Newbie 865 - Game over!

[Elmo]

Day 1, Vote Count #1

tracker <- RPG*Twilight

Not voting: Toon Fighter, Canada, CommieX, PaltryExcuse, Neo-con John, Gayle, tracker, imkingdavid

The

deadline

is Wednesday 25th November, 22:00 UTC, which is 16 days, 14 hours and 55 minutes from this post. If deadline hits, there will be No Lynch.
With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.

CommieX & Neo-con John have been prodded; Canada is V/LA.

[RPG*Twilight]

so unfortunate news.... I got hit with the flu bug and will be hopped up on drugs for the next couple of days... so I'll be V/LA till probably wedensday. Thanks.

[Neo-con John]

Sorry for not participating, long weekend.

So from what I gather so far there have been small fingers of suspicion cast at RPG and PE, a very small finger pointed at Gayle, and what I would describe as a strong finger being pointed at tracker which has actually resulted in a vote. That is 4 out of 9 players that have been accused in some fashion, and I like to think that the group cannot be dead wrong on all four, meaning we have a fairly good chance that at least one of those listed is actually scum.

Now I may have missed something, please tell me if so. I have prepared the following summation of suspicions so far:

Commie X accuses tracker in PS#20 about the questions asked

RPG accuses Gayle in PS#21 for his answer to the no-lynch question, though it later appears resolved in PS#25

RPG accuses tracker in PS#29 for his position on lynching lurkers

RPG accuses PE of possibly trying to "protect" tracker in PS#33

Gayle puts the names of RPG and tracker in bold letters in PS#35 questioning RPG's suspicions and had the following to say about tracker

He asks about the everyone's opinion on allowing a no lynch, but does not give his own until everyone else has given theirs. Then he goes out of his way to explain why a no lynch may be feasible.

He establishes that he is scatterbrained and doesn't have the best memory. A good excuse for a mistake later in the game.

He questions twilight's use of the word agenda, as if he thought twilight was accusing him.

He first advocates lynching lurkers as a policy, and then waters it down a bit with 'if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1'.

A strong case indeed.

Overall I am unable to figure out RPG, he is throwing accusations around a bit too much, though this could just be evidence of an aggressive towns person.

Gayle seems to have cleaned up any problems folks were having with his position on no-lynch, his case agianst tracker seems solid.

I completely agree that it looked like PE was trying to protect tracker from RPG's questioning which was pretty harsh, perhaps RPG was onto something? Nothing else PE has done seems scummy though so that doesn't add up right now.

Tracker seems very suspicious to me. From the beginning I saw the questions as good for the game but also as really good for tracker as it provides a great cover for scum. He gives the appearance of being pro-town while at the same time collecting valuable information on all of us and maybe even dividing us amongst ourselves. His second line of questions looked to me like someone trying to divert our attention away from the RPG/PE fiasco in PS# 29-33. The questions themselves just seem weak and quickly put together, What is your favorite role?, C'mon. I am not quite quite ready to vote but I am

Seriously considering:tracker

[imkingdavid]

so unfortunate news.... I got hit with the flu bug and will be hopped up on drugs for the next couple of days... so I'll be V/LA till probably wedensday. Thanks.

Sorry to hear that. I hope you have a speedy recovery!

@neo - while you're right that there is a chance of one or even two of the 4/9 people you listed is scum, there's a larger chance that one or both are not being looked at right now. What's to say they're not both lurking? But if you've got suspicions of someone, go for them. Don't just look at the people that other people are looking at. Although it is sort of early in the game and some people haven't really posted much at all.

As far as RPG goes, you may have something there... I played with him in Newbie 826 and he played pretty much the same way that he is playing so far, and turned out to be scum.

Here's a weak vote based on meta to apply pressure.

vote: RPG*Twilight

btw,

Tracker seems very suspicious to me. From the beginning I saw the questions as good for the game but also as really good for tracker as it provides a great cover for scum. He gives the appearance of being pro-town while at the same time collecting valuable information on all of us and maybe even dividing us amongst ourselves. His second line of questions looked to me like someone trying to divert our attention away from the RPG/PE fiasco in PS# 29-33. The questions themselves just seem weak and quickly put together, What is your favorite role?, C'mon. I am not quite quite ready to vote but I am

Look at the other game that he was in the started with questions instead of RVS. A lot of the questions he's asked are basically copy/pasted from there. But... I don't know.
Right now RPG's my highest.

[CommieX]

I'm back, our internet went down over the weekend. Sorry.

Now then, on with the scumhunting!

From the very beginning (and yes, we are still at the beginning), twilight has been questioning a lot of things. Too many things, in my opinion. I understand that the point of the game is to question things, but some of these questions were a stretch. His posts are thick with paranoia for this stage of the game. He could be trying a little too hard to appear town.

This has already been touched on, but I still really don't like this for two reasons

1. Mafia is pretty much the game of paranoia
2. You kinda have to make stretches in the beginning of the game to get the game rolling

Gayle:

but some of these questions were a stretch.

Could you give examples?

and often times, from what I've seen, scum are heavy lurkers so you'll often hit scum

Eh? Not from my experience, but I have a more limited experience on this site.

KingDavid:

(and everyone else but IKD is the most experienced so I'm most interested in his opinion), What's your take on this?

however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

I can't speak for RPG, but it kinda seems like you're strawman-izing his argument? (am I using that right?)

I would rather lynch scum that waste my days policy lynching lurkers.

Again, Strawman-izing (I think)? Everyone besides the scum wants to lynch scum. That's how we WIN.

I don't have a favorite role, I don't have a least favorite role. Wouldn't it be a bit more appropriate to ask those questions in a game where there's more experienced people playing?

I am choosing not to answer this for the following reason...
I don't want to give the scum knowledge of who I suspect the least, as doing so will let them know who not to try and push the lynch of. Also mafia often NK (night kill) the most pro-town players that they would have a hard time building support for a lynch of. So by answering this question, I would only be aiding the scum, which is something I do not wish to do.

I agree.

The fact that you say townie tells me that you probably have an analitical mind. You enjoy decidphering people's posts to find discrepancies that signal scum. correct?

Please don't try and psychoanalyze people. Just...don't.

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

And what is this, mr. every little bit of information helps the town?

Vote: Tracker

for not sharing with the class.

As far as RPG goes, you may have something there... I played with him in Newbie 826 and he played pretty much the same way that he is playing so far, and turned out to be scum.

As in throwing around a lot of questions in the beginning, or something else?

BTW, I realize a lot of my post has already been touched on by other people.

[imkingdavid]

This has already been touched on, but I still really don't like this for two reasons

1. Mafia is pretty much the game of paranoia

Would you agree or disagree that mafia has more to be paranoid about than a pro-town player? Based on that, does it make sense to assume that a player who is acting highly paranoid is likely scum?

and often times, from what I've seen, scum are heavy lurkers so you'll often hit scum

Eh? Not from my experience, but I have a more limited experience on this site.

In some cases, yes, scum do lurk more often than townies. However, it can go either way. I don't find lurking inherently scummy, even though I also don't find it pro-town in any respect. Which is why I am of the mindset that we should replace all lurkers, rather than lynch all lurkers.

KingDavid:

(and everyone else but IKD is the most experienced so I'm most interested in his opinion), What's your take on this?

however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

I can't speak for RPG, but it kinda seems like you're strawman-izing his argument? (am I using that right?)

1) The wiki defines strawmanning as "mischaracterizing your opponent's position in order to present a weaker argument than they have actually given, thereby allowing you to defeat it." (Strawman - wiki link) So I guess this could be considered strawmanning, yes.
2) Please

please

label your quotations. Because just from reading this and the next quotation, it looks like you're attributing them to me and then accusing me of strawmanning. However, both this and the next are from post #37 by

tracker

. So to avoid confusion, add ="player" to the

tags.
3) As far as my opinion goes on this one, yes, he does seem to be putting words into RPG's mouth.

I would rather lynch scum that waste my days policy lynching lurkers.

Again, Strawman-izing (I think)? Everyone besides the scum wants to lynch scum. That's how we WIN.

Again, please label your quotes. However, this time, I don't see him as directly referring to any of RPG's quotes in his post. If I am missing something, let me know. But it looks like he's just stating his opinion here.

As far as RPG goes, you may have something there... I played with him in Newbie 826 and he played pretty much the same way that he is playing so far, and turned out to be scum.

As in throwing around a lot of questions in the beginning, or something else?

A couple of things, but I'm waiting to see more of his behavior this game before telling him what I'm looking for. Any scum can mask their play when they know what to/not to do if they try hard enough.

[imkingdavid]

EBWOP. lol just realized that I didn't label one of the quotes in the above post, and ironically, it's right after I get onto CX for it. for the sake of clarity, all quotes in the above post are by CommieX (CX).

[CommieX]

Would you agree or disagree that mafia has more to be paranoid about than a pro-town player?

Disagree, at least in the context of this game, as the mafia knows who is with them and who is against them whereas the town doesn't. But it's subjective.

2) Please please label your quotations. Because just from reading this and the next quotation, it looks like you're attributing them to me and then accusing me of strawmanning. However, both this and the next are from post #37 by tracker. So to avoid confusion, add ="player" to the

I apologize.

[imkingdavid]

Would you agree or disagree that mafia has more to be paranoid about than a pro-town player?

Disagree, at least in the context of this game, as the mafia knows who is with them and who is against them whereas the town doesn't. But it's subjective.

Well, yes, that's the point of the game, that mafia know who each other are. However, because they are trying to blend in with the rest of the town, aren't they naturally going to be more paranoid about how they word things and such than, say, a vanilla townie? Pro-town players don't have as much at stake as anti-town players, because there's more of them, so there's more of a chance of a town win. Does that make sense?

2) Please please label your quotations. Because just from reading this and the next quotation, it looks like you're attributing them to me and then accusing me of strawmanning. However, both this and the next are from post #37 by tracker. So to avoid confusion, add ="player" to the

I apologize.

No worries. I was just confused as to whom you were referring exactly until i looked it up.

[PaltryExcuse]

Would you agree or disagree that mafia has more to be paranoid about than a pro-town player?

Disagree, at least in the context of this game, as the mafia knows who is with them and who is against them whereas the town doesn't. But it's subjective.

Well, yes, that's the point of the game, that mafia know who each other are. However, because they are trying to blend in with the rest of the town, aren't they naturally going to be more paranoid about how they word things and such than, say, a vanilla townie? Pro-town players don't have as much at stake as anti-town players, because there's more of them, so there's more of a chance of a town win. Does that make sense?

Overall, I think it depends on the player. You could be paranoid about who's on your side, you could be paranoid about who's on to you. Anyone's 'paranoia' at this stage in the game is only going to help in later days if we see a dramatic personality switch.

At this point, IKD has been very helpful as an IC. However, many have jumped on tracker and RPG as doing the 'townie thing' (getting conversation going and actively scumhunting respectively) and the most obvious one in this category is IKD. Still, the 'too townie' argument means little without scummy actions.

I completely agree that it looked like PE was trying to protect tracker from RPG's questioning which was pretty harsh, perhaps RPG was onto something? Nothing else PE has done seems scummy though so that doesn't add up right now.

Was my 'defense' harsh or was RPG's questioning harsh? And if I were defending another player, how is that scummy?

[Canada]

Alright, feeling better. Anyone got an explanation on V/LA?

I've gotta go now, but I'll re-read tomorrow and hopefully have some insight into the game.

* Note to self - Re-read Newbie 865.

~Canada

[Neo-con John]

PE-I meant the questioning was harsh. I also was agreeing with RPG that it seemed as though you were trying to remove the attention on tracker, who... if scum, is a scummy move on your part as in this scenario you would be his scum partner.

So I would like to ask you, Paltry Excuse, what do you think of tracker and why did you get in the way of RPG's questions?

[PaltryExcuse]

What I think of tracker:
At this point, I have no definite read on tracker. Honestly I'm finding this tunneling on tracker, with nearly everyone jumping on his bandwagon and finding him scummy, a little bit scum-led or scum-supported. This early in the game, it is difficult to get firm reads on people, and I think people are ignoring the obvious possibility of: He's just asking questions. I think it's easier for scum to jump on in support of something negative against another player rather than make their own case. Why? That's what I did until the 3rd day, and I won. People could be genuinely finding tracker seriously scummy, but on the other hand it is an easy excuse for scum to latch on to at this point.
Just to point out the people who said they find him scummy with <3 pages of posts: RPG, Commie, Gayle, ToonFighter(though passively) and you. That's enough to lynch him, if so inclined (though I'm not saying at this point you all are inclined to do so).

Getting 'in the way' of RPG's questions:
RPG may see me as another target, but I doubt he'd drop his suspicions because another person asked him a question. It put some suspicion on RPG, true, but it didn't stop him. I still don't see this as a defence on tracker, it was a question aimed at RPG. Attacking a scumhunter is not a defence of those they are scumhunting.

[tracker]

Not all lurkers are scum and some scum are the most active players, lurking is not a true scumtell. Keeping that in mind, in a lot of the games I've played in or read, normally at least one of the scum team lurked. and in a couple of games they lurked to victory.

I would like to venture so far as to say I've been misunderstood.

if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1, if i just don't know who the scum is, from what I've seen, it seems to me that lurker lynching is probably the better option. In short, if I believe you to be scum, I'll do my best to get you lynched, if I don't know,

or don't agree with the case on anybody, I would prefer to lynch a lurker.

That bolded part of the quote strikes me as odd. "Anybody" is a vast generalization of... well, everybody. That would include lurkers. If you are preferring to lynch a lurker, isnt that a case, that he's lurking? I just find this a bit contradictory. Sounds like your just going to use any old reason in the book to get someone lynched.

In this post(#29), RPG overexaggerates my case as to say I'll lynch anybody for any reason whatsoever, when this is not true, and I would rather lynch someone who's given off solid scum tells as I've already said.

however if you would rather let the scum have a free kill.... I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

Um. Of course not. Where did you get this from? It's nice to see that you're putting words in my mouth. I'm trying to move past the molasses that is your questions and pick apart the text from the answers from the first batch, which you really havent done yourself. Quite interesting. Maybe you should yourself pay attention to the answers people have. It'll do wonders. The only way we'll get past the "majority not finding scum" is if we start, oh I don't know, scumhunting. And it seems you're trying to deflect by asking even more questions that, like I said, have nothing to do with helping us find scum.

so do I accuse RPG of overexaggeration(strawmanning) or do it in return?

That said, Tracker is almost too scared to get out of "beginning" question mode. At least I answer questions and move on, but seriously, a second round of pretty much "beginning" questions?

Here is where your wrong. All of post-37 has it's purpose. Starting with the first part where I "put words in you mouth". You overexaggerated my case so I returned the favor.

this was already explained in above post(#43)

This is really just out of curiosity. I agree that Lurkers do not help the town, even if they have a pro-town role, so they should not be allowed into LyLo. However, I think that a better way eliminating lurkers is to just replace them,

rather than policy lynch them. Of course, not to say that I won't lynch someone who has been lurking, but IMO if you waste your days policy lynching lurkers,

you're going to run out of days, and chances are, scum will win.

and as for the other case of strawmanning I was just using a phrase already out there.[/quote]

Gayle puts the names of RPG and tracker in bold letters in PS#35 questioning RPG's suspicions and had the following to say about tracker

He asks about the everyone's opinion on allowing a no lynch, but does not give his own until everyone else has given theirs. Then he goes out of his way to explain why a no lynch may be feasible.

He establishes that he is scatterbrained and doesn't have the best memory. A good excuse for a mistake later in the game.

He questions twilight's use of the word agenda, as if he thought twilight was accusing him.

He first advocates lynching lurkers as a policy, and then waters it down a bit with 'if i believe someone to be scum then they're lynch candidate #1'.

A strong case indeed.

Tracker seems very suspicious to me. From the beginning I saw the questions as good for the game but also as really good for tracker as it provides a great cover for scum. He gives the appearance of being pro-town while at the same time collecting valuable information on all of us and maybe even dividing us amongst ourselves. His second line of questions looked to me like someone trying to divert our attention away from the RPG/PE fiasco in PS# 29-33. The questions themselves just seem weak and quickly put together, What is your favorite role?, C'mon. I am not quite quite ready to vote but I am

Seriously considering:tracker

I'm pretty sure I countered above points but I don't have the time to back and find them now, so I'll just restate my view.

1) I know IKD said something about this as well and I'll try to remember what he said. Another question before I start, if I had given my answer before the rest of the town commented how would that have affected your answer? I believed it would affect and judging that nobody found it to be even remotely possible as a good option for the town, i'm going to continue believing that it would have.

I try my hardest to understand both sides of an arguement, and the very fact that a No-Lynch can be feasible I had to ask that question. My side is the same as everyone else's No-Lynch=bad, and that we should make an educated lynch every day. It's the only way to win.

2)I didn't of it so much as an excuse for forgetting things in this game but as informing you guys that my schedule is hetic and I may have to priotize other things before this.

3)I still don't understand RPG's use of that word and I'm still waiting for him to get back at me.

4)I don't see myself policy lynching lurker's, EVER, I never said that, IKD said that, I don't think I ever advocated policy lynching lurkers, I said that if we're close to the deadline (were No-Lynching is the set course of action)and the town is divided about wether Player A is scum or Player B is scum, and I don't agree with either of them I would rather lynch a lurker(who is at worst an anti-town player) than let our lynch slip away.

Have to go eat now, try and get back on later

[CommieX]

@Tracker: Just so we're clear:

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

Announce your findings.

[imkingdavid]

This is really just out of curiosity. I agree that Lurkers do not help the town, even if they have a pro-town role, so they should not be allowed into LyLo. However, I think that a better way eliminating lurkers is to just replace them,

rather than policy lynch them. Of course, not to say that I won't lynch someone who has been lurking, but IMO if you waste your days policy lynching lurkers,

you're going to run out of days, and chances are, scum will win.

and as for the other case of strawmanning I was just using a phrase already out there.

Ahh, there it is. Thanks for finding that.

For the record, I wasn't implying that anyone wanted to "waste our days policy lynching lurkers". "you" is a generalization not directed at anyone. Maybe I should have specified that. My bad.

2)I didn't of it so much as an excuse for forgetting things in this game but as informing you guys that my schedule is hetic and I may have to priotize other things before this.

Would you mind rewording this? Doesn't make sense right now. maybe I'm too tired.

4)I don't see myself policy lynching lurker's, EVER, I never said that, IKD said that, I don't think I ever advocated policy lynching lurkers, I said that if we're close to the deadline (were No-Lynching is the set course of action)and the town is divided about wether Player A is scum or Player B is scum, and I don't agree with either of them I would rather lynch a lurker(who is at worst an anti-town player) than let our lynch slip away.

I said, and I quote,

so from what I gather, you agree with Lynch All Lurkers? If I'm wrong, let me know; if not, here's a question, then:

You never "let me know" that I was wrong, so I assumed you do agree with LAL. In which case, you would advocate (whether you say it or not) policy lynching lurkers, as that is the definition of LAL. Sorry if I misrepresented you. I wasn't necessarily trying to, but I was going with the information I had.

At this point, IKD has been very helpful as an IC. However, many have jumped on tracker and RPG as doing the 'townie thing' (getting conversation going and actively scumhunting respectively) and the most obvious one in this category is IKD. Still, the 'too townie' argument means little without scummy actions.

I don't see myself as having "jumped on tracker and RPG as doing the 'townie thing' (getting conversation going and actively scumhunting respectively)". If you see me doing that, you're welcome to provide examples. However, I my vote on RPG is based on meta from my previous game with him, not on him trying to stimulate discussion.

[tracker]

V/LA - That is when you know that your going to be gone so you announce it in the thread ahead of time. I don't know what it stands for but thats how it's used.

@Tracker: Just so we're clear:

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

Announce your findings.

my "findings" in this case would really not be of much use as we're on page 3 d1, basically what i meant by my "findings" where my thoughts and what i found "interesting" and stored away for future reference, I would prefer to save them for later, but if you and 2 others ask I will reveal them.

I guess if i had to take a stance on it I would have to say I would be more towards replace all lurkers than lynch all lurkers, sorry for not answering/clarifying that before.

IKD if there was a deadline approaching and you didn't think the town concrete a lynch on anybody,(and you didn't agree with the case on either of the top lynch canidates) would you rather try and lynch a lurker, jump on one of the other wagons and hope for the best, or what?

Also IDK, I know that you weren't accusing me of wanting to policy lynch lurkers it was that other's were using that as an example in an attack against me when i didn't even coin the phrase. I figured that I should clarify that.

What's IMO?

Mod: What happened to toonfighter?

[imkingdavid]

Alright, last post before bed. I hope.
(btw all quotes in this post are of tracker, just in case I fail to label any.)

V/LA - That is when you know that your going to be gone so you announce it in the thread ahead of time. I don't know what it stands for but thats how it's used.

^this, except V/LA =

V

acation/

L

imited

A

ccess.

(all following quotes are from tracker):

I guess if i had to take a stance on it I would have to say I would be more towards replace all lurkers than lynch all lurkers, sorry for not answering/clarifying that before.

IKD if there was a deadline approaching and you didn't think the town concrete a lynch on anybody,(and you didn't agree with the case on either of the top lynch canidates) would you rather try and lynch a lurker, jump on one of the other wagons and hope for the best, or what?

I guess nearing a lynch in the given scenario with no hope of a deadline extension to allow a replacement for a lurker time to give their thoughts, I would vote toward a lurker. Although, I would in any other case try to build a case on someone that has something to be built on, instead of just resorting to a lurker. But in the scenario you gave, I would opt for oa lurker.

Also IDK, I know that you weren't accusing me of wanting to policy lynch lurkers it was that other's were using that as an example in an attack against me when i didn't even coin the phrase. I figured that I should clarify that.

Ah, ok, thanks for clarification.

What's IMO?

IMO =

I

n

M

y

O

pinion.
Also commonly used is IMHO, which is "in my humble opinion".

[Canada]

Tracker, thanks.

You're asking what IMO stands for? In My (Humble) Opinion. Humble is sometimes added.

Hopefully will get time to post again today, but my mom is being a "w"itch.

~Canada

[Canada]

Bah, is there any particular reason only a few of my quotes are working? Like, two of Gayle's quotes work, but the rest don't (and they're all formatted correctly). I have a rather large post ready, but the quotes are all messed up.

~Canada

[imkingdavid]

Make sure you have " around the username or it won't show properly. ANd make sure you have both a [quote*] and a [/quote] (without the *).

[RPG*Twilight]

Finally back! Man, that flu really kicked my ass for 4 days. But i'm here.

Let's start here.

As far as RPG goes, you may have something there... I played with him in Newbie 826 and he played pretty much the same way that he is playing so far, and turned out to be scum.

Here's a weak vote based on meta to apply pressure.

vote: RPG*Twilight

Right now RPG's my highest.

That is true, we do have some previous experience. But you have me completely baffled by this. Did I really play the same way in that game as in this? I still have that game on my watched topics, and I re-read all of what I wrote. I got prodded, had short sentences, didnt even talk to my scum-buddy (who got killed in D1, which I wasnt entirely active on.) Which, if you'll see, is exactly how i'm not playing now. So where in that game is there really a whole lot of similarities to this one? That being my first mafia game, and being scum, was pretty unnerving. If anything, David, i'm playing completely opposite, i'm actually scumhunting. This makes me pretty weary of you, trying to use my meta that is the complete antithesis of what i'm playing now, to make your case. And that, and only that, is the reason i'm highest on your list? Again, baffling.

On the topic of tracker:

This early in the game, it is difficult to get firm reads on people, and I think people are ignoring the obvious possibility of: He's just asking questions.

So was I. So why did you ask me why I was isolating him (with questions) about his questions? His questions, in all actuality, are less impactful to the game then mine. I'm wondering WHY he's continuing to ask questions when we are clearly trying to move past that and decipher what we have already. His questions would be impactful if they were on page 1. He already did that. Those are page 1 questions. Not page 3 "I have nothing to add and I'm scared to move on so lets revert back to what we did and I can hide" questions. How does that not scream of hiding in a hole to you?

I think it's easier for scum to jump on in support of something negative against another player rather than make their own case. Why? That's what I did until the 3rd day, and I won. People could be genuinely finding tracker seriously scummy, but on the other hand it is an easy excuse for scum to latch on to at this point.

I agree. But in order, right now, for us to get any movement past this, we needed to break free of those questions. That's why I did it. My hope is to see people's reactions to what other people say about tracker, because it's like a domino effect. We can see how people stack up against tracker, and I, at least, can adjust accordingly. If I see that people are just along for the ride, and not picking out other peoples' texts when there's inconsistencies and contradictions, then we have an issue. Day 1 is a slow process and I am just trying to move this along and see what we can uncover from our players.

Getting 'in the way' of RPG's questions:
RPG may see me as another target, but I doubt he'd drop his suspicions because another person asked him a question.

I actually dont. That first paragraph you wrote in this text i've deciphered is screaming pretty pro-town to me. But you are right, people ask me questions, I will answer.

On to tracker.

dirt? this wasn't about dirt. What do I need dirt for? This was about gaining insight into your thoughts. The fact that you say townie tells me that you probably have an analitical mind. You enjoy decidphering people's posts to find discrepancies that signal scum. correct?

Correct. But where does this help you? Anyone can be analytical here. To play this game I believe we all have to have an analytical mind somewhat. I still dont understand how this is going to help you with any case you have, it really, and always has seemed, liked a stall tactic.

did you fail to notice that half the town is AWOL? These questions are useful in the sense of getting players involved.

They werent awol in the first set of questions. That wasnt enough? Which leads me to this:

So the questions I've been asking don't count as follow-up questions?

... No. Those were just like those questionnaires you take for a job, where they ask for the same question 3 different ways. You werent really out to gain information. And if seeing that one has an "analytical mind" is going to get you to catch scum, then you need to sharpen your scumhunting skills.

just because I haven't chosen to announce my findings to the world doesn't mean I don't have any.

Yeah, because you need findings first. Like I said, those questions didnt help. If you have findings, then prove it. Why would you wait? Because you have a third batch of questions that you need to "gather more findings"? Or as i'd like to call it, hiding in a hole.

Show us your findings.

Why would you hold out findings if your town?

And by the way, Tracker, I think I explained what I meant by paranoid. It just seems like I caught you, that's all. Now you're a bit scared.

BTW, I realize a lot of my post has already been touched on by other people.

An interesting little ditty here. Just wanted to note it, but it seems a bit odd he had to outright mention it before he got any heat for it. You know, stop it before the snowball rolls in. I'll see if he contributes more.

Okay, done with the wall of text. If I missed anything, let me know and i'll answer it, but I kind of have to blame it on it being 5:15 in the morning.

[Canada]

Alright, figured out my problem! Gotta go in ten minutes, so I'll read over RPG's post tonight, and add anything to the current post, before posting it. Freaking Word. .

~Canada

[PaltryExcuse]

I think I've caught whatever was going around. Blech.

At this point, IKD has been very helpful as an IC. However, many have jumped on tracker and RPG as doing the 'townie thing' (getting conversation going and actively scumhunting respectively) and the most obvious one in this category is IKD. Still, the 'too townie' argument means little without scummy actions.

I don't see myself as having "jumped on tracker and RPG as doing the 'townie thing' (getting conversation going and actively scumhunting respectively)". If you see me doing that, you're welcome to provide examples. However, I my vote on RPG is based on meta from my previous game with him, not on him trying to stimulate discussion.

Poorly worded sentence on my part. I didn't think that. I meant some are looking at those two for the 'too townie' reason, while they haven't considered you as being 'too townie' for being helpful. Just pointing out inconsistencies.

This early in the game, it is difficult to get firm reads on people, and I think people are ignoring the obvious possibility of: He's just asking questions.

So was I. So why did you ask me why I was isolating him (with questions) about his questions? His questions, in all actuality, are less impactful to the game then mine. I'm wondering WHY he's continuing to ask questions when we are clearly trying to move past that and decipher what we have already. His questions would be impactful if they were on page 1. He already did that. Those are page 1 questions. Not page 3 "I have nothing to add and I'm scared to move on so lets revert back to what we did and I can hide" questions. How does that not scream of hiding in a hole to you?

Surprisingly before this game started, I read two games he was in (kept up with the most recent one, and before I started playing I read a different one) and the random questions seemed to linger for a few pages. However I agree it seems like the town wanted to move past and his new ones might've stagnated things again. Hence, null-read.

[Elmo]

Bump!