Mini 1117 - Manhattan Special - [GAME OVER]

[GreyICE]

Well, first as people have noted, I'm not a fan of the RVS stage. I'm especially not fond of it because scum have the ability to night talk before it, and now can predict things and act in ways that allow them to maneuver through reasonably easily. Because day 1 is the most unpredictable time for scum (they gain more control after this with NK) I figured I'd end the RVS, and see how wagons come together.

Second, Pergol has the least experience. He's the most likely to pull a "no you weren't!" slip, so if I was going to do it, it would be him. Also, I want a goddamn read on Pergol. He likes to lurk. Figured this would force him to post. No luck, and honestly looks like the game is getting a replacement there.

I'm honestly shocked that no one is even listening to Emp. I'm obviously ignoring this thread. There's no point in seeing how a wagon comes together if you get in the middle disrupting things. What would be the point if I started spamming the thread immediately? But everyone dismissed him out of hand. Goddamn why? Doesn't even make any sense.

Finally, there's like more penis measuring contests in this thread than I feel comfortable reading through. A few more and this thread could qualify as gay porn.

Now, who is the scummiest? Well, Longing could be buddying me (why would he think I'm town? Why defend me?). But Shado isn't only buddying me, he's doing nothing to actively scumhunt, and complaining about the accusations flying around.

Unvote: Pergol

(unless he doesn't replace out. SOOOOO Putting that right back if he does post here)

Vote: ShadoWolf

What makes you so uncomfortable with accusations, Shado? Scared they have substance in them when they're directed at you?

[ShadoWolf]

Doh. I just realized that I didnt mean Midnight. He hasnt done anything yet except for some random vote.

The scum is Shadow. He is here, but not really here. Like he is making his appearance known but not contributing anything of substance. All I see from him are small one liners criticizing people and not being all that pertinent. That has to be the scummiest type of behavior.

It's difficult to contribute something of substance amongst all the bullshit daddy issues in this thread. However, just as a special favour to you, I'll try to up my content-o-meter. My sincerest apologies.

What makes you so uncomfortable with accusations, Shado? Scared they have substance in them when they're directed at you?

They don't make me uncomfortable, I just think the accusations levelled were brought up too early in the game.

[el simo]

Read back posts 9, 12 and 20.

9 states my observations
12 states shadow's observations
20 states how I call shadow's observations "parroting me" (because he mentions exactly the same two facts i mentioned)

You've split my mind now.

On one hand you see someone parroting (personally I don't think it was a parrot but that is irrelevant) and you make it heard - which would seemingly disprove my point.

But on the other hand you do the same thing you were guilty of doing with IS and that is flinging mud, you claim he is parroting but leave it at that, you make no implications as to what this means about his alignment (ie is it scummy).

Unvote

for now. I need to get a meta on you or something.

Grey's action mark him clearly scum due to there not being any pro-town natureto his actions. That means hecan't defend himself without resorting to WIFOM. That's not fair!

That is a fair enough statement but to believe it to be true after two posts and one day, it's a stretch imo.

[Substrike22]

I will write my two main points on Substrike for him to answer in a less funny way.
Question 1

a) He dedicates 10 lines to criticize Internet Stranger and Empking for their votes on Grey. He even finds suspicious some of these attacks.
b) He finds scummy and votes for the only player "defending" Grey.

How are a) and b) compatible in your scumhunting?

Question 2

a) He says that he does not understand my issues with IS
b) Critizicing and voting for Shadow he says that there are clear flaws in IS that I am pointing out
c) Later he says we are point out to different flaws

How are b) and c) compatible with a) ?

Q1) I voted for EMPKing about 15 seconds later. Check the post times if you don't believe me. I realized that I found EMP scummier than Shadow at the time and changed my vote accordingly.

Q2) We had two different arguments on IS, I didn't understand yours. I asked you to clarify. That's all. For point "b", see my above answer.

UNVOTE: MS

Lurker can wait.

VOTE: EMPKing

Post 98 he hops on the popular wagon without giving a reason. I'm just getting scum vibes. Most of his arguments on p4 is regarding WIFOM stuff, not really much to do with the game. And El Simo was right, that was WIFOM. EMP is trying to push the wagon anywhere but himself, for any reason.

[CrazyQuestions]

But on the other hand you do the same thing you were guilty of doing with IS and that is flinging mud, you claim he is parroting but leave it at that, you make no implications as to what this means about his alignment (ie is it scummy).

You are not making implications as to what my second flinging mud means about my alignment.

I obviously disagree that I made any flinging mud. The word "parrot" is as clear as the word "flinging mud". In any case, I did not find his parroting especially important, since some people tend to misunderstand or not even read some of my messages. Since his vote on me seemed to be a joke/random, I did not pay more attention to it.

I need to get a meta on you or something.

You do not need it. You made a mistake (assuming you did not understand my post) calling me on flinging mud. After my explanation, you had to rationalize your past mistaken accusation so you have come with a ridiculous argument. It is so weak that you even retreat politely saying that you need a meta...

[el simo]

But on the other hand you do the same thing you were guilty of doing with IS and that is flinging mud, you claim he is parroting but leave it at that, you make no implications as to what this means about his alignment (ie is it scummy).

You are not making implications as to what my second flinging mud means about my alignment.

I obviously disagree that I made any flinging mud. The word "parrot" is as clear as the word "flinging mud". In any case, I did not find his parroting especially important, since some people tend to misunderstand or not even read some of my messages. Since his vote on me seemed to be a joke/random, I did not pay more attention to it.

Difference being I voted you and said your actions were scummy, and continued to pursue your case. Where as you made the comment and left it that.

I need to get a meta on you or something.

You do not need it. You made a mistake (assuming you did not understand my post) calling me on flinging mud. After my explanation, you had to rationalize your past mistaken accusation so you have come with a ridiculous argument. It is so weak that you even retreat politely saying that you need a meta...

No I didn't because you made the exact same tell, reason why I need a meta is to confirm whether you play like this normally or if I have two damning tells on you or not.

[CrazyQuestions]

Your opinion is noted, but you started this episode so biased that no matter your alignment, it is not going to affect my view.

(personally I don't think it was a parrot but that is irrelevant)

1

post

2 times calling

dumb

or similar to grey
3

reasons

for his vote !!

Doesn't mean you can push a BW

on someone who clearly made 2 RVS posts

.

Calling his posts dumb

isn't a great move, either, as they were RVS posts. The

fact you needed reasons

for a vote in RVS is also suspect, but forgiveable for now.

[el simo]

How am I biased? I saw a scum tell and attacked you for it. Why does this make me biased? How am I being prejudice? That is a silly notion.

---

Ah right I get the parrot now, I didn't understand how you used the numbers in that post. I thought they were dictating how many reasons you have to believe IS was curious, as in the first reason is post the second reason is times calling dumb and third reason is reaons for his vote <- which was completely illegible. But it makes sense now.

[CrazyQuestions]

Question 1

Q1) I voted for EMPKing about 15 seconds later. Check the post times if you don't believe me. I realized that I found EMP scummier than Shadow at the time and changed my vote accordingly.

Allow me to ask how your mind decided to vote for Empking in 15 seconds, since 15 seconds before you said:

Personally I'm finding your play just as suspect as Shadow's right now

---

Question 2

Q2) We had two different arguments on IS,

I didn't understand yours

. I asked you to clarify.

That's all

. For point "b", see my above answer.

This is NOT all.

If you did not understand my questions, how the hell would you say in the same post:

there are

clear flaws in IS' post

,

which Crazy is actually pointing out

If you did not understand my questions, how the hell would you know our reasons were VERY DIFFERENT?

Crazy you and I find IS's post "curious" for two very different reasons.

.

[GreyICE]

To derail this debate, what does everyone think about lynching lurkers? Because...

Unvote

Vote: Saporovirus

[CrazyQuestions]

How am I biased? I saw a scum tell and attacked you for it. Why does this make me biased? How am I being prejudice? That is a silly notion.

I proved you that I both noted the behavior of IS and Shadow. The parroting was noted by me, and it was a very minor issue to me since he had not been inconsistent voting me (seemed a fun vote). The behavior of IS was noted by me, and I have been following the story later. You can read the daddy-son story. There is not any mud at all. If you want a wall of quotes to see it, I will do it, at the cost of making people tired of me.

POST 11

"Strange" phenomenon updated. The regularity remains...

4 serious words consecutively used in a post: (rid, quick, lynch, scum)

POST 20

I assume that (you parroting me) + (you voting for me) implies that your vote is random

Read the four consecutive rhetoric questions of Internet Stranger. Introducing such four serious words after a random vote by Grey is kinda a curious phenomenon.

[quote="substrike]
Personally I'm finding your (EMPKING) play just as suspect as Shadow's right now.

You STOLE my words !!!
However, I will avoid using them, because: (i) in my case, YOUR refers to substrike instead of empking, and that might create confusion in the audience and (ii) I like slow play and I would not use the word suspect for these episodes...
[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

Again, you just totally biased by your first impression when you had not even understood my messages. I doubt you understood the message on "the four words". And I also doubt you understood my sentence on the stolen words with substrike...and hence, you better ask someone to explain to you...

[TheLonging]

Well, Longing could be buddying me (why would he think I'm town? Why defend me?)

I called you town? And I don't think you realize how retarded Emp's point was anyways

unvote
FoS: ShadoWolf

for the record, I'm thinking more along the lines of meta as well, Empking bothers me more.

[CrazyQuestions]

...words...

Snif Snif, you forgot me. No need to tell me why, but you can do it after answering me what you have avoided, i.e., why you found me scummy first.

[Empking]

To derail this debate, what does everyone think about lynching lurkers? Because...

Unvote

Vote: Saporovirus

Or we can lynch scum.

Post 98 he hops on the popular wagon without giving a reason. I'm just getting scum vibes. Most of his arguments on p4 is regarding WIFOM stuff, not really much to do with the game. And El Simo was right, that was WIFOM. EMP is trying to push the wagon anywhere but himself, for any reason.

Do I need to explain why this post is bull?

1. One other vote is not a "popular wagon".
2. I've beren clalling Shado scum since Day 1. No small minority of posts have been giving reason for my voting Shado.
3. "Most of his arguments on p4 is regarding WIFOM stuff," - This is simply not true.
4. "that was WIFOM" - No it wasn't. Please provide evidence for this statement.
5. El Simo admitted he was spouting nonsense when he called it WIFOM originally (Though it was masked in a rather defensive, aggresive tone.)
6. "EMP is trying to push the wagon anywhere but himself, for any reason." - This is clearly nonsense because
a) if I was moving the wagon to anyone I wouldf've joined Crazy's.
b) I've been calling Shado scum since page 1.

Do I need to explain why this post is scummy?

1. Its bull.
2. Its doing a chainsaw defence of a player that we scumhunters have already noted a connection between on page 1.
3. Its hopping onto the largest wagon.
4. Its hopping on the largest wagon for the sole reason to keep Shado from getting up.

[Internet Stranger]

This Shado as scum idea is looking better and better. I still want partial credit for this scum lynching though, Emp.
At this point, his scum buddies hould be scurrying away like rats. I just hope that they get brave and surface themselves now.

[CrazyQuestions]

@Substrike:

Trying to understand what the hell Empking and IS are talking about, I realized that you do not need to answer my Q1. You already did with your previous answer.
Q2 is there for you to answer.

[el simo]

How am I biased? I saw a scum tell and attacked you for it. Why does this make me biased? How am I being prejudice? That is a silly notion.

I proved you that I both noted the behavior of IS and Shadow. The parroting was noted by me, and it was a very minor issue to me since he had not been inconsistent voting me (seemed a fun vote). The behavior of IS was noted by me, and I have been following the story later. You can read the daddy-son story. There is not any mud at all. If you want a wall of quotes to see it, I will do it, at the cost of making people tired of me.

POST 11

"Strange" phenomenon updated. The regularity remains...

4 serious words consecutively used in a post: (rid, quick, lynch, scum)

POST 20

I assume that (you parroting me) + (you voting for me) implies that your vote is random

Read the four consecutive rhetoric questions of Internet Stranger. Introducing such four serious words after a random vote by Grey is kinda a curious phenomenon.

[quote="substrike]
Personally I'm finding your (EMPKING) play just as suspect as Shadow's right now.

You STOLE my words !!!
However, I will avoid using them, because: (i) in my case, YOUR refers to substrike instead of empking, and that might create confusion in the audience and (ii) I like slow play and I would not use the word suspect for these episodes...

[/quote][/quote]

Again, you just totally biased by your first impression when you had not even understood my messages. I doubt you understood the message on "the four words". And I also doubt you understood my sentence on the stolen words with substrike...and hence, you better ask someone to explain to you...[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

You never said he was scummy or voted him once in these quotes. This was my original point, nothing you have said has changed this, you made these statements but did nothing with them, you were just throwing them up in the air. You didn't FoS or say these things made him scummy or vote him or nothing, you just said them, this is scummy because its bait for town to use with out you getting yourself dirty after a possible lynch.

His parroting hasn't changed this because after you called him out for parroting, again you did nothing with it, you just left it, you never said it was scummy or that you were suspicious of him nor did vote him, you just said it. This is why I unvoted, to check a meta, to find out if this is your normal play, to see if you are always this purposely vague or if it's just you being bad scum.

I will comment on the other discussions in short time.

[el simo]

To derail this debate, what does everyone think about lynching lurkers? Because...

Unvote

Vote: Saporovirus

Or we can lynch scum.

I never saw this post by Grey until Emp quoted it, and I don't like it one bit. There is a lot of discussion going on, there is no need for us to halt everything and vote lurkers at this point in time, all it will do is stifle discussion and make this game inactive.

This looks like typical scum trying to be pro town.

vote: GreyICE

Still going to comment on other discussion gimme a sec.

[TheLonging]

...words...

Snif Snif, you forgot me. No need to tell me why, but you can do it after answering me what you have avoided, i.e., why you found me scummy first.

I'm sorry I missed your question. What was it?

[GreyICE]

To derail this debate, what does everyone think about lynching lurkers? Because...

Unvote

Vote: Saporovirus

Or we can lynch scum.

I never saw this post by Grey until Emp quoted it, and I don't like it one bit. There is a lot of discussion going on, there is no need for us to halt everything and vote lurkers at this point in time, all it will do is stifle discussion and make this game inactive.

This looks like typical scum trying to be pro town.

vote: GreyICE

Still going to comment on other discussion gimme a sec.

Oh FFS there's so many people involved in that dick measuring contest that if they were all scum we'd be in LyLo right now.

I'm tired of towns that fight with eachother and let people slide with a single line "oh hai gaiz chekin
in bbl" for pages and pages and pages.

Then it turns out they've been NKing everyone and sliding because they're 'really busy.'

I'm not going to let lurkers lurk our town into the ground, and I've already stated the other major sinner I'm 95% on replacing out.

[Internet Stranger]

Then take that up with the mod. Dont punish us with scummy play.

[GreyICE]

Then take that up with the mod. Dont punish us with scummy play.

That's really fucking rich coming from you.

[Erratus Apathos]

UNVOTE: ShadoWolf
VOTE: Internet Stranger

Any reason you're ignoring me?

What a surprise. He did it again.

I want to see some votes on IS and I want to see them

now

.

[el simo]

So scum hunting is a dick measuring contest and lurker voting is pro town, have I got it right Grey?

[el simo]

And if we're measuring dicks, IS has the biggest, he registered four years before me and 6 - 8 years before the rest of you.

This means I have the second biggest, just how the ladies like it.