Mini 518: Underground Mafia, The Nightmare is Over!

[Miztef]

/confirm

[Miztef]

so let's get this started

Vote: Anata112

for being the newest player in this game ^^

[Miztef]

I think I'll

unvote vote: Curiouskarmadog

[Miztef]

no real reason for 3rd vote, just decided to get the game moving forward. Seems to be working ^^

[Miztef]

jitsu, where is your avvie from? It's interesting.

the game is moving along slightly, but I have very little reads on people. I think I'll keep my vote for now, see where it goes.

I think it's nice that jitsu tried to comment of everyone, although I don't think it makes him more protown atm, as there is little to analyze.

it's also a bit interesting that karmadog unvoted without a revote at this point in the game, although I don't really know what it entails.

[Miztef]

well, it's good you've read up on alot of games. I have a bunch of mafia experience, but it's from all sorts of sources, which require different strategies. This type (forum mafia) is by far the most in depth and hard to figure out. Although, live action is my favorite (where day is 1 day, and night is 1 night).

We do need a fourth vote sometime soon, or someone to slip up badly. (preferably scum)

[Miztef]

well, the idea is that with many votes on 1 person, people start to react more, since something could "actually" happen. If no one is at risk, there is no point in reacting in any way really, since there is no point in using your influence, since there is no need to sway the vote.

wow, what a run on sentence.

basically, no pressure, no point.

[Miztef]

the last few posts have no real pushes towards anyone being scum. Which makes sense , considering there has been very little scummy actions so far.

However, we do need to start picking out the first candidates for lynch, and I think I'll

unvote vote: Korlash

karmadog has given me no reason to keep my vote on him, and korlash has been a little overreactive and, from my POV, confusing. So, let's see where this takes us.

[Miztef]

In short, I agree that a vote or talk is best. Those are just a few things I could think of that would start the game moving a little. (Not saying I wold do them. I'm not really! Don't hold that against me here! ^^')

This line just amazes me in it's oddness.

So, you agree that talking or voting is the best things to do... wonderful, the 2 things we are able to do, we should do! Yet.... you may or may not do them. OK. Wow.

I honestly just don't even know what to think about it, it's just so odd. After that whole speech, that's the conclusion.

I have no idea if it pertains to you being scum or not, but it's just crazy.

So, my question is: Can you explain/elaborate?

[Miztef]

ah, maybe I should have read more carefully, I didn't really see all the stuff about flaming and researching other games.

Still... after all that, the conclusion being a simple "we should talk or vote" seems almost pointless.

I'm honestly shocked no one has voted for me yet. I would think a vote on me would make sense after that post from you korlash.

I do find jitsu's tatics very good and clean, and as we go forward, will become more useful. I hope his clarification works well when there is loads of information.

Right now, I think I'm gonna lay off pushing any wagons very hard, we need a bit more activity from other players.

[Miztef]

did no one notice the "I'm on vacation" line of Mexal's?

He probably only had a brief time to post, or cared only slightly, cause he's on god damn vacation.

It's pretty ironic when you think of it. Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

[Miztef]

@Actuary: My guess for # of scum is 3. Including any other anti-town roles. Having 4 scum is just too much unless there is a good portion of power roles, considering 4 is 1/3 of the players. I think 3 is about standard for 12 player games.

Nothing else of interest right now, although, I also wish to know what "playing black" means.

[Miztef]

I wasn't shocked that no one voted me at that specific time, just that there were no votes on me at all, random or otherwise. Usually my gameplay is seen is heavily scummy right from the get go, so it's just a different feeling for me.

Why korlash? Simply because he had the most votes on him, so I added another to see what would happen. My "laying off hard wagons" line is my way of saying there is no heavy evidence against anyone I have seen, so I'm not gonna write speeches on why specific players should be lynched.

I wouldn't mind changing my vote at this time, just have no one to change it to. I am starting to get the impression korlash is town, but only slightly, so I think I'll stick to it until my scumdar picks up something good.

[Miztef]

lol, I actually thought there was some complicated reason you posted it in that order.

and, yay for me being the only player you get scummy vibes from. God I am such a bad pro-town player.

[Miztef]

lol, I love magic, I can't believe I missed a comment refering to it. Haven't been following it lately though.

oh, and yes, I'm an extremely impatient player. Not to get the day finished per say, I just like to keep things moving at a fast pace. This game is getting a bit fast though, so I think I'll try to slow down a bit.

I've noticed that in games where I'm mafia, people tend not to suspect me for a good while, cause I tend to play more cautious. When I'm town, people tend to jump at me right away, since I play however I feel like ><.

[Miztef]

I'm not sure what your asking of me karma dog...

Yes, I was surprised that no one had voted me yet, only because I am used to being voted for on page 2-3 in most games. This game was an oddity for me. I was also referring to korlash not voting me, in addition. I hope that makes sense.

[Miztef]

OK.

So, as town, I tend to be completely careless with my actions, impatient, and jumpy.

However, as scum, I tend to play more cautiously, and keep myself under the radar. That's why in game's where I'm civilian, I tend to be attacked quite early on, and many times I stay the center of attention for long periods of time.

This game is going crazy fast in my opinion, even for my impatient self. That's why I feel it should be slowed down slightly. I'm not talking about everyone lurking or anything like that, just a little more thought to things, instead of super fast accusations on many people.

@jitsu: Yes, that "god, I'm such a bad pro-town player" was a not so subtle 'ploy'. However, it's mostly me just being frustrated. I'm not terribly good at playing scum either, I just enjoy the game. I don't pretend to be very good at it.

I'm not sure how those first 2 lines are contradicting, as a pro-town player, I am seen as scum quickly, as a scum player, usually it takes a while longer before suspicion comes my way. Does that clarify?

[Miztef]

I suppose it is WIFOM. You can disregard it if you wish, but it's basically my only argument to counter why I'm impatient at this point. Basically, I have no other explanation for my actions other then, that's my playstyle.

I think I'm gonna move on from that now, but if you really wish me to explain it further, just ask me a direct question and I'll try to answer as best I can. (can't promise it won't be WIFOM though)

Although you are both suspicious of me, I find anata and Mexal playing well pro-town at this time.

Mexal's comment about jitsu caught me off guard, I didn't even realize what jitsu was implying. I was under the impression he was pro-town until that observation. Now it is questionable.

Karmadog gives me some confusion, although seems to be pushing for the same things as anata and mexal.

[Miztef]

@korlash: I was the 3rd vote on karmadog ><

[Miztef]

Man, I always feel like I'm falling behind in this game, so many posts.

I only skimmed, so please don't codemn me if I missed information:

@Jitsu: about the quote wall you made for me, I suppose it is inconsistent, but honestly, that's just me switching my mind about what I think should be happening, It's still not very clear in my mind in the first place. I do agree that the game is going well though.


You asked me to switch my scum vote as well, if I don't think korlash is scum anymore. (something along those lines at least) Since my suspicions of everyone at this time are low, I think I'll have to just

unvote

until I get some time to reread and evaluate the game so far. I have 2 midterms today, so I don't think I'll get it done till tomorrow or later

[Miztef]

alright, my turnabout from 58 - 63...

My thought pattern is basically that I went a little too hard on korlash, and was telling everyone that I'm gonna slow down on my actual evidence/case building until I actually get more substantial material. I suppose it could be seen as me trying to correct a mistake.

[Miztef]

@karmadog: lol, trying to use my "supposedly" circular logic against me? It's not being more cautious, it's correcting a mistake (somewhat).

[Miztef]

OK, I just read everything up to this point again, and will do so again soon (probably). There's a lot of info swimming through my head, so please try to bear with this post, and don't take it as my absolute and solid opinion on eveything:

Scum list (top 3):

GunslingerSB
Karmadog
Korlash

Reasons:

Gunslinger - pretty sure we have a newb player here. I still consider myself a newb, and I've played around 20 games around the net (usually die quickly though) and many more in real life. His comments on page 8 and blatantly anti-town, and contradictory. As others have pointed out, he attacks jitsu, then posts a scum list with him in 8th. He wishes to lynch someone (anyone?) that "Seems suspicious", he even mentions at random. His reasons for feeling people are scummy, is basically "wonky". Right now, I believe he is scum, and a very bad one at that.

karmadog - I wish I had substantial evidence for this one, but it's more of a scum-vibe then anything. It's hypocritical of me to say, but his attack on gunslinger is opportunistic seeming, and almost too hard (as if he's SURE gunslinger is mafia). Maybe I just don't like this playstyle, but IGMEOY.

Korlash - Very odd poster. Most of his posts pertain to views on how the game should be played, and how roles could/should/would act. After looking through a bunch of his posts, I noticed a general lack of observations and conclusions. I need to look into this more to solidify my position on this.


Other Notes:

Sudo-Nym: Seems scummy, but I agree that he could be some "other" type role. Unless something radically changes about his game play, I don't think I want to vote today at least.

Anata (her long post): A lot players have drawn observations/conclusions about anata from this post, but I don't see anything particularly incriminating or very pro-town. I may need to read the posts that react to it again to get more info.

Mexal: Most pro-town player to me at this point. I don't have much evidence for this, I just like the way he plays, and trust his opinion most at this time.


I think that's about all I have to say at this time.

[Miztef]

I know, it's completely hypocritical, but it's the way you state things. It's as if you know what's going on a bit too much. I had my scum list, and don't have much evidence. Sorry, I did what I could to explain.

Again, these are not set in stone opinions, I've been really busy lately, and only recently read over the posts. I still need another good reread.

[Miztef]

@Miztef:

I notice your play has gotten considerably tighter. Previously you didn't defend yourself and called your own play horrible. Now you are attempting to say something, and actually defend yourself but I can't really find anything substantive in your posts, and I still get the feeling that you are overall very lazy, and like others have said, attempting to put votes on people and let others push. You've posted no true in-depth analysis other than "general vibes" on people.

Also, you say you think Mexal is the most pro-town and you trust his opinions most of the time, but last I remember, he thought the attacks I and others made on you had merit. I know the two are not necessarily mutually exclusive, but why do you say you trust someone (a fairly strong statement of innocence) that really doesn't seem to trust you?

Does everyone ignore my "I've been busy lately" lines? I'm trying here, but 3 midterms and calculus + algebra tests coming up soon, I really just can't think this stuff through right now.

I said, in that post, that I still need to reread, and that my opinions are just rough stuff right now. I wanted everyone to know I was still involved in the game.


About the Mexal comment, I actually didn't realize Mexal was still very keen on me, I only skimmed through his posts (as there are a whole lot of them, and I was focusing mostly on things that pinged my scumdar).

Tonight, hopefully, I will have enough time to reread and clarify my position.

[Miztef]

I believe I unvoted korlash eariler...

anyway, if not I

unvote

now

[Miztef]

I'm going on a trip this weekend, so I may not be able to post too much, but here's some quick thoughts right now.

About Anata: I haven't had time to read through the case against her, but I agree with Korlash that 3 votes in succession are mighty fast. That's something I definitely want to look into.

Sudo's latest posts helped me understand a bit of where he's coming from, and I think many of his scummy actions can be attributed to simple mistakes. I don't think he is scum at this time, but he isn't a particularly good townie if that's the case.


Btw Korlash, I also agree that, in the exact same post, saying your voting someone for pressure and voting them does deter the amount of pressure actually given substantially. However, in the very early game, it's just natural to start by semi-random voting to get things moving along.

[Miztef]

Many players seem to be after anata at this time. While I agree that many of her posts are scummy, her lack of experience makes me consider how useful it is to attack her at this time.

I do not want this day to go by with only a fowl swoop and anata dieing. I think changing the attention to 1 or 2 more players is necessary before this day ends.

My reasoning is that, if anata is scum, she is almost sure to continue to slip up no matter who the attention is on (no offense to anata), and we will have a more confirmed scum anyway. As town, at least we give her a chance to make up for her mistakes.


Korlash has actually intrigued me over the last few posts. The "attack" on mexal seemed odd and, from my POV, illogical, as mexal's vote was perfectly acceptable in my books, as jitsu has pointed out with some of his latest posts. I acknowledge korlash was not trying to say mexal is scummy though, as he has pointed out, he was only looking for a reason behind mexal's vote.

My conclusion however, is that Korlash is trying to be a little too safe with his maneuvers, and I'm getting a more and more scummy vibe as time goes on for him.

[Miztef]

well, I think the problem I'm seeing is that besides myself and anata, there is little attention focused elsewhere. If I wanted an easy argument, I would probably go after anata as well.

It was honestly just a small argument against you korlash. It just seems you are able to slip out of any argument against you by saying "Well, I actually meant it THAT way, not This way that makes me look bad." Basically I'm saying your non committal.

btw... how did you manage to quote my name wrong? lol

Anyway, some other observations of mine:

Jistu - Awesome posts, keep them coming. Although an admitted newb, I love the way you post and how you condense arguments. You've moved up to my most pro-town player atm.

anata - please keep posting. This would be an extremely inopportune time for you to start lurking. I'd really like to hear your latest comments on the game.

... not too much else I don't think.

[Miztef]

sorry for the double post.

I just realized anata had said she won't be on until tomorrow. Scratch my "lurking" comments on her, my mistake.

[Miztef]

@mexal: Anata did mention she can not post till monday. I made the mistake of thinking she was lurking as well.

[Miztef]

Because some people are still keen on lynching me, can I get all the points against me so I can defend myself? I believe I tried to defend myself before, but I'm a little confused as to what makes me so especially scummy.

I find it kind of ridiculous that karmadog posted a whole bunch of stuff regarding anata and some others, yet hasn't talked about the case against me lately, whom he seems to be keen on lynching. My impression is basically that karmadog is either mafia going after the easy lynches, or just has a grudge against me for voting him earlier.

His spreading of suspicion (me, gunslinger, mexal, sudo, anata?) is quite large, and gives me the impression that he is trying to make sure he can slip between votes and look more innocent no matter who is lynched.

If he is scum, His semi-protection of anata makes me believe she is also more likely scum.

Don't care how OMGUS this seems, I feel karmadog is most scummy at this time, and am going to

vote: Curiouskarmadog

[Miztef]

I think Mexal is right in the sense that lynches do have to happen. There is no need to let days drag on for extra weeks if the biggest lynch candidates have already been picked and all the arguements against them have been said. (not sure in this case, but for a while now no new cases have been presented, at least not seriously).

I will post more on this later, have class now.

[Miztef]

vote to kill god

[Miztef]

please disregard last post, my roommate posted that.

[Miztef]

I can't believe the mess I've got myself into. Since I'm likely to die soon, I'm gonna

claim Civilian

. I guess it wouldn't be so bad if you lynched me, this has been one the of the productive day 1's I've seen in a game without getting too muddied up.

If I did have a strong case against someone, I'd honestly post it right now. I don't. This game has been really fast, and has been hard to keep up with. Any time I do get a read on someone, it's already been posted about 5 posts ago. Everything I have to say about others has basically been said already.

I'll

unvote vote: anata

as well, as that seems like the most likely candidate besides me.

Here's a small write-up on my general opinions of people in the game. I'd love to go into detail, but I've had a horrible day, and I don't have much time anyway.

Mexal - Very pro-town. Because him and jitsu are both so "pro-town" I'm inclined to believe at least one of them is scum, but I've yet to see any major flaws in mexal's arguments, so I see no reason to consider him for lynch

Jitsu - Very Pro-town. Great arguments, lots of clear arguments. I enjoy reading his posts more then anyone else's.

Jerubbaal - Neutral/scummy. Kinda just pops in and out. I don't particularly find his arguments bad, just not very useful. I would keep an eye on him later days, but not a good lynch candidate for today.

CKD - Scummy. Don't like most of his arguments. They are rarely very clear and he gets emotional (it seems). Of course, it's very OMGUS of me to think him scummy but meh, that's how it is.

Korlash - Neutral. Very odd player. Some posts scream scum to me, others make me think he is very town. Just kinda random.

Gunslinger - Scummy. I think everyone knows he seems scummy. Not much else to say.

Abstract - ???. Kinda disappeared this game didn't he? I don't really have a read on him.

Anata - Scummy. Shocking isn't it? Even if I didn't think she was scummy, the way the town is going, it's basically me or her, so I have to be against her.

Sudo - Scummy/Other - As others have pointed out, Sudo seems to have ulterior motives, yet is not especially scummy. I'd want to keep him around just to see how it goes.

jayalay - ???. Kinda disappeared on us too. Don't even remember any of this posts.

oEJo - Townie. I like his posts. Not scummy really, but not particularly pro-town either.



So, after my basically worthless write-up, please do what you will. If I do survive for tomorrow, I'll try to keep up more, but right now I don't have much more of a defense.

[Miztef]

jesus christ people post way too much in this game.

I only skimmed cause I only have a hour, but I'll try to say what I can.

I'm claiming Vanilla Townie. If you lynch me, you will not be losing a power role, have no worries about that.

In regards to the Mexal and Jitsu comment. I don't think it's WIFOM. When 2 people are doing amazing jobs of providing logical arguments for the town, It's hard to believe that the scum would let that happen and not try to get one of their own as an influential member. Checking over the thread though, that "influential" scum could also be jerubbaal, as he participates a lot more then I had thought. I usual don't like reading his posts though, so I guess I kinda skimmed over them.

I don't even have a good defence against most of the evidence against me. Basically, I was completely off my game (if I ever had one) this game. I cared little what I posted, and didn't think about it too much. I just got back to the site after a 2 month vacation, and this is my first game (although I've joined 2 others now as well).

If my death does actually give information to the town, I guess it isn't so bad. How often do you actually hit scum day 1 anyway? The only time I've seen it was when I was the scum being lynched day 1 ><.

I think if this day goes on much longer, we are just mudding the waters. It's basically me or anata, I say place your vote.

[Miztef]

That's actually really impressive Jitsu. I wasn't all that suspicious of anata before, but this actually amps it up a good chunk.

@korlash: That is definately the oddest post I've seen all game. With basically no true content as well....

I'm disliking CKD more and more as the game goes on. Too emotional and aggravates more then looks for scum. The attack on Sudo for example, maybe Sudo just didn't post everything he thinks about the game at that time. I don't see why there was a need to attack that post.

Aggravation posts:

and if it is too much for you, maybe you need to ask for a replacement too.

why bother correcting a mistake?

out of our three pages of arguements, these two points are the only things you got out of it?

I don't know what it's called, but CDK continually makes comments about his emotional state on things, as if it will get his point across better.

...Will I feel like an ass? No. ...

I am tired of the town...

...I have gotten fustrated with this game and there are tons of lenghty posts...

He has also kept a somewhat defensive stance towards anata:

Clearly, if Anata is guilty of anything it is being lazy...On a different note, I find it interesting that she got 3 votes back to back so quickly when this game has two quite scummy players just floating around. Please explain to me, how being lazy is scummy. Granted it is not very pro-town, but scummy? How is Anata’s laziness any different from Oejo or Gunslinger? I think Jitsu made some good points, but I think that a lot of this case revolves around game theory versus actual scum actions and assumptions. I can agree with some of Jitsu’s points without being compelled to place a 4th vote on Anata. I think she has adequate amount of pressure on her at the moment (as jitsu said about Gunslinger and Mitzef). Does this mean I wont change my mind about her later and vote her? No, I just want to keep my vote on who I actual think is scum.

I dont think Anata is scummy at this point (dont have a problem with her). Her actions (or lack thereof) have been noted. ....

....All that being said (quoted) I think Anata is a newbie/lazy/trying to look town. I don’t think that being lazy=scummy. I think being lazy =useless and not very helpful. Trying to look town is different. This is a scum move to be sure, but it could also mean other things….all of it are assumptions. It is note worthy, but not enough for me to vote. .....

A particularly interesting quote is:

"Wow Anata was town, well, CKD must of known she was town that is why he defended her to look town"

or

"See Anata WAS scum, so CKD must have been defending her because they are buddies.."

It is lose/lose for me...

This is upsurd as evidence against me. Everyone would be suspicious of you anyway if she turns up scum. It doesn't matter that if I say that. It doesn't make me look more innocent if she turns up town at all. I would assume it makes me look a little a more town if she turns up scum though. I think I'm getting into WIFOM here though.

He then says:

Mex, you want information? I am actively pushing for a Mitzef lynch....if he IS town, wont that make me look mighty suspicious? This guy is all types of scum.

That's true... but why would you want me dead if you only gain information on your own alignment if I turn up town. What info do YOU gain if I turn up town?


I'm inclined to believe anata is quite likely scum at this time. Should she turn up town, That would lift a lot of suspicion off CKD for me. Should she turn up scum, I would be very hard pressed to believe CKD is not scum.

This is my attempt at a case against someone. I hope it's not full of flaws, but as you have all seen, I'm not particularly good at presenting my arguments (or even making them).

[Miztef]

I'm pretty sure this day is basically over. We need lynch info. This game is just stalling now.

[Miztef]

Right now I'm just waiting to hear what the replacements have to say, but I don't really have a problem with everyone keeping their votes on who they think is scum. May help the replacements choose who to look into easier.

[Miztef]

Korlash bandwagon eh?

I've found korlash to be suspicious right from the start. I didn't honestly think he'd become a lynch candidate this late in the day, and if he does turn out scum, Gunslinger and Anata become more likely townies.

CKD is still high up in the scum list for me, but I haven't really considered his play in connection with korlash. I wonder if there is any connection.

Korlash's latest post seems like a typical scum about to die post, and based on alot of the evidence adel gave, I think I'll go right ahead and

unvote Vote: Kolash

(btw korlash, I don't think it's ever good to state you should have been lurking)

[Miztef]

did you honestly just use post count to distigush scum from town.

I agree with that first chart (the map of all votes, FoS's etc.) as evidence, but using post count / word count????

You've got to be kidding me.

I'm still happy with my vote on Korlash, this day just needs to end anyway. I will make a good argument if need be, but I think everyone just wants this day to end, so I see no point in wasting the effort.

[Miztef]

ugh, I can't believe korlash just claimed roleblocker... it's hard to see it in his muck of posts, but he really did "claim" roleblocker [post 581 para. 7]

Thank you for the clarification adel. If your system honestly does work for you, that's fine, I just don't want to be voted on based on the amount of posts I made.

Korlash, I'm honestly not posting my case against just because I'm too lazy to do so.l I really don't have the time, and I get the feeling it only really makes sense to me, as it's based mostly on my experience with another player that played somewhat like you, and his differing styles when scum vs. town.

Your posting style in and of itself does not constitute scummy behavior, however, the way you interpret posts, choose on who to vote for, and how you relay information are all confusing and unhelpful to the town. It is honestly like reading through a 8 year old trying to write a novel.

You post nonsensical fluff mixed in with hard facts, and there is no way to distinguish the 2 easily. As scum, you can use this to your advantage by saying you meant different things when someone catches you saying something illogical/scummy.

Unfortunately, seeing as you claimed, which is something I completely did not expect of you (as scum), I will

unvote

. I think it is unlikely you would be so bold as to claim roleblocker at this point if you were indeed scum. I don't believe you are the kind of player that can argue a counterclaim, and therefore would not risk claiming in the first place. It is of course possible you are mafia roleblocker, but I believe that role is unlikely in this set-up, and even if you were, you would be unlikely to claim it at this point. Your post saying you didn't even know there was a mafia roleblocker seems sincere to me as well, and helped sway to to believe you are a town roleblocker.

I will see where the town goes at this point, but I do honestly want this day to end soon, so I'm warning now that I will jump on the next decent bandwagon (if I agree with it of course).

[Miztef]

well, you know what karma dog, your right, it is a scummy thing to do, but at this point, I think everyone can agree this day has already basically passed, and we are just squabbling now. I admit adel has brought some interesting new stuff, but it's not profound or ground shaking. I would love to build a case against you, but I believe that is pointless with so many other suspects right now.

[Miztef]

A scumtell basically just means anything that a scum would do to help his team. Any other "tells" vary completely based on playstyles.

I can tell you right now I've been a town roleblocker in a mini, and don't ever remember a having a mafia roleblocker in any game I've been in. Since that's what I based my info off of, I assumed town roleblockers were more common.

I made that long explanation to avoid stupid comments like "He's trying to distance himself from his scumbuddies". Obviously it would have came no matter what the case.

It is possible jerubbaal and korlash are scum, but I can't believe you that you think found all three mafia day 1. Almost always the first day ends up with a townie dieing, I have learned not to put too much hope in correctly finding scum day 1. The best you can reasonably hope for is gaining information from the lynch.

[Miztef]

I haven't updated my wiki for a long time (at least not with new games) but it's true I haven't played too much here.

In many other games I have played offline (which is at least 50, probably more) I had never encountered a mafia roleblocker. That is, of course, an unfair statistic, but I'm basing my unvote on this, and don't expect others to agree automatically with it. Your evidence against korlash is continually growing, and I agree with most of it. I will

vote: Korlash

at this point. I believe he has a good chance of survival this day, so I hope my vote against him (if he turns out scum) will be seen as a townie move.

I don't mind losing. I am still learning to play well on this site, and realize I won't be able to beat players like you (adel) and mexal easily. I'm actually glad you are pointing out my mistakes, even though it makes me look more scummy.

At this point, I believe one of adel, jitsu, or mexal is scum, based solely on their amount of influence. Every time I have been scum, (yes, yes, anecdotal evidence) I have noticed at least 1 scum always takes a hard stance to get their opinion heard in the town. I have no evidence against a specific one of them, but I can't wait for this game to end and see who the scum actually are. Just thought I'd mention that.

[Miztef]

@korlash: That was just a typing mistake on my part. As defence for my eariler action of unvoting you, in my experience, mafia roleblockers are rare. However, adel seems to know what he is talking about, and no one has disagreed with him, therefore, I revoted you because that knowledge of mine was incorrect.

@jitsu: I can't guarantee I will state my case, but I have been saying parts of it as the arguments have continued. My problem with stating the case is that my scumtells are different then others, as adel has pointed out, having your own system of identifying scum is quite important for proper play. I may present the case soon if I feel like it though, right now it's midnight where I am, so I don't have the time.

[Miztef]

I for one am just really excited to be playing with such a veteran member of the site. Yay Flay!

Nothing much else to say though, I'm just waiting for this day to end really... However, I will listen to whatever others have to say though, with the replacements and such.

[Miztef]

I'm still struggling a lot with the korlash vote. I want to believe he is scum, but I'm just not sure. I've already voted/unvoted/voted him, but I'm gonna have to

unvote

again. He did claim roleblocker, and no matter what the statistics say, I'm gonna believe him for now.

I noticed Gunslinger and Sudo are both on the Korlash wagon as well. To me, this makes them suspicious. I know I was just on the wagon, but I've been deeply struggling with it, where as those 2 just plopped on and were done with it.

I'm going to wait for anata's replacement to post before I actually consider voting her for now, We can always get her/him another day anyway, there are more productive people to go after for now. (I am not saying setael shouldn't post soon, I'm just saying I'm gonna give him a chance before I jump on his case).

Right now, I think I'm happy going back after good ole

GunslingerKB

[Miztef]

I didn't know setael was female. I will keep this is mind for the future. Sorry.

[Miztef]

you didn't bold your vote on me adel.

I'm gonna claim Town. (I don't know if I've been hammered or not yet) . As it always happens, A townie is lynched Day 1, so I don't mind my own death. Hopefully a good chunk of information has been gained today, and the town can win on a subsequent day ^^. Good luck to all, and I hope adel and Mr. flay get along. I think I may go see what Adel's post said, why not post it decrypted as well Adel?

@Jitsu: I was honestly just too lazy to post a case against Korlash. Most of the stuff against him was just things I dislike in game, and count as "scummy", so I felt a case against him would look dumb anyway.

[Miztef]

I forgot as well... hence why I claimed again. Too long a day.

[Miztef]

Great game everyone. I didn't get to follow too much of it after I died, but I'm glad town prevailed in the end.

It's almost unbelievable the the "semi" inital suspects turned out to be the scum all along. Although, gunslinger being doctor was quite the surprise for me.

Sorry to CKD, I hounded on you a lot while I was alive, which was basically WIFOM.

@Jitsu: I'm a japanese student as well, I was so very amused by your name when I had learned what it meant (only recently).