Open 230 - Bird 7 - Game Over

[Robocopter87]

Its sounds like you did think he was scum right here.

Unless you are bussing your partner for no reason at all?

This is putting words that were in your mouth in a box.

[XScorpion]

I guess you still don't get what the word "if" means. I'll try to explain it some more...

If you are scum, the lynch will be incorrect. Unless you are bussing your partner for no reason at all?

Ok let's break this down.
First, we start with the magical beginning, "if you are scum." Now that the statement begins with these, we have to look at the rest of the statement through the view that Mykonian is scum, because if he isn't scum, then the statement means nothing. I could rewrite it like so:

If you are scum, the lynch will be incorrect. Unless you are bussing your partner for no reason at all?
If you aren't scum, then I know nothing about the situation.

It means the same thing.
OK, now that we are operating under the assumption that Mykonian is scum, we go to the next part - "the lynch will be incorrect." Sounds like you have an ok grasp on this.
And the last part, "unless you are bussing your partner for no reason at all." This indicates simply uncertainty as to whether or not Robocopter is scum, because it offers the possibility that the lynch will be correct AND mykonian is scum.

Now if you could point out exactly where I said anything about my own opinion, I would be much obliged. And let me know if you are still unclear as to what "if" means.

[AurorusVox]

Now, I wonder, why do you assume the lynch will be incorrect? While you are voting for him!

If you are scum, the lynch will be incorrect. Unless you are bussing your partner for no reason at all?
Your logic sucks.

a) This is despite not really posting his own reasons for wanting to lynch robocopter
b) He didn't insinuate that budja was scum for quickly putting robocopter at L-1, though he insinuates that myk would be scum for quick-hammering
c) If he's as apathetic about a robocopter lynch as it seems from his questions, why doesn't he just unvote robocopter to take away the mislynch that he's convinced it would be?

I'm not sure if you know this or not, so I think I'll tell you: We haven't really left RVS yet. If you think that I've played seriously so far...
but then again this is coming from the guy who thinks hiding information is good for town. Never mind.

If you're going to try to use my meta, at least get it right. In the game you are referring to, I actually said that I agreed with you that hiding information is often anti-town. Flail more please.

[XScorpion]

And you aren't voting with me because...?
Talk is cheap. Put your vote where your mouth is.

[AurorusVox]

In this game?

My mouth says that I suspect you. I am already voting for you. Therefore I am putting my vote where my mouth is.

Unless by "with me" you're asking me to vote for the same person as you, in which case you're suggesting that I should hammer someone because I partially agree with you on a game-theory related matter.


If you're talking about the other game, then this isn't the place to discuss that.

[XScorpion]

It's kinda hard to discuss meta without talking about another game.

[AurorusVox]

I'm not asking you to not discuss another game in general. I'm asking you to not talk about who I should vote for in the other game, in this game. If you have an issue with my vote in the other game, take it up there.

[XScorpion]

A lot of good that's doing.

[AurorusVox]

Stop trying to derail discussion in this thread.

Since we've established that the second half of this is wrong:

"I'm not sure if you know this or not, so I think I'll tell you: We haven't really left RVS yet. If you think that I've played seriously so far...
but then again this is coming from the guy who thinks hiding information is good for town. Never mind."

all we're left with is:

"I'm not sure if you know this or not, so I think I'll tell you: We haven't really left RVS yet. If you think that I've played seriously so far..."

Your threat to Myk was serious enough.

And if I've seen something to seriously comment on, then I'm out of the RVS, because there is a reason behind my vote. And I'm not going to just discount everything you've done because "it wasn't serious", or else, what is the point of RVS? RVS is meant to give us stuff to talk about, right? So now I've found something to talk about, and am voicing my concerns. Why are you worried that I'm putting a serious case together on you? If you're innocent, you should have more than crying about it still being RVS to defend yourself with.

[XScorpion]

Your threat to Myk was serious enough.

I must have missed the part where Myk was proven to be scum and he quickhammered.

Why are you worried that I'm putting a serious case together on you?

Because you're wasting time that could be spent looking for the real scum.

If you're innocent, you should have more than crying about it still being RVS to defend yourself with.

Unfortunately, that's the only defense that I have, because anything else would be a lie.

[AurorusVox]

Your threat to Myk was serious enough.

I must have missed the part where Myk was proven to be scum and he quickhammered.

IF he quickhammered, would you have voted him tomorrow?

[mykonian]

you need 3 full sentences to talk 1 sentence straight again. Not a great sign scorpion.

and please don't cry, tears make it hard to read the game. If you were town, you wouldn't make a problem of giving your opinions.

[XScorpion]

IF he quickhammered, would you have voted him tomorrow?

And Robo flipped town? Yes.

and please don't cry, tears make it hard to read the game. If you were town, you wouldn't make a problem of giving your opinions.

Well you seem to be convinced I'm scum, why do you care if I cry or not?
It's kind of hard to give my own opinions when people have already told me what they are.

[AurorusVox]

IF he quickhammered, would you have voted him tomorrow?

And Robo flipped town? Yes.

Then your threat was serious.

[XScorpion]

Then your threat was serious.

I'm of the opinion that he would only have quickhammered if he was scum.

[Robocopter87]

Too much WIFOM in that. He knows that you know that he is scum if he quickhammered.

[XScorpion]

That's why he wouldn't do it.
Derp.

[AurorusVox]

Then your threat was serious.

I'm of the opinion that he would only have quickhammered if he was scum.

Do you deny that the threat was serious?

Also, Budja has said that he wouldn't care if anyone hammered on Robocopter. Do you think he's scum for not caring if someone quickhammered? I mean, he basically gave the quickhammer the go-ahead. It's saying, "If I were in that situation, I wouldn't mind (quick)hammering." But you've not issued a similar threat to Budja, despite him putting Robocopter at L-1?

[XScorpion]

Do you deny that the threat was serious?

If he quickhammered, I would vote him on the next day. Is this too complicated for you to understand?

Do you think he's scum for not caring if someone quickhammered?

No.

[AurorusVox]

Do you deny that the threat was serious?

If he quickhammered, I would vote him on the next day. Is this too complicated for you to understand?

You're the one that doesn't understand.

I know that you say you would have voted him the next day. Because of that fact, I proposed that your threat was serious. I wanted you to give me a yes or no answer as to whether you agree to my proposal, because you deny having played seriously in this game so far.

Hence my question; "do you deny that the threat was serious?" But I'm no longer interested in your answer. As far as I can tell,

Either you lied and have played seriously.
In which case, why lie, scum?

Or you lied and your threat wasn't serious.
In which case, why lie, scum?

[XScorpion]

You don't even want to hear the possibility that I'm town anymore so I'm not going to waste my time.

[AurorusVox]

You don't even want to hear the possibility that I'm town anymore so I'm not going to waste my time.

You can accuse me of tunnelling all you like, but you've tried to dodge my questions, and that doesn't look like something a town aligned player would do. Perhaps if you spent your time actually answering my questions rather than avoiding them, I might consider you being town, and it wouldn't be a "waste". But I'll follow my other questions for a while since you clearly aren't interested in them anyway.

---

A good question. I know that it would narrow down the town, but just by one, the way I figured it, Cop can confirm someone as scum. Then you could get a scum lynch without a problem. I don't care if you lynch me. But, I am NOT self voting/hammering. Won't do it.

That relies on a series of particular events - cop investigating a mafia, mafia not killing the cop, cop not being counterclaimed, etc, etc. Also, even assuming that everything goes according to your plan, you'd end up in 3-man lylo with no clears. Do you feel that such a situation, even the "best case scenario", is worth losing a townie over, considering we could instead lynch scum today? Or are you just trying to look like you'd bravely offer up yourself for the good of the town (I'm not sure I'd even agree that it's that much in the favour of the town)?

But I'm glad you won't self vote.

[XScorpion]

Perhaps if you spent your time actually answering my questions rather than avoiding them, I might consider you being town, and it wouldn't be a "waste".

Perhaps, but I don't think it's worth my time to try to have a small chance at changing your mind. Seeing as how we seem to be playing the same way in both games right now, I'm not particularly surprised how things are turning out.

[Robocopter87]

This is extremely obnoxious to listen to. Aurorus, I understand what you are saying I agree with you. but stop fighting with him. He isn't going to stop.

[AurorusVox]

This is extremely obnoxious to listen to. Aurorus, I understand what you are saying I agree with you. but stop fighting with him. He isn't going to stop.

Yes, well, I've decided to focus on questioning other players for now :\