I don't think zyrc actually posted anything, but if he did get a random vote off before deciding to throw an innocent into reading through 6 pages of...One very long discussion...Anyways, just in case,
Unvote
.
As it stands I haven't really seen scummy behavior, at least, nothing that guarantees scum, from any of the players. I, personally, don't like the bandwagon approach, it seems to me that it can be taken advantage of too easily. Therefore I won't vote for either Matt_s or Khel without a good idea of their scumminess. I need further evidence, particularly from those who aren't posting, before deciding.
To all the bandwagonners who didn't supply any reason: Really? Shameless bandwagon? For shame.
Willing to replace in any game, have some background experience but haven't gotten all of the specifics down, ie. abbreviations and other terms...
Okay, I'm so sorry about my last post. It ended rather messily. Let me clarify.
The way I see it, a normal game of mafia has 2 general groups, mafia and town, and then we sift through actions based on which of those two groups are likely to do it.
This game, has 4 groups, all of which will react to things in different ways. Named town, named scum, unnamed town, unnamed scum.
I think I'm not the only one arguing based on this line of reasoning. Matt and Massive both defended Khel by saying that a nameclaim is something that a named town would do, but that something that a named scum would not want. I'm not going to quote, but Massive's post 99 makes it pretty clear that scum would not want a name claim. Matt's post 75 and 28 also show that he thinks scum would have been against a name claim.
Now, unnamed people, have a very clear reason to be against the nameclaim. I'd be quite surprised if they weren't. Named people, at the very least, should see why khel would do it, and are more likely to see it as stupid play than scummy play. Destructor, I think showed how a named town would act to a name claim.
You FOSing khel though, not so much. It looks like named scum trying not to go for a nameclaim to avoid being found out. That's why you're on my naughty list. After rereading everything though, I think I'm going to
It just struck me to look at the people who were on the khel wagon, and especially the people who weren't.
The people who were on the khel wagon, are crazyvlad, coolbot, gsgold, matt - in that order.
The people who were on the matt wagon, are ranger, massive, khel, coolbot, eljko. Destructor was voting for matt for a while, but it was an L-5 vote, and he pulled it out before it was an actual wagon.
Ranger's vote was a random vote, so I'm going to discard it. NOBODY is on both wagons except for coolbot. I'm not really surprised, matt and khel have been arguing from opposite ends from the get go, and they've both been really vocal about their opinions.
The people who made it a point to stay off a particular wagon, are people who have argued for the point of view of khel and matt. Massive's post 99 is a good example of a named person staying off the khel wagon. There are other people who see things from Khel's point of view and decided to stay off the wagon. The people on the Khel wagon is crazyvlad, who I think justified his vote - and then coolbot and gsgold who did it for the sake of bandwagonning.
The thing with coolbot is, his post 14 makes it clear he's unnamed. Matt, in post 15, identifies with him as a fellow unnamed vanilla. Why then, coolbot, are you on the Matt wagon?
I can understand khel, massive and maybe eljko. They're named, and don't identify with the unnamed view of the game.
You, on the other hand, are unnamed. If you really were an unnamed vanilla like Matt though, you wouldn't have voted for him. The more I thought about it, the more I figured it isn't just named scum scared of giving away a bad name who would have been against a nameclaim, but also unnamed scum who were scared of being found out as not part of the fellowship.
Besides all that, which I will grant, is assumption on how named scum and unnamed scum would act, and besides the fact that you have been on both wagons, despite most people identifying with either khel or matt, you've shown sketchy reasons for being on them.
Your vote on khel was, and you admitted, for wagonning, and then vague mentions of how you thought it was anti-town. I think it was clearly unjustified. Your vote on Matt, besides the fact that another unnamed vanilla wouldn't have done it, was also for sketchy reasons.
Maybe you just like voting for vague reasons, but I'm against votes that aren't clearly justified and explained. I'm keeping my vote on you until you give me a good reason not to.
Also, I'm really sorry for the long posts. =( I've just been rereading, and there's quite a lot on my head, so I decided to just put the stuff down. To avoid creating really long pages like page 5, I'm going to cut my posts into littler pieces from now on.
I just remembered something. Back in post 28, I mentioned that something CoolBot said made me nervous. At the time I didn't say what it was. It was the fact that he said he wasn't in the Fellowship. Nothing about not having a name, just that he wasn't in the Fellowship. Of course I didn't specifically say that I had no name, but I was trying fish for reactions. Yet CoolBot mentioned that he wasn't Fellowship when coming to my defense. I'd think that he'd explain that not everybody had names, but he just said that he wasn't in the Fellowship. At the time, it made me even more paranoid. Right now, it's something that people may want to look back at. It's not exactly mind blowing evidence, but the way he worded his post seemed odd to me.
Yeah, I originally had his post pegged as an unnamed vanilla response, but it looks more like unnamed scum to me now. I was originally looking at the different ways that named and unnamed would act, I didn't think to differentiate between named scum, and named town, and unnamed town and scum.
The fact that unnamed scum might act similar to unnamed town flew by me, so I didn't suspect coolbot. All the same though, even without all the mess of nameds and unnameds, his voting pattern and waggoning is suspicious. That itself would warrant a vote.
Despite large amounts of evidence, all of which he agrees with, saying that CoolBot is Scum, Matt still maintains his vote on Khel, whom he used to agree with and recently bandwagonned against. He had a rather pitiful excuse to vote for Khel too, considering right before he said he wouldn't vote Khel for the lynch because he believed him to be Town, and, correct me if I'm wrong, a power role. This seems suspicious to me, and I'll let Matt answer to that.
As for CoolBot, I'll have to reread what he has said, pick up on what you two have seen.
Willing to replace in any game, have some background experience but haven't gotten all of the specifics down, ie. abbreviations and other terms...
please read again my posts from page 5.
If you've started voluntary to do a votes count please do it correctly.
ty.
As it's pretty late I'll post some content. welcome imat.
I don't want to keep you so close to the gun, until I hear more proded players comments, then I will vote or not vote for you. All depends on what I read. You got a deal on me, I have a deal on you, fair enough?
I'm not voting Matt_S because he's unnamed. I never said anything like that. I am voting him because of his quick change of vote around post 70. He gave no justification for it, and it looks odd to me.
Matt_S wrote:Yet CoolBot mentioned that he wasn't Fellowship when coming to my defense. I'd think that he'd explain that not everybody had names, but he just said that he wasn't in the Fellowship.
Revealing if not everyone has a name gives scum a lot of help when they have to come up with a claim. Since the crux of Khel's argument was that there was
only
Fellowship, I only had to reveal I wasn't in the Fellowship to stop the mass claim. Unnamed townies should not have been revealed.
ting =) wrote: I can understand khel, massive and maybe eljko. They're named, and don't identify with the unnamed view of the game
Just because we defend khel does not mean we have names. I defend khel because I think he is town. I was against nameclaim, but that did not necisarily mean scum. I think his actions are pro-town, so I defend him. That does not spell out if I am named or unnamed.
Just to clarify why I think coolbot is the shadiest player so far:
1. He's been on BOTH bandwagons.
2. He didn't give CLEAR reason for being on them.
3. He doesn't act in a way I'd expect town, named or unnamed to act.
I never said you're voting for Matt because he's unnamed. My post was messy and hard to read, I apologize.
What I meant was that I can't see your Matt vote as coming from an unnamed townie. You've just claimed it, but if you really were, then why the Matt vote? His reasons would have been clear to you. He did give justification, and it wasn't a quickchange. He's been toying with the notion of voting khel since the beginning.
I'm keeping my vote on you. It was not a quick change. He did justify it in his earlier posts. Saying it, 'looks odd' is vague.
eljko wrote:
That was post nine. He seems to know a lot about the townie PM, but there is no townie PM posted by Shaka. Two possibitites strike me right away.
That's the clearest indication that you're not unnamed townie. There are little hints here and there before that, but nothing definite till that.
I'm not accusing you of anything, I'm just saying that I'm wary of your actions. You could be named townie, power or scum. That's all.
eljko wrote:
That was post nine. He seems to know a lot about the townie PM, but there is no townie PM posted by Shaka. Two possibitites strike me right away.
That's the clearest indication that you're not unnamed townie. There are little hints here and there before that, but nothing definite till that.
I'm not accusing you of anything, I'm just saying that I'm wary of your actions. You could be named townie, power or scum. That's all.
Whatever, I am not going to have a cow over it. It is not a big issue right now.
I do agree with all your coolbot fun stuff right now, but I want to read more posts. This is like a 5 person game right now. We need to get it crusing.
And I apologize for being a spelling nazi, but my name has a "c" in it.
@eljcko. Sorry, i didn't notice. =) And yes, not that big an issue.
mod:
Could you prod everyone? Eljcko is quite right about there being just a few of us active right now. I'd like to know what everyone else thinks of coolbot.
CoolBot has show himself to be shady in this game, I don't know if he warrants a vote, but his quick bandwagon hops do strike me as trying to get a quick lynch over with, perhaps anxious for the night to arrive. However, I haven't been looking much at his posts because I was paying more attention to Matt and Khel at the time. I'll have to look at CB's posts specifically.
Willing to replace in any game, have some background experience but haven't gotten all of the specifics down, ie. abbreviations and other terms...
