Food Fight Mafia - WHO OWNS THE SCHOOL???

[Gorgon]

Are you fishing or only want to make sure the spotlight won't go after you, Gorgon?

Neither. I was simply suspicious of your phrasing and the intention behind it, and wanted to address that. I find your answer satisfactory.

Should have read, "

C'est idiot

to imagine why it was included in the main part of my role PM if I did not always have it."

And yes, if I told you that in the past two weeks I have lost my job, nearly broken up with my fiance, and discovered I can no longer afford the rent for where I am living and am currently scrambling to find a new apartment before my finances run dry, you would consider it an appeal to emotion. And apparently, wanting a little bit of privacy and not posting details of my personal life online are considered "holding out".

Please, don't set up questions where no matter what I answer you can reply, "That's scummy". It doesn't get us anywhere.

Thats not Appeal to Emotion. Its not even especially game related. -.-

I think he means you'd construe his complaints about RL issues as appeal to emotion on the basis that it might seem like an attempt to garner sympathy.

[mneme]

2. What happens if you break your PR?

There is no punishment explained or even hinted at within the role PM itself.

Can anyone else with a PR confirm or deny this?

Hai. I did so in my claim.

Hermit's play is very bad. At least today.

That said, I don't buy the idea of safe claims in this game. Doesn't fit the flavor, and PRs are easy enough to fake that a "safe claim" is unnecessary.

Also, the claim about "I don't know why DGB would warn on some posts" seems unfounded -- DGB has -never- warned on a PR post AFAIK.

An analysis of when the PRs appeared (in which order) is in order.

Also, note that my PR is proven by my food...is anyone going to claim that I've faked being Nipponese?

Hmm. Pulsewidth was first.
Bamboo (Hermit) was second.

Bamboo's food matches his role (croissant, a tartine au Nutella, and a drink: apricot nectar). Though it's odd that he has 3 pieces of food and I have 8.

Now re Blackberry...

Blackberry replaced Foolinc. He never bothered faking a post restriction. (presumably, with a safe claim, he would have).

Now, re Foolinc:

Hmm. Post 13, he's making with the PR/Mexican food, before "I" and before Bamboo posted.

That said...one interesting aspect: his food was fake. The pepper didnt' do any damage.

He then...didn't throw any food at all.

So as it is, we have evidence that Foolinc managed an early fake PR, but none that his food matched his PR (and, in fact, some that it didn't -- with no real food thrown...).

In conclusion? I'm not planning on throwing any food at Hermit today. His play is far more like mine than like Blackberry's, so as far as I'm concerned, he's likely town.

I think Holy's scum, though -- her claim just doesn't make much sense.

[Korlash]

I think Holy's claim makes more sense then Yam's... But then again... I'm me... so... yeah... Not much up in the old noodle you know... ^^

[Battle Mage]

2. What happens if you break your PR?

There is no punishment explained or even hinted at within the role PM itself.

Can anyone else with a PR confirm or deny this?

Hai. I did so in my claim.

Hermit's play is very bad. At least today.

That said, I don't buy the idea of safe claims in this game. Doesn't fit the flavor, and PRs are easy enough to fake that a "safe claim" is unnecessary.

Also, the claim about "I don't know why DGB would warn on some posts" seems unfounded -- DGB has -never- warned on a PR post AFAIK.

Eh?
Please read the posts of those who have claimed PR's.
-.-

An analysis of when the PRs appeared (in which order) is in order.

Also, note that my PR is proven by my food...is anyone going to claim that I've faked being Nipponese?

Hmm. Pulsewidth was first.
Bamboo (Hermit) was second.

Bamboo's food matches his role (croissant, a tartine au Nutella, and a drink: apricot nectar). Though it's odd that he has 3 pieces of food and I have 8.

Now re Blackberry...

Blackberry replaced Foolinc. He never bothered faking a post restriction. (presumably, with a safe claim, he would have).

Now, re Foolinc:

Hmm. Post 13, he's making with the PR/Mexican food, before "I" and before Bamboo posted.

That said...one interesting aspect: his food was fake. The pepper didnt' do any damage.

He then...didn't throw any food at all.

So as it is, we have evidence that Foolinc managed an early fake PR, but none that his food matched his PR (and, in fact, some that it didn't -- with no real food thrown...).

In conclusion? I'm not planning on throwing any food at Hermit today. His play is far more like mine than like Blackberry's, so as far as I'm concerned, he's likely town.

I think Holy's scum, though -- her claim just doesn't make much sense.

Holy replaced Foolinc?

[mneme]

Kore wa ikura desu ka? The players who have claimed PRs are:

Me/Sir T/pulsewidth
Foolinc/Blackberry
TheHermit (repl. YosiP (repl. Bamboomancer)

AFAIK, that's it.

Foolinc was scum, and nothing he says has value.

I and Hermit have been consistent in saying that there's no stated punishment for breaking/bending a PR, we've never been warned or whatnot, etc.

Since I've eliinated Hermit from likely scum, that leaves four scum among:

Holy(repl. JordanA24)
BattleMage
Korlash (repl. VitaminR)
Gorgon (repl. pickemgenius)
Yamahako

I don't think Korlash is scum. I don't -think- Battlemage is scum.

So therefore, the other three are probably scum. But I might be wrong about Korlash, about Battlemage, or about Hermit, so food-covering order matters.

[mneme]

edbp (Gomennasi!): -3- scum left.

[Yamahako]

I could have sworn I'd seen a post warning someone with a post restriction this game - but I just went back and couldn't find it. Am I crazy?

[TheHermit]

Yamahako's been giving me a bad feeling for the whole game, so I decided to look into him. Here's what I found:

Post 26 is interesting in that Tar is obviously role-playing an anorexic valley girl. Yama says nothing about this despite later claiming pretty much the exact same role.

In Post 118, he loudly advocates support for throwing food at whoever you find suspicious. Ignoring for a moment the questionable wisdom of this advice, he changes his mind without explanation by 365.

EBWADP - scratch that, I just re-read my role name, maybe there is a reason.

I claimed before - but here it is again

I am Karina A. Carpenteria, an anorexic. I am with the students.

My lunchbox contains 100 peas, 2 saltines, and a cup of hot coffe.

What is it about your

name

that makes you think you would be more susceptible to damage than others?

Throughout Day 1, he notes that his peas are useless because they do no damage. The question in MY mind right now is, are they doing no damage because they're weak? Or are they doing no damage because he doesn't actually have peas?

Post 288, he gives friendly advice to BM. He claims that BM is being illogical and confusing, and yet he doesn't find this suspicious in the slightest.

Post 510, he again notices BM acting scummy and lets him off easy. Forgive me for making these observations, but I think if Yamahako is scum there is a very good chance BM is scum as well.

On page 26, there are two "food counts". Yamahako throws a saltine at skitzer between them, and there is NO change in his damage level. To me, this says that Yamahako's food is all fake. He has not thrown a single piece of real food throughout the game. This strongly suggests that his claim is fake as well.

I'll continue my analysis in a bit, but I think it's fair to allow everyone some time to comment on what I have so far.

[Battle Mage]

I could have sworn I'd seen a post warning someone with a post restriction this game - but I just went back and couldn't find it. Am I crazy?

No, there are plenty of PR warnings. Just not everywhere there ought to be.

[Battle Mage]

Yamahako's been giving me a bad feeling for the whole game, so I decided to look into him. Here's what I found:

Post 26 is interesting in that Tar is obviously role-playing an anorexic valley girl. Yama says nothing about this despite later claiming pretty much the exact same role.

In Post 118, he loudly advocates support for throwing food at whoever you find suspicious. Ignoring for a moment the questionable wisdom of this advice, he changes his mind without explanation by 365.

EBWADP - scratch that, I just re-read my role name, maybe there is a reason.

I claimed before - but here it is again

I am Karina A. Carpenteria, an anorexic. I am with the students.

My lunchbox contains 100 peas, 2 saltines, and a cup of hot coffe.

What is it about your

name

that makes you think you would be more susceptible to damage than others?

Interesting point.

Throughout Day 1, he notes that his peas are useless because they do no damage. The question in MY mind right now is, are they doing no damage because they're weak? Or are they doing no damage because he doesn't actually have peas?

This is a very good point. I'll have to look into it, although it is fairly easy to test. :p

Post 510, he again notices BM acting scummy and lets him off easy. Forgive me for making these observations, but I think if Yamahako is scum there is a very good chance BM is scum as well.

Why are you apologising? Because you are claiming that the 2 confirmed town players are both scum? that would give us 3 godfathers, 2 of whom are apparently affiliated to the same scumgroup?
This is too ridiculous for response.

On page 26, there are two "food counts". Yamahako throws a saltine at skitzer between them, and there is NO change in his damage level. To me, this says that Yamahako's food is all fake. He has not thrown a single piece of real food throughout the game. This strongly suggests that his claim is fake as well.

I'll continue my analysis in a bit, but I think it's fair to allow everyone some time to comment on what I have so far.

I look forward to your next installment!

BM

[Holy]

@Korlash: The mexican PR claimer was foolinc/Blackberry.

Yesterday I ate page 30 to 40, Skruffs VS BM continues, and things getting more interesting after BM invested by Tar and Skruffs by Fonz. Oyeah, I noticed DGB warned Yossip/TheHermit about a PR failure. Conclusion regarding BM VS Skruffs thing, need more reading tbh.

Also, the claim about "I don't know why DGB would warn on some posts" seems unfounded -- DGB has -never- warned on a PR post AFAIK.

Coincidentally, I just read that (the PR warning), go see page 36.

Also, note that my PR is proven by my food...is anyone going to claim that I've faked being Nipponese?

Your PR is supported with your food as true, not proven true because of your food, IMO.
I can't get off the fact that BM's food are so German, but he didn't claim any PR about German.


Tomorrow I'll try to read more and faster >.>

[TheHermit]

Continuing where I left off...

Post 663: Okay, so the coffee is real. I would think an anorexic would have water and not coffee with their lunch.

718: BM is acting really scummy.

719: But we should still lynch skitzer.

854: Of course you can't hurt anyone, most of your food isn't real!

914: Breaks up the fight between Skruffs and BM. This may just be the first pro-town move he's done all game!

1223: Puts forth the assertion that Skruffs and BM are members of the same mafia. From where did this accusation originate?

1519: Yamahako gets cleared via Tar's investigation. Considering we do not know the veracity of the investigations, and there could still be another godfather running around this isn't enough to dismiss all suspicion but it IS a blow to the theory.

1546: cicero asks Yamahako some questions, which he answers in 1588. Displays single-minded dedication that ABR (then ghulof) was scum. It should be noted that every single person that Yama has expressed suspicion of has turned out to be town.

1598: Is very certain of ABR's scuminess, but uses his food on Tar instead under the vague "it gives us more information" line that I've seen scum use SO often to lynch townies without giving a good reason. By the by, now that Tar is gone what information have you gotten out of this? I don't want anybody answering this for him.

1660: In contrast to his earlier buddying, Yama seems intent on throwing out BM. Could this be a bus attempt?

1684: Claims that lying about not having an ability is a scum move. I vehemently disagree; outing yourself as a power role guarantees your death in short order. Many time have I seen power roles claiming vanilla in order to keep the scum off them.


Okay.

Now that I've noticed that BM's been confirmed via investigation (I had forgotten that), it's ridiculous to assume they're both scum. Unless our investigator masons have problems, but with a godfather in the mix I find this unlikely. At the same time, there's something about "investigating masons" that makes me think something's up with it; you'd have a confirmed innocents problem otherwise. So consider this hypothesis dead and buried pending new information. However, based on my analysis I am quite convinced that Yamahako is the soup scum godfather.

Are there any mistakes I've made that indicate I shouldn't be alpha-striking him?

[Battle Mage]

I can't get off the fact that BM's food are so German, but he didn't claim any PR about German.
Tomorrow I'll try to read more and faster >.>

Maybe the reason i didnt claim a PR is coz i dont have 1. This is supported by the lack of warning messages accompanying my posts. lol

[mneme]

Also, note that my PR is proven by my food...is anyone going to claim that I've faked being Nipponese?

Your PR is supported with your food as true, not proven true because of your food, IMO.

[/quote]
Gomennasi -- I meant "proven=tested", not "proven=proven true", but was sloppy.

Yes, my PR claim is supported by my food selection, not proven objectively true by same. However, my Japanese theme is, if not proven, certainly indicated by my food.

I can't get off the fact that BM's food are so German, but he didn't claim any PR about German.

Hmm. Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it.

At least one of Korlash, Yama, and BM are scum if Hermit and I are town (and the similarities between Hermit and I seem greater than the differences). This...is interesting.

[Battle Mage]

Are prunes inherently german? lol

[TheHermit]

Hmm. Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it.

At least one of Korlash, Yama, and BM are scum if Hermit and I are town (and the similarities between Hermit and I seem greater than the differences). This...is interesting.

Your attempt,

sans succès

, to equate a post restriction with "confirmed townie" is noted.

And I JUST realized that I didn't abide by my post restriction during my analysis. Like I said, I'm not used to these things. -.-

[Yamahako]

What about my role name made me second guess? It was the "an anorexic" part. It's listed right next to my role name. I didn't think anything of it when I first read my pm because there wasn't any rules related reasoning behind it.

Tar claimed anorexic, and I think I said I was dubious of the claim, but then again we ended up with two "fat kids" to take that however you like.

And about faking my food? I've been trying really hard to see if it did anything the whole game. Last round it did a lot. If you want I'll prove it on you... however how monumentally stupid of me would it be to claim food that would implicate me in a "soup scum" mafia - unless you're claiming that I'm admin scum. Because by saying my food is both soup like AND I'm lying about it, then I'd have to be Admin Scum wouldn't I?

My suspicion of Tar was directly tied to the belief among the 3 member mason/cop group that one of them was mafia. Tar was the most scummy. What does his death tell me? That his investigations were likely genuine. There's no mention of sanity in his role at death, however, so I can't make 100% claims to the veracity of his investigations. But it told us SOMETHING. ABR was just incredibly scummy- and pointing it out isn't.

Actually, a lot of your case against me is just restating what I've had to say with the implication that it is scummy. Taken out of context of the conversation - and especially not quoting it so the exact text can be seen in conjunction with your rebuttal (?) doesn't really do much to support your supposed case.

But you claim I'm the soup scum mafia godfather. Bravo in the most contradictory evidence to use in order to come up with a conclusion ever.

[Korlash]

Well if Your keeping up with my thinking.. I would "vote" for yama at this point...

That WIFOM thing you just said made me think for a bit... I don't see how you "have" to be Admin scum... As for claiming food that implicates you... duh... if your lying about your claim you will have to tell some form of truth to support it. So by using the real food you have scoped down you hoped to be able to prove you really wee who you claimed to be. I would be willing to bet you have some kind of... can/bag of peas, a box/pack of crackers... and I could see Coffee.. I mean Godfathers need to drink it right?

Well thats my position...

[Yamahako]

Well if Your keeping up with my thinking.. I would "vote" for yama at this point...

That WIFOM thing you just said made me think for a bit... I don't see how you "have" to be Admin scum... As for claiming food that implicates you... duh... if your lying about your claim you will have to tell some form of truth to support it. So by using the real food you have scoped down you hoped to be able to prove you really wee who you claimed to be. I would be willing to bet you have some kind of... can/bag of peas, a box/pack of crackers... and I could see Coffee.. I mean Godfathers need to drink it right?

Well thats my position...

I'm NOT admin scum (I'm not soup scum either). I'm a student. However, he's claiming that I'm lying about the food I have. In order to lie about the food I have, I couldn't possibly be soup scum. What kind of idiot would claim foods associated with soup if they knew they were in a mafia with such a flavor? If I were soup scum, I'd have claimed some other kind of food and been careful to not have only my food happen between vote counts (so that it was hidden). I've been extremely careful to do the opposite in order to prove my food. Look at yesterday for more proof. THe only way I'd LIE about having peas and saltines is if I were part of the Admin mafia, having had no knowledge of a soup scum group. However, the case against me assumes that Tar's investigations are accurate, and additionally assumes I am a godfather. While I don't necessarily believe that the balance would have 5 sane cops in this game (which makes me suspicious of Korlash), there's a problem with me being a Godfather. There's already a dead Admin scum Godfather.

The case is full of holes. It more looks like a desparate attack of a mafia member who's been found out. The rest of the case is additionally weak when you actually look at the points he's been making. The things he's implying are scum tells are actually non-tells that anyone could be making.

[Gorgon]

Blackberry replaced Foolinc. He never bothered faking a post restriction. (presumably, with a safe claim, he would have).

What do you mean? Blackberry used Spanish words in the two posts he made.

It must also be noted that foolinc was the first player to use a foreign language word in his post.

1) foolinc had a real PR that forced him to use Spanish words in his posts. However, his role, "Adolf Hillthor, Gym Teacher" doesn't indicate in any way that he's somehow Spanish/Mexican/whatever. This is therefore a baffling possibility, although not impossible per se.

2) foolinc decided out of the blue that he was going to fake a foreign language PR. This is an unlikely possibility, since other players then followed who had such a PRs; TheHermit/YosiP/Bamboomancer (French) and mneme/Sir Tornado/pulsewidth (Japanese). So either they both faked their PRs as well, or they are real. Neither possibility fits well with the assumption that foolinc faked his PR, IMO.

3) foolinc didn't have a PR, but his role PM stated that it would be safe to fake a Spanish language one, as there would be players in the game who had such foreign language PRs. I think this is a likely scenario. In this scenario, TheHermit and mneme are both likely town. However, it is also somewhat possible that one or both are faking their PRs. In this case, I would think it would be both, rather than just one, since it would be unbalanced to give just one scum group a fake foreign language PR'd player.

Perhaps one of TheHermit or mneme needs to be sacrificed in order to test this (since if one of them turns out town, I think it's highly unlikely that the other is scum), but I actually lean towards both being town. A 'safe' PR is something that makes more sense in the hands of a lone SK (as it's only fair to give him some tools in order to prolong his chances of survival, especially in a large game) than in the hands of a scum group. There remains the possibility that Bamboomancer and/or pulsewidth faked a PR without having any info about a 'safe' PR, but I tend to think it's unlikely.

To summarize, I find the following to be most likely ATM:

- foolinc/Blackberry had a 'safe' fake PR in order to prolong his chances of survival and blend in with the town. The town includes heHermit/YosiP/Bamboomancer and mneme/Sir Tornado/pulsewidth, who both have real PRs.

[Gorgon]

Also, here are the only two instances I found of PR failure warnings:

viewtopic.php?p=857483#857483
viewtopic.php?p=857725#857725

Note that both are directed at Yosip (Now TheHermit). I think this pretty much proves that TheHermit at least has a real PR.

[Yamahako]

Also, here are the only two instances I found of PR failure warnings:

viewtopic.php?p=857483#857483
viewtopic.php?p=857725#857725

Note that both are directed at Yosip (Now TheHermit). I think this pretty much proves that TheHermit at least has a real PR.

Thanks for finding those Gorgon. I reread all of DGB's Posts and couldn't find them.

[Korlash]

I'm NOT admin scum (I'm not soup scum either). I'm a student. However, he's claiming that I'm lying about the food I have. In order to lie about the food I have, I couldn't possibly be soup scum. What kind of idiot would claim foods associated with soup if they knew they were in a mafia with such a flavor? If I were soup scum, I'd have claimed some other kind of food and been careful to not have only my food happen between vote counts (so that it was hidden). I've been extremely careful to do the opposite in order to prove my food. Look at yesterday for more proof. THe only way I'd LIE about having peas and saltines is if I were part of the Admin mafia, having had no knowledge of a soup scum group. However, the case against me assumes that Tar's investigations are accurate, and additionally assumes I am a godfather. While I don't necessarily believe that the balance would have 5 sane cops in this game (which makes me suspicious of Korlash), there's a problem with me being a Godfather. There's already a dead Admin scum Godfather.

Dude this whole "If I were scum I wouldn't have done this!" argument is a bit lame. I don't know about you but if I had to fake claim I would try to use food that did damage yet still fit my flavor of claim. The fact your food does absolutly nothing pretty much tells me you tried to use food that you hoped would work by, I dont know... renaming it, scoping it down, or exstracting parts of it. Like pea soup you scoped down to just peas. Or a handful of pease could have been renamed.

THe only way I'd LIE about having peas and saltines is if I were part of the Admin mafia, having had no knowledge of a soup scum group.

I find this interesting... That's the only way? I mean you didn't plan to get to say this crap eh? come on... The safeness of WIFOM... That calls to me so often... And I'm assuming then that all your food was claimed before day 3 then. I can't even remember when I replaced in anymore... hmm...

I still think all food needs to do something... I mean have you ever been hit by 100 peas? I guarentee you you'll have mushy stuff hidden in places I never knew pes could fit into.. *shudders*

While I don't necessarily believe that the balance would have 5 sane cops in this game (which makes me suspicious of Korlash), there's a problem with me being a Godfather.

Suspicious? I thought it was already established the mason cops were untrustworthy in the sanity department. Whats with the casting doubt on me all of a sudden? hmmmm? Is it... i don't know... cause I'm pushing this? hmm? Talk scum! Talk!!!!!!

[Yamahako]

While I don't necessarily believe that the balance would have 5 sane cops in this game (which makes me suspicious of Korlash), there's a problem with me being a Godfather.

Suspicious? I thought it was already established the mason cops were untrustworthy in the sanity department. Whats with the casting doubt on me all of a sudden? hmmmm? Is it... i don't know... cause I'm pushing this? hmm? Talk scum! Talk!!!!!!

This case to too contrived. You say you're innocent, and that's fine - then we can't (in my opinion) trust the investigations. However you seemed sure that me and Battle Mage were clear earlier today since there were multiple investigations that came up innocent on us. That's a contradiction.

Gorgon seems to think I'm lying about my food - but seems to believe that the investigations on me are correct - but I'm the god father. Well I can only be the godfather of the soup-scum mafia - but then why would I be lying about my food while still maintaining them as soup ingrediants if I knew what mafia I was in?

I don't know why anyone hasn't mentioned this already - as I assumed I would be quick lynched when I read it myself - but the night kill was from Pea Soup. I don't know if the soup scum get to decide things like that - but I'm pretty sure it was engineered to implicate me.

I'm not casting doubt on you specifically Korlash - I just am not convinced we can trust you AND your investigations. It makes me suspicious that all the innocents actually came back innocent so far - so there's no precedence for thinking we should ignore the results - and in my case there's a good reason for me to stand behind - but I

haven't

because I don't trust them. As a townie I'm not looking out for my interests I'm looking out for the group.

[Korlash]

A contradiction? Dude... Everyone is now considered innocent you baffoon! Giant massclaim hellooooooo! Combined with the posibility of one lone scum left, and that scum being a freaking godfather, means most investigation results become moot! moo...

Enough of the wifom already.... we get it... spouting that off every post wont help...

I like the whole "I'm looking out fo the group!" thing at the end.

Oh oh...

I'm not casting doubt on you specifically Korlash

(which makes me suspicious of Korlash)

If you wan't to bring stupid contradictions into it I got one for ya right here... Can't get more specific then this...