least i think its like that if i understand the roles correctly. Mafia gets one kill during the night, right? If mafia gets one kill and vig gets one kill then its easy to confirm Jenter's role cause there will be two kills. Jenter, you should not publicize who you will kill as vigilante (next night phase) cause mafia can then double your kill so that there will only be one death during the night phase. this will indicate to everyone that you were lying and probably get u killed in D2. why would mafia do this? because then they can kill the most dangerous power-role left without possibility of doctor assistance. best is to not tell us who you NK and if two turn up dead then we'll know your role is legit.

I hope I'm understanding these roles correctly because this is first time i'm seeing vigilantes or masons. also, is it certain that vig wins with town?

[Erotomachia]

Vigs always win with the town...otherwise they're called SKs.

But yeah, you're right. We probably shouldn't be telling the power roles what to do. I didn't even consider the possibility that the mafia could kill Jenter's target. Then we couldn't be sure whether Jenter is scum or not.

On the other hand, I wouldn't want Jenter to kill any random person just to confirm himself. For example, I think that he definitely should not kill Gator or Jimmy. Since we'll lynch someone today, that will leave 8 possible targets for him tonight.

..but I'm still not joining the Gatorguy fan club.

You think he's scum? But in that case you must believe that Jimmy is also scum.

[ThaiBoxerShorts]

You think he's scum? But in that case you must believe that Jimmy is also scum.

I'm going to refrain from having an opinion on Gator/Jimmy for the time being. Jimmy doesn't strike me as particularly scummy, but I find Gator

so

scummy that it's kind of hard not to be suspicious of anyone he's linked to.

I'm just saying that in light of recent developments, I'm willing to give Gator the benefit of the doubt for now. Lynching him would be a poor tactical choice considering everything that has happened in the last few pages,. But that doesn't mean I'm letting him off the hook. I'll be keeping a close eye on him.

[Streeflo]

Don't direct town powerroles. kthxbai

[Oman]

About Mafia doing a double-kill. I don't like that idea. I doubt they'd do it, or they, essentially, waste a night phase (that is, they only get one kill out of a potential two).

Now that Jenter is a night-vig (confirmed), I could easily see it as an SK claiming vig. Of course, I don't believe it to be so, but the oppertunity is there.

Jenter should still kill the most scummy person (in his own mind, if you don't want to do a vote thing) as killing anyone else is just pointless.

[Erotomachia]

Here's where we stand now:

Jenter Brolincani (3) Gatorguy91, Jimmy R, Haut Boy
Oman (2) Streeflo, Erotomachia
Gatorguy91 (1) Jenter Brolincani
soupfly (1) Haut Boy
Niv (1) Soupfly

We still need to hear from Niv, Erg0, Haut Boy, and Gator.

[Gatorguy91]

woah, forgot to remove my vote on jenter

unvote jenter

[Streeflo]

Jenter, you should not publicize who you will kill as vigilante (next night phase)

cause mafia can then double your kill so that there will only be one death during the night phase.

this will indicate to everyone that you were lying and probably get u killed in D2. why would mafia do this? because then they can kill the most dangerous power-role left without possibility of doctor assistance. best is to not tell us who you NK and if two turn up dead then we'll know your role is legit.

I hope I'm understanding these roles correctly because this is first time i'm seeing vigilantes or masons. also, is it certain that vig wins with town?

This is stupid. You know mafia can choose to no kill and achieve the same result right?

[Oman]

Streeflo, Jenter has already stated he uses a machette. If it came they were "shot" then we'd know..unless Maz doesn't do that in his death scenes

As for not directing town powerroles...why not? I know not to direct cops or docs because thats mafia assiting and also has a few other things attatched to it (they often are smart enough to do it themselves). I don't understand not directing the vig..unless you are saying the mafia can direct it as well causing two "mislynches" per day (lynch and vig).

[Niv]

Jenter, you should not publicize who you will kill as vigilante (next night phase)

cause mafia can then double your kill so that there will only be one death during the night phase.

this will indicate to everyone that you were lying and probably get u killed in D2. why would mafia do this? because then they can kill the most dangerous power-role left without possibility of doctor assistance. best is to not tell us who you NK and if two turn up dead then we'll know your role is legit.

I hope I'm understanding these roles correctly because this is first time i'm seeing vigilantes or masons. also, is it certain that vig wins with town?

This is stupid. You know mafia can choose to no kill and achieve the same result right?

I am seing all the issues with oman, but righ now, reading this i have a problem. Streef: you actually think that the mafia will forgoe the night kill to incriminate jen, when they can just nk Jenter or one of the self coonfirming masons..... FoS Oman,

Vote Streefo

[Oman]

Niv has the same idea I had in 388. Why would they waste their night phase just to make Jenter look bad?

[Streeflo]

Streeflo, Jenter has already stated he uses a machette. If it came they were "shot" then we'd know..unless Maz doesn't do that in his death scenes

Must have missed that part of the role claim.

As for not directing town powerroles...why not? I know not to direct cops or docs because thats mafia assiting and also has a few other things attatched to it (they often are smart enough to do it themselves). I don't understand not directing the vig..unless you are saying the mafia can direct it as well causing two "mislynches" per day (lynch and vig).

If mafia have a roleblocker, they can roleblock the vig if he is targeting a mafia member. If not, they do nothing.
If the vig was going to kill an innocent and the mafia planned on killing the same innocent that night, the mafia can just choose someone else and avoid what might have been a crosskill.

Streef: you actually think that the mafia will forgoe the night kill to incriminate jen, when they can just nk Jenter or one of the self coonfirming masons.....

No I don't.

[Oman]

Ah I see Streef.

[soupfly]

problem we must address is how to verify jenter's role.

mod, can you clarify how the death scenes would play out? i.e. can the killers chose their weapons or are they predetermines (or random). do we know if the same person was killed twice? what are all the scenarios for this...that is assuming that jenter is telling the truth.

[Oman]

Soup, I don't believe Maz will tell us that. Mods tend not to reveal a whole lot of information (remember when you asked about Gator's absense)

[soupfly]

Soup, I don't believe Maz will tell us that. Mods tend not to reveal a whole lot of information (remember when you asked about Gator's absense)

i never asked about gator's absence, someone else did.

this is different. we are asking about the parameters of the game which are necessary for us to understand as we put together a strategy. i'm not asking to confirm or reveal roles but to tell us how the death scenes will be handled.