Mirth wrote:Gah Im really sorry I havent posted or finished reading. I have family visiting and I didn't expect that they would drive me absolutely insane. I'll be able to post late tomorrow evening, when they finally leave. Again, I'm really really sorry about this, because they're usually not this annoyingly clingy, and I didn't forsee this as a problem.
...ookey. We don't really care, sorry.
OK 1.) why did you post this? Just to show you are an ass?
2.) everyone should care, because WE ARE ON A SK DEADLINE...we need everyone commenting and posting...and voting, or the SK will pick us off one at a time
HazzelQ wrote:
Sorry Stewie I don't see the connection.... Me mixing up the games have nothing to do with that. Let's say I was scum, what would I gain from pretending to mix up the games??
It's a way to justify a comment you made earlier that sounded as if you were not a vanilla townie or were not aware that all pro-town roles are vanilla townie. I might have thought about easing up on you had you not done this twice in a relatively short period of time.
So when I acknowledged it myself that would have been real good for me whatever alignment I had? I still don't get how you can use it as an argument of me being scummy.
Mirth wrote:Gah Im really sorry I havent posted or finished reading. I have family visiting and I didn't expect that they would drive me absolutely insane. I'll be able to post late tomorrow evening, when they finally leave. Again, I'm really really sorry about this, because they're usually not this annoyingly clingy, and I didn't forsee this as a problem.
...ookey. We don't really care, sorry.
OK 1.) why did you post this? Just to show you are an ass?
2.) everyone should care, because WE ARE ON A SK DEADLINE...we need everyone commenting and posting...and voting, or the SK will pick us off one at a time
HazzelQ post#222 wrote:We = Me (I'm schizo... and in a bad mode, sorry)
HazzelQ wrote:
Sorry Stewie I don't see the connection.... Me mixing up the games have nothing to do with that. Let's say I was scum, what would I gain from pretending to mix up the games??
It's a way to justify a comment you made earlier that sounded as if you were not a vanilla townie or were not aware that all pro-town roles are vanilla townie. I might have thought about easing up on you had you not done this twice in a relatively short period of time.
So when I acknowledged it myself that would have been real good for me whatever alignment I had? I still don't get how you can use it as an argument of me being scummy.
1. you made a comment which, in this game, only scum would have said.
2. you justify your comment by saying that you were confusing it with another game.
3. you do it again.
To me, it seems that you are saying that you are confusing games to cover up a scum slip.
I've been repeatedly asking him to contribute (without expressing this on purpose)
If you want something you should express it, so things are abundantly clear.
I still don't see it. Post 212, 194, etc... None of these say lurking or any kind of non-contribution to me.
It sorta defies the point of catching him lurking if I make it abundantly clear...
Anyway, recently Stewie has been commenting on people (x seems town, y seems scum) without any sort of justification. (And I did specifically ask for this) To me this looks like a scum flying beneath the radar.
"Logic is a systematic method to come to the wrong conclusion."
[u][b]Next:[/b] Doctor Who Mafia[/u]
[u]Testimonials about Mgm:[/u]
:shock: - Stoofer
You put me through hell Mgm, my nerves are crushed :/ - Patrick
HazzelQ wrote:
Sorry Stewie I don't see the connection.... Me mixing up the games have nothing to do with that. Let's say I was scum, what would I gain from pretending to mix up the games??
It's a way to justify a comment you made earlier that sounded as if you were not a vanilla townie or were not aware that all pro-town roles are vanilla townie. I might have thought about easing up on you had you not done this twice in a relatively short period of time.
So when I acknowledged it myself that would have been real good for me whatever alignment I had? I still don't get how you can use it as an argument of me being scummy.
1. you made a comment which, in this game, only scum would have said.
2. you justify your comment by saying that you were confusing it with another game.
3. you do it again.
To me, it seems that you are saying that you are confusing games to cover up a scum slip.
Ok, you need to read what happened again. I posted directly after I made that mistake, before anyone else said anything about it. Oh, and also- #1 is total fallacy dude since I am not scum.
HazzelQ wrote:
Sorry Stewie I don't see the connection.... Me mixing up the games have nothing to do with that. Let's say I was scum, what would I gain from pretending to mix up the games??
It's a way to justify a comment you made earlier that sounded as if you were not a vanilla townie or were not aware that all pro-town roles are vanilla townie. I might have thought about easing up on you had you not done this twice in a relatively short period of time.
So when I acknowledged it myself that would have been real good for me whatever alignment I had? I still don't get how you can use it as an argument of me being scummy.
1. you made a comment which, in this game, only scum would have said.
2. you justify your comment by saying that you were confusing it with another game.
3. you do it again.
To me, it seems that you are saying that you are confusing games to cover up a scum slip.
Ok, you need to read what happened again. I posted directly after I made that mistake, before anyone else said anything about it. Oh, and also- #1 is total fallacy dude since I am not scum.
You posting directly after you made that mistake only means that you realized your mistake before people were able to pile on you for it. Good point about 1; append to it "or people who are actually confusing games" which I'd be willing to believe you were, had you not done it again in post 130 (and apologized for it in 131, which, once again, is irrelevant).
Sorry for my silence, its been hectic around here for the past few days. Now I have peace and quiet. yay. A continuation of the pbp I started:
100: CKD votes MGM and lists reasons for scumminess.
a) d3sisted and MGM voting each other as example of mafia voting each other early on. admits this is a weak argument
b) random vs. hunch reasoning for vote on CKD
c)MGM saying the vote was random after the hunch post.
d) metagaming on Raffles and Hazzel (I don't really get how this is scummy, though)
e) trying to push a lynch
d) unvote without reason, not sharing reason
101: MGM says an explanation will help scum more. also mentions that he's made the most posts besides CKD easy to find scumminess.
102: I ask CKD why vote MGM just then, even if everything has been around for a while, and mention to MGM that lots of posts dont necessarily mean more of a chance to be scummy
103. Raffles says he didnt get a PM until 3 posts after starting. asks mgm to explain contridiction
(I want a clarification on this, if you don't mind, Raffles. 3 posts into the game or 3 posts after you posted here)
104. CKD answers that he did a reread after seeing two votes on MGM. decided MGM was scummy.
(Hmmm...I might be missin something here, but I don't remember Kinetic unvoting in my reread. So that would have meant that with CKD's vote, MGM was at 4 votes. Hmmm...)
105. MGM tells me to reread his post. That more posts = more material to work with.
106. Kinetic checks in says he's kist reading this and doesn't like what MGM is saying
(I don't like this post in retrospect. It's pointing fingers without giving a reason)
107. MGM states that he feels that in CKD's post (100) that the 3rd reason was the only valid one. Says
a) weak argument. people check back at who votes who later. (this, like CKD's post, is WIFOM)
b) (I don't really understand this point)
c) admits to contridiction and bad memory (not really an answer)
d) comment on metagaming how Raffles really shouldnt have been excluded from it. (I don't see why this is such a big deal)
e) mentions that townies get antsy with deadlines
f) points to post 101
108: MGM responds to Kinetic's post about Pooky checking pms and cites my post (66) that says half the people posted before and half after and it really doesnt say anything about the SK.
109. I ask MGM is the townie coment is a claim. explain my position about not having a lynch, because of the nightless nature of the game that its better to wait than mislynch. i also mention that i understand MGMs point about more posts but gave a poor explanation, but that i think more material doesnt neccessarily mean more fodder for suspision. I mention that I don't like Kinetics suspicion of MGM and that MGM hasn't done anything new.
(I missed Kinetic's original vote on MGM. I was under the impression that I was the first vote on MGM when I made this post. At this point Kinetic still has a vote on him.)
110: MGM says that I could consider the townie comment a claim if I want to since its true, meant to say restlessness isnt scummy. Wants to get past random voting and get more info. Says that not having a lynch might not be a bad idea after all at this point.
111. CKD agrees to my faulty comment on Kinetic, mentions probably unsurity about whether its better to vote or not as motive. Asks for prods to get the game going.
112. Hazzel accuses MGM of being the SK. Thinks this is a newbie game. Thinks killing the person who MGM voted for is a way of detracting suspicion.
113. Hazzel laughs at MGM's comment on CKD's metagaming between Hazzel and Raffles
(This is where Hazzel's approach starts bothering me a little. Very aggressive. Not sure if its warranted)
114. Hazzel calls meaningless discussion on the when the SK first posted thing.
115. Hazzel says MGM claims townie and attempts to abandon plans to quicklynch because of the focus on him.
(it wouldn't have been a quicklynch. needed to have pointed that out.)
116. Hazzel agrees with CKD that we need more posting and says he sees no reason not to lynch MGM, because if MGM is a vanilla townie, we don't lose anyone important.
117. CKD called Hazzel out on the possible lynching of a townie, asks who Hazzel thinks is important, says he doesnt want to lynch a townie, says Hazzel's post seems scummy like an attempt to cover butt either way.
118. CKD berates quotes.
119. Hazzel says he isnt sure of MGM's alignment, doesnt see CKD's point, says he doesnt know any more than CKD.
120. Hazzel berates quotes.
121. Hazzel says he mixed up the setting and townies are just as important.
122. MGM says hes not trying for a quick lynch, but wanted a lynch predeadlin. Abandoning the idea due to lack of active players. Says claim has no weight as there is nothing else to claim
123. Stewie unvotes and votes Hazzel. says Hazzel's argument of losing an unimportant townie applies to lynching Hazzel s well. asks for condensed posts.
(don't really like the reason here.)
124. I post a list of things I don't like. Mention MGM's change of opinion. Not sure if i'm unhappy with it because of people ignoring that I've said this multiple times or the actual change. Mention Hazzel's post about lynching townies and that townies are not expendible, even in newbie games, which Hazzel seems to be confusing it with.
(I shouldn't have let Hazzel's post slide this easily)
125. Hazzel says he'll post as much as he wants, tells Stewie to go back and read his posts about expendible townies and the explanation to it.
126. Hazzel agrees that I have a right not to like his post about lynching townies, and that he still thinks its okay to kill townies because we can afford it, and we should try and lynch the scummiest person here. Says "take me out if you need to"
(I don't like the part about "take me out if you need to" like a bluff of whether or not to lynch. I also want to comment I was in a game where the least scummy person actually ended up being mafia, so I'm not too hasty.)
127. Kinetic says Hazzel and CKD are starting to look like scum. Unvotes MGM votes Hazzel.
(Here is the unvote to the vote I originally missed.)
128. I ask Kinetic why the opinion switch, why suspicious of CKD
129. Kinetic says his opinion wasnt a sudden switch and that his original MGM vote was a hunch and he left it on for longer than necessary to get more reads. Saw CKD and Hazzel picking on the smallest things (this is true, I think) doesn't think both CKD and Hazzel are scum, but one might be, thought Hazzel was worse.
(Then why double team? One latching on to the other?)
130. Hazzel says heis not moving his vote. Asks if he's at 3 votes and needs to role claim.
(This is the third time he confused games. This is starting to bother me, as its really not that hard to keep them straight.)
131. Hazzel apologizes for mixing up posts, says he doesn't have to say anything, to look at his other posts.
132. I comment on the mixing up games thing, that I'll have to wait and see as to whether or not I believe it.
133. Raffles asks MGM about the hunch/random thing. Says it looks like a story change in forgetting a cover up. Says to Hazzel that he doesnt see a deadline pressure so much as a need for lynching the SK soon.
(cover up for what?)
134. MGM says the name was random because "someone with a name like that had to be scum" no posts, nothing to base it on.
135. Hazzel laughs at something MGM said.
136. Ninja apologizes for not posting, promises to post tomorrow.
137: MGM says that we should consider the kill-period night and says that we are on a weeklong deadline
(I have to say I'm more inclined to agree with Raffles)
138: Raffles says that he thinks its better to try and eliminate the SK accurately and not inflict accidental damage on the town. Votes MGM
(This is vote number 4.)
139. Raffles unvotes MGM
(Did he realize this was vote number 4?)
140. MGM says he's not advocating collateral damage and that he changed his opinion about the need to lynch.
141. I ask Raffles why the vote and unvote
142. Raffles says the vote assumption wasnt unreasonable, but the vote was too rushed. wants to hear MGM. Asks MGM if he's not for a definate lynch before deadline anymore.
143. MGM says thats right.
144. Raffles asks me for my thoughts, says I've been on the sideline.
(actually I hadn't)
145. I ask thoughts on what. Say that I commented on everything I felt needed commenting on. Waiting for more people to actually say something.
146. CKD says that he asked for prods and that we don't have time to wait because of the SK deadline.
147. Raffles asks me if I'm holding back any information
148. Raffles corrects his comment, says he meant comments or opinions.
149. Heather says that MGM is acting scummy, and that the Hazzel/MGM discussion and MGM changing his vote about the lynch looks scummy. (I don't understand the rest of this post)
Going to check my other games and then finishing this up.
After the first failure to lynch, in a large part down to a complete lack of discussion from some people, I expected the next week would be better. I was wrong.
Heather called me scummy for changing my opinion, but she never helped to get us a lynch in the first place when we still had plenty of time to get one. The last vote I saw of Heather was August 14, that's right about the first day (circa 2 days in) - no votes since.
Not lynching 'yesterday' was not all that bad. After all we were lacking information to make an informed decision, but that is no excuse not to lynch 'today'. We know what slowness leads to, so we should know better than to get into the same situation again. The only way to beat the SK (and the mafia) is decide on a lynch. If we don't, we're sitting ducks, and we'll get picked off one by one.
"Logic is a systematic method to come to the wrong conclusion."
[u][b]Next:[/b] Doctor Who Mafia[/u]
[u]Testimonials about Mgm:[/u]
:shock: - Stoofer
You put me through hell Mgm, my nerves are crushed :/ - Patrick
Ok, I'm thinking I'm WIFOM'ing myself to death with this game. I don't like voting unless I'm airtight on my reasoning. Mgm, I don't think my reasoning with you is tight (hence my super confusing ass posts). This is why i haven't voted. Hazzel is still looking scummy to me. I don't like his confusing of the games or the aggressive nature he's been having with the last posts. All of this has been said and I agree with it.
HazzelQ wrote:
Ok, you need to read what happened again. I posted directly after I made that mistake, before anyone else said anything about it. Oh, and also- #1 is total fallacy dude since I am not scum.
I don't think pointing out the mixing up makes it any less of a scummy move. It wouldn't have gotten by anyway, even if you hadn't pointed it out, especally twice.
"Not a shred of evidence exists in favor of the idea that life is serious."
-Brendan Gill
150. Pooky posts the M4yhem was killed.
151. Kinetic says he thinks the SK is trying to frame MGM, suspects Hazzel, doesn't give reason though.
(he hasn't given very many reasons for anything, actually)
152. MGM tells Heather that he already explained his change of opinion.
153. Heather cites MGM failing to answer my question about why we should hurry and have a lynch by saying not having one is a good idea. Heather says the answer to Hazzel's question looks valid, but not the initial switch.
154. I tell Raffles that I'm stating what I think as we go along, say I have something to add to the recent townie death. I mention that MGM mentioned he didn't like misspellings and that this could possibly be either a random way of picking people to kill or someone picking up on MGM saying that and trying to set him up, like Kinetic said, but Kinetics post doesnt mention a reason. I ask why Hazzel. Not sure of what Heather ment in the last post. Don't understand the SK's choice of M4yh3 since all he did was vote me, and say he didn't think Hazzel was the SK. I don't think its an inactivity kill. Mention that it seems that M4yhem discounted Hazzel as a suspect and that Hazzel and MGM are the only ones with votes on them now. Also mention that D3sisted asked MGM why not vote M4yhem and this could be taken as possible breadcrumbing by the SK looking for mafia, but why not kill MGM is the SK is looking for mafia.
155. I wonder if it wouldnt be better for the SK to kill mafia so they can't gang up on him, but that it probably doesn't matter who dies as long as he's not left alone with a mafia majority.
156. MGM corrects my use of the word scum.
157. MGM lurker votes Ninja, FOS's DeepSouth.
158. Kinetic says that MGM is probably the most likely to be lynched and he see the town killing MGM so the SK would probably go for someone who isn't in danger of lynching just to eliminate people. Says he thinks a "newb SK" might think killing M4yhem would cast suspicion on MGM. Says he's suspicious of Hazzel, as well as others. And that there are two scum groups with info.
(Two things. Why assume a "newb SK"? Could be that the SK kill really was off D3sisted's post. And two who are the other people?)
159. I agree with MGM's correction, sk about Ninja vote, say I don't see the point of lurker votes. Ask Kinetic about two groups comment.
160. MGM says that the games been on for a while and not being able to post isnt an excuse, in regards to Ninja.
161. MGM corrects above.
162. CKD says hes still for an MGM lynch. Says that if we lynch MGM and MGM is mafia, then FOS on Kinetic. Asks how SK is trying to frame MGM with M4yhem kill, says he thinks there are better people to kill for a frame. Why would SK need to frame MGM. Thinks that if MGM were the SK he's take out someone voting for him
(wouldn't this be suspicious though)
Says the SK would probably get rid of someone voting for MGM to try and frame him. Wouldn't the SK be trying to frame me instead since M4yhem's vote was on me. How does killing M4yhem sped up MGM lynch.
(Should have called CKD out on this, but why assume the SK is stupid enough to kill someone voting for a suspect, because its not very likely someone would eliminate a person voting for them as that would be suspicious, so why assume the SK would use that to frame if its not solid logic. Actually this is all WIFOM.)
163. I ask CKD why Kinetic is suspicious if MGM turns out to be mafia.
164. CKD says it looks like Kinetic is defending MGM by trying to make it look like MGM is being framed. Doesn't trust anybody defending anybody else. Why the defense.
(Could be to keep from lynching a townie.)
165. MGM refers CKD to my post 154 for possible reasoning.
166. Hazzel asks Kinetic why he didn't answer my question of why Hazzel is suspiciousand most likely to be the SK. and what info Kinetic means and who the people are.
(Hmm...this is interesting. It is probably least likely that Hazzel is the SK due to the post thing.)
167. Kinetic says that both kills have been on MGM joke targets. Says he's defending MGM not because he thinks MGM isn't scummy but that he thinks the players wagoning on him are. Says CKD is putting words in his mouth about defending MGM. Says Hazzel chopped up his post and that he missed my question. Said he never said he though Hazzel was the SK, looking for a slip up. Thinks Hazzel is mafia, that one of the others on MGM is also mafia, and that MGM probably isn't the SK. Says the SK is his own group in response to my question.
(This accusation of post chopping doesn't hold up. I was unsure and checked, but Hazzel's first quote is post 151 the second is 158, I had indeed posted in between, asking that question. This is false on Kinetic's part.)
168. CKD FOSs Kinetic again, says MGM never targeted M4yhem. Asks how killing M4yhrm helps lynch MGM. Says that Kinetic seems to hve cleared himself both ways regardless of if MGM is scum. Asks if Kinetic thinks MGM is scum or not.
(This is a faulty premise. No one except the scum can be sure, so I don't fault Kinetic for this.)
169. Kinetic cites faulty notes. Thought MGM voted M4yhem after D3sisted, says "but it was really Heatherlou" says it was a mistake
(This is false. MGM voted CKD.)
Says his premise was flawed, but the SK wants MGM lynched regardless of alignment.
(this part is true)
Says he doesn't know what MGM is. Isn't going to say anything one way or the other due to pressure. Says he's seen scum pressure like this a lot.
(Yet CKD is asking for an opinion here. Opinions are not carved in stone.)
Says that regardless of what MGM is CKD will still be suspicious of Kinetic.
(This part is decent. All WIFOM, but it does theoretically hold).
Thinks CKD, Hazzel and I are the scummiest people here.
(I obviously have to disagree with this, on one count at least.)
Says hes not defending MGM and not going to "follow anyone blindly."
170. CKD says that "anyone playing mafia realizes why the SK did not want to hit MGM" and says Kinetic's faulty info would make it look like lynching MGM is scummy
(I don't understand this part. Also, note, my last post before this was the last post where I had a chance to actively play. So this is my first time doing a decent close read of everything starting after. I did post in between, but it was only comments on snatches.)
CKD says that Kinetic called him scum for calling out the fencesitting, not a logic trap. Thinks MGM and Kinetic are buddies and Kinetic is not sure of a lynch of MGM hence fence sitting. Asks why Kinetic won't admit why he's defending MGM. Asks why MGM is not on Kinetic's scum radar. Says he thinks MGM is still the person to lynch and he knows who he wants to target next.
(I'm not liking the cockiness of this post. Right now, on this read through, I'm thinking the two most suspicious people are CKD and Kinetic, both as possible mafia, and this may be distancing. This is all WIFOM right now though. I am not done reading yet. I type my thoughts as I go along.)
171. Stewie says he doesn't buy Hazzel's reasons.
(I don't like Stewie's brief posts, they don't add much.)
172. MGM says he voted D3sisted for crappy spelling and its not too much far fetched to think he has similar thoughts about M4yhem.
173. Kinetic says its not that he doesn't find MGM scummy, but that he finds MGM scummy on par with me, but Hazzel and CKD scummier. Doesn't like CKD's certainty that MGM is scum
(this point i agree with. No one can be certain of anything.)
Says he's not jumping on MGM because CKD and Hazzel as his prime suspects and that he's not defendng MGM. His defense of MGM is the same as CKD's defense of Hazzel.
(Hmmm... I missed this when I skimmed before. Why isn't Kinetic attacking me more head on here, if he really thinks I'm scummy? He hasn't really given any reason for me being scummy except for my vote on MGM at this point.)
Kinetic tells CKD not to threaten him, sarcastic comment.
174. MGM tells CKD to stop harassing Kinetic because if MGM dies CKD will find out that they're not partnets. Mentions other combinations. Says CKD finds Kinetic guilty without evidence. Asks how Kinetic defending him helps either of them. If theyre both scum, leads to two deaths, not one, and not MGM's playstyle.
(But is it Kinetic's playstyle? I'm not going to metagame here. The one time I tried it in another game it did not help me.)
175. Raffles says everyone who is posting looks scummy to him, not sure who to go for. lists his reasons as follows:
MGM: asks why harassing anyone is wrong, way to get them to talk, gained more insight on Kinetic.
Kinetic: seems to have no doubt on scum mind, with no WIFOM, seems to obvious to be scum though. Asks why not lynch anyone else (in refernce to SK wanting MGM lynched) Doesn't it not matter to the SK who gets lynched. Says d3sisted kill was probably random, and not too convinced that M4yh3m was a theme kill. Not liking Kinetic's reaction to CKD.
CKD: says CKD is talking sense
(Why?)
Me: Doesn't like that I contribute as things go along, townie should be trying to dig up stuff and generate conversation, says I'm not prepared to nitpick
(I'd like to point out that at this point, I've posted more than Raffles with nitpicking even.)
Hazzel: Asks for an opinion on Kinetic and MGM
(Okay....I don't like this post. Why not list reasons of possible suspicion for Hazzel and CKD. They haven't exactly been perfectly innocent n my eyes and I'm sure some other people agree here.)
176. Raffles asks us to ignore reference to another game.
177. Heather agrees with me that her last post didnt make a point. The point was that Heather read MGM's posts and found the switch scummy, and even if subsequent posts explained it, the initial switch was sudden and unexplained.
(I'm guessing Heather means backpeddling logic here.)
178. MGM says the switch had to be sudden and that with 1 week between kills there isnt enough time for a "nonscummy change of heart."
(Doesn't address the lack of reasoning for switch though.)
179. Kinetic says he was pointing out that an SK wouldnt atack MGM at all but wouldnt try to prevent MGM lynch. Thought he had more evidence when he brought up the point, learned he was wrong, says the point has not been contridicted yet
(Er...maybe i'm missing something, but wasn't Kinetic says that the SK was *framing* MGM...ie speeding up the lynch?)
Says the killing D3sisted lets the SK off the hook for killing mafia for now, says he first though MGM was the SK, but decided against that. Not sure if MGM is mafia though. Says he's not a fan of WIFOM because almost anything can be WIFOM
(this part about WIFOM is true.)
Wants to find a motive. Says to Raffles that his(Kinetic's) original theory for targeting M4yhem blew up and it was probably random. Didn't like Hazzel's jumping around and threatening people.
(I don't either particularly, but this post seems like damage control to me right now.)
Asks Raffles why not suspicious of CKD.
(This is a good point.)
180. MGM says no point in making Kinetic talk since he's already talking, says the premise of harassing Kinetic is faulty as he (MGM) is not scum. Asks for an answer about how questioning wagon makes Kinetic scum and how MGM killing d3sisted would be a coverup.
181. MGM says hes going to check if Kinetic is right about the quote splitting but FOSs Hazzel in the meantime.
182. Hazzel points out that Kinetic is wrong or lying about the post splitting as the posts referenced were 151, 154, and 158.
183. MGM asks for prods or replacements.
184. Hazzel quotes stuff about how Kinetic said he never said Hazzel was the SK.
(Hazzel quotes posts where Kinetic calls Hazzel as suspect here. To be fair, Kinetic doesn't actually say suspect for what. He might mean scum in general.)
Hazzel says its kind of impossible for town to know what scum are planning to do next.
185. Hazzel says he'll finish analyzing later.
186. Raffles says he's waiting for Hazzel's answers. asks Stewie for an opinion.
187. Pooky says that Ninja and DeepSouth have been prodded.
188. Hazzel says that he thinks while there is no proof that MGM is scum, MGM responds oddly when pressured and throws votes and accusations around, discusses meaninglessthings to stall, and has weird ideas that Hazze doesn't like.
(This isn't really a reason, I think.)
Hazzel says he hasn't jumped on Kinetic (Hazzel's vote is still on MGM) thinks Kinetic is a compulsive liar, doesn't think Kinetic is scum, just stupid.
(Er...I don't get this. If Kinetic isn't scum, why would he be lying?)
189. CKD asks if Kinetic isn't scum, why would he be lying.
190. I post, a brief overview of stuff after skimming the thread. (Hadn't had a chance to read everything between my last post and this one. This is after I passed out after not sleeping for 30+ hours. ) I unvote MGM. (Which I should have done before.) I ask Kinetic why he's associating me with CKD and Hazzel. I say I voted before Hazzel or CKD. I say that most of my posts refer to me wanting to be right about a lynch, not quick, so I'm not pushing. I think that MGM is possibly mafia though. I ask MGM why CKD should stop harassing Kinetic because harassing = information. I tell Raffles that I nitpick stuff when i see stuff to nitpick, if I don't see anything I wait until I do. Say I'll finish later.
191. Hazzel says he wants to revise his statement. He's not sure of Kinetic's alignment but thinks he's a lair.
(This doesn't answer the question)
192. MGM says he isn't stalling, says its okay to disagree with him, but he is trying to get discussion going.
(This is true)
193. MGM responds to me that pressure can lead to unneccessary defensiveness and might throw off a read.
(I don't agree with your comparison to claiming here, but it is a valid point otherwise.)
194. Stewie says he thinks at least one of Kinetic or Hazzel is scum, says Hazzel is more likely. Thinks MGM is town and at least one of the people on him is scum.
(Care to elaborate, please?)
195. Hazzel reference post 114. Says he's going to reset.
(Why is Hazzel so frustrated here?)
196. CKD asks for a clarification, asks Hazzel what his tactic was before.
197. Hazzel clarifies that he doesnt like that his tactics arent getting him anywhere. Tries to inflame people if scu, to slip up but its not working
(I just have to add that I don't think its a very valid tactic inflaming tht is).
198. Stewie corrects Hazzel's typo.
199. Kinetic says he's made a few mistakes in the game, and he's getting picked on for stupidity on his part. Says he's rereading and unvotes, but thinks he'll move it back to where it was.
200. Hazzel asks for a grammar clarrificantion.
201. Hazzel agrees with Stewie's correction.
202. Pooky says Xyzzy is replacing Ninja
203. I apologize for abscence start post analysis from very beginning to post 99.
204. MGM says he's still not willing to share the reason for his unvote of CKD back in the beginning of the game, because it would help the scum more.
(Would you care to explain why it would help the scum more, at least?)
205. Hazzel says that he thinks MGM is trying to imply he's a cop, smiley face.
206. Hazzel says MGM doesn't know anything that we don't know, asks for the reason, says its not information for sure.
207. MGM says that there are severa things he knows that we don't know and if we don't have an idea about what they are, he's not going to mention it.
(ohhhhhkay....i'm confused here.)
208. MGM asks for participation.
209. Raffles ass Stewie for reasons on why either Kinetic or Hazzel are scum in his opinion.
210. Kinetic asks for an SK deadline extension due to real life and not being able to post.
211. MGM says an extension would be nice and that we need replacements.
212. Stewie says he doesn't like Kinetic and Hazzel's arguing and that Hazzel is more likely to be scum because of confusing this game with the newbie game (which happened, yes, but has since stopped). says MGM seems to be protown.
(I still am not thrilled about hte lack of actual content from Stewie. This post doesn't say much.)
213. MGM votes Hazzel because of lynch deadline and lack of other target, says that he would be happy to lynch present but not posting players.
214. Raffles votes Stewie by lynch all lurkers.
215. MGM points out that Stewie posted almost as much as Raffles and has been sharing his opinions.
(Which is note entriely true. Stewie, while sharing, hasn't ben substantiating.)
216. CKD is surprised about the opinion that Stewie is lurking.
217. Raffles says Stewie i lurking in plain sight byt not really contributing. Says he didn't know the game started until some pages in. Mentions other game with lurking scum.
(I don't like metagaming, but agree that Stewie hasn't contributed much.)
218. MGM says Raffles should have asked for contribution directly, but that he doesn't see Stewie's posts as none contributing.
219. I apologize for my abscence.
220. Hazzel says he doesn't see what game mixups have to do with being scum.
(I think the point here was possible use of the newbie card.)
221. Hazzel says that he really doesnt care about my reason for being away.
(Jeez, no need to be rude. I was apologizing for contributing to the hold up of this game, though if it suits you better I can disapear without a reason next time.)
222. Hazzel sort of apologizes.
223. Stewie says something that I don't quite understand here. Says he doesn't see how Raffles thinks he isn't contributing.
(Here, I would like to ask Stewie to back up his opinions on other players with post quotes and such)
224. MGM asks for a votecount.
225. CKD jumps on Hazzel for the rude comment, saying that everyone should care because we're on deadline.
226. CKD offers an unofficial votecount.
227. Hazzel answers Stewie's confusing post with a confusing post. (I don't get this, but I don't think its important right now)
228. Hazzel cites his sort of apology.
229. Hazzel again sort of apologizes, but not really.
230. Stewie says that Hazzel made a comment only scum would have, justifies it by citing game confusion, does it again.
(Okay, I think I get this now. His point is that Hazzel's lost of townie thing was scummy)
231. Raffles says that it sort of defeats the purpose of catching lurkers
(why are we on a lurker hunt? I thought we were hunting scum. The two are not synonymous.)
Says Stewie has been commenting without justification. Says it looks like scum flying under the radar.
(Couldn't this also apply to you, Raffles?)
232. MGM asks if Raffles was just trying to make an accusation of lurking stick. Fos's Raffles.
233. Hazzel says he posted right after the mistake before anyone said anything and that the argument is a fallacy
(But Hazzel also said that he still doesn't see anything bad about lynching townies even after discussion)
234. Kinetic votes Hazzel, says he is the best bet.
(Reasons please?)
235. Stewie says Hazzel posting about the mistake only means that he realized it before anyone else,. Also says that Hazzel did it again.
(This seems kind of irrelevent)
236. Raffles asks MGM about the FOS.
237. CKD says we're at deadline.
238. I post a pbp of 100-149.
239. MGM says after the first no lynch he expected a lynch the second week, but was wrong, says that Heather called him scummy but hasn't been helpful. Says we need a lynch now.
(MGM, you're currently voting Hazzel, how sure are you of that?)
240. Heather says she doesn't like voting without being sure (I agree here), mentions the game confusion thing with Hazzel.
And that brings me up to date. I'm going to go take care of a few quick household chores and then get back here with my opinions of players. I am not prepared to vote, yet, however, as there is lots of stuff still unanswered.
Okay, player impressions (sorry for the mass posting), I'm going in the order of the front page. I'm basing a lot of this on degree of lynch pushing, because, while I think we do need to figure out who the SK is and quickly, I'd rather have something solid to go on before we kill anyone. My premise is that anybody who is completely sure or seems completely sure of a lynch suspect seems to be more suspicious since only 4 people here know something the rest of us dont.
CKD- very active, which is good, and brings up valid points, but I don't like his method of attacking Kinetic (see my above post for reference to which posts bother me) or his certainity that Kinetic and MGM are partners. I think it is possible that he and Kinetic are partners and that was all distancing, but this opinion is all just WIFOM and I know it. I do think his initial attack of MGM was warranted, though, but I don't like the pushing for a lynch. I'm leaning toward mafia.
Deepsouth - no opinion at all. He had a couple of posts early on, but I really have nothing to say about him.
Hazzel - Aggressive, not particularly nice in agression. I don't like the accusations of Kinetic being a liar, but that is mainly because of the follow up. If you're not sure if hes scum or not, you cant be sure if he's lying or not. The two are dependent. I also don't like the attempts to inflame people. Sure, I believe in battering people, but not with accusations. I don't think Hazzel is the SK, but I'm not going to rule out the fact that Hazzel might be mafia, but right now I'm just not sure. I also don't get why, after that whle long exchange with Kinetic, Hazzel's vote is still on MGM. See above for a few particular things that bother me. Oh. And I don't like Hazzel's townie claim. It was unnecessary.
Heatherlou - not much of an opinion here. She hasn't said much. I don't think she's mafia simply because she hasn't interacted with anyone else very much, but I'm not ruling out the possibility that she is the SK. My opinion here is neutral, possibly leaning toward townie though, as she's not actively pushing for a lynch on anyone.
Kinetic - I definately do not like a few of his comments, especially about Hazzel splitting his posts. (By the way, Kinetic, you still haven't answered about that. Please do so.) I don't like his all out arguement with CKD (this could be WIFOM on my part, I'm aware of it.) I think he is possibly Mafia, but probably not the SK, unless he's breadcrumbing stuff.
MGM- He bothered me early on with the d3sisted hunch/random thing, and up until my abscence and read through I was thinking he was probably mafia. I am not sure now, but am leaning to townie, based on the exchanges between Kinetic and CKD, as those just seem to bother me a lot. I also like that MGM is pushing for conversation, which is protown.
Raffles - I am suspicious of Raffles. I don't like his attempts at trying to catch people at lurking. (Though I agree that up until recently Stewie really wasn't contributing much) I agree with MGM that its better to directly question. While I understand that some scum like to lurk, there are other scum who are super active, so I don't want to generalize anything. I don't like how he wrote off CKD as protown and didn't post an opinion of Hazzel a while back.
Stewie - Not much of an opinion. I would like to hear his opinion of everyone.
Xyzzy/Ninja - No opinion at all.
That said, its now past the SK's deadline, so its too late for a lynch anyway.
jesus man, you do this in every game...I just finished reading that, how long did that take you to type..
there is a couple items I think I want to address, but it will require me going abck and rereading your reread, which I dont have time for at the moment.
one thing I noted I wanted to mention.
Mirth wrote:
Says the SK would probably get rid of someone voting for MGM to try and frame him. Wouldn't the SK be trying to frame me instead since M4yhem's vote was on me. How does killing M4yhem sped up MGM lynch.
(Should have called CKD out on this, but why assume the SK is stupid enough to kill someone voting for a suspect, because its not very likely someone would eliminate a person voting for them as that would be suspicious, so why assume the SK would use that to frame if its not solid logic. Actually this is all WIFOM.)
I know, which was my point. The whole SK is trying to frame MGM was ridiculous on many levels...I dont think the SK would try to frame anyone...Think you might be missing my point on this post.
"I hope one day I can openly play as wolfy as Pooky and get zero pressure for it grumble grumble."
-MariaR
"I can't even look at the game anymore.
That evil teddy bear has got everyone twirling by his thumb.
It's like witnessing an slow but unavoidable train crash you can't stop."
Why are you convinced it was used to frame MGM? DeepSouth had two posts. The first post he FOSed you for something you didn't say in regards to the serial killer posting (you didnt correct him). And he voted Raffles for not having posted yet. The second post he unvotes. No connection to MGM whatsoever, why bring it up?
Mirth wrote:... while I think we do need to figure out who the SK is and quickly, I'd rather have something solid to go on before we kill anyone. My premise is that anybody who is completely sure or seems completely sure of a lynch suspect seems to be more suspicious since only 4 people here know something the rest of us dont.
I disagree. With someone getting killed every week, we can't afford to wait to hit something 'solid' before we lynch. We'd be dead long before it happens. A reasonable suspicion should be enough to lynch like it is in any other game.
Besides what kind of solid thing are you hoping for? There are no cop investigations and no useful roleclaims (everyone would claim townie).
"Logic is a systematic method to come to the wrong conclusion."
[u][b]Next:[/b] Doctor Who Mafia[/u]
[u]Testimonials about Mgm:[/u]
:shock: - Stoofer
You put me through hell Mgm, my nerves are crushed :/ - Patrick
178. MGM says the switch had to be sudden and that with 1 week between kills there isnt enough time for a "nonscummy change of heart."
(Doesn't address the lack of reasoning for switch though.)
It's all in the timing. If we don't get close to a lynch by Friday/Saturday anything after that would be a rush job. That's when not lynching became a good idea.
180. MGM says no point in making Kinetic talk since he's already talking, says the premise of harassing Kinetic is faulty as he (MGM) is not scum. Asks for an answer about how questioning wagon makes Kinetic scum and how MGM killing d3sisted would be a coverup.
Why didn't you comment on this? I'm still waiting for an answer and no one gave it.
204. MGM says he's still not willing to share the reason for his unvote of CKD back in the beginning of the game, because it would help the scum more.
(Would you care to explain why it would help the scum more, at least?)
No, I don't.
215. MGM points out that Stewie posted almost as much as Raffles and has been sharing his opinions.
(Which is note entriely true. Stewie, while sharing, hasn't ben substantiating.)
There's been a lot of non-substantiating going on (see 180), but not doing so is a far cry from lurking.
231+232: Mirth actually gets it. Still no idea why, Raffles?
239. MGM says after the first no lynch he expected a lynch the second week, but was wrong, says that Heather called him scummy but hasn't been helpful. Says we need a lynch now.
(MGM, you're currently voting Hazzel, how sure are you of that?)
"Logic is a systematic method to come to the wrong conclusion."
[u][b]Next:[/b] Doctor Who Mafia[/u]
[u]Testimonials about Mgm:[/u]
:shock: - Stoofer
You put me through hell Mgm, my nerves are crushed :/ - Patrick
