Gistou (Over!)
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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RAM Goon
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Alright! So, first, I have a very serious question:
HOW ARE YOU ALL SO FUCKING OBTUSE?????(Except for like, mathblade, and Nahdia...nobody else sees to fucking get it)
You have FOUR role PM's to look at, PLUS YOUR OWN, and the mods word saying that town factions eliminate all threats to them, and scum factions are trying to control the vote, and you SOMEHOW DON'T FUCKING KNOW WHAT A TOWN WIN CON WOULD LOOK LIKE?
Yes, members/a specific member of <town faction A> may be a threat to <town faction b> and so on, BUT THEY'RE NOT SCUM.
The part of everyone's PM that is aligned is the removal of those scum aligned slots, the ones trying to control the vote. The priority is removing fucking scum, not removing people who are obviously fucking town aligned based on their win condition claims, but might need to be removed for YOUR specific faction to win.
With that said.
We have two notable investigate results? One from <unknown member of luna's neighborhood> on SS, saying he is one faction, which he says he is not, and one from SS, on LLD, saying she is a wulden(and we know wulden is a generally anti-town race if we accept that the Luna/Stormblade/Copper 'hood is town, because they have been warned that there may be wuldens in there...clear implication is that wuldens are anti-town), but she says she's an individual wulden who wins with the town.
The entirety of the SS situation doesn't make sense. All Luna mentioned was SS' faction, which in and of itself doesn't mean anything because we don't know what the scum factions name(s) is(are). It literally makes no sense for scum!SS to claim the results on him must have been false, when the faction name alone isn't ACTUALLY a guilty. I'm inclined to believe he is actually this individual vampire faction simply because I'm going to attribute a base level of competence to their slot, and assume they wouldn't put themselves in a position where they're "caught" by a faction cop AFTER they've already heard the result, and the result wasn't an outright guilty.
Now, with that said, that brings up somethings that needs resolution: Luna, you asked SS how they would feel if you said your faction cop was "strong willed"...and then later on you said either he's lying or you had an unlucky redirect. The implication of strong willed is that the slot in question was empowered or otherwise guaranteed to have their actions resolve on their target. If that was the case, then there was no possibility of an unlucky redirect.
Which is it? Was there possibly a redirect, or is it CERTAIN beyond any doubt that this individual received SS' faction information?
For LLD: I don't think being wulden makes her automatically scum, BUT I do think the wuldens are generally scum aligned, based on the information given to us by Stormblade and their relation to their PT. This means that if she is scum, it makes perfect sense for her to claim "individual wulden" for her faction. Basically, her result is semi-null to me. Not impossible that she's an individual, but if she's scum, what she's done is exactly what she HAD to do as scum.
-Cerb
pedit: Ninja'd by Bins.-
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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Its worded like "when all the treats to your faction die" how is its similarity to "when all the treats to individual humans faction die" means their town?
~IceHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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RAM Goon
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RAM Goon
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The fact you honestly believe this and then later work up to fill in info that there are only two town factions makes me think that 1) you honestly believe this because being Individual human is all you know 2) you don't have a lot of info to work with and 3) you sort of haven't been reading (to know that the West Empire, Northern Tribes, etc are the town factions).In post 4138, rb wrote:Also I'm pretty sure the "Town" WinCon is the one that says you win with the Individual Humans, regardless of your race.
All Individual Human factioners please vote Salt Squad.
But that's okay, I think you just confirmed yourself as town like BBMolla did.
~ The other posts except the last one were Bins, m'bad.-
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RAM Goon
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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There are four role pm's ; two are definitely town
two of them are critically suspicious and have a redacted part. how on earth would you call one town with no info , just based on those suspicious powerful roles and the similarity of their wincon wording?
pedit : all the thing mod confirmed about wincons is the fact game started with at least one town faction with that wincon and one scum faction with the majority wincon.
I can see both flips as second and thirth scum factions as it stands and I have no reason to believe not.
~IceHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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I don't like anyone who is calling anyone town for having that wncondition
I won't let another saga frontier happen here.
Don't give this faction a free path
~IceHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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RAM Goon
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I think SS said the redacted part is the Factional Recruit. Or I just assumed that from what he was saying.In post 4406, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:two of them are critically suspicious and have a redacted part. how on earth would you call one town with no info , just based on those suspicious powerful roles and the similarity of their wincon wording?
But then it's like a Factional Town Recruit. To, you know, maybe fight back against the possible cult recruits?
I agree, though. That's the only part that bugs me. But the wincon is important. If their wincon is scum, what's saying the Northern Tribes aren't scum too? Is it cause their name is in a pretty blue colour? No, the Northern Tribes are town. Even if they don't share a wincon with the Individual Humans.
Going to review A50's post too.-
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RAM Goon
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Okay, but are you not listening to what SS is even doing right now? Why would he, a scum faction in your words, claim he was a scum faction? Claim the wincon and everything and say he was aligned with Kuroi? Why would he not just use his give fakeclaim if he were scum? I don't see how Town isn't being reasonable here. Why didn't Kuroi use his fake claim?In post 4407, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:Don't give this faction a free path
This is the difference between SS and LLD right now. SS genuinely gets their wincon. LLD is still acting like she has no idea. I think that's because it's a fakeclaim.
~ Bins-
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RAM Goon
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Also ~ Bins, sorry.In post 4408, RAM wrote:
I think SS said the redacted part is the Factional Recruit. Or I just assumed that from what he was saying.In post 4406, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:two of them are critically suspicious and have a redacted part. how on earth would you call one town with no info , just based on those suspicious powerful roles and the similarity of their wincon wording?
But then it's like a Factional Town Recruit. To, you know, maybe fight back against the possible cult recruits?
I agree, though. That's the only part that bugs me. But the wincon is important. If their wincon is scum, what's saying the Northern Tribes aren't scum too? Is it cause their name is in a pretty blue colour? No, the Northern Tribes are town. Even if they don't share a wincon with the Individual Humans.
Going to review A50's post too.-
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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I don't see a northen tribe flip with a redacted factional part
and yes I beleive they can recruit
I'm saying there might be more
and they might not be town
I don't like you guys considering that faction town like shit and moving on. this is just blantly unsetteling cuase its a huge assumption based on no logicHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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what is he doing? scum hunting?In post 4409, RAM wrote:
Okay, but are you not listening to what SS is even doing right now? Why would he, a scum faction in your words, claim he was a scum faction? Claim the wincon and everything and say he was aligned with Kuroi? Why would he not just use his give fakeclaim if he were scum? I don't see how Town isn't being reasonable here. Why didn't Kuroi use his fake claim?In post 4407, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:Don't give this faction a free path
This is the difference between SS and LLD right now. SS genuinely gets their wincon. LLD is still acting like she has no idea. I think that's because it's a fakeclaim.
~ Bins
I beleive a scum will scum hunt in multiball for sure
screaming? yeah they will do that if pressured as eaither alignmentHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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A Song of Ice and Fire Mafia Scum
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I like to even call the way they reacted scummy not towny.
the way beeboy was insisting that he would fake claim if he was scum and refrenscing back to their vote on kuroi was scummy AF
~IceHydra of Frozen Angel and Firebringer-
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RAM Goon
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NO FAIn post 4412, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:
what is he doing? scum hunting?In post 4409, RAM wrote:
Okay, but are you not listening to what SS is even doing right now? Why would he, a scum faction in your words, claim he was a scum faction? Claim the wincon and everything and say he was aligned with Kuroi? Why would he not just use his give fakeclaim if he were scum? I don't see how Town isn't being reasonable here. Why didn't Kuroi use his fake claim?In post 4407, A Song of Ice and Fire wrote:Don't give this faction a free path
This is the difference between SS and LLD right now. SS genuinely gets their wincon. LLD is still acting like she has no idea. I think that's because it's a fakeclaim.
~ Bins
I beleive a scum will scum hunt in multiball for sure
screaming? yeah they will do that if pressured as eaither alignment
He's CLAIMING what you think is a SCUM FACTION. WHY THE HELL WOULD HE DO THAT? Especially if it doesn't match the RESULT on him? I think he's telling the truth.
I think these Individual Vampires and other creepy shit (Individual Wuldan, I guess) are the "Enemies that are actually your allies." Mastin is talking about.
~ Bins
pedit - It really wasn't.-
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copper223 Jack of All Trades
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I am Cerberus, you are all dumb, let me make a huge post that reaches no conclusion and parrots Nahdia.
LLD's forced claim after the check is not null ( ), it makes her by far the likeliest scum or if we want to be generous anti-town even over heartless whom I know has other as a nation and is therefore very unlikely to be human, likeliest is they are the 5th faction.
Beeboy is still posting in this game and this makes it unlikely for him to be pure scum, LLD did not cc so this discussion for today is pointless anyway.-
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rb Survivor
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I'm going to have to go with FA on this one in that I don't really think that it's somehow a matter of lynching all the scum + cult and then everyone else gets to have supper-happy-fun-times and wins the game.
Or maybe they do. I really can't tell because I think everyone believes they're Town but I think that what everyone believes might actually be wrong and Dram and co. aren't necessarily scum but they're possibly not-town and their WinCon isn't compatible with Individual humans necessarily.
I get the impression that Luna/SS/Dram/Stormblade are like shared-survivors or something who need to survive to endgame and that they'll probably take any kind of action either town or scum aligned if it means they survive. Maybe I'm crazy but that's how I see it. I don't really see how their wincon works with what I know to be Town. I think they actually misunderstood what they are and mistakenly thought they were 'Town' because 'new humanity treaty' sounds all special and good and human-alignmenty, but they didn't know that Titus/BBMolla type factions existed.-
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rb Survivor
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RAM Goon
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Also, LLD also claimed one of these "Individual [Scummy sounding shit]". Do you think that's scum as well? I mean, it even has a different wincon from town! Do you think scum again fakeclaimed something scummy? I just don't think LLD thought she would get heat for claiming something with a town wincon.
The Individual Wuldan sound worse than the Individual Vampires. Especially because their wincon is different from mine (the town one) and I can't even figure out who Dram was aligned with yet for certain. But I still think they were town-ish.
LLD is just fakeclaiming it. Which also sort of confirms again along similar logic that it's town because why would scum fakeclaim something that was Scum?-
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RAM Goon
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[/spoiler]In post 3907, mastin2 wrote:[/quote]In post 3909, mastin2 wrote:dramonic, who wasEugine Lysander,, hasUndead Risen Slavedied N1. [/quote]
BBMolla, who wasJulia Otho,, hasIndividual Human Jailkeeperdied N1.[/quote]
[/quote]
This is the friggin proof FA. Mastins post: They win if all threats to them are eliminated. EVERY SINGLE WIN CON WE'VE SEEN(AND YOU'RE OWN, ASSUMING YOU'RE TOWN): "You win if all threats to <faction name> are eliminated".
-Cerb
pedit: There are people in this thread who are apparently ignoring Nahdia and incapable of understanding the basic mechanics of this game, in spite of overwhelming evidence...and are making cases against people based on that misunderstanding. It has to be corrected copper.
MOD NOTE:
UH...I'd fix this if I could figure out what the heck actually happened, but...well, I'm clueless.Last edited by mastin2 on Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.-
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rb Survivor
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I'm human and 'Other' so no it doesn't mean shit. Race is literally poop in this game.In post 4415, copper223 wrote:I am Cerberus, you are all dumb, let me make a huge post that reaches no conclusion and parrots Nahdia.
LLD's forced claim after the check is not null ( ), it makes her by far the likeliest scum or if we want to be generous anti-town even over heartless whom I know has other as a nation and is therefore very unlikely to be human, likeliest is they are the 5th faction.
Beeboy is still posting in this game and this makes it unlikely for him to be pure scum, LLD did not cc so this discussion for today is pointless anyway.-
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Stormblade Goon
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Actually, from a strictly logic based perspective, Frozen Angel isright. All we know is that ONE scum faction has the wincon "You must control 50% of the vote". There could be other scum factions with other win conditions.
Personally, I disagree with that notion, but that's not a confirmation.
-NahdiaABR // Nahdia // Errantparabola-
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Wake1 Jack of All Trades
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So since I don't know who is with me or against me, what does this mean?
It doesn't say I'm individual or isolationist, and I don't have a PT.
All it says is that you win if all threats to the Northern Tribes faction have been eliminated.
Problem is, I don't know who or what they are.-
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rb Survivor
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Yeah that's what I'm saying. Which is why your faction looks bad to meIn post 4421, Stormblade wrote:Actually, from a strictly logic based perspective, Frozen Angel isright. All we know is that ONE scum faction has the wincon "You must control 50% of the vote". There could be other scum factions with other win conditions.
Personally, I disagree with that notion, but that's not a confirmation.
-Nahdia-
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rb Survivor
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You're Town.In post 4422, Wake1 wrote:So since I don't know who is with me or against me, what does this mean?
It doesn't say I'm individual or isolationist, and I don't have a PT.
All it says is that you win if all threats to the Northern Tribes faction have been eliminated.
Problem is, I don't know who or what they are.
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