Mini 497 - Game Over

[dusterhan]

i've got no idea who could be mafia... so, lets leave me alone and discuss who else could be a scum

[kabenon007]

yes, let's. That's a combination of let and us, that means you included! You need to help too!

[joost]

i've got no idea who could be mafia... so, lets leave me alone and discuss who else could be a scum

Okay, that post has convinced me you are actually scum.

Vote: Dusterhan

and I doubt I will remove this vote any time soon. If you want to prove you are pro-town you need to join this game, read all the posts and tell us what strikes you as strange or scummy. As long as you don't do that I will suspect you.

[Sephiroth]

i've got no idea who could be mafia

... so, lets leave me alone and discuss

who else could be a scum

I really dislike when people tell the town to discuss, and add nothing of their own. How can you say that you have no idea who the mafia are, then ask us to discuss who

we

think they are. It's ridiculous.

Please reread the thread, and tell us what you think of a couple players. If you give us another BS post, I think I'll be leaning towards voting you.

[Atticus]

Dusterhan... Tsk tsk tsk... You need to stop volunteering for things you can't do. Examples: answering questions, playing the game mafia.

[Sephiroth]

...

Who are you suspicious of?

What posts strike you as odd?

Why are you being a

n

idiot

lurker?

Is there some real life complication that you have that stops you from having an opinion?

...

These are some questions I posted earlier for you, Dusterhan, feel free to answer.

It's just occured to me, that Atticus didnt ask you who you thought was suspicious. He asked you two questions, both easier to answer than who you thought was scum. Can you please answer them?

[Atticus]

Did I miscount? I thought there were four...

[Sephiroth]

My mistake. For some reason I was only reading the bold portion.

[Atticus]

Ah, I was using that as a way to separate the questions, make it easier to read.

[destructor]

i've got no idea who could be mafia... so, lets leave me alone and discuss who else could be a scum

Okay, that post has convinced me you are actually scum.

Vote: Dusterhan

and I doubt I will remove this vote any time soon. If you want to prove you are pro-town you need to join this game, read all the posts and tell us what strikes you as strange or scummy. As long as you don't do that I will suspect you.

Can you explain how that quote has convinced you that dusterhan is scum? I don't mean to defend dusterhan the slightest, but that vote seems a little hasty.

[joost]

Well I have suspected Dusterhan since his "...or am I?" post. Later on I started having doubt that he might not have understood what the game of Mafia is all about, namely reading other people's posts and drawing conclusions based on that (or of course lie through your teeth if your scum). He seemed to post without reading anything.

The he asked what questions we asked him (he could have read them) and Atticus repeated them. Now Dusterhan has acknowledged he read them and still he refuses to answer, that's downright scummy behaviour if you ask me.

[Atticus]

I would love to lynch dusterhan once he posts simply because he infuriates me so, but I really can't come to any conclusions when he's bluntly avoiding questions and... the game.

[kabenon007]

Really, though, in all honesty, what other conclusion can we make about dusterhan? What possible gain could a townie have with not posting, avoiding questions, and baiting us?

[joost]

I agree with Kabenon. As long as Dusterhan keeps posting every few days and he doesn't add anything to the game but confusion, there's no need to let him live. If let him live and lynch someone else, scum will probably not kill him if he is town and he will bug us on Day 2 too. And the more people get killed the more influence Dusterhan will have on the game. I say we lynch him and get on with the game in a reasonable manner.

[joost]

EBWOP
Are Knuck and SP still around?

[Knuck]

Yup I'm here. I get the feeling Dusterhan isn't scum but at this point it doesn't really matter considering he will just keep posting the same garbage over and over, too bad it wasn't replaceable. I can't see why we don't just ignore him and look for other scum tells from other players. We can't say 100% either way what he is, no one knows. I'd rather lynch someone that has acted scummy, and as much as Dusterhan annoys me by not playing the game, I personally think we would just be throwing away a day to some useless newbie.

Then again a lynch on him may help us after the fact by providing us with more information, which we are in dire need of.

Ill

Unvote

as of now, but am still not comfortable voting for Dusterhan, as much as he is not helping.

[joost]

I can't see why we don't just ignore him and look for other scum tells from other players.

I hear that a lot, but I don't see anyone actually doing any scum hunting. What has been going on on this thread is people saying Dusterhan is annoying and he might be scum or Dusterhan is annoying but we should ignore him.

Ignoring him doesn't mean repeating that we should ignore him. If people don't want to lynch Duster, I'd like them to say who they do find suspicious and why. Otherwise this game will just drag on the way it's been doing.

I'd like people to post their list of suspects, here's mine, High to low

Dusterhan

- For reasons I have stated several times, most importantly he's not willing to help the town and he admits it

-Tinvision-

- For his odd change of opinion and vote in posts 102 and 104. He explained himself, but as townies have more to gain by reading the game thoroughly, not reading properly is a scum-tell in my book. Also his defense of Duster by referring to a different player in a different game is odd and suspicious.

Knuck

- Ok I think I'm guilty of not reading the thread to thoroughly or maybe my memory is phailing me. I reread Knuck's posts and I saw his post #130.

Dusterhan has been absent in all of his games not just this one. He joined up as a newbie, quickly got into two games, played badly because he is young and bored, then left.

I read all Dusterhan's posts and he only signed up for 2 games. This one and Mini 492. He didn't leave any game. This is either a blatant lie or a very bad guess. Knuck mentions Duster playing like this in all of is games later in post #162 and that's when I notice it and comment on it. But I complete forgot/missed he said something similar (but much more scummy) earlier.

FoS: Knuck

SilverPhoenix

and

Nekka-Lucifer

- Both for lurking and not adding much content, we're still waiting for SP to do what he promised more than a week ago. But besides the lurking I don't have any thing concrete on them. They ahve not really helped town much.

Kabenon007

- For voting for Dusterhan not to pressure him and not to lynch him. However that's the only odd thing I could discover about Kabenon. Overall I get a townie vibe from him

Atticus

- He didn't do much to help the town at first but I think I need to get used to his style of playing. He makes very short posts most of the time and he's often very sarcastic. I need to make sure I don't confuse that with being scummy. He's been adding more content to the game lately, though I'm not sure if that's because he's getting very annoyed by Dusterhan (being in 2 games with him and all).

Destructor, Aimee, Sepiroth and Nirp

- I can't find anything suspicious on these people. They strike me as willing to help the town catch scum. I don't think one is acting more pro-town than the other, but they are on the bottom of my list together.

[Nirp]

I hear that a lot, but I don't see anyone actually doing any scum hunting. What has been going on on this thread is people saying Dusterhan is annoying and he might be scum or Dusterhan is annoying but we should ignore him.

We have been focusing on dusterhan quite a lot. It seems this is useless, as nothing we do short of lynching him is going to change anything. I personally still believe he is likely town, but since he isn't contributing anything I wouldn't be terribly upset if he got lynched. Either way, it is hard to tell his alignment when he doesn't post content, but my guess he is simply uninterested town.

Ignoring him doesn't mean repeating that we should ignore him. If people don't want to lynch Duster, I'd like them to say who they do find suspicious and why. Otherwise this game will just drag on the way it's been doing.

Agreed.

-Tinvision-

- For his odd change of opinion and vote in posts 102 and 104. He explained himself, but as townies have more to gain by reading the game thoroughly, not reading properly is a scum-tell in my book. Also his defense of Duster by referring to a different player in a different game is odd and suspicious.

Although I agree that -TinVision- has been suspicious, I am not sure if not reading properly is much of scum-tell. When I am scum, I will likely be extra careful to read everything well precisely so I don't make any errors that people might find suspicious.

My own main suspects at the moment are -TinVision- and kabenon007. Both have suddenly changed their opinions and have been posting some really shady arguments. However, I can't say that I am particularly convinced either of them is scum.

Mod:

has Nekka-Lucifer been replaced yet?

SilverPhoenix has been rather absent lately, although I admit I can't find a lot to say either at the moment. I'd like him to post some content though.

[Aimee]

unvote

.

Limited access for a while coming up.

[Sephiroth]

My thoughts on all of the players that I suspect, off the top of my head (or in one case, that I think should be lynched despite alignment). I will make a second post later detailing the other players in the game. All the other players did not really stand out to me, so I'm going to reread and find out why this is.

Atticus:

Atticus makes several small posts early in the game, though most of his comments are arbitrary or noncommittal in nature. This earned my early suspicion. He goes on to make a weird post 22 about Dusters motives, clarifying something that he doesn't actually know. I'm guessing this was to get a reaction out of duster, however. From that point on he gets serious and into the game. Defends Tin once, attacks Nirp, expresses suspicion on Kabenon, and Fosses him. He was starting to become a more active player, but now he seems to have partially returned to his previous habit of posting arbitrary things, or making posts that are noncommittal. He's been going back and forth between these two types of posting all game, and I am therefore slightly suspicious of him.

Dusterhan:

Earlier I pointed out that it would be a good idea to ignore Duster. It is quite clear that Duster does not plan to contribute anything to the game. Because of this, we have no idea of his alignment. Going by percentage, it is highly likely that Duster is town. However, after much thought, I'm starting to think that Duster may not be a bad choice of lynch after all. Firstly, there is the matter of info that we may get from a Duster lynch. People have said throughout the day how we don't get much info from a Duster lynch. But think about it; who has yet to post an opinion on the issue? As far as I can tell, everyone has a well documented opinion of a Duster lynch, and there is the matter of some odd behavior by certain players (tin and Kab's weird switches for example). The duster lynch could give us some good info. Second, Joost makes a good point in 213; If we dont lynch him now, when will we? I find scum NKing him highly unlikely. As joost said, the longer that Duster lives, the more he will hurt the town, and influence lynches. This will be especially bad in endgame. Thirdly, Duster is unwilling to scumhunt himself. He also asks "who are we picking on". I am very worried that late game he will be susceptible to being lead by scum and this will be VERY dangerous late in the game. So I think a Duster lynch would be a good move right now.

Tinvision:

He seems to make two random votes which is odd, and his play is almost too random for the random stage. But this is really a matter of playstyle more than anything. Later he says the case on Duster is weak, yet jumps on a few posts later. He explains his mistake in 109, but to me it seems a way to get out of having to explain himself fully. I think his next post with the full explanation was weak, but thats simply my opinion, and not something I can base suspicions off of. I liked his argument with kabenon on page 5. He then lurks for a while, and posts on page 7. He claims that his vote on Duster was out of frustration, though when he originally voted, he claimed it was because the lurking was scummy. Why does he unvote then? It's not as if Duster has stopped lurking. Logically, he should still think he's scummy. Why would he decide not to lynch him if he thinks he's scummy enough for a vote earlier on? I have no idea. He has been lurking ever since. Tin is looking pretty suspect in my eyes.

kabenon007:

I dislike his post 33. I ask a question directly to Duster, so as to pressure him, but kabenon speaks up in his defense. It really hurts the effectiveness of a post when another player answers for the intended player.
post 51: says duster is unhelpful to town.
post 80: reiterates that duster is unhelpful. says "he is not scummy...yet".
post 98: claims that dusters scummy looking posts can be explained by newbness. what happened to duster not looking scummy, just unhelpful?
post 100: asks why duster looks like newb scum as opposed to noob town.
post: 115: ignores joosts answer. says that destructor is logically right in his argument against tin, which tin points out to be an incorrect understanding of logic.
post 124: asks what the point of voting duster would be
post 135: votes duster. Huh?
His behavior about Duster just seems...weird. I dont know, it seems kind of scummy to me. The rest of his posts are for the purpose of defending his vote, for the most part. Not much else on him. He looks fairly suspicious.

Alight. More tonight, hopefully. I am still deliberating where my vote should go, but as I've said, I fully support a Duster lynch, unless I'm completely convinced someone else is scum.

[dusterhan]

I've got nothing to say. I don't find any of you suspiciouse except maybe joost. So there. You guys are playing WAY to safe.

[kabenon007]

What do you know about playing this game, dusterhan? You haven't "played" at all! We might be playing too safe, but you aren't playing anything, except maybe dumb.

[Knuck]

I've done some thinking about Dusterhan and have changed my mind. I would not mind seeing him gone, though I still believe he is town, the lynch will garner us some information and sooner or later he will have to be disposed of. My defending him was sort of me being new kicking in I guess and was just playing in black and white, as I see him as not scummy so I automatically went into defense mode for him while trying to find other scum, which i realize isn't going to happen as of now. Dusterhan, go play Halo or something.

Vote: Dusterhan

[Atticus]

MOD:

Getting a vote count eventually would be hella nice.

I have no idea who I'm voting, but I know who I will vote.

Unvote, Vote: Knuck.

Why? Well, with only 8 posts in the game (less than one per page) he his hard to get a solid read on, but I have found something I'm curious about.

Within 3 posts he changes his position on duster completely.

Post 162: Calls kabenon scum for trying to pick off a helpless townie, duster.

(large amount of space here, but mostly it is just the town coming to the conclusion that duster will

not

help the town)

Post 215: Unvotes kabenon, is not sure whether to lynch duster or not.

Post 222: Votes dusterhan, because he says it will garner information. (I don't believe this is true because there is relatively no one that can be connected to duster)

As I see it, these small moves could possibly indicate a Knuck-duster scum relationship. It's not much, but I'm curious as to what you have to say, Knuck.

[Knuck]

Eh, ya I agree with you it does seem like I am waffling pretty hard, but as I said my defending him earlier in the game was due to me being new and not wanting someone who really has no tells either way of being scum or town(so i say town only for the fact by numbers). I realize right now though our collective best bet would to be get rid of him and see what information can be brought to us. I ALSO still believe both Joost and Kabenon007 are acting scummy by harping on Dusterhan so early and so hard, and may be scum partners. I will keep vote though and won't FOS anyone as this is purely speculation and am just throwing that out there.