Food Fight Mafia - WHO OWNS THE SCHOOL???

[Gorgon]

But I forget. Who cleared him?

I went back and checked. It was Tar, in his post 54.

[cicero]

Thanks. A Tarhalindur innocent is, imho, meaningless.

[Skruffs]

Still, while I agree that Tar's results are useless, that's my opinion. opinion.

When there are like 15 players, it makes no sense to try and lynch players that have an innocent on them, even if it's possibly from a naive cop, than it is to go after those players that have NOTHING On them.

Re: Battlemage : I will note that the only person you attacked yesterday was someone who hasn't lied about their claim and has at least one certified cop and another uncertified cop investigation on him. You didn't even mention has yesterday, so of course you will wait until today to talk about it being a mislynch. ^.^

[cicero]

Still, while I agree that Tar's results are useless, that's my opinion. opinion.

When there are like 15 players, it makes no sense to try and lynch players that have an innocent on them, even if it's possibly from a naive cop, than it is to go after those players that have NOTHING On them.

I dont think that as the right play here. I can see why you would say that seeing as you are one of the players benefitting from such an innocent, but I have to call it as I see it. It seems infinitely more likely that the mason cops innocents dont mean anything, so I'm going to ignore them. I'm not ignoring the other cops though.

The part of your post after "Re: Battlemage: were you talking to me or to him? About me or about him?" I got confused.

[DrippingGoofball]

[Battle Mage]

Yamahako has an 'innocent' on him, though, right?

True. But if one assumes that the mason-cops are naive, this is irrelevant.

Not that I'm stating this assumption as fact

, but I think it's likely. I do at least think it's quite likely that not all of

three

mason-cops are completely sane. That's just way too overpowered.

Also, the cheerleader nature of the flavour is another indicator, IMO. If they're just gossiping cheerleaders, I'm not sure they'd make for such good actual investigators.

Or perhaps it is the cheerleader who find out what is REALLY going on. The truth behind the lies.

Its a double edged sword.

BM

[Korlash]

[quote="Skruffs"]When there are like 15 players, it makes no sense to try and lynch players that have an innocent on them, even if it's possibly from a naive cop, than it is to go after those players that have NOTHING On them. [quote]

You know that using this logic means you can't really attack BM... Just saying...

[Skruffs]

I'm Not Saying that we should lynch BM, I'm just CONSTANTLY repeating that he is playing like SCUM BM trying to act like 'sterotypical TOWN BM"

Believe it or not I don't vote people just cuz I don't like them, I *DO* try to vote for the peopel who are likely to be SCUM.


Cicero: I am also NOT saying we should take the innocents as anything more than claimed innocents. But in the off chance that the cops are NOT naive, there is NO reason to kill the people they have cleared, NOT when there are SO MANY players that *aren't*... That makes sense to you, right?

Toss three french fries at Gorgon

[Skruffs]

Korlash - Do you mind if I give you a bad behavior note? IF you don't say no in your next post I am going to assume you don't mind the idea (To see if it possibly acts as a roleblocker for students)

[cicero]

Cicero: I am also NOT saying we should take the innocents as anything more than claimed innocents. But in the off chance that the cops are NOT naive, there is NO reason to kill the people they have cleared, NOT when there are SO MANY players that *aren't*... That makes sense to you, right?

Toss three french fries at Gorgon

I asked Yamahako some questions. He said he'd answer. He hasn't answered. He has food like a grown up and a soup scum. You are stopping me from pressuring him which will let him float through to end game, based on a situation in which we know that it is far more likely that the mason-cops results are not trustworthy. I'm not down with that.

[Skruffs]

Cicero:
The post in which he said he would reply was the LAST POST he has made to the site, since then. I don't think it's fair to say he's ignoring your request, just yet. Chill. I have no reason to put your desire to pressure vote Yamahako over my own suspicious, on Gorgon.

[cicero]

Don't let me stop you from poking Gorgon. I think he's a very good lynch choice for today and I have my can of coke primed for a possible shot to his head. If you look back you'll note me commenting that one of his posts looked like posting for the sake of posting. I stand by that.

I've just been trying to attract a broader player base back into the game starting with my lingering suspicion dude.

Incidentally, half this game is lurker-ville right now. If we dont turn our attention to that before February 5th, I HIGHLY recommend that the active players stop sniping each other and turn their attention to the shadows.

[cicero]

eDWOP: Incidentally, half this game is lurker-ville right now. If we dont turn our attention to that before February 5th, I HIGHLY recommend that the active players stop sniping each other and turn their attention to the shadows tomorrow.

[Yamahako]

1.) Skitzer was overly defensive, and was constantly saying he thought I was guilty - but didn't want to waste food - yet he basically never used any food. ABR hasn't actually commented on the game with his own thoughts. The entire time he was questioning what other people thought he should do.
2.) ABR (who has been replaced) is almost definetly scum. Skitzer may just be lazy. ABR has links to a, now, known scum.
3.) They basically stopped posting, I was intending to try and do a PBPA on ABR, but I was a Day late (night started earlier than I thought it would). Things have been unpredictable and hectic for me making it more difficult for me to post regularly.
4.) ABR, Tar, and Skitzer. Tar would give us the most information, ABR would be more of a sure thing.
5.) Because I figured if they were actually town they would comment on other things. Their argument left the realm of standard bickering and entered the absurd shortly before that post. It seemed more like a calculated measure that would insure one person was thought of as town Early on. I'd wager if they actually are in a mafia they are paired with Tar-scum which would balanced that many "cops" nicely.

how about you comment on the game yourself rather than continually ask questions and complain about lurkers? If you commit to statments I bet you'll get more participation - if that's your real goal (as opposed to just appearing town.) IGMEOY.

I'll do my best to get my ABR (now replaced) case up - but if you just view all his posts it should be obviously. Actively lurking is nearly always bad in my experience.

[cicero]

how about you comment on the game yourself rather than continually ask questions and complain about lurkers? If you commit to statments I bet you'll get more participation - if that's your real goal (as opposed to just appearing town.) IGMEOY.

Thanks. I need to go back and fully digest your answers in light of the facts but in the meantime the above paragraph turned you from a somewhat suspect for me to a major suspect for the game.

I's an obvious OMGUS that doesn't have a shred of basis in reality. I've taken stands, popular and unpopular, throughout the game on issues and players. Questions have, in fact, been more limited.

A cursory honest read of my play demonstrates the misrepresentation inherent.

Tsk.

[Tarhalindur]

1.) Skitzer was overly defensive, and was constantly saying he thought I was guilty - but didn't want to waste food - yet he basically never used any food. ABR hasn't actually commented on the game with his own thoughts. The entire time he was questioning what other people thought he should do.
2.) ABR (who has been replaced) is almost definetly scum. Skitzer may just be lazy. ABR has links to a, now, known scum.
3.) They basically stopped posting, I was intending to try and do a PBPA on ABR, but I was a Day late (night started earlier than I thought it would). Things have been unpredictable and hectic for me making it more difficult for me to post regularly.
4.) ABR, Tar, and Skitzer. Tar would give us the most information, ABR would be more of a sure thing.
5.) Because I figured if they were actually town they would comment on other things. Their argument left the realm of standard bickering and entered the absurd shortly before that post. It seemed more like a calculated measure that would insure one person was thought of as town Early on. I'd wager if they actually are in a mafia they are paired with Tar-scum which would balanced that many "cops" nicely.

how about you comment on the game yourself rather than continually ask questions and complain about lurkers? If you commit to statments I bet you'll get more participation - if that's your real goal (as opposed to just appearing town.) IGMEOY.

I'll do my best to get my ABR (now replaced) case up - but if you just view all his posts it should be obviously. Actively lurking is nearly always bad in my experience.

There are several problems with this post, but two stand out:

1) Your single-minded focus on ABR, and the logic that you're using (the unexplained "links to a known scum"). I think that you may actually be correct about ABR... but if so, it's because you're scum from the rival group who caught on to ABR after I brought up the player list theory. (I can't really consciously explain why, but when I looked at your recent attacks on ABR I was immediately reminded of my attack on Theopor (Replicator scum) as Gou'Ald scum in Stargate SG-1.)

2) You seem to think that Skitzer is a valid lynch candidate. Small problem there - Skitzer was lynched as vanilla town on Day 1, therefore lynching him again would be difficult at best.

Tarhalindur lynch candidates:

Skruffs - Despite the double innocents, I'm having difficultly accepting his play as pro-town for previously explained reasons.
Battle Mage - the early BM/Skruffs feud still concerns me (again, it reminds me of my attack on Theopor in SG-1, albeit not to the extent that Yamahako/ABR does) and the claim is somewhat suspect.

Yamahako - as much a gut read as anything, but his recent play is really pinging my scumdar for reasons explained above. I need to check and see how under-the-radar he's been, and whether the IIoA (Information Instead of Analysis) tell is applicable.

Gorgon - Very under-the-radar, adjacent to Lowell on the player list (though how valid that theory is remains to be seen).

[Korlash]

Korlash - Do you mind if I give you a bad behavior note? IF you don't say no in your next post I am going to assume you don't mind the idea (To see if it possibly acts as a roleblocker for students)

*Sigh* why me... But thats cool, go ahead. I have been a bad bad Leroy Brown... <.< What? I didn't say anything.. stop looking at me...

[Skruffs]

Interesting.

TArhalindur's list (except for Gorgon) seems to consist entirely of players with investigations on them. And for some reason, he's trying to not only discredit his own investigations, but ALSO the fonz, that we have NO reason to suspect as being naive.

Thank you for your willingness to cooperate, Korlash. ^.^

Bad Behavior Note: Tarhalindur

Since you have no faith in your own investigations, hopefully you can at least tell me tomorrow, if the bad behavior note blocked that investigation.

Bad Behavior Note: Mneme

Bad Behavior Note: Battle Mage

Tar: What about
1. JordanA24
2. Blackberry (repl. foolinc)
4. mneme (repl. Sir Tornado (repl. pulsewidth))
6. TheHermit (repl. YosiP (repl. Bamboomancer))
7. Flameaxe (repl.Blight)
10. Albert B. rampage (repl. waar)

Most of these players have not been investigated at all, but you are just ignoring them. Why?



Mod:
11. hasdgfas (repl. ckillor) is still in the alive list?

With two scum groups, I presume 3 or so in each, -1 for soup scum, and with only 13 alive, I don't know if it's possible to win unless there are crosskills of SOME sort.

[Korlash]

... So all that and no note for meee???

T_T *cries*

[DrippingGoofball]

ghulof replaces ABR. Yay!

[ghulof]

Yo. This is Gorrad's alt, just on here to avoid confusion. In similar news, crap, I was wrong about ABR. He's scummy, lurking, blah blah blah all that jazz, but that's just how he always plays. He was telling the truth about the PR-giving abilities, I have no investigative powers though. I'll do a reread today or tommorow and throw food before the deadline.

[Tarhalindur]

After a second reread on my scum candidates, I noticed something that I really should have noticed before now, something that I find incredibly scummy.

Gorgon has offered lots of commentary on game theory (setup thoughts, thoughts about my mason group), but he has, at best, barely commented on anyone's play. Observe:

Hi.

I never got my role PM when I agreed to replace, so I just forgot about the whole thing. I only just realised I'm actually in this game when I got a prod from DGB. I asked for my role PM though, so I'm now officially in the game. Guess I have some reading to do.

Standard entry post, nothing to see here.

There's no time. Just throw your food on one of the top choices(besides me)

Let me guess - The guy with the highest bar gets "lynched", or whatever happens in this game at the end of the deadline, right?

Question involving game mechanics, no comments on other players.

The student covered will the most food will be sent home to shower.

Ah, found it. But it appears you're way ahead, ABR. Does it matter if I throw my food or not?

Again, asking about the game mechanics.

Okay ...

I only have three shots, and looking through pickem's posts using the magic of the Find tool, I see he's used two of them already. So here goes my last one.

Fling consommé at The Fonz

Fires at The Fonz with little reasoning. I'd need to check context to be sure, but my impression is that this may be a case of scum trying to pile onto a town wagon.

Forgive me cicero, for I know not what I do!

I'll be more careful with my food tomorrow, when I've actually figured out what the heck is going on here a little better.

Looks like a fun theme though.

Trying to understand the setup is not necessarily scummy. Trying to understand the setup

instead of finding scum

, however, is scummy as all hell.

Rereading, even the last 10 pages, takes time that I don't have. I'm going to bed any minute now.

Also, I did assume that people might want to know what kind of food everyone has.

Fish fish fish, anyone? And I still don't see any scumhunting.

Okay, I've read the game now, and feel quite embarrased over my entry into it. Thing is, from ABR's comment I thought there was some kind of pressure for everyone to throw all their food before the deadline. I picked The Fonz randomly, and didn't know anything about anyone's roleclaims. I know you only have my word for this, but this is the truth, although DGB can probably verify that I did indeed not get my role PM until just before I started posting in this game.

Anyway, the argument between BM and Skruffs is pretty bizarre and annoying at times. However, one argument that I felt was very convincing was the discrepancy between the way BM's and Skruff's BB notes worked. Therefore, I find it incredible to learn now that BM only tonight thought of asking for a clarification of the way his BB notes worked - not sure what to make of this, but it certainly doesn't look good. Then again, town-BM is often certain of things that turn out to be wrong, and he has admitted this mistake of his.

Regarding cicero's analysis of the deceased Lowell's attacks, it is an interesting fact that he picked on Gorrad that much. I agree that it looks a little over the top to be distancing, but he did start of doing this very early (which to my mind is a slight sign of possible distancing). Also, it's now clear that there are now most likely two scum groups, right? The administration scum who dismiss students, and the soup scum who boil them. This means that scum as well as town don't necessarily have to be fabricating their cases - scum could be attacking each other across groups. I must say that I got a bad vibe from Gorrad while reading through the game, so he could well be scum.

Unless some other dairy item got thrown at ABR, then the cheese doodles might be it.

In fact, I just looked up the nutritional information for "Cheese Doodles" and they contain calcium, in contrast to the other snack products from the same company, which suggests that cheese doodles are indeed a dairy product (at least in real life)

Interesting - and now Nightfall is dead, and the PR cannot be verified. IMO, Nightfall could have been killed for these reasons:

- ABR is scum, and didn't want his fabricated post restriction to be proven wrong (but then, why would he fabricate something like this in the first place? Hmm ...)

- Someone killed Nightfall in order to make ABR look bad (A stupid use of a NK IMO).

- Nightfall was killed because of good play/someone guessed he was Tar's mason partner (Most likely, I think - not discounting the other options, though).

Btw, regarding Tar's role, yesterday he claimed he had investigative powers, but today he has not revealed any results (only Nightfall's results). Why is this?

The theory of the player list is also highly interesting - we seem to have some strong evidence that people are indeed ordered by their roles (all three gossiping masons grouped together, and the specialised cops grouped together). It's kind of lame that this seems to be game relevant, but I guess everything that's useful for winning is fair game, so ckillor is definitely not a stupid lynch, if only to test this theory.

I look at this post, and I see lots and lots of theory about the setup and plenty of speculation about why a scumgroup might have killed Nightfall (worlds of WIFOM, anyone?), but no actual scumhunting (except maybe his halfhearted "yeah, let's kill ckillor to test the theory"... which he might have supported as scum expecting that the ckillor lynch would discredit the theory, and at the very least generate a mislynch).

Tar ... I have indeed posted since replacing - a few posts, even. It is true that I've been less than active these past few days, but that goes for all my games. I friggin' hate to have to anwer for this, but I thought it would be pretty obvious that this is a busy season for most people. I especially dislike that you should have to ask whether I've posted or not, when this is easy enough to check.

And yes, checking the list, I do see that I/pickem was next to Lowell. This means (only to me, obv) that either the theory of consecutive scum does not hold water, or Lowell's group starts with him. This weakens the theory, IMO. Especially since I agree that ckillor's role both sounds plausible and, if true, not likely to be affiliated with the soup scum.

I would, however, like to hear whom ckillor has blocked.

Weak defense to my attack, nothing less, nothing more. Weak enough to be a null tell, IMO.

Damn - I've lost track of this game. I've looked at it a few times, seen that there's lots of new posts, been daunted, and decided to post later. Sorry.

I see I'm under pressure to claim. That's understandable given the circumstances.

I'm Joy F. Spelling, spelling bee kid. I'm vanilla, far as I can see - no special powers mentioned in my role PM.

Claim is decent, if not great. Still no scumhunting, however - the only post in which Gorgon came close to expressing suspicion was his agreement with the ckillor lynch.

Does anyone else find it a little odd that ckillor claimed RB and yet he turned out to be what I assume is a vanilla townie? Quite

étrange

, is it not? What reason would he have to lie about his role? I'm so confused.

Not only that, but he gave a different name as well. Weird.

Commenting on why another player might have acted as he did instead of. you know, actually offering an opinion of or analysis of other players... seeing a pattern yet?

This game seems to be lagging, and we need to spice it up.

Here's something to chew on: Night two, two players were bashed in the head. Are there any 'motivators' or players that would help someone do more than one night action? If so, whoever they targetted ngiht two may have been scum.

Interesting point. Here's the list of deaths:

DAY 1
skitzer - Irreversibly traumatized, Nola Grand, Vanilla aka "town"

NIGHT 1
JDodge - Boiled in the cauldron, David N. Goliath, Slingshot Kid aka"town"
the silent speaker - Fired, School Secretary, Sabotageur of Bad Behavior Notes, and Protector against School Suspensions, aka "town"

NIGHT 2
Erg0 - expelled, Linus Smart, Administration Cop aka"town"
The Fonz (repl. PlaysWithSquirrels) - bashed in the head, Hans Tubbinger, Cafeteria Cop aka"town"
Nightfall - bashed in the head, Jessica Bumble, Gossiping Mason aka"town"

NIGHT 3
Gorrad - bashed in the head, Antonio Gentile, Peanut Allergy Suffferer aka"town"
vollkan - fired, School Nurse with Burn Kits and EpiPen aka"town"

We have one 'boiled in cauldron' kill N1. Sounds like soup scum. But why were there no kills in this manner N2, nor N3? Did the 'doc' get lucky both nights, or the killer blocked both nights ... or some combination. However you look at it, two nights of no killing are weird.

The firings and expulsions that take place, one per night, sound like admin scum. Nothing unusual here.

I'm not sure what 'bashed in the head' is, but it could easily be a SK. The two bashings N2 could be due to some sort of motivator, yes. Or some special attribute of the role, like an extra single-shot kill?

Again, lots of setup speculation, plenty of WIFOM on scum actions, no player analysis.

Well yeah - it very much seems like the mason-cops are naive. I find it hard to believe that they've used all their investigations on townies.

Anyway, what happened to BM? Did he forget about this game?

Commenting on mason sanities is okay... commenting on mason sanities instead of analyzing other players? Not so much.

Also, possible Gorgon-Battle Mage connection. (Gorgon as admin goon and BM as admin Godfather, with maybe Skruffs as soup Godfather? Wouldn't rule it out.)

I have a sandwich?
I got a prod, requested by someone called Grogon. rofl

BM

That's me. I like grog!

http://arrrr.com/grog/groggroggrog.jpg

Bring the Grog on!

P.S. No, I'm not drunk.

P.P.S. I wish I had some grog to throw.

HEY LOOK, HERE'S A PLAYER WHO'S JOKING AROUND INSTEAD OF CONTRIBUTING TO THE GAME.

[/jdodgemode]

I'm willing to vote Gorgon today. ^.^

There is no reason to assume that the cops are naive or lying based on their investigations, just because they have all received innocents. I belive Tarhalindur is scum, but that's because of slips he's made, but I'm not going to actively go after it yet, scum will eventually have to kill both of them, just because of the risk that they might be un-naive.

Anyone who was in ORK MAFIA should know that sometimes the cops just have horrible investigative skills; Shanba in that game 'cleared' the godfather n1, investigated townies the entire game, and finally found the miller.

Does anyone think they are a miller and would be willing to be investigated to check out that theory?

So, you're willing to vote me because I agreed that the mason-cops seem to be naive? I don't quite understand ...

There were further arguments offered, besides the fact that they have no guilty investigations. One of the strongest ones, IMO, was the fact that none of them have received guilty investigations, and thus I mentioned that. I could have written a long essay where I reiterated all the arguments offered, but I saw no need to.

Also - no, I was not in ORK MAFIA, nor have I read it. You may have wastly superior stores of data to support the assertion that this is not an unusual situation, but I do not. I'm not pulling the newbie card here, just saying that I'm less experienced than you. For example, this is my first large game ever.

Also, how was that assertion scummy? Why would scum be more likely to say it? You left that out of your accusation.

Defense is always a null tell, pulling the newbie card while trying to say that he's not pulling the newbie card, still no player analysis.

I agree that Gorgon's certainty of the gossips being naive points to the possiblitiy of him and probably one of those "cleared" being naive.

What do you mean? Is the second 'naive' supposed to read 'scum', perhaps?

As for your question, Skruffs, no I don't have any clear reason, per se, to believe any of the people cleared are actually guilty. I didn't even have a full grasp of who had been cleared when I said I believed the cops were naive.

I didn't f*cking think things this far. If you want to lynch me for that, go ahead. It's not like I'm in way too many games for my taste anyway.

I get why this is scummy now - it might have indicated that I have the hidden knowledge that one of the people cleared are scum, but it's not. There's of course little I can say at this point to convince you otherwise.

This is why I have been quiet in this game - I don't really know what's going on in it ... and of course the minute I say anything game relevant, it's blown out of proportion like it's a huge tell, just because it's not well thought out. I f*cking hate tells.

Regarding the foreign kids, I'm not sure all of them are town. It's just a little too simplistic to set things up so all the people with foreign language posting restrictions are town, IMO.

Anyway, if I had to vote right now, it would be Yamahoko. The questions that cicero dug up for him were actually quite interesting, and his reluctance to answer them is troublesome.

Cool, player analysis! Problem is that the analysis basically consists of "I agree with Player Y's questions."

Defense is a null tell (though the Skruffs attack is doing a good job of convincing me that, if Skruffs and Gorgon are both scum, then they're on rival teams), foreign kids = setup analysis, nothing more, nothing less.

Anyway, this game started out with 24 people, which is a bit less than 30.

Are

you

paying attention, Skruffs?

Need to look at context to be sure, but I think this is basically filler.

I get why you're going after BM, Skruffs, and I also get why it's not working - BM is too erratic a player, especially when he's town. His scummy behaviour is too easily written off because of this.

I'm not ruling out the possibility that he' scum, though. Especially since he hasn't contributed much of value to this game for quite some time now.

Well, I have to give Gorgon credit - it's player analysis. Incredibly wishy-washy player analysis, yes, but player analysis nonetheless.

Also, I'm really starting to see a Gorgon-BM scumpair here.

Yamahako has an 'innocent' on him, though, right?

True. But if one assumes that the mason-cops are naive, this is irrelevant.

Not that I'm stating this assumption as fact

, but I think it's likely. I do at least think it's quite likely that not all of

three

mason-cops are completely sane. That's just way too overpowered.

Also, the cheerleader nature of the flavour is another indicator, IMO. If they're just gossiping cheerleaders, I'm not sure they'd make for such good actual investigators.

Mason-cop discussion, yes. Player analysis, no. Pinging my scumdar? Definitely.

Tells are tells; they're important, but not that important.

But the biggest tell is lurkish, passive behavior.

Glad you agree. I agree with the second one as well, and know that I am guilty of passiveness in this game. I'm trying to change that now ... a plus is that I'm actually not as insanely busy these days as I was for way too long, so I actually have some time to devote to MS.

Hey, at least he admits it. Not like I think that should necessarily save him, though.

In short, outside of a few recent posts, Gorgon has done absolutely no player analysis (aka scumhunting), despite posting plenty of thoughts on the game setup. I haven't fully analyzed Pickem's posts yet, but a cursory readthrough suggests that pickem failed to provide player analysis as well. That is the IIoA (Information Instead of Analysis) "tell" (for lack of a better term), and it's enough for me to favor your lynch today.

Probably should have posted this case earlier, but other games took precedence.

ALPHA STRIKE: GORGON
Fire celery sticks at Gorgon
Fire cherry tomatoes at Gorgon
Fire cheese at Gorgon

[DrippingGoofball]

25 hours to deadline kids!

[Yamahako]

Throw 2 Saltines at Tar

Throw Cup of Hot Coffee at Tar

I think out of him and ABR - both being equal - Tar's death gives us the most information about who remaining scum might be.

I don't find the Gorrad case that compelling - because posting about the same set-up and theories regarding it isn't necessarily scummy on its own.

[cicero]

...and now he's throwing his food at a claimed mason-cop from the masons who provided him with the innocent result that skruffs wants us to obey. Yamahako, I have to hand it to you that you might just be town because I don't know if scum would have the balls. But your view of this game doesn't line up with my view of this game at all.

I think with Gorgon and Yamahako we may have two soup scum.