So is it "townsman who's in the fellowship" or "townsman, fellowship means townie"? My PM does not specifically say that the Fellowship is the Town; it says a lot of stuff about conquering the baddies, but it doesn't say anything about the Fellowship.Matt_S wrote:My role pm says I'm a townsman who's in the fellowship.
Mini #553: Over!
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massive Mafia Scum
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Page Eleven Vote Count!
Votes required:7 to lynch
4, Matt_s-massive, Khelvaster, Coolbot, Talitha
1, Eljcko-Destructor
1, Talitha-Qman
Not Voting:6, Petunho, Matt_S, eljcko, crazy_vlad, Imat, ting =)
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CoolBot Mafia Scum
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That's more or less what mine says too. That's why this townsman in the fellowship stuff confuses me. If anyone is named, I have to believe it's those in the fellowship.massive wrote:My PM does not specifically say that the Fellowship is the Town; it says a lot of stuff about conquering the baddies, but it doesn't say anything about the Fellowship.-
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Matt_S Mafia Scum
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Post removed.Show"So I went to the librarian in the biology section and asked her if she could find me a map of the cat." -Richard Feynman
The Feynman Problem-Solving Algorithm:
(1) write down the problem;
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eljcko Goon
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I think it would be a safe idea to say the fellowship is town. It is not like we have a reverse of good guys and baddies, (like in the MGS mafia game i"m in. Foxhound is the good guys and snake is bad.) I will believe Matt's claim, for now. But I agree with talitha that we need to get moving on, we should get this day over with soon-
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Qman Goon
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for f's sake quit with the followship talk the flvor is gone, and frnkly you can always have a traitor in the ranks. Ruling people out over role pm claims that don't matter anymore (Or conviting then for it) is just bullshit.One Hamster to rule them all!
One Hamster to find them!
One Hamster to bring them all!
And in the sawdust bind them!-
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CoolBot Mafia Scum
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I don't think anyone was saying otherwise. The question is whether the fellowship comprises the entire town, not whether the fellowship is town or not.eljcko wrote:I think it would be a safe idea to say the fellowship is town.
No, we shouldn't throw out this info just because the game was categorized wrong. I think getting to the bottom of the Fellowship is a good idea, especially with a claim like Matt's.Qman wrote: Ruling people out over role pm claims that don't matter anymore (Or conviting then for it) is just bullshit.-
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ting =) Mafia Scum
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About Eljcko:
If you read back - I actually thought he was the most suspicious at first. Then, I changed to coolbot. The switch was partly because I was afraid I was wrong about him and he might be a power role. Here's why:
A couple of things are obvious: He is not a townie, named or unnamed. [Sorry Qman, I have to. =(] You can read his previous posts, he mentions in a number of posts not knowing what the townie PM is, without making any distinction between named or unnamed townie.eljcko wrote: That was post nine. He seems to know a lot about thetownie PM, but there isno townie PMposted by Shaka. Two possibitites strike me right away.
This makes him either power role, or scum - which is why I was unwilling to continue my attack on him - I was unsure.
I've made up my mind now though. Read back on his early game reactions on the name claim. I don't want to quote since you have to take it in context of all the other posts around it.
He was against the name claim. If you read back on how the other people with names reacted: They could all see that the plan could maybe work, like destructor. Sure, most of them had apprehensions on how it might not work, but the nameds could see how it might work.
People like matt and ranger all thought it might out the power roles, something which, I maintain that only town without names could have thought of.
Eljcko's behaviour doesn't fit either the named or unnamed town profiles. In fact, if you read post 26, he sits on the fence, something which massive called him on earlier. He says he AGREES with whatmattsays, BUT he calls a name claim PRO-town, which is something matt obviously did not think. Then, after saying that a name-claim would be pro-town, he says he WOULDN'T go for it because a name-claim would be bad early on in the game, and he says that khel was asking for specific names, something which khel never asked for in any way.
That ended up sparking a confession where he says he misunderstood khel, but when he says what he thought khel actually meant, he STILL misunderstands what khel was saying - showing that he never saw things from khel's, or any of the named's eyes at all. In fact, now that I've reread everything, coolbot actually ends up agreeing with eljcko's misunderstanding of khel's view, and he ends up sparking an argument with khel in post 70. You can read khel's reply to coolbot and eljcko's view in post 77.
In fact, in light of all that, I'm more convinced now that Eljcko and coolbot are scum. I am going tovote:eljcko-
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crazy_vlad Townie
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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destructor Mafia Scum
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I finished a second reread, and honestly, things didn't make a whole lot more sense the second time around. =D
I'm hearing the calls for the day to end and I'm agreeing, I just don't believe the evidence against Matt is tight enough to call him scum. I need to look over eljcko myself again, post by post because I'm suddenly unsure of myself, though I don't know why... =/
Did you mull over it? What did you decide?Talitha wrote:I wasn't given a name when i replaced in, and I assume that the other replacees don't have names either. This doesn't mean that people who are original players shouldnt claim... I will mull over that for a while.
I don't understand why you're considering this. The way I'm reading this, you're suggesting that Matt was improvising a gambit, hoping that theremassive wrote:On a related note, however, Matt_S does not claim "unnamed" until after the theme gets pulled. Up until that point, he had merely said there was something in his PM that only vanilla townies would know. Can you read and infer that he's saying "we have no name?" It's possible. But it's also possible that he was hedging his bets and hoping that no one would keep pushing.wassomething in the townie PM that implied a mass name-claim wouldn't work. I guess it's possible, but not as likely as him actually not having a name, being vanilla and assuming all vanillas were like him, in my opinion.
Imat, is there a reason you left Khelvaster, Petunho, crazy_vlad and myself out of your list in Post 255?.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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massive Mafia Scum
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I think (a) "vanilla townie" is the easiest scum fake claim to make, (b) good mods make sure that there is no "common thread" among generic role PMs that townies can use to clear each other, and (c) given the initial flavor of the game, "vanilla townie" is a very unlikely role to have.destructor wrote:I don't understand why you're considering this. The way I'm reading this, you're suggesting that Matt was improvising a gambit, hoping that therewassomething in the townie PM that implied a mass name-claim wouldn't work. I guess it's possible, but not as likely as him actually not having a name, being vanilla and assuming all vanillas were like him, in my opinion.
But you think all the scum were given safeclaims, so I see why you think the opposite. Where's my eyeroll emoticon?"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
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destructor Mafia Scum
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Well, I think it's likely, because that's my experience with themed mini-games (SG:A Mafia and Vegetable Mafia).
With (c), do you mean "vanilla townie" as a role name, or as the generic role? I don't believe it would have been used as a role name, but I don't think anyone has suggested this so far..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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massive Mafia Scum
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No, I mean "vanilla townie" as in a generic role."1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!-
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crazy_vlad Townie
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Matt_S Mafia Scum
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I said a little too much about my role pm I guess. I tried to explain where the whole "fellowship" thing came into my pm.Talitha wrote:Did the mod delete a post of Matt's? What happened there? A brief explanation from someone who knows what is going on would be good.Show"So I went to the librarian in the biology section and asked her if she could find me a map of the cat." -Richard Feynman
The Feynman Problem-Solving Algorithm:
(1) write down the problem;
(2) think very hard;
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massive Mafia Scum
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All right, FINE. The mod has obviously decided to continuously interject himself into this game so we don't lynch you, so let's move on.
unvote"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!-
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CoolBot Mafia Scum
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eljcko Goon
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Ahhh I see. But i agree with qman, flavour does not matter anymore, just the roles (but I do believe some fellowship may be scum, or the game would be broken.)CoolBot wrote:
I don't think anyone was saying otherwise. The question is whether the fellowship comprises the entire town, not whether the fellowship is town or not.eljcko wrote:I think it would be a safe idea to say the fellowship is town.
@ting
I was against name claim because it would jeprodize the power roles. We don't want a bunch of people claiming vanilla, which happens to be very popular now, and then a couple players sitting back with there mouthes shout because they are town and it is not smart to lie. The power roles are screwed. The fact that I disagree with something pro-town is not a very good point to fool with either,(i saw the emphasis you put on the "contradiction".) I would consider myself a conservative, but I don't believe in the death penalty, a conservative belief.
When I misunderstood khel's idea, his is the thought process that happened. I read his posts and thought he wanted all the names to come forward (I did not read it carefully enough) instead of non-fellowship townies. I turned out to be wrong, so that screwed up my thought process, so I sounded wishy washy.
I would also like to say I have no link that I know of with coolbot. I would probably vote for him, but no one except ting was buying, so its not worth it. But, CoolBot, you were on both bandwagons, I will remember that. But you have stopped looking, so you are a bit vindicated in my book.
I will answer questions you have for me if you want more, anything to clear up muddy water towards me.-
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Imat Goon
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Sorry, I was watching certain players at the time and really only had thoughts on them, at least, any specific thoughts. I'll read over your responses and finish up my list, hopefully I'll fine something more there than I found elsewhere...Willing to replace in any game, have some background experience but haven't gotten all of the specifics down, ie. abbreviations and other terms...-
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shaka!! Goon
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ting =) Mafia Scum
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I'm not buying this. Especially not the bold bit. That the power roles might be compromised by the name claim would only have come to people who had no names to begin with.@ting
I was against name claim becauseit would jeprodize the power roles.We don't want a bunch of people claiming vanilla, which happens to be very popular now, and then a couple players sitting back with there mouthes shout because they are town and it is not smart to lie. The power roles are screwed. The fact that I disagree with something pro-town is not a very good point to fool with either,(i saw the emphasis you put on the "contradiction".) I would consider myself a conservative, but I don't believe in the death penalty, a conservative belief.
When I misunderstood khel's idea, his is the thought process that happened. I read his posts and thoughthe wanted all the names to come forwardI did not read it carefully enough) instead of non-fellowship townies. I turned out to be wrong, so that screwed up my thought process, so I sounded wishy washy.
To people with names and who were of the opinion that everyone else had names, there would have been no way to single out who was a power role based simply on having a name.
And also: the italicized bit. You're still reading it wrong - that IS what khel wanted, all the names to come forward. He's already explained his plan since then, so I'm not going bother. But honestly, if only a few non-fellowship people chimed in with their names, how did you expect khel's plan work? His plan worked on the basis that 9 people claiming with names will out 3 people without names, or at least 3 people with bad names.
I'm keeping my vote.-
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destructor Mafia Scum
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You're saying that this game has no vanilla townies? I don't think I'm understanding you here...massive wrote:No, I mean "vanilla townie" as in a generic role.
I missed his post. Doesn't that sort of thing usually result in a modkill? Or was it something else?CoolBot wrote:When I last posted, Matt's post wasn't deleted. He paraphrased his role PM, apprently close enough to warrant mod action. So he's confirmed.
unvote: Matt_S
This is confusing the shit out of me..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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massive Mafia Scum
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mod: I disagree, I don't think anything should have been said about the makeup of the game, confirming or denying whether named or unnamed roles existed, which you did in post 42.
destructor: I was saying that, yes, I could see this as being a game with no vanilla townies. I think that, in terms of the original set up and theme, that having a generic nameless vanilla townie is unusual. There are plenty of flavorful characters in the stories that you could assign a "name" to everyone, even if you don't give them an ability.
Unfortunately this means I need to reread the whole thing."1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!-
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crazy_vlad Townie
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massive Mafia Scum
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I agree with ting about eljcko. Eljcko goes from indicating unnamed townieness to indicating named (and Fellowship no less), then adamantly denying one way or the other. And now most recently has stated that we should move on from the flavor of the initial roles.
vote eljcko
I also think I have a read on what category ting fits into. I must be getting some of the ring rust off. =]"1AM .. not a good time to think I started mixing massive and mathcam" - Totem, DP8
"unvote mlaker; vote massive; It's like MeMe/mneme and Corsato/Cadmium" - Dragon Phoenix, Newbie 38
PLEASE NOTE: I actively avoid being online on weekends! Don't replace me just because of this!
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