Mini 578 - Mistery at Montescuro - Game Over!

[PyroDwarf]

/confirmed

[PyroDwarf]

just a heads up, sundays are my busiest days so I might not be able to post every sunday.
anywhoo

Vote:Singing Librarian

Please be quiet!

[PyroDwarf]

uhmm, okay. Sensfan, what does this mean?

I voted you because you had 2 votes already.

Why did you move your vote so quickly? It doen't make sence to me. why not just leave it on macavenger? Guardian, why the mystery?

[PyroDwarf]

I think SensFan is more suspicious than VH. It wasn't his vote on macavenger, that could pass as normal random stage voting. But why change it to JtP right after guardian? Guardian vote's change seemed to be a response to Macavenger's "even vote count" comment, as did SensFan's vote on Macavenger. But moving it to the person that another player just voted for? Why not have 2 players with 2 votes? I think I'll keep my rand. vote and pot a FoS on SensFan.

[PyroDwarf]

I legitimately am coming to the opinion that using meta is a bad policy.

How would you respond if I told you that Adel did a study near the end of last year showing that in 200 or so random minis, day ones where scum were lynched were on average about a page shorter than day ones where town were lynched (8.5 as compared to 9.5)? What if I also told you that she said that day ones where the town eventually won were shorter than day ones where the town eventually lost, to an even greater extent, about 2.5 pages (7.5 as compared to 10)?

I lol'ed
Guardian, I don't see any case against Phox. I'm sorry if I am answering a question not directed at me, but this is just my personal opinion. You seem to be pushing really hard on phox, but your case is nonexistent.
I can at least see the logic behind sensfan's vote changing shenanigans, but you are to suspicious to pass up.

Unvote, Vote:Guardian

After re-reading, I'll put a FoS on VH, I agreee with Macavenger's post 61.

[PyroDwarf]

Well guardian, I've read Phox's posts over and over, and I don't see the WIFOM or Hypocrisy that you speak of. The most suspicious thing about him is his post count, not content. I lol'ed because I didn't realize there was different types of meta... I suppose that makes sense. Maybe I would find you less suspicious if you showed exactly where Phox was so hypocritical.
Near's comments are odd. What do you mean Joudas is talking funny? I don't see any post restriction... What do you mean by this.
I still agree with Macavenger that VH is acting suspicious.

[PyroDwarf]

Waiting for phox's response to Guardian's allegations before I move my vote. I want him to elaborate on this:

I think that's a fair assumption. Not that bandwagoning is a major accusation these days. It seems to me that as long as the votes are spread out evenly, then the reasons for voting don't have to be held by strong opinion. It allows for wishy washy votes.

This was in response to the "fair and balanced" vote count, after he voted next to last.

[PyroDwarf]

I agree with Macavenger on his scum list, but I'm not sure about Near. I'm more suspicious of Guardian and VH than I am of near.

[PyroDwarf]

Pyro: I'm suspicious of him because his play has largely been "me too" -- e.g. he's doing a lot of agreeing and not much original thought.

Well, I will agree with this. But, it's probably because I generally agree with what has been said so far. But, I will try to add more of my own thought in too. That being said, what do you guys think about Sensfan? I initially thought him suspicious because of his voting, but I became distracted by other, more frequent posters. I don't think Phox is scum, I'm still not sure about guardian. Right now, I'm thinking VH is closer to scum than Guardian. I'd like to hear from near(heh) now that he's got another vote and FoS. I think near has the best case against him right now, with VH next. My main issue with guardian was how he had sunk his teeth into a small comment and tried to run with it. I know that he just recently changed his vote to near, so now my suspicion has lessened. so I guess my scum list looks like: VH,Guardian, Near, sensfan ... idk, who else is lurking?
I'll keep my vote on guardian 'till we hear from VH and near at least, hopefully sensfan, too.

[PyroDwarf]

Idk what to say, guardian. I work a lot. I'm sorry I'm not posting too your liking. Still no word from sensfan, btw. And how long will it take VH to read thru? If you want to talk about my lack of content, check out EvilGorrilaz. He seems to be trying to post under the radar. Is it time for a votecount? What is Near at; he should post before he dies.

0 - no real content
1 - nrc
2 - 2 mild questions
3 - mild suspicion of sensfan
4 - apologizes to me, and votes me for something others are finding me suspicious of.
5 - asks me questions about case. builds momentum agreeing with people about near. agrees with mac about vh.
6 - quotes the part of phox's post i've been referencing all along.
7 - agrees with mac, but more suspicious of me and near.
8 - agrees he's been "me too", pushes case a little on sensfan.

0 and 1 don't really count, just business as usual. #2 Is where i seee something suspicious about sensfan. number 3 is more of that. Number 4 I said I'm sorry because you had just said not to answer questions not directly directed at you. Also, just because others are finding you suspicious, I can't? You were pushing that wagon up-hill in the snow, I saw your zeal as a scum refusing to let his case go. Also, I put a FoS oh VH and agree with Macavenger in this post, btw.
5 and 6 are about me trying to understand your case better. Also, what am I gonna say about near? I just had some questions for him. 7 so I again agree with mac. Big deal. it's the same thing I've already agreed with him on, His suspicion of VH, Near, and Guardian. 8 yes I agree with other players, most noteably mac, but, he's been the most active aside from Guardian, and Guardian is more suspicious to me and I just agree with mac on his scum list, kinda. So, I don't think I am being too aggree-full, I just happen to have the same scum list, and had the same thoughts regarding VH.

[PyroDwarf]

Ditto on the wait, I just hope near isn't just a butt-hurt townie. If he's active in other games, he needs to stop in, if not only to say "screw you guys". Maybe prod Sensfan and near?

[PyroDwarf]

so, sensfan. Do you have any thoughts on what's going on? Who do you think is the scummiest?

[PyroDwarf]

Guardian, why am I third on your scum list. My response was not acceptable? What was wrong with it? You didn't even comment on it, I thought you would have, but you didn't.

[PyroDwarf]

Hi new guy!
I wasn't trying to overreact to Phox's wagon, I was suspicious of the way Sensfan reacted. Please explain oblique defense more. what actions are you talking about?

[PyroDwarf]

okay coron, you are reading way too much into my questioning on Sensfan. Did you not find the way he moved his vote around suspicious? Not only do I find his vote moving suspicious, but after his absence, all he has to say is "I'm here" why bother posting that at all? I think I was not the only one wanting a little more than that from him. Also, it wouldn't have mattered why sensfan voted for, if guardian had voted for XXX, and sensfan did what he did, would you say that I was doing oblique defence for XXX? Any ways, it looks like were going to have to get another replacement, so bah

[PyroDwarf]

coron, my hypothetical argument was: Sensfan votes for bob, Guardian votes for jane. Sensfan changes his vote from bob to jane. This all happened in a few minutes. I was curious as to why sensfan would change his vote so quickly. He's response was lacking so I continued suspicion. It wasn't because it was JtP, it could have been any player.

[PyroDwarf]

Pyro, I think it is less likely that you would have acted the way you did if JamesThePhox weren't your scum partner, which is why I am suspicous of both of you because of your actions.

No. I am suspicious of sensfan because of the way he voted. I guess it's a small thing to you, but at that point, it was all we had to go on. What if they had both voted for me or you, and I called sensfan on switching his vote like that? Would you find that scummy?

I wanted someone closer to a lynch than 2 votes.

thats good and all, but that was page two on a random guy. I'm for pressuring people, but shouldn't it not be random? At this point, however it looks like he will be replaced, so
Coron:What do you think about the vote count, and guardian's accusations towards JtP because of it?

[PyroDwarf]

sorry guys, work is crazy, i had thought that i posted, but i was in a hurry, i must have hit preview instead of submit... tonight ill give content, im on lunch right now, so no time.

[PyroDwarf]

okay, so Near's "slip" is interesting, but I don't know what to make of it. I can see why guardian would question it. Near's response was a bit dragging, but it seems to have been necessary.

I never wanted more phox lynch, I just wanted to leave the implication that I did.

So, you didn't want him lynched, but you wanted to seem like you wanted him lynched? sorry for the short post, ill be back after work.

[PyroDwarf]

coron, You're talking about tells, well in that article, it says the first person to speculate on a role is likely to be that role. Now, I'm not sure if you are the first to mention it, but you are pointing lots of fingers. You have three people as potential SK. Planting seeds before night one so you can pick us off easier?

[PyroDwarf]

i hate it when people claim like this. this not presure. i'm on my way out and my comp is busted posting by psp sux.

[PyroDwarf]

well, there goes near. I've been out due to my computer taking a dump on itself. I'll try too keep up via my psp, but don't expect super long posts, it's a pain to post with that thing. Im at my gf's house, so yay... hopefully near is scum, I don't like DBE "claim" and I've already said that I didn't like coron's.

[PyroDwarf]

yikes. I did not see that comming. While I did say that i did not like people claiming without pressure, I don't think it was a good reason to lynch coron. Mac, DBE, and near, why did you let guardian's insistance lead your hand? Just because someone post over and over that someone is scum, especially the way guardian was, doesn't mean you should vote for them. My vote has been on guardian for a while now, and I think I'll be keeping it there.

[PyroDwarf]

i want to keep my vote on guardian. I had it on him day one for some suspiciousness, and now i'm keeping it on him for dragging coron down. Just the way he was so insistant that coron was scum doesn't sit right. He was certain enough to say "lynch me if coron is town" Does anyone think this is scumy? I know that i said i didn't like coron and DBE's claims, but that wasnt quite enough evidence for me to lynch them. Mike, other players are asking good questions, why place a vote on anyone if you wanted a no lynch?

vote:guardian

[PyroDwarf]

my bad on the partial quote, i really didnt mean to do that, i just woke up and didnt fell like trogging thru your posts. I don't see what near being or not being scum has to do with your innocence/guilt.

1) Near and Coron are both town, and probably Guardian is scum trying to get us to lynch a tracker.
3) Near is town believing Coron's claim, but is wrong and Coron is scum.
4) Near and Coron are both town, Guardian is a nincompoop.

well options 1 and 4 are correct, as "there's no flipping way near is scum" and i didnt misquote, there was no option two. so guardain I'll assume you wont claim scum, so town: we have a confirmed nincompoop, we must be cautious :p

[PyroDwarf]

then why lynch someone that claimed a power role? The chance of his myslynch would have decreased as the game went on, no? We would have seen results from him and would have been more likley not to kill him. Would it not have been better to lynch the other suspicious player, instead of the suspicious player that claimed a power role? Should we not have waited at least one day to see what results he came up with? Maybe he would have gotten a null like DBE, but we could have gone from there.

[PyroDwarf]

Well, that is cretainly interesting. I like the cop for scum.

unvote

, Assuming you are correct, for now. If I were the cop, I would have investigated DBE, because I thought there was a lot of investigative roles. I don't know about mass claim. Maybe we could have DBE and guardian target the same person tonight. They would either be lying scum, or we could confirm guardian, assuming DBE is a watcher.

[PyroDwarf]

I don't like this post. What does "I like the cop for scum" mean? Why should he have investigated DBE?

I like the cop for scum means that I've thought that guardian was scum since mid-day one. I obviously need to get my scumdar calibrated or something. I suggested the he should have investigated DBE because he was so suspicious of all the investigative roles. If I was cop and thought "Wow, theres a lot of investigative roles, thats suspicious". I would have investigated DBE to verify her claim.
@joudas: I see what you mean. I didn't think this plan thru, obv. I just wanted a way to verify that guardian is indeed the cop before he goes and leads the town right down the drain. My reasoning with that plan was If guardian is lying, he wouldnt target playerX and dbe would, she would say "hey guardian never showed up." more in a min

[PyroDwarf]

did you read waht i just posted?

I suggested the he should have investigated DBE because he was so suspicious of all the investigative roles. If I was cop and thought "Wow, theres a lot of investigative roles, thats suspicious". I would have investigated DBE to verify her claim

while at the time she had only psuedo-claimed, guardian could have made sure she was townie, at least.

[PyroDwarf]

@joudas: I responded to your allegations. As i said, I just wanted to be sure guardian was the cop. I thought he was scummy up untill the point he claimed. I suppose old suspicions die hard. I wasn't trying to direct night choices in any way, I guess I was still under the impression that he was scum.
@MBF: is your refusal to claim supposed to be an insinuation that you are a doctor?

[PyroDwarf]

I just don't like it, "I'm at L-1, but i refuse to claim" Even if you think your wagon is not good.

[PyroDwarf]

i'm sorry, I just think that a refusal to claim may as well be a claim in it self. Joudas, you are willing to hammer me or mac, yet you voted for SL...Any who, I wasn't fishing, i just don't like it when someone is at L-1 and won't claim,to me that means PR or scum. With so many investigators, i think it was pretty obvious what he is, a doctor or a scum. ANd now that I've thought about it more, I would like to vote for MBF, but I don't want to be accused of OMGUS, so I'll just FOS untill he responds.

[PyroDwarf]

Well, DBE as certainly dug herself a scum hole. Trying to "act town" is not a good thing to admit, i think. It looks like guardian and ABR went to the same scum hunting school. Pick a guy and ride them to a lynch. While this is a fine playstyle, I don't particularly care for it. Dasquian, I am almost sold on. He didn;t claim when he was at L-1, he only said he wasnt scum.
It seems he has been backed into a corner and is in survival mode. However, before i place my vote, i have to figure, Do we have a cop and a watcher, or was it a cop and a tracker. Or, was it watcher and tracker, and ballsy scum? I think it would be safest for me to vote the non PR claimed member in this, so I will

vote:Dasquian

putting him at L-1 again.

With the information I currently have, the votes distributed how they currently are, the fact I'm not sure how close pyrodwarf is to a lynch, and the fact I still want to reread his posts, I would rather have my vote on mbf than pyrodwarf

I'm pretty sure I was at one or zero votes when you said that.

s now really the best time to be "lazy"? You are too lazy to look through the 25 most recent posts for votes, but not to make the player by player analysis of over 500 words?
This strikes me as very odd, especially since there's been less than 25 posts since the last vote count, in none of which pyro has been voted.
First off, where are you coming from that pyro was voted?
Second off, how are you too lazy to count but not too lazy to make these posts you've been making?
Third, where are you coming from that pyro has gotten a couple of votes, so many that you fear voting him because you don't know how many votes are on him???

/agree

[PyroDwarf]

Day 2 is more interesting. He seems to readily accept Guardian's cop claim, having assumed him to be scum on day 1. You'd think he'd be more suspicious of him still - I am.

i am still suspicious of guardian, it just seems that everyone else was willing top accept his claim. I don't think putting/keeping my vote on him would do any good.

That's a lot of nothing for two weeks. I can sympathise with busy work, but...

Dude, untill recently, i was working two jobs from 6am to 8 or 9 pm, and my GF is preggers. Luckily for you guys, i just got fired from one job so maybe I'll be able to post more.
As for my fishing, really, The only reason i see for him not to claim would be doctor or scum. As he said, he didn't claim because he didnt think his wagon was meritous. IDK, I'm just used to people claiming when they are L-1/2 ish, but I am still realativelty new.
As for my vote, it was going to go on MBF,DBE or you. I didn't want to lynch a claimed PR, we can at least verify(hopefully) her tommorow.
On my rhetoric, I was speculating about how likley it is that our claimed power roles are lying.

Do we have a cop and a watcher, or was it a cop and a tracker. Or, was it watcher and tracker, and ballsy scum?

theres my full quote, note that i speculate that we may have a watcher and tracker and scum. GTG to breakfast with the woman...is that okay with you guys?

[PyroDwarf]

i dont think all the claimed PR's are lying, I am just saying that it's likely that one of them is a liar. Unfortunately, the one i think is a liar has claimed cop, the most powerful claim so far. I think it unlikely that we have 3 investigators. I didn't vote DBE because although she has scum tells (admitting to trying to act town) she is rather new. And now that i think about it, i do support a guardian lynch still. He investigated joudeas, who a couple people have already said seemed pro town already. seems like an easy fake. If i me and him are both here tonight, i wouldn't be suprised if he fakes a guilty result on me to get me lynched, as i seem to be the biggest questioner of his claim. what do ya'll think about this?

ps: sorry about the tone of my last post, getting fired when your lady is expecting is a bit stressfull.

[PyroDwarf]

im not scared of a investigation, im scared that he's a liar.

[PyroDwarf]

Grr, abr, is using guardian's playstyle that got coron lynched. I don't like it. I read that article, and it seems like that is his thing. Also, I dont like

Oh yeah. I have information I am not allowed to talk about regarding Dasquian.
By mod rules, I am not allowed to speak of it. Be assured that I have this tell 99.7% down pat.

I am from the school of thought that if you cant talk about it, dont even bring it up. And I also dont like that he is claiming 7/7 on scum...so what if you are on a hot streak, streaks gotta end some time. I'm not saying he is right or wrong, but it seems that his methods are...unsound...
It seems like he is trying to appeal to our fear of loosing instead of scum hunting, any one else see this?

[PyroDwarf]

there goes the day. i'm on psp . hard to post .guardian dont get mad get even. use your powers for good. see ya'll tomorow

[PyroDwarf]

p.s. get a room you two

[PyroDwarf]

Al B. what makes the fact that someone complained about you clearing? Just cuz they complained about you doesn't clear them. Maybe you didn't die last night because scum wanted to kill a "confirmed" pr. I think they would want to win instead of settiling a grudge.
Now, guardian says MBF is a townie. he said the same thing about joudas, yet you consider joudas on your scum list. I'm thinking that three investigators is a bit much w/o giving the scum any thing so it is likley that they have a roleblocker or you are crazy/nieve/ whatever.
Are you saying i am scum because of my "doctor fishing" ? MBF brought that upon himself, he refused to claim, so I thought he must be doctor or scum. If he is doctor, then this is a crazy town.
I'm inclined to belive that MBF is scum, and that would mean your investigations are flawed, and that implicates joudas too. I'm not sure on the third member. it could be yos2, or it could be you, and you are the mafia roleblocker.
of course, i could be wrong, joudas or MBF could be a GF, and you are copletley sane. Why do you think mac is scummy? he seemd pretty town all game.

[PyroDwarf]

I don't see what the big deal with my comment is. I don't think i should be lynched for it. are there other reasons you think I am scum? I think we should take a closer look at Al B. I don't think repacing near is a clearing trait, as many others seem to.

[PyroDwarf]

damn ABR, didn't your daddy talk to you about your attitude problem? Seriously, with the way you are acting, I'm inclined to think that you are scum with joudas/mac and yos, and you are trying to kill him to maintain your "7for7" of course you want to kill him. after he dies, you can just say: "see, now im 8for8, i cant be wrong! kill Pyro or MBF! "

[PyroDwarf]

well, i am on the verge of a lynch, and it seems that my crime is doctor fishing? I am sorry but I am used to people claiming at L-1,L-2. if any thing I'vem learned to keep such thoughts to myself. anyways, best not post drunk so I'm off![/i]

[PyroDwarf]

sorry guys, I went on vacation. This is getting to be a little adavnced for me. This is the first game i got in after i was killed N1 in my newb game. I've never been in an endgame, let alone lyol.
Abr, do you really think replacing me would advance the game?it seemd to slow down as it is, and you want some one to come in and you'll have to wait for them to get caught up. I can re read all I want, but im not sure I know what to look for.
[quote=Macavenger]Assumption for some later analysis: PyroDwarf is scum.

Summary: Very little scumhunting, lots of shifts of suspicion in order to align with popular wagons and subtly push them. Avoids taking firm stands on many issues where possible. Attacks players a lot, but asks few questions, doesn't vote a lot. Mentions PyroDwarf only once, distancing a bit when Guardian is attacking him. Does not mention Yosarian at all, or at least not in any significant context. Ends the day coasting to a probable Near lynch with his vote sitting there for a while.
[/quote]
i think that one of the instances of my name should be replaced with some one else's, no?

[PyroDwarf]

what makes them confirmed? because you say so? because near played so well before you took over? because guardian investigated mike? what about joudas then?

[PyroDwarf]

im sorry Al, i just dont like your posting style. You need, like, an attitude adjustment or something.

[PyroDwarf]

fuck you Im out, I'l go play tetris. So suck a cock.

[PyroDwarf]

woot im actually in a wiki! ABR is a jerk, if i ever get stuck in a game with him, ill probly request a replace.