NY 187: Pariah's Mafia [/FIN]

[Boonskiies]

I greatly despise this dragon wagon

true dat.

[TheDominator37]

Boon please catch up. You inactivity is annoying me

[davesaz]

Re-evaluating Dom.
Actually, just re-evaluating.

[TheDominator37]

Dont try to meta me im trying something new this game

[Aeronaut]

Alright, going to do this a few pages at a time. I should be able to finish tonight.

p19, p20

I told you we needed to wait for Prolapsed Brain's response.

We didn't even get a role-claim

For the record, this post makes me pretty unconfortable. It sounds very "Look how pro-town I'm being!". AKA it looks like Key here is trying to pin the lynch on anyone but himself. And it seems almost rehearsed/fabricated.

Annadog40,

[Town] Gunsmith

, has died Night 1.
Mykonian,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.
Klingoncelt,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.

One of these kills makes Garmr town.

Wow.

Is that common for a large to have 3 NKs?

VOTE: duppin

Sheeping Mykonian.

Yea, I've seen it a few times before. Usually that many kills means we also have some pretty strong protective power to balance it out, though.

I'm really puzzled as to why you're so easily sheeping Mhykonian's scumreads for no other reason other than that he was town, and he died. Why not Anna? Why not Kling? There's zero chance you're so lost on reads at this point in the game that you have to resort to basing your vote off of the D1 reads of a dead VT.

Yeah, I'm sure everyone forgot I was pushing that wagon Keyser; thanks for bringing that up. Very pro-town of you.

VOTE: Bulba

You're calling Keyser Anti-town, but then voting Bulba. Just thought you ought to know.

I typically don't like going for lurkers, but Kitty Galore

sticks out as having posted just often enough to slide by without saying anything useful

or even voting.

VOTE: Kitty Galore

Pedit: Bulba stuck out too, but I thought Kitty's no-vote to be interesting, especially if it's a silent vote mechanism.

This is gross.

With all that's gone on do you really have no better direction than to vote someone for lurking? I mean, like, aren't there other lurkers, and why aren't you trying to push them? Tbh, the bolded just describes yourself. This was a safe-ass post and you know it.

VOTE: Keyser

Sheeping Mykonian.

Again with the sheeping Mhykonian. Has the bulba lead gone cold?

It was half-joke (after voting dupping) and half serious (I think Mykonian makes the most sense as a kill coming from scum) and I like to keep things simple and assume that people are killed because they have good reads. The Anna and Kling kills completely baffle me though.

Keyser's recent posting was pretty terrible and I'm not feeling the conviction in his posts.

PEdit - The vote came before FA, Bulba and Kling. We couldn't see it though, it wasn't included in the VC until a lynch was achieved (which was bullshit)

This post is really why I have a problem with the above posts. It would be easy enough for you to kill Mhykonian just so you could blindly and safely sheep his reads the next day. I feel like you're better than this.

Then if we are going to presume this is a scum pr then bulb is the best candidate because he voted with the intent to push him to L1

This is true. But I also don't feel like Bulba was in the game long enough to have made that vote, right?

Anna night kill doesn't make sense from a scum point of view. More than likely a vig if anything. She didn't add much to the game. I could easily see a vigilante thinking she was scummy.

Anna looked pretty town tbh.

BBT looks pretty bad in my opinion. Dave looks pretty bad in my opinion. Not sure about key yet. These reads may change as I go, but honestly BBT is probably where I'm voting today.

[Aeronaut]

I feel quite comfortable now just sitting here thinking and taking note of reads to myself. large games are like that through I can always sit back and analysis things at my own pace.

My turn to ask... my earlier impression of your play was to pick something and tunnel it. Did I misremember or something?

@Garmr, don't think I got an answer on this.

Anyone know Garmr well enough to comment on meta?

This soft meta push is silly.

Here are the votes on Prolapsed Brain's wagon:

Nope.

Cool.

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain

I noticed PB did post after he got called out, but didn't respond to it.
VOTE: Prolapsed Brain

VOTE: Prolapsed BrainGiving in to pressure seems rather scummy.

PB's iso is not giving me any positive feelings, though. He's not sharing information, and with 12 posts I feel I should know -something- about his read on the game, and I don't.

VOTE: PB

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain
Sure, I could get behind this.

That question makes me re-think my stance:

Pressure would

force

him to play to his win-con* and try to survive.

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain

I'm thinking pb needs some more pressure.

VOTE: pb

We need to get him talking and interacting.

<DOUBLE VOTE POSTED HERE>

Keyser, do you think it would look scummy for PB to suddenly start doing ~things~ once people started to vote him?

That question makes me re-think my stance:

Pressure would

force

him to play to his win-con* and try to survive.

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain

*as both town or scum.

This is true.

Lets see where this goes: VOTE: PB

VOTE: PB
Also iffy. He needs to get to l y n c h minus one.

That is more than 'pretty weak reasoning'.

Having said that; maybe if you join the PB wagon and we push him you will be able to develop a read?

Perhaps...

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain

I believe this puts him at L-2.

No, wait, I can go for Mykonin later.

Back to

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain.

Yea, so Bulba joined us after the vote was given. He replaced Silverwrath who I'm pretty sure siteflaked, so I don't really see him having put the vote there in that place either.

Because on the surface it looks pro-town (he has a lot of posts like this) but in reality it does nothing as anyone with a pair of eyes can go and look at the votes on the PB wagon and how they got there.

Keyser is trying hard to play the role of 'Helpful Townie' and I'm not buying it.

This is one of the few things I kind of agree with you on. However, your reasons for voting Key have changed. First you're just sheeping mhykonian, and then when you're called out on it it's because he looks fabricated. That looks cheap to me.

Guys, if you think this extra vote is a scum PR, then surely you think it's too powerful to be unlimited uses. And if it has limited uses, why would they use it D1? The only good answer I can think of is that they wanted to make sure that one of their own did not get lynched.
VOTE: dragonspawn
This makes sense anyway. Given the pushing of the counterwagon to dragon's by so many people, it's likely scum joined in on that. BBT would be a strong possibility for a dragon partner, but I'm more confident in dragon being scum.

I believe that Dragon is town because of this post You should too.

VOTE: Dragonspawn

I like this.

Nope.


Hey, here's a question: What if the person who double voted was

OFF

the wagon?

[Aeronaut]

Will do the rest tomorrow morning I think, I'm falling asleep on this keyboard

[FA_Q2]

FA. I just took a glance at cows ISO and it looked as if he was focused at the start of the game and then as the game progresses his quality in posts declines. I remember you said something about his meta earlier. Can you please post the link? I think I want to look at that game

I have no meta with cow. The only time that I think I mentioned meta was when cow was asking about PB. I think that this is the first game that I have played with cow.

[FA_Q2]

Annadog40,

[Town] Gunsmith

, has died Night 1.
Mykonian,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.
Klingoncelt,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.

One of these kills makes Garmr town.

Why?

That only makes sense to me IF you know the source of those kills - information that we are lacking AFAIK...

[Keyser Söze]

[To Post #719 - I wrote this last night, but fell asleep]

D2 vote history

BlueBloodedToffee - duppin, Bulbazoor, Keyser Söze
dragonspawn - Bulbazoor,
Keyser Söze - Bulbazoor, <unvote>
davesaz - Kitty Galore
Garmr - BlueBloodedToffee, dragonspawn
FA_Q2 - BlueBloodedToffee
Shazam - dragonspawn
RadiantCowbells - dragonspawn
Bulbazoor - dragonspawn, Aeronaut
duppin - dragonspawn
Kop - BlueBloodedToffee

D2 is still young, but we need more input from Boonskiies, Sword Master, Aeronaut*, Kop, Kitty Galore*

(*has started to post now)

.
So far, D2 has seen a great focus on Bulbazoor, then dragonspawn and finally on BlueBloodedToffee. I would like the above players to share their thoughts on the respective "wagons".

First of all, a summary of reads/comments relating to

Bulbazoor

:
FA_Q2 to Bulbazoor: "I want you to add something to the game in general." FA_Q2 calls Bulbazoor's play: "not only scummy - it is massively so". FA_Q2 links Bulbazoor to BlueBloodedToffee: "I think you are his partner though".
duppin raises a question to Bulbazoor in relation to his accusation about Keyser Söze trying to frame him: "If you think he is town, why would he want to frame you?". duppin shares his view on Bulbazoor's reaction: "Bulbazoor's reaction feels genuine to me". duppin says his concern about Bulbazoor's wagon: "Not feeling his train at all to be honest. I am interested in the people on it though." At the time only dragonspawn was on the Bulbazoor wagon, Keyser Söze had unvoted.
Kitty Galore: "I am not sure Bulb is scum".
RadiantCowbells says "Bulba is clearly a scum led wagon". At that time dragonspawn and Keyser Söze were on the Bulbazoor wagon.

Summary of reads/comments relating to

dragonspawn

:
Bellaphant says dragonspawn "seems to be obv!town".
RadiantCowbells asks Gamr: "Garmr, help us lynch DS. There's huge associative tells between the two, and a scum flip from one would basically entail an instalynch on the other."
Garmr says "the reason that dragon wasn't pushed to l-1 was because he is scum".
Shazam says "I find dragon scummier", in relation to BlueBloodedToffee.
FA_Q2 disagree's with Shazam's logic about dragonspawn's wagon: "This line of reasoning does not really makes any sense".
Bulbazoor says "Dragon is saying stupid stuff" and "Dragon is acting too pushy from his town self".
duppin says "the reason I find Dragonspawn suspicious is mostly because of PB's flip".
TheDominator37 says "I greatly despise this dragon wagon".
Kitty Galore defends dragonspawn: "I just didn't think any of the things DS did were lynch worthy"
The Cow supports Bulbazoor's theory about dragonspawn trying to push Bulbazoor's lynch: "I see, interesting theory. Perhaps we should look into this. To help us find evidence, would you mind pulling up quotes from Dragonspawn to help prove this? It would really help you prove your innocence, and in the long run, maybe root out a few scum! That would be fantastic"

Summary of reads/comments relating to

BlueBloodedToffee

:
Bellaphant said BlueBloodedToffee is "scum pushing a narrative".
Gamr said "i'm all good for a bbt lynch".
Shazam said "I agree with the cases on BBT", "consider me a potential vote for BBT".
FA_Q2 says "BBT is the larger concern here - not only is he more scummy but he is also the stronger player".
dragonspawn says "I'm townreading bbt".
TheDominator37 says "I find BBT's first posts quite scummy. He is pushing for votes off of absolutely nothing", "I actually think that he is scum", "I'm pretty confident bbt is mafia" and that there are "no reasons to let him live today".

Other interesting reads/comments:

RadiantCowbells said "If anyone's obv-town it's Garmr", "I don't know if I can take a thing that Dom posts seriously."
Garmr said "fa_q2 your on my to lynch list after ds and bbt", "not sure if kitty is bad town or scum".
Bulbazoor town-reads Keyser Söze: "Your meta seems like the other game" and "I am leaning scum on aeronaut."
dragonspawn describes RadiantCowbell's behaviour: "seems scummy to me", "that's the problem with rc he plays a scummy game in my opinion. Even as a townie".
TheDominator37 says "I also have a strong town read on key". "I should keep an eye on gar. He is being quite random and not explaining any of his reads.". "My scum list Bbt Kop Garmr". "My read on aeronaut is scum lean". "FA is a strong town read for me".
Kop, explaining his vote for BlueBloodedToffee: "From what I have seen, don't like his posts."
BlueBloodedToffee said "Prodge".

[I will add

my

comments and reads on these statements later this afternoon. In large games, there is alot of information to process.]

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Another important comment for you to add;

BBT gives 0 fucks about this game.

Discuss.

UNVOTE:

[Keyser Söze]

Reading through Aeronaut's catch-up observations - I like them very much:

Aeronaut on Keyser Söze: "For the record, this post makes me pretty unconfortable. It sounds very "Look how pro-town I'm being!". AKA it looks like Key here is trying to pin the lynch on anyone but himself. And it seems almost rehearsed/fabricated." [Valid point - my playstyle is very much try-hard townie. I invest all my energies into scum-hunting, and make sure I post my feelings/thoughts on events - so that people have an optimum of information on me, incase I am killed.]

Aeronaut on the 3 night-kills: "One of these kills makes Garmr town." [I am hesitant to ask Aeronaut: how? who? what? and why?. But I feel it would be anti-town at this time. I needed/wanted to flag it however.]

Aeronaut on BlueBloodedToffee's sheeping in D2: "I'm really puzzled as to why you're so easily sheeping Mhykonian's scumreads for no other reason other than that he was town, and he died. Why not Anna? Why not Kling? There's zero chance you're so lost on reads at this point in the game that you have to resort to basing your vote off of the D1 reads of a dead VT." [I agree with this - this behaviour is very alarming. BlueBloodedToffee has been confident in pushing wagons (with no reasons) but has repeatedly found it difficult to present his own detailed scum-read cases, instead, resorting to pushing/sheeping scum-reads of dead townies -

I view this as scummy

. His behaviour has demonstrated an anti-town attitude.]

Aeronaut on davesaz's vote on Kitty Galore: "This is gross." [This is true, alot has happened D1/N1/D2, and to vote for Kitty Galore for lurking is lazy IMO. Why doesn't davesaz want to comment on the bigger wagons?]

Aeronaut on the double vote: "Yea, so Bulba joined us after the vote was given. He replaced Silverwrath who I'm pretty sure siteflaked, so I don't really see him having put the vote there in that place either." [Yes, and Shinobi confirmed the VC was in chronological order].

Aeronaut on the double voter: "Hey, here's a question: What if the person who double voted was OFF the wagon?" [Agreed - the scum PR could be off or on the Prolapsed Brain wagon].

[Keyser Söze]

Another important comment for you to add;

BBT gives 0 fucks about this game.

Discuss.

UNVOTE:

Do you town-read me now? Or do you feel like you do not want me lynched for D2?


This is quite a jump from earlier (please explain this shift in read):

VOTE: Keyser

Sheeping Mykonian.

Keyser's recent posting was

pretty terrible and I'm not feeling the conviction in his posts

.

I believe you're scum

, yes.

Keyser is

trying hard to play the role of 'Helpful Townie' and I'm not buying it

.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I don't want to.

[Keyser Söze]

BBT gives 0 fucks about this game.

I don't want to.

You are either defeated scum, worried about damage limitation, or you are a townie experiencing a nightmare game

I want to put you out of your misery.

VOTE: BlueBloodedToffee

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I appreciate it but unfortunately I won't be lynched Today.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Should I claim now?

I noticed a lot of people are suspicious of me/voting me and I have no idea how many have actually done it.

Today is an important Day. After my flip people should remember who targeted me and why they did it. I guarantee scum are taking advantage of the situation; the amount of scum reads on me fro nowhere is quite telling.

[Keyser Söze]

Should I claim now?

Only at L-1.

Why don't you scum-hunt? Analyse your wagon at least. Never seen you this defeatist. If you are town, you are making yourself an easy lynch option for both town and scum. Tell us your reads and why you have unvoted.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Nah, I can't be assed with this game. I'm not enjoying it at all so I'd much rather focus on other games that I am enjoying.

I can tell you there is at least two scum (probably three) in Dom/FA/Kop/Cow/Duppin.

VOTE: Dom

I'll come back to this game in around 47 hours time.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Might actually try and read this today.

Haven't read the game properly since page 13 or something like that.

[Aeronaut]

Annadog40,

[Town] Gunsmith

, has died Night 1.
Mykonian,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.
Klingoncelt,

[Town] Citizen

, has died Night 1.

One of these kills makes Garmr town.

Why?

That only makes sense to me IF you know the source of those kills - information that we are lacking AFAIK...

I won't be answering this at any point today.

Another important comment for you to add;

BBT gives 0 fucks about this game.

Discuss.

UNVOTE:

Why? Because I'm pushing you?

I appreciate it but unfortunately I won't be lynched Today.

ehhhhhh

Should I claim now?

Only at L-1.

Why don't you scum-hunt? Analyse your wagon at least. Never seen you this defeatist. If you are town, you are making yourself an easy lynch option for both town and scum. Tell us your reads and why you have unvoted.

We're not putting anyone at L-1 for the rest of this game unless we're completely ready to lynch them.


Will be doing some more catchup today, but I'm also doing a lot of driving so it may not be until late tonight.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Aero, given you now know what you know; why are you still voting me?

[Aeronaut]

I wasn't to begin with.

[TheDominator37]

Nah, I can't be assed with this game. I'm not enjoying it at all so I'd much rather focus on other games that I am enjoying.

I can tell you there is at least two scum (probably three) in Dom/FA/Kop/Cow/Duppin.

VOTE: Dom

I'll come back to this game in around 47 hours time.

I am going to take this with a grain of salt because you still do not provide any reasoning!

[TheDominator37]

Might actually try and read this today.

Haven't read the game properly since page 13 or something like that.

Soooo.. Let's just lynch random people for reasons never to be told