Team Mafia 2018: Game 3 - Random GIFs Game Over

[Mathdino]

@Radja

: A50 is a bad/opportunistic scumread. And yeah, my whole team towntunneled you because of pages 1 2 and 3. If the evidence starts swinging in the other direction, hell yeah I'm gonna start questioning my own tunnel.

@T-Bone

: T-Bone what you're really asking is "Give me a good reason smart!town!Dunker would muddy the waters". Dunker is not good at reading me. Or, it seems, anyone for that matter given that he relies completely on shit he can't even describe.

Like, it actually makes perfect sense he's scumreading me. He was simultaneously scumreading me in both games we played together before my flip in the other game. And he's correct that my style this game has been similar to my style there. I have a fairly consistent playstyle with an all-over-the-place tone in general. The exceptions are things like
A. Switch: N0 guilty on Bins, gotta do something different.
B. NSG's game: Replaced into a MyLo slot at L-2 and was told to save myself and solve the game.

Tonereading is trash in this situation. I'm confident Dunker would toneread me as scum in most games on this site. That's why I've been annoyed. I knew once my scumgame ended he'd act all high and mighty like HEY GUYS I WAS RIGHT ABOUT DINOSCUM THAT TIME when he was literally only right because he deathtunneled a townie and then literally told everyone "Guys lynch this guy and lynch me in LyLo tomorrow if I'm wrong". No town motivation for that. Just stupidity.

But what reason is there for scum!Dunker to completely ignore all reason and abandon the town's topics of discussion to just tunnel me all day?

[Radja]

Currently talking to my team about the game. I'll make a post about it later

[T-Bone]

@T-bone: Are you SRing Dunker or are you just trying to convince him that meta is trash?

Maybe I just want to ask a question?

[chesskid3]

@Radja

: A50 is a bad/opportunistic scumread. And yeah, my whole team towntunneled you because of pages 1 2 and 3. If the evidence starts swinging in the other direction, hell yeah I'm gonna start questioning my own tunnel.

@T-Bone

: T-Bone what you're really asking is "Give me a good reason smart!town!Dunker would muddy the waters". Dunker is not good at reading me. Or, it seems, anyone for that matter given that he relies completely on shit he can't even describe.

Like, it actually makes perfect sense he's scumreading me. He was simultaneously scumreading me in both games we played together before my flip in the other game. And he's correct that my style this game has been similar to my style there. I have a fairly consistent playstyle with an all-over-the-place tone in general. The exceptions are things like
A. Switch: N0 guilty on Bins, gotta do something different.
B. NSG's game: Replaced into a MyLo slot at L-2 and was told to save myself and solve the game.

Tonereading is trash in this situation. I'm confident Dunker would toneread me as scum in most games on this site. That's why I've been annoyed. I knew once my scumgame ended he'd act all high and mighty like HEY GUYS I WAS RIGHT ABOUT DINOSCUM THAT TIME when he was literally only right because he deathtunneled a townie and then literally told everyone "Guys lynch this guy and lynch me in LyLo tomorrow if I'm wrong". No town motivation for that. Just stupidity.

But what reason is there for scum!Dunker to completely ignore all reason and abandon the town's topics of discussion to just tunnel me all day?

It's almost as if....meta is trash amirite?

T R I G G E R E D

[T-Bone]

Goddammit Math, see what you've made me do? Chess is gonna be scared for life.

[T-Bone]

@T-bone: Are you SRing Dunker or are you just trying to convince him that meta is trash?

Maybe I just want to ask a question?

And also maybe I want Dunker to answer the question rather than Math jumping in yet again to answer EVERYTHING?

jsyk @ Math

[Mathdino]

Give me a good reason that town!Dunker would muddy the waters, please.

bro i thought you were talking to me here sorry

[Radja]

@Dino: people have been scumreading A50 since the beginning of the game. How the hell can you say that read is opportunistic and bad?

Your attack on me makes no sense. Your callout of my A50 read makes no sense. Your scumteam with me in it makes no sense. And you havent given any reasoning.

I need an explanation on all of that with solid reasoning. I'm not going to take this shit from you.

[Radja]

@chesskid: Reck wants to punch you somewhere unpleasant for handwaiving MathDino. He wants you to take a good hard look at his iso

[Mathdino]

1. The fact that other people are doing it doesn't mean it looks good on them. With new information, he bleeds town. Go talk to your teams about it.
Like, he literally crumbed that his team in reality got 4 town PMs and 1 scum PM before momo flipped scum, and that he was left to choose between the 4 because his team didn't want him taking the scum PM on paranoia. Reads should change with new information.

2. Sorry it makes no sense to you. Scumteam is because I was already toying with Bins/LLD and Bins/Elena and was having some trouble finding more scumreads.

3. Don't care enough to case you. Feel free to not take this shit.

Give me better scumreads than A50 please.

[Mathdino]

Like honestly, the only explanation I have for reads as bad as yours or Dunker's (or I suppose Titus's and fitz's but they literally just replaced in) is that none of you are paying enough attention to the gamestate to have context on a ton of shit. And my guess is that your teams are collectively not able to work together as much as would be ideal due to activity and demotivation tournament-wide.

The A50 scumread is dumb and fails to take into account the entire second half of the game. (and what the fuck is "Thank you for confirming you're scum"???)

The me scumread ignores both my trajectory and my team's collective playstyle (and also the extra research and reads modifications that have been happening behind the scenes).

And the Titus/Transcend/Eddie scumread is just bad and ignores any semblance of reconsideration of "Huh, maybe this player just has a scummy playstyle".

[Almost50]

@Radja: I'll try to explain it to you as if you were a toddler. da da?

I said I'm calling those who are trying to lynch me

based on my self-vote

Scum. You argued not everybody was using that reasoning, so I quoted myself and emphasized it was those who

were

using that kind of reasoning in particular that I'm calling out as Scum, and yet you reiterated some people are not only SRing for that and claimed I was confirmed Scum to you.

I have no problem with people who SR me for "other reasons". I will look into their reasoning and evaluate their cases independently. My problem is with those trying to lynch me

because I self-voted

, and I used the game KMD kindly reminded me of to prove that 3 our of a total of 4 scum tried to lynch the Town player who self-voted, while NONE of the Town players voted them for it.

That game points to:
1- Town do self-vote at times, and for varying reasons
2- Other TOWN do NOT use that to push them (I personally defended Joda against that particular reason, but ended up SRing her for reasons that were totally unrelated to her self-vote)
3- SCUM are LIKELY to use THAT REASON to try and push for the lynch. The game clearly shows NO TOWNIE voted Joda for self-voting, while a "majority" of Scum did. 75% if the total Scum, which also 75% of the wagon at it's peak, and the only town vote on her was herself.

Now ell me you still don't understand and try to argue that I'm SRing everyone who SR me and I will probably ignore you for the rest of the game and be on the wagon that leads to your lynch if one ever develops at any point of the game of I'm still alive.

[Radja]

My team disagrees on A50. Crumbing that you're town doesn't actually means you're town man. I mean wtf. You should know better than that. Try again.

So you have no explanation for why nyou're linking me to Bins/LLD/Elena? Noted.

Also no real explanation to scumread me either? Okay..

P-edit.

Was going to vote you but I'll read your new stuff first

[Mathdino]

But I'm fairly sure your team isn't paying enough attention to this game to pick up on what I'm talking about. You're already misunderstanding the argument.

Lemme go check team notes to see if that association is actually valid real quick.

Yeah nothing ruling it out. I literally said in that post that I'm not seriously pushing that scumteam on some kind of association, I'm just calling my scumreads for potential postgame baller-ness.

And nope, the implication I'm getting from most of your posts is you haven't paid enough attention to shit anyway. I have no reason to think that explaining more shit to you is going to improve the gamestate. Also don't care enough. Tunneling me can be your funeral tbh.

[Almost50]

he literally crumbed that his team in reality got 4 town PMs and 1 scum PM before momo flipped scum

Now WAIT A FRIGGIN' SECOND. Your interpretation there could get me banned, bro. I never said that.

What I said is I didn't want to play in Alisae's game because it has complicated mechanics (and I have been in Ali's last game so I know), and then I was left to pick from 4 other role pms and that it didn't matter which one I took.

You can probably verify what I said against some "newly mod confirmed info", but that's as close as I'm going to reference anything outside this thread, and I strongly deny I crumbed we received a Scum PM. I only said I didn't want to play in a certain game and added that we received 5 Town PMs.

[Radja]

@Dino you can disagree with my reads bit calling them dumb is uncalled for and just a way to handwaive my arguments. Looks bad.

Also did you just call yourself town because of effort????

And again you handwaive my scumread on Transcend for no reason.

Wtf dude...

@A50 I don't think anyone is scumreading you because of your selfvote. Feel free to correct me.

P-edit

@Dino you cant just say "scumteam is 1-2-3" and don't expect those people to give you shit about it. That's not how this Works. And don't threaten me to pursue you because that doesn't work on me. Feel free to continue discrediting my ability to read. The more you do it, the more convinced I become that you're scum

[chesskid3]

@chesskid: Reck wants to punch you somewhere unpleasant for handwaiving MathDino. He wants you to take a good hard look at his iso

im not ready to commit from the 20% of posts ive read.

Give me specific pointers and I'll see whatever he wants me to see god rest his soul.

otherwise wait til after barthelona

[Radja]

If you're trying to piss me off, you're getting there dino. You don't get to handwaive everything I say without any reasoning and then tell me I'm too stupid too understand whats going on.

I need a break...

[mhsmith0]

Votecount 1.09

Titus (4)

Bulbazak , T-Bone , UC Voyager , Bins ,

havingfitz (2)

Keychain , ChannelDelibird ,

Bins (2)

Mathdino , Almost50 ,

Mathdino (4)

Titus , havingfitz , Dunkerdoodles , Elena Fisher ,

Almost50 (1)

Radja ,

Not Voting (2)

Aeronaut , chesskid3 ,

Day one deadline is Sunday February 4, 9 PM PST. (expired on 2018-02-04 21:00:00)

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch!

[/size]

[Almost50]

Was going to vote you but I'll read your new stuff first

No, no. Don't let it deter you from voting me if you have reason to. Just make sure you do have a case that I can respond to.

[Radja]

I wasnt talking about you. I'm already voting you. I was talking about Dino.

[Mathdino]

@A50: Got it. You at the very least crumbed you got the same situation with the 4 remaining games.

@Radja: I did not call myself town for effort. I've been explaining the Transcend scumread being bad for a long time now. And if your scumreads are literally just me, A50, and Transcendslot, and we're not gonna be able to work together on shit because you misinterpret every other post I make, then scumread me all you want.

Like, you're trying to condition my behaviour by talking to me in the moment about what will make you scumread me. Why would you literally give me ways to make myself less scummy to you if you already think I'm scum? If you really think I'm scum and wanna take me down, put me in situations that let me dig my own grave. But telling scum that you think they're scummy because of X action and they should stop doing X action, that's undermining your own scumhunting efforts.

I'm having a hard time believing Radja is actually invested in scumhunting here.

Here's my interpretation of your trajectory (on a few things):

1. Enter game mostly discussing Eddie/LLD. Cool.
2. Start tunneling A50, ok dude.
3. Explain that you and Shea both have issues with my lines of questioning while repeatedly not understanding my UCV interrogation (mfw Shea fucking thinks I was trying to mislynch UCV).
4. Spend your entire catchup trying to fan the A50 wagon back into existence.
5. Explain that despite your initial LLD scumread, you don't want to lynch her D1,

after she already replaced out.

6. Try to get A50 into a position where you can continue going after him. Completely fail.
7. Totally 180 your read on me after I float the idea out there that you're scum.

Oh and suddenly now that you're scumreading me, you can talk about how Shea doesn't like my trajectory and Reck is begging chesskid to take a second look, which is real funny after calling me town as fuck during your catchup.

It's almost like your read on me is more for political reasons than actual desire to scumhunt.

[Almost50]

@A50: Got it. You at the very least crumbed you got the same situation with the 4 remaining games.

That I did.

[Mathdino]

A50, am I on a shitty train of thought with Bins/LLD/Radja idea?

I can see a potential LLD/Radja connection tbh. In hindsight I don't see a good justification for Elena/Radja idea.

What are your other scumreads beside Bins?

[Almost50]

A50, am I on a shitty train of thought with Bins/LLD/Radja idea?

Nope. So far it still makes perfect sense for the trio to be scum together, and I didn't want to affect your reads before, but I'm glad you came around on Elena.

Other than your 3, I'm not sure about CDB, Aeronaut, T-bone & CK (but T-bone & CK are like last resorts. Like, if we mislynch and then get a clear on another one of the main suspects.. maybe then).

Oh, and Dunker. I'm not 100% on him either. I know he can do better than this, but I don't explicitly SR him either.

My strongest SR remains Bins though, and she's not even trying. Like, I would expect Town!Bins to be overly noisy, and especially while we are waiting for Titus/Fitz to catch up, so we have all the time for her to Town!case herself or show some genuine Scumhunting, but she seems to have basically given up.