Open 43 - C9+2 GAME OVER before 499

[Mastermind of Sin]

*sigh*

[ryan]

Your playstyle has alot to do with telling me about your allignment. Your style is scummy, hence my reasoning for thinking you are scum. Take away your playstyle and I dont have anything to go on

Now, one (hopefully the last) question, would you say that I play the same as scum and as town (or if you cannot judge likely play the same as each)

Your style is the same, ANTI TOWN. You are not helpful as town and you give off SCUMMY vibes either way. I'm tired of this back and forth crap. Either come up with something valid (doubtful) about this god awful theory or hang from the rope.

Setael: You vote Deathsauce and offer no opinion on these last few pages of exchange with JDodge? Why?

[JDodge]

So basically what I can figure out from these questions is that ryan has no problems lynching a townie, even though I'm fairly certain that he knows the following:

1. We can only afford 2 mislynches in this setup, the lynch of someone whom he even thinks

could

be town

2. There is a possibility that I will neither confirm nor deny at this point that I could even be a power role, thus dramatically weakening the town in the process.

Furthermore, in my experience, when insulted ryan gets

extremely

defensive as town, something which I have not seen to the same extent in this game. As a matter of fact, in the one game where I have seen ryan play as scum, he acted much in the same way he has here: somewhat "in control", rather aggressive play that seems more like what I'd expect from a good pro-town player. Through pressuring him with an endless barrage of questions, I not only drew out the playstyle I've seen as scum, but got the above "no problems lynching town" thing.

Now, the other thing that makes me think ryan is scum is his interactions with Tyler; ryan starts getting pressured and suddenly Tyler steps in saying "Don't answer!" and "He's manipulating you!". He also

answered

some of the questions for ryan, and looking back through for most of the game he's been suspicious of ryan consistently, but almost never actually acting on it. Thus I think he's scum trying to distance rather poorly.

Thus I think we can get a lot of information from a ryan lynch.

Unvote, vote: ryan
FoS: Tyler

[ryan]

I figured you'd vote and STILL not explain your stupid theory, thanks for proving my vote to be concrete till we see your scum ass lynched.

[xyzzy]

Vote Count Number Eight (Five to lynch)

Setael (vampyrusddg)
ryan (DeathSauce, JDodge)

JDodge (ChocolateAttack, ryan, TylerJ)

DeathSauce (MoS, Setael)

Not voting: thinktank

You post too quickly.

[JDodge]

I figured you'd vote and STILL not explain your stupid theory, thanks for proving my vote to be concrete till we see your scum ass lynched.

you do realize the whole lurking thing can't be explained until i know if it works or not, right

[ryan]

I figured you'd vote and STILL not explain your stupid theory, thanks for proving my vote to be concrete till we see your scum ass lynched.

you do realize the whole lurking thing can't be explained until i know if it works or not, right

But look what it's done JDodge, it's made you look like a great lynch and even IF you are town it's been a bad play to do it.

[Setael]

Setael: You vote Deathsauce and offer no opinion on these last few pages of exchange with JDodge? Why?

Pay attention, ryan. I did offer an opinion on these last few pages of nothingness. I'll post it again for you since you missed it:

Wow. That was a whole lot of nothing. Obviously JDodge is intentionally lurking in his games, whether he be scum or town, to test some kind of theory. My guess is the theory is something like "Scum is more likely to wagon a lurker than Town is". Just a guess.

JDodge, I would like your opinion on thinktank.

I do think this whole exchange made ryan look more scummy, and JDodge look more Town. ryan's willingness to lynch townies (though he's trying to camouflage it) is indeed scummy. However I don't agree with this:

Now, the other thing that makes me think ryan is scum is his interactions with Tyler; ryan starts getting pressured and suddenly Tyler steps in saying "Don't answer!" and "He's manipulating you!". He also answered some of the questions for ryan, and looking back through for most of the game he's been suspicious of ryan consistently, but almost never actually acting on it. Thus I think he's scum trying to distance rather poorly.

I do not think Tyler would have intercessed on ryan's behalf the way he did if they were scum buddies.

@MoS - I'm guessing your *sigh* was for my 2nd vote on Deathsauce. If so, could you please stop making such a huge deal about every time I am the second vote? Evidently it doesn't have the connotation you think it does, since you've been wrong about it twice now.

[ryan]

Setael: Willingness to lynch townies? How do you know who the townies are UNLESS you are scum?

[DeathSauce]

Hmmmm, well.

I do find that ryan is playing very much like he did when he was Godfather in another game we participated in, but I just don't put all that much stock into that. The "claiming townie" episode is more suspicious, in my eyes.

However, JDodge, your argument just doesn't hold water for me. It basically boils down to "ryan is willing to vote for someone that could be a townie", but that is true for all of us. No one is ever completely sure of who is scum and who is town, how could they be? You just vote for who you are reasonably certain is scum.

And that being said, I am reasonably certain you are scum.

unvote, vote: Jdodge

I believe this puts him at Lynch -1

[Setael]

Setael: Willingness to lynch townies? How do you know who the townies are UNLESS you are scum?

I think it was pretty obvious that I was referring to this post, especially the bolded part:

So basically what I can figure out from these questions is that

ryan has no problems lynching a townie

, even though I'm fairly certain that he knows the following:

1. We can only afford 2 mislynches in this setup, the lynch of someone whom he even thinks could be town

2. There is a possibility that I will neither confirm nor deny at this point that I could even be a power role, thus dramatically weakening the town in the process.

Nice job trying to twist my words though.

Deathsauce's last post was fabulously scummy. He thinks ryan is playing as scummy as he did when he was godfather in another game, but then votes JDodge for no reason. "I am reasonably certain you are scum" is not a reason, nor is it a case. JDodge is looking very town, and both Deathsauce and ryan are looking very scummy.

[ryan]

JDodge is looking very town? Are you serious? Show me some town like occurences Setael because lurking and calling a THEORY pro town is completely bogus.

[DeathSauce]

Setael you are a pure hypocrite

My reason for voting JDodge is right there above my vote. Perfectly and clearly explained.

Meanwhile your vote on me is because one of my posts was apparently "worth two votes".

Now think about it again, which one is for "no reason"?

[Mastermind of Sin]

I figured you'd vote and STILL not explain your stupid theory, thanks for proving my vote to be concrete till we see your scum ass lynched.

I notice that you don't actually try to debunk JDodge's theory, instead resorting to ad hom to distract from the issue at hand.

@MoS - I'm guessing your *sigh* was for my 2nd vote on Deathsauce. If so, could you please stop making such a huge deal about every time I am the second vote? Evidently it doesn't have the connotation you think it does, since you've been wrong about it twice now.

It was for your vote, but not because of the place on the wagon. Those tells only work in specific circumstances, and they're not very reliable. It was more the fact that you just jumped on behind

my

gut vote without providing any reasoning.

I agree that TylerJ probably would distance instead of defending as scum, but I'm really curious about DeathSauce's last post, which reeks of scumminess. No one has actually given any reasons for JDodge's theory to be bad, and it looks pretty decent to me. I'm seeing a DeathSauce/ryan scumgroup here. Hell, on the offchance that ryan is town, DeathSauce's vote looks scummy to me regardless.

[xyzzy]

Vote Count Number Nine (Five to lynch, JDodge at L-1)

Setael (vampyrusddg)
ryan (JDodge)

JDodge (ChocolateAttack, ryan, TylerJ), DeathSauce)

DeathSauce (MoS, Setael)

Not voting: thinktank

Since JDodge is at -1, you get another VC.

You still post too quickly.

[JDodge]

Mod

: I'm pretty sure that not only do I not have 2 votes, but I am also not voting myself.

[ryan]

MoS: How is intentionally lurking and than saying you're testing a theory a pro town approach?

[Mastermind of Sin]

I've done similar strategies as town before. *shrug*

[ryan]

I've done similar strategies as town before. *shrug*

So intentionally lurking is a benefit to the town, how?

[Setael]

Well, for one thing it got you to basically admit you want to lynch a Townie just for lurking. It also made you look really scummy. So if you are scum, it flushed out a scum. If you are Town, it just muddied the water.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I will not be able to post content until tonight or next monday. I have an Ultimate tournament this weekend.

[ryan]

Well, for one thing it got you to basically admit you want to lynch a Townie just for lurking. It also made you look really scummy. So if you are scum, it flushed out a scum. If you are Town, it just muddied the water.

That is untrue and for you to twist words around to build a case for somebody else is not necessary. I find his playstyle 100% anti town and it's NOT a good way to help us find scum.

[thinktank]

Because his playstyle is "scummy" can not be your reason for lynching JDodge, it can neither prove him guilty nor innocent. While JDodge has not completely cast suspicion of himself, he has lifted some of the load towards you Ryan. I find it scummy that you are willing to lynch him based on the current evidence because even the thought that JDodge could be town would keep me from voting from him, but you claim that because he is not helping town necessarily, he is as good as scum? Sorry, i completely disagree with that theory, because someone maybe a laibility does NOT necessarily mean they're scum and thats what we're trying to do.

Tyler: It doesnt help that you answered questions for Ryan and told him to specifically hold of on answering questions. What was the point? the two of you were attacking each other before and now you come to his aid? doesnt add up. unless perhaps the two of you are scum pair and you attacked each other to cast suspicion of yourself in the late game.. just a hypothetical.

BTW what happened to vampyrusdogg? havent heard from him in a while? Perhaps he needs to be prodded?

FoS: Ryan and TylerJ

[TylerJ]

Thinktank, me and ryan destroyed each other earlier. And you think we are a pair. lol. Oh, well. The fact is I hate manipulation. If it was you being manipulated, I would have done the same.

As far as who I suspect as mafia, almost everyone. Seriously, it would be easier to say who I don't think are mafia. So I'll do that. MoS, Thinktank, and CA seem to be off the list completely. Everyone else, not cutting it. Vamp, just hasn't been active so I can't say anything about him.

As to why I think everyone else is scummy, well here is why:

Setael likes twisting things.
Ryan said he was a townie way too often for my liking.
Jdodge was lurking and then jumped in with this theory stuff. Hasn't scum hunted at all.
Did I adress everyone? I'm missing someone aren't I. hmmm.

Anyway. I feel like all of this has been covered so I don't see the neccesity of bringing up past issues and getting in arguments again. However, if you would like, you could try to defend against the accusations.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mod: Can we get a prod on vampyrusdog?