Don't inflate your ego. You're nothing special to me, I'm just taking my time this game.In post 623, Fate wrote:Waiting until I'm a viable counterwagon to save yourself TGin?
I haven't read your posts yet but from that statement alone you might be worth looking at
Mini 1869- camn's revenge GAME OVER!
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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Aeronaut He/HimJack of All TradesHe/Him
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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Speedy recovery
“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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I was excited...then people told me that just playing with you was a rite of passage.
At this post, what they said I soon learned to be true“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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Vaxkiller Jack of All Trades
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How long have you been holding onto that one?In post 628, Fate wrote:I thought you were looking forward to your "first game with Fate" gin?
What changed?
Being scum against me is that unpleasant?-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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Look, Nacho is scum this game. Its common sense.
camn KNEW I would be hunting for revenge on Nacho scum given how her last game turned out.
That's why immediately after Nacho was scumdrafted I was town drafted.
She knew it was a guaranteed scum caught- now let's lynch dat free scum. All the rest will get shaken out in the process.
The only question is whether you clowns are with me or against meFate is absurdly beautiful. 運命に弄ばれる
"Fate you keep alternating between narratives of doing it for fun and doing it for the sake of winning"-
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Pine In Your Head
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Vaxkiller Jack of All Trades
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This sentence is worded in a way that makes it seem like you were there, or you know more than town should know.In post 631, Fate wrote:That's why immediately after Nacho was scumdrafted I was town drafted.-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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Fate :HAPPY:
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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In post 393, Nachomamma8 wrote:I will make my fully glorious entrance tomorrow, after work. My time is limited tonight, but I will be dropping a couple beautiful bombs of wisdom on some select people for you to enjoy in anticipation of my return.“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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mastina She/HerFalse ProphetShe/Her
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Hey.In post 569, Pine wrote:Eww.
Don't go dissin' on mah medicine.
When you're sick for a solid six months, soon you learn very quickly to appreciate the taste of a good cough drop. Back in those days, I was a pack-a-day cough drop user. Each drop lasted about 20 mins, and then I'd pop a new one into my mouth. Kept me from being miserable and also helped hide that I was constantly sick. People knew I got sick, but they never knew that I never stopped being sick, and it was thanks to the magic of these amazing lil' hard candies.-
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mastina She/HerFalse ProphetShe/Her
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You want a case?In post 574, Pine wrote:Mastina, pick a scum and make a case for me. I'm bored.
I'll give you three!
Here's my case on TheRealGin-N-Tonic.
Here's my case on Aeronaut.
And here's my case on Nacho!-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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Im glad you support your scumbuddys excuse
He avoided me
After I called him out he didn't list me in his bombs of wisdom.
I get it, when you're pressed for time the last thign you want to do is address an aggressive player who is going to hound you for any slip ups
better to come at me when he's got more time to read through the thread and choose his position accordingly once he can see how the rest of the thread views me
I'm already unpopular as it is, he might even take the chance to call me scum!Fate is absurdly beautiful. 運命に弄ばれる
"Fate you keep alternating between narratives of doing it for fun and doing it for the sake of winning"-
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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Okay that's funny and all, but for a designated IC of the forums, I'd expect you to actually make a case instead of funny links and gags.“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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mastina She/HerFalse ProphetShe/Her
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Okay. One: cursing is not a sign of AtE. You can fucking curse all damn day and not have a lick of emotion behind it. Two, there was only one curse word in there. And three, said curse word? Not even used in a manner that is ever emotional.In post 589, SirCakez wrote:This is definitely AtE. He's cursing, asking to be wagoned, mentioning a scummy award.
You NEVER say "fucked" when you're emotional.
Sure, you can say fucking as an emotion.
Sure, you can say fuck as an emotion. (Fuck you, for instance.)
But fucked? No. Fucked is used in either two connotations: the literal sense of fornication, or the metaphorical sense of being screwed. "I'm fucked". "You're fucked". And those terms? Usually used in a lighthearted manner, the polar OPPOSITE of real AtE. You don't see people saying "we're fucked" and saying it as an emotional outcry. Maybe there's dread in it, but most commonly, it's an expression of that lighthearted "we're doomed", and nothing more. Which, you know, is self-evident. Because let's see the context of the fuck-bomb dropped:
There's humor in there. HUMOR. Not emotion. Humorously declaring that if we can't tell the difference, WE are fucked. Not him, WE. There's rules when it comes to cursing. There's a whole language, a whole fucking language, designating what a curse word means and the context behind a curse word. A curse word can add humor, it can add vulgarity, or it can add drama. This one was the former two, but not the latter one, and the drama is what cursing as AtE actually is.when you can't tell the difference, you're pretty much fucked.
Oh and four: mentioning a Scummy nomination is not ranting. It's bragging. You're not doing AtE if you're bragging. Pride isn't an emotional outcry. Ranting, based on anger, would be. But there's not so much as a fucking HINT of anger in the post. It's empty. Hollow. Shallow. Which brings me to...
Five: That request to be wagoned? Yeah that was bullshit.
If TheRealGin-N-Tonic actually wanted to be wagoned, know what he'd do? He'd self-vote the moment votes were valid. He'd go on a crusade to get wagoned. He'd point out how he was serious, and he'd make it a big deal. Do you know what we got from him instead?
This. That's it. Nothing more on the subject at all. It's as if...oh yeah. The original request was empty and hollow, because TheRealGin-N-Tonic wasn't actually interested in wagoning himself. He just said something which looked good, but when analyzed, had nothing actually good backing it.In post 275, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Also I asked for a flashwagon on me and then people vote you so like, what gives?
Now fuck off about your bullshit definition of AtE because TheRealGin-N-Tonic's post there was about as far away from AtE as you can get.
Oh gee, it's almost as if I EXPLAINED this already! It's not like I haven't clarified this ten times already.even assuming Pine didn't RNG his picks, how would you know whether he tried to WIFOM the playerlist with his picks or not if you were town?
But since you apparently weren't listening those nine other times, let me educate you on the subject.
There's a binary choice here. BINARY. Either it is, or it isn't.
Pine either made wifom picks, or he did not.
Now, no matter which he choice, there's the wifom game. We have to ask: did he make optimal choices, or did he try to throw us off?
Yet everyone is crying wifom to this whole process. They insist that because we can't determine which he decided to go for, the process of trying is therefore useless.
If people assume that Pine's picks cannot be reliably determined, then Pine has no incentive to make wifomy picks because nobody will believe he would make those blatant choices because people will cry wifom to the idea.
As a result, Pine is going to make the choices that are most optimal: he's not going to choose players for wifom. He's going to choose the players he thinks will make the best team. As a result, his choices can be figured out, if people stop being morons and crying out wifom to the idea.
It's like nightkill analysis.
Scum have the power to kill a player who blatantly points to the scum via NKA, or making a wifom kill to misdirect the town.
People will assume that because of the latter, NKA is therefore useless.
As a result of people discarding NKA, scum can make the nightkill on a player who blatantly points to who the scum are via NKA...
...Because the town will write it off as wifom.
When, newsflash. Scumteams don't actually kill players off of wifom. It's stupid, because nobody actually does NKA. So when a scumteam kills a player off of wifom, they're shooting themselves in the foot.
Same exact principle applies here.
Pine had the power to select a team which was blatant via basic Pine knowledge. (And keep in mind I have FAR FUCKING MORE than just basic Pine knowledge.) Alternatively, Pine had the option of making wifom picks for the scumteam, to misdirect the town.
People will assume that because of the latter, Pine's picks are therefore meaningless.
As a result of people discarding Pine's picks, he could make whatever the fuck he wanted to in terms of picks, no matter how blatantly obvious the picks would be...
...Because the town will write it off as wifom.
It's really not that fucking hard to understand.Last edited by camn on Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.-
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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Hey Mastin, I have a riddle for you I'd like your thoughts on.
Pine can't manipulate me as I know his alliance, however, what's to stop him from using his scum picks to do his manipulation for him?
I'm going to add a small step to what you just built and ask you about the possibility of it being true.
Pine uses SirCakes with giving the instructions to pocket me by giving me an early town read (by the way I'll admit I did like Cakes after he made that post, so in a sense it did work), which then will allow his scum team to have a town ally later down the road?
The reason I ask this is because when reading your guides, I noticed that one tip as scum is to make one town member like you and keep him around till LyLo so the scum player can trust that the townie will see the last townie as scum by PoE.“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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mastina I think youre town and while your posts make my eyes bleed like many others I wam willing to look past that and lynch scum with you.
So how is Nacho first sound? I don't want him NKing me then weaseling awayFate is absurdly beautiful. 運命に弄ばれる
"Fate you keep alternating between narratives of doing it for fun and doing it for the sake of winning"-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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No one designated me IC what the hell
My playstyle was always revolutionary, thats why they didnt give me best newbie
But it is damn effective
Or terrible.
Its an accurate as hell or destroy the town Im in sort of deal
But I trust in camn-senpai's choices to have me on the right side against the right scumsFate is absurdly beautiful. 運命に弄ばれる
"Fate you keep alternating between narratives of doing it for fun and doing it for the sake of winning"-
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Fate :HAPPY:
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SirCakez he/himIs A Liehe/him
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I read Ttyll and you were much more...uptight that game so I'm hopeful you're legit here.In post 624, drealmerz7 wrote:
at they are least in this gameIn post 622, SirCakez wrote:I TR dreal for his shitposting and tone
Generally those things get him scumread but they're town tells for him
gotta switch it up!
oh god this wallIn post 643, mastina wrote:
Okay. One: cursing is not a sign of AtE. You can fucking curse all damn day and not have a lick of emotion behind it. Two, there was only one curse word in there. And three, said curse word? Not even used in a manner that is ever emotional.In post 589, SirCakez wrote:This is definitely AtE. He's cursing, asking to be wagoned, mentioning a scummy award.
You NEVER say "fucked" when you're emotional.
Sure, you can say fucking as an emotion.
Sure, you can say fuck as an emotion. (Fuck you, for instance.)
But fucked? No. Fucked is used in either two connotations: the literal sense of fornication, or the metaphorical sense of being screwed. "I'm fucked". "You're fucked". And those terms? Usually used in a lighthearted manner, the polar OPPOSITE of real AtE. You don't see people saying "we're fucked" and saying it as an emotional outcry. Maybe there's dread in it, but most commonly, it's an expression of that lighthearted "we're doomed", and nothing more. Which, you know, is self-evident. Because let's see the context of the fuck-bomb dropped:
There's humor in there. HUMOR. Not emotion. Humorously declaring that if we can't tell the difference, WE are fucked. Not him, WE. There's rules when it comes to cursing. There's a whole language, a whole fucking language, designating what a curse word means and the context behind a curse word. A curse word can add humor, it can add vulgarity, or it can add drama. This one was the former two, but not the latter one, and the drama is what cursing as AtE actually is.when you can't tell the difference, you're pretty much fucked.
Oh and four: mentioning a Scummy nomination is not ranting. It's bragging. You're not doing AtE if you're bragging. Pride isn't an emotional outcry. Ranting, based on anger, would be. But there's not so much as a fucking HINT of anger in the post. It's empty. Hollow. Shallow. Which brings me to...
Five: That request to be wagoned? Yeah that was bullshit.
If TheRealGin-N-Tonic actually wanted to be wagoned, know what he'd do? He'd self-vote the moment votes were valid. He'd go on a crusade to get wagoned. He'd point out how he was serious, and he'd make it a big deal. Do you know what we got from him instead?
This. That's it. Nothing more on the subject at all. It's as if...oh yeah. The original request was empty and hollow, because TheRealGin-N-Tonic wasn't actually interested in wagoning himself. He just said something which looked good, but when analyzed, had nothing actually good backing it.In post 275, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Also I asked for a flashwagon on me and then people vote you so like, what gives?
Now fuck off about your bullshit definition of AtE because TheRealGin-N-Tonic's post there was about as far away from AtE as you can get.
Oh gee, it's almost as if I EXPLAINED this already! It's not like I haven't clarified this ten times already.even assuming Pine didn't RNG his picks, how would you know whether he tried to WIFOM the playerlist with his picks or not if you were town?
But since you apparently weren't listening those nine other times, let me educate you on the subject.
There's a binary choice here. BINARY. Either it is, or it isn't.
Pine either made wifom picks, or he did not.
Now, no matter which he choice, there's the wifom game. We have to ask: did he make optimal choices, or did he try to throw us off?
Yet everyone is crying wifom to this whole process. They insist that because we can't determine which he decided to go for, the process of trying is therefore useless.
If people assume that Pine's picks cannot be reliably determined, then Pine has no incentive to make wifomy picks because nobody will believe he would make those blatant choices because people will cry wifom to the idea.
As a result, Pine is going to make the choices that are most optimal: he's not going to choose players for wifom. He's going to choose the players he thinks will make the best team. As a result, his choices can be figured out, if people stop being morons and crying out wifom to the idea.
It's like nightkill analysis.
Scum have the power to kill a player who blatantly points to the scum via NKA, or making a wifom kill to misdirect the town.
People will assume that because of the latter, NKA is therefore useless.
As a result of people discarding NKA, scum can make the nightkill on a player who blatantly points to who the scum are via NKA...
...Because the town will write it off as wifom.
When, newsflash. Scumteams don't actually kill players off of wifom. It's stupid, because nobody actually does NKA. So when a scumteam kills a player off of wifom, they're shooting themselves in the foot.
Same exact principle applies here.
Pine had the power to select a team which was blatant via basic Pine knowledge. (And keep in mind I have FAR FUCKING MORE than just basic Pine knowledge.) Alternatively, Pine had the option of making wifom picks for the scumteam, to misdirect the town.
People will assume that because of the latter, Pine's picks are therefore meaningless.
As a result of people discarding Pine's picks, he could make whatever the fuck he wanted to in terms of picks, no matter how blatantly obvious the picks would be...
...Because the town will write it off as wifom.
It's really not that fucking hard to understand.
-First off, the cursing thing. If someone is cursing constantly then yeah it's not AtE. But look at Gin's ISO. He is very very restrained, and is only cursing when talking to people who are pushing him (with the exception of one early shitpost). It looks like legitimiate anger and not just someone who curses all the time. For that specific post, I'm not seeing the humor in saying that if you can't tell the difference between his town and scum games, you're fucked. Out of your three definitions, it looked like anger to me (especially combined with his other posting), which would be drama.
Bragging IS an appeal to emotion imo. By saying "oh I'm such a good player I would never get wagoned as scum and I have a scummy to prove it", he's basically trying to make the people pushing him think twice. Which would be a scumtell if it weren't for the other factors.
The call for a wagon on himself was maybe bullshit, but it looks like something pissed off town would say, given how early it is. I did something similar as frustrated town in Shadowrun.
Your whole last bit is wrong because of what you're arguing over: WIFOM. Maybe yeah Pine predicted that people would be paranoid and then make "optimal picks" for his team. But then maybe he predicted that people would predict that (like you've been doing) and then make WIFOMy picks instead. But then maybe he predicted that people would predict THAT and went with the optimal picks instead.
etc
etc
etcBrian Skies - "I just wanna say Cakez is an evil mod and this is an evil setup."
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Get to know a Cakez!-
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TheRealGin-N-Tonic Jack of All Trades
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@MastinIn post 640, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Okay that's funny and all, but for a designated IC of the forums, I'd expect you to actually make a case instead of funny links and gags.“To be is to do”—Socrates. “To do is to be”—Jean-Paul Sartre. “Do be do be do”—Frank Sinatra.
"Gin, you are so charismatic it's scary." -nancy-
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mastina She/HerFalse ProphetShe/Her
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Yes, in fact I do see the scum motivation behind my play today. In fact, a large portion of my play this game I'm plagiarizing from my scumgame. Now there were tweaks involved to make it my towngame, of course, but a large portion of my posting is based upon my scumgame, and as a result, it is RIDICULOUSLY easy for me to see my posts as scum. Sometimes, I have to remind myself that I am in fact supposed to be playing a towngame, here.In post 607, Aeronaut wrote:Ok, doyousee a scum motivation behind your play today? Furthermore, do you understand why I'm asking people that question?
So as a result: no, I do not see a town reason for you to be asking that question. I can see a reason to ask it as scum, but I see no reason for you to ask it as town.
Okay. Let me put it to you this way. I have more games with Nacho than any other player on the site. ANY other player on the site. Even Pine. I have hydraed with Nacho more than any other player on the site. We've seen countless games as Calcifer, and one as Palisade. He has seen me as town more than any other player, both himself as town and with him as scum. He has seen me as scum more than any other player, both himself as scum and when he is town.I actually don't see how it would be a scum claim from his perspective. I know there's no way I could possibly comprehend the narrative you have going on in your head, but please try.
While his accuracy isn't quite on the zMuffinman/AngryPidgeon level, he's second only to them in terms of having an accurate read on me in games. He and I have always, on some fundamental level, just had a way of getting the other. We hydra extremely well together, work better as a team than any other player. Even AngryPidgeon, the guy who replaced Pine as my frenemy after Pine left, the guy who I have an insanely high number of games playing with, can't work as well with me as I can work with Nacho. We have a soul link of sorts. We might not hold the power to perfectly read each other...
...But in the rare instances where he would have a scumread on me, he'd never willingly admit it. He'd keep it to himself. He'd keep it private, pondering on it. He'd hope to lure me in to a trap, or to be proven wrong, or any other various reason. He wouldn't share it, because if he did, then if he's wrong he'd lose his chance to work with me and if he's right then he'd lose his chance to ensnare, to trap, me. So even if he did have a wrong scumread on me, he wouldn't share it.
Furthermore, Nacho also knows of our extensive history. He knows how I view his play. He knows all of the above is how I view him. He either has a correct read on me, or is faking having a correct read on me, because he knows that if he took the alternative route, I'd campaign HARD to lynch him, especially post-Tales of You. In that game, Nacho started as a top-tier townread. (Not because of his half, I'd like to point out. His hydra partner, bork, was ridiculously good at being obvtown even as scum and Nacho never would've been top-tier otherwise.)
Themomenthe started pushing me, Iknewhe was scum. That wasn't some random OMGUS on my part. That wasn't some random revelation on my part. I'm extremely self-conscious of my play. I know when I am being obvtown. I also know, furthermore, when I am being obvtown to the players who know me. I knew I was obvtown in that game to those who knew me. And I knew, then, that because Nacho wasn't seeing I was obvtown, he was scum. I was right.
Same thing applies here, and the same rule is in effect here. I might not be obvtown to everyone, but to anyone who knows me, I most certainly am. Nacho knows this. So if Nacho were to scumread me...it would be a flat-out scumclaim.
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