NY 187: Pariah's Mafia [/FIN]

[BlueBloodedToffee]

OK so how does the fact that we're most likely in multi-ball factor into your thought process?

[pisskop]

Votecount 3.03

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Dragonspawn

- (3) Firebringer, garmr, Annarchy

Annarchy

- (2) Dragonspawn, Shazam

Firebringer

- (1) FA_Q2

FA_Q2

- (1) BlueBloodedToffee

Kitty Galore

- (1) Bulbazoor

Not Voting:

Boonskiies, Kitty Galore, Keyser Söze, Titus, Aeronaut, duppin, Ankamius

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With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch.
Deadline is 01SEP15, (expired on 2015-09-01 13:00:00)

[duppin]

That is the point though. I clearly stated I find him scummy, but that I was not too fond of his train.
I don't think his train makes a lot of sense unless scum are on it. That either means his teammates are bussing or that we have multiple scum teams. It is also possible he is town, but I sincerely doubt that is the case.

[Keyser Söze]

I have 4 pages to catch-up with.

[Garmr]

Sighs if we don't lynch ds then that means scum killed off all the smart town :/

[Bulbazoor]

Does it bother any of you that if I'm scum there hasn't been a single counter wagon today?

actually there was one on Firebringer, and there was some suspicion thrown my way
and your buddy Bulba is trying to get one going on Kitty

Fuck this. After I literally argued with dragon? Have you read?

[Bulbazoor]

VOTE: annarchy
That last statement.

[Shazam]

Shazam, why the turn around?

Duppin, you're unsure on Dragon based purely on wagon speed?

Posts 1535 and 1611, plus a gut read on his posts since then.

[dragonspawn]

Since when is bulb my buddy?

[dragonspawn]

Sighs if we don't lynch ds then that means scum killed off all the smart town :/

So do you say that because you dont consider yourself smart or because you aren't town?

[Garmr]

Also to those saying there is no case on ds learn to bloody read the game there has been 2 FUCKING DAYS WORTH OF CASES

to those saying how hard it was to get yesterday but how easy it is today. Multiple scum teams are a high probability his own scum team probally thought us town were SMART enough to lynch him today.

gahh this roster is killing me.

[Garmr]

Sighs if we don't lynch ds then that means scum killed off all the smart town :/

So do you say that because you dont consider yourself smart or because you aren't town?

If I wouldn't get banned for what i was thinking right now I would say it. But short answer none of the above.

[Ankamius]

My favorite part of the game so far is that the moment the dragonspawn wagon starts getting criticized, Shazam and duppin jumped ship immediately.

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: dragonspawn
VOTE: Shazam

This is by far the more scummy hop.

[Ankamius]

Shazam, why the turn around?

Duppin, you're unsure on Dragon based purely on wagon speed?

Posts 1535 and 1611, plus a gut read on his posts since then.

1535 has nothing to do with dragonspawn and he ended up hopping on the dragonspawn wagon after that post; 1611 was a question that was only ever answered by one person (ftr; that's a fake townslip if anything). The best part is that his only post between 1611 and his unvote was in support of the wagon.

Yeah, this slot's flipping scum.

[Garmr]

Sigh this dragonspawn lynch is looking like a dream. I think maybe the best idea is to lynch the people that look like scum I emphasize on the scum bit resisting it until I can get it through.

[dragonspawn]

Also to those saying there is no case on ds learn to bloody read the game there has been 2 FUCKING DAYS WORTH OF CASES

to those saying how hard it was to get yesterday but how easy it is today. Multiple scum teams are a high probability his own scum team probally thought us town were SMART enough to lynch him today.

gahh this roster is killing me.

Of there are two days worth of cases it shouldn't be so difficult to provide one should it?

[Garmr]

Also to those saying there is no case on ds learn to bloody read the game there has been 2 FUCKING DAYS WORTH OF CASES

to those saying how hard it was to get yesterday but how easy it is today. Multiple scum teams are a high probability his own scum team probally thought us town were SMART enough to lynch him today.

gahh this roster is killing me.

Of there are two days worth of cases it shouldn't be so difficult to provide one should it?

Day 1- your over action to people joining your wagon your behavior gets really defensive. Mentioned day 1 and was the first thought that popped in my head.

[Aeronaut]

P-dodge and Reading

[Aeronaut]

First, regarding Dragon/Dave:

Wow, busy weekend and the thread blew up while I wasn't looking.

Re 922 after a little looking I think I see it too. Obviously it would be hugely antitown to explain if it is indeed a guilty.
VOTE: Dragonspawn

I don't see a scenario where dave makes this post on his scumbuddy. Here he's pushing Garmr's unexplained and vague guilty on Dragon. Doesn't it make more sense for scumdave to want to question this a lot harder instead of pretending to "see" something if they were together?

That makes zero sense from a scum perspective. I feel like it's more likely that Dave saw Dragon as an easy mislynch and decided to just go with it.

[Aeronaut]

BBT why Titus?

[Garmr]

Quick summary of all the cases brought so far.

Day 1

Spoiler:

-Dragonspawns defensiveness to people voting him in rvs.

-Dragonspawn acting stupid to try and get people to brush off the fact he was defensive.

-How easy a prolapsed counter wagon was built up yet DS was just as scummy if not more.

-now we have a dave flip we can see how defensive dave was of dragonspawn.

Got a few minutes before my next meeting, so I have an opportunity to write down some thoughts. I don't have a big enough window to do an in-depth reread, so need to shoot from the hip here.

Keyser is giving me uncomfortable feelings of matching the "scum leading town" or "too town to be scum" tell. Things turn out bad when I miss these signs. I'd rather put a weak scum read here and have it improve over time than dismiss him and have it bite me later.

Hard to tell if Shazam beetlejuiced or if this is merely the time he's online. Must wait to see if a pattern of posting times develops. That's a really weak tell though so I'm leaving him null for now.

I agree that Dragonspawn's reaction seemed more defensive than it should be. But I do that as town myself at times, so I can't really scum read him for it. OTOH I haven't really seen anything that screams town either. I won't go into details on what the deciding factor might be, as it's not a good idea when scumhunting to coach possible scum on how they'd get me to town read them.

BBT still gets a weak town read. Pushing wagons for dubious reasons is ok early in D1. Kinda like the submarine tactic of firing a torpedo to see what direction your contacts move.

Garmr bugs me but I'm not sure exactly why. It's pure gut, and I don't mind admitting it.

Pedit: @dragon The weak read on BBT would be limited time only. The torpedo trick only works once, then he gets to do actual scumhunting.

Here is dave trying to justify dragonspawns response.

VOTE: Prolapsed Brain
Giving in to pressure seems rather scummy.

Here is dave jumping onto the counter wagon of ds.

-His reasoning for being on pb was pathetic.

I'm thinking pb needs some more pressure.

VOTE: pb

We need to get him talking and interacting.

DAY 2

Spoiler:

How does having a double voter mean it's a scum? Couldn't a townie have that pr too?

And how does that in any way implicate bbt? Just because he was pushing the wagon?

Seems to me that bulb would be more suspect since h specifically said he wanted to get the wagon to L1. I just don't know if the secret vote came before he joined us or not.

Look at this comment and how similar this is to daves.

Let's look at this:

Could be some ones a double voter

Dragon no point unvoting. It changes nothing.

You should rejoin wagon to make sure wagon is maintained in the case of Mod error.

@BlueBloodedToffee, you either knew about the scum PR which enabled the early hammer, or scum are setting you up for the miss-lynch. Your incessant push for Prolapsed Brain to be put near L-1 needs to be flagged.

This did catch my eye though. Why do you presume it is a scum PR? Couldn't it be a town double voter? One of the vote counts did have a <vote> inserted in the middle of the list.

These couple of posts tell a little story to me.

Anna night kill doesn't make sense from a scum point of view. More than likely a vig if anything. She didn't add much to the game. I could easily see a vigilante thinking she was scummy.

I saw nothing obviously town about Anna. In fact if I hasn't previous experience with her I would have suspected her more.

Anna was fairly obviously town; Kling was the vig shot if there is a vig.

Mykonian was 100% the scum kill. Could be multi-ball with scum also looking for other scum and killing Anna, that should be considered.

Also why would scum kill an obvious townie if they are looking for other scum?

These couple of post make me feel like dragonspawns team killed anna the way he behaves around the anna night kill is weird and not the type of interaction I would think of town. I don't think a townie would dwell on the one kill out of three so much.

The reason Garmr seems town to me is that the whole "RC was telling me to fake cop" thing, while misguided, also seems pretty genuine to me. Like I don't see a scenario where scum says it like that.

Really because I see that as a really scummy move. I didn't scum read him until that point.

It looks to me like he wanted to use the 'dragon was copped guilty by someone else' as a ploy to push a mislynch with the force of a cop claim and then be able to squirm out of it the next day if dragon flipped town.

Right now I am willing to go with bulb, garmr or bbt. All three are scummy IMHO.

so you think dragon is actually town can you tell me why

Could you tell me why I am?

And why you need to fake a guilty on me if its so obvious?

Has dave as a scum read yet when It become more and more obvious that I'm town that made a msitake pushes me as scum usning Similar logic as dave.

The reason Garmr seems town to me is that the whole "RC was telling me to fake cop" thing, while misguided, also seems pretty genuine to me. Like I don't see a scenario where scum says it like that.

Really because I see that as a really scummy move. I didn't scum read him until that point.

It looks to me like he wanted to use the 'dragon was copped guilty by someone else' as a ploy to push a mislynch with the force of a cop claim and then be able to squirm out of it the next day if dragon flipped town.

Right now I am willing to go with bulb, garmr or bbt. All three are scummy IMHO.

so you think dragon is actually town can you tell me why

Could you tell me why I am?

And why you need to fake a guilty on me if its so obvious?

This is just one example of him trying to push that I was trying to set him up and trying to get a lynch through on me.

Was going to make this longer but getting tired of typing while I see people ninja me in the preview

[Garmr]

First, regarding Dragon/Dave:

Wow, busy weekend and the thread blew up while I wasn't looking.

Re 922 after a little looking I think I see it too. Obviously it would be hugely antitown to explain if it is indeed a guilty.
VOTE: Dragonspawn

I don't see a scenario where dave makes this post on his scumbuddy. Here he's pushing Garmr's unexplained and vague guilty on Dragon. Doesn't it make more sense for scumdave to want to question this a lot harder instead of pretending to "see" something if they were together?

That makes zero sense from a scum perspective. I feel like it's more likely that Dave saw Dragon as an easy mislynch and decided to just go with it.

This logic is incredibly wrong you have to think like scum which your obviously not doing. If dave is scum buddies with ds and someone has a guilty on your scum buddy what sane scum would fight it. You put yourself in danger once your buddy flips. Hell maybe its the time difference between we joined aero but there was a stage in mafia scum were busting your buddies was the cool thing to do. The key here is the behavior flip when he saw his chance to jump off the ds wagon and jump on me.

[Aeronaut]

Sorry I did not mean to rub my inexperience all over your Dragoncase

I'll try to be be more careful about that next time

[Garmr]

You probably have the same amount of experience as me just the different era's we played in is what I'm getting at.