There Will Be Bloodshed (Game Over)

[evilpacman18]

Vote: evilpacman18

He's clearly evil. It's in his name.

Oh man. I've never heard that one before.

[Calcifer]

VOTE: ConfidAnon
For killing me in NY 118.

Vote: evilpacman18

He's clearly evil. It's in his name.

Oh man. I've never heard that one before.

Is that all you two have to say?!?

[Parama]

Calcifer, explain each of those reads in detail, because right now I'm really liking my vote as more than RVS.

[DLG]

I'm brash and aggressive, and like to challenge everyone, a few people at a time. So don't be surprised if I suddenly launch into a detailed analysis of your actions so far and read entirely too deeply into them.

Bugs me not to know which pronoun to use.

Clearly, you didn't see Black Swan.

If you're going to sell yourself as hyperTownie, I'd expect the unrelated fluff-n-stuff to disappear. Is anything grabbing your attention, yet?

@Empking and Calcifer
You both have Friend in your sights already, but aren't providing any reasons. Please do so.

Preview edit: Similar thought here, Parama.

@ evilpacman18
So, ConfidAnon's joke was trite. Do you have anything other than hypersensitivity to a random vote on you to offer?

UNVOTE: TwoHeadedBoy

No need for a random vote when things are picking up already.

[Calcifer]

Moving Pine to my suspicion list for the moment after DLG's post, combined with something else. Near the bottom of the suspicion list, though.

Calcifer, explain each of those reads in detail, because right now I'm really liking my vote as more than RVS.

Hint: it's in the votes. See if you can figure it out yourself.

I'm fully capable of explaining the reads in detail, but feel it'd be anti-town to do so at this moment.

[Pine]

Calcifer, explain each of those reads in detail, because right now I'm really liking my vote as more than RVS.

I'll let Nacho handle the RVS. My RVS antics are...less than appreciated.

Personally, I'm chalking it up to the second quote, for now.

@Calcifer: Thanks for the offer of instruction, but no thanks. I'm savvy enough not to fall into the trap of someone I'm looking hard at as scum. I've pulled that trick in far too many games with novice players while playing as Mafia. Bring them under your wing, gain an ally, give them genuinely good advice, and subconsciously, they'll never suspect you. It also works wonders in cutthroat strategy games, like Risk. Play your opponents against each other while portraying the voice of wisdom, let them bleed each other dry, and sweep them all up when they're spread thin. Same principle applies here; I'm not going to let anyone manipulate my strategy or vote, even subliminally. But thanks for the thought, if you are Town.

Note that that's not a FOS, per se, just wariness. We can talk after this game about our apparently-similar styles.

I'll post in greater detail later. Busy day, even if it is a snow day on spring break. (The video games, they call to me.)

Preview edit @DLG. When I wrote the "fluff and stuff" post, it was going to be only the second player post. And as I've previously stated, I'm not actually a fan of RVS, preferring instead the Q&A or tell-me-about-yourself stuff. Further, I'm a new player in a game of, as far as I can tell, people who largely have a history. I felt an introduction was warranted, in the spirit of laying all of one's cards on the table. And at that time, there was really nothing to challenge or pick apart. In a few hours, around dinner time or so, I intend to sit down and cut apart what's happened so far. The other two posts fall into a similar category-nothing really significant to look at yet. The pronoun thing is actually pertinent (in my opinion,) as, if you haven't noticed, I'm a bit of a stickler for spelling, grammar, and clarity, though I have rarely been accused of being concise. And honestly, Black Swan was the best movie I'd seen all year. I check threads near-constantly, as is the wont of a student with a smart phone and perpetual internet access. Most of those posts, however, are meant to be asides, where ones like this are when I've actually sat down with my computer to type out something. Paragraphs on a smart phone are hard to do and...damn I've rambled a lot. Mostly off-topic, which I suppose actually strengthens your point.

TL;DR-I have ADHD, and check posts a lot. Long posts like this will be common, but also expect short comments on what people have said. The long posts are the serious ones, short posts are generally made from my phone and not intended to be significant.

Preview edit #2: Dammit, I need to write shorter posts. Got ninja'd twice in what was intended to be a brief check-in. Yes, this was relatively brief compared to what you may see later. Apologies in advance for walls of text, I like to ramble. I'll post TL;DR summaries when it occurs to me to do so.

[Calcifer]

Personally, I'm chalking it up to the second quote, for now.

Nah. This is actually a far more productive tactic in the RVS than normal. If you ever get a chance to play with Haylen...well--assuming she still does it--her preferred RVS tactic outside of Newbie Games, she got from me.

Spoiler: Ramble to Pine

Bring them under your wing, gain an ally, give them genuinely good advice, and subconsciously, they'll never suspect you.

I do think of this when I'm scum, but I do it regardless of alignment. If you see a player you can help, then help 'em. As scum, I have the side-thought, "...and then they'll help you, too, later. ". But it really is a side-thought. DLG and my other half were in my first Newbie Game since my return to the site--and they know better than anyone else how I teach far better than I actually play. (Well, play as scum. It seems like I play better as town than I do to teach. ) The advice is advice which I find helpful, so I give it. My alignment has no influence on the advice I'd give.

Same principle applies here; I'm not going to let anyone manipulate my strategy or vote, even subliminally.

Fair warning--I've tried this before; it doesn't work. In fact, when I tried to make sure nobody would manipulate my strategy or vote, it had the OPPOSITE effect, and I was completely and totally fooled, manipulated masterfully. In my effort to consciously try and avoid manipulation, my paranoia ended up making me extremely vulnerable to manipulation. It might end up differently for you, but I doubt it. I've seen others try this, too, and they were manipulated.

No matter what, you'll always be manipulated by SOMEONE. But it seems like in the effort required to try and prevent this, you ironically end up amplifying it. I don't know why. If I delved into the subject, I'm sure I could figure it out. It's just been something I've observed to be true in my time. I hope it works for you better than it worked for me, or those I observed taking a similar route.

But thanks for the thought, if you are Town.

I'd prefer you thank me for the thought regardless of my alignment. Like I mentioned, I take pride in my capability to teach, even if I'm not the best of all players. But, eh, I'm rambling, so I'll stop myself.

Pine's been moved off the suspicion list; I find that reply more than adequate. See if you can get into the town, half, Pine, when you post your thoughts. Will wait for them eagerly.

[Empking]

You both have Friend in your sights already, but aren't providing any reasons. Please do so.

My reasoning was given. Friend is trying to look town.

[evilpacman18]

VOTE: ConfidAnon
For killing me in NY 118.

Vote: evilpacman18

He's clearly evil. It's in his name.

Oh man. I've never heard that one before.

Is that all you two have to say?!?

Yes. For me at least. I don't believe in reading into RVS votes as much as you.

[Calcifer]

Yes. For me at least. I don't believe in reading into RVS votes as much as you.

We (well, Nacho--I helped! ) caught you last game from them, did we not?

[evilpacman18]

Yes. For me at least. I don't believe in reading into RVS votes as much as you.

We (well, Nacho--I helped! ) caught you last game from them, did we not?

I would have made the same opening post as town but I panicked when you took it the way you did and screwed up on DH's question.

[GreyICE]

OOH, RQS:

Whose hitting "show" on the mastwalls?

Kidding, kidding, interesting stuff in there. Anyway, I wanted to say that I'm hard to manipulate, but no one is totally manipulation proof.

P.S. Mastin, I have no meta. Good luck!

P.P.S. If that was a short wall from Pine, I say we report him to the moderator, Mastin is running two accounts. My god man, take a minute or two and edit your post down into something that makes sense. I've been diagnosed with ADD, that doesn't mean you have to inflict rambling wallposts on the world

Anyway, I'll just

Vote: No Lynch

because I've done it a few times and Mastin is metaing me, so he should see that I'm town when I do it

Or I'm just softclaiming 'fucking with his head.'

[GreyICE]

By the way, as soon as it gets approved, I'll probably be replaced by a hydra of Katsuki and me. It's currently sitting in the approval queue.

[Calcifer]

Yes. For me at least. I don't believe in reading into RVS votes as much as you.

We (well, Nacho--I helped! ) caught you last game from them, did we not?

I would have made the same opening post as town but I panicked when you took it the way you did and screwed up on DH's question.

And that still counted, didn't it? Opening post, sure, same as town. Immediately after that, not so much.

P.P.S. If that was a short wall from Pine, I say we report him to the moderator, Mastin is running two accounts.

The thought had crossed my mind that Pine is eerily similar to myself. One of the reasons I want to warn him, too. The closer they are to me, the more warning I have to give to them to avert my path.

GreyICE, meta'ing is not an all-powerful tool. I would not use it to determine instantly if someone is town or scum. It is a general "get a feel for players"-type thing. I might meta people later-on in more detail, but early-game meta is just to get a general feeling for players' styles, not an indicator of alignment.

[GreyICE]

Oh good

I've tried the entire 'meta lynch' thing, and I found that I was really good at lynching town when I used it, and really good at lynching scum when I trusted what I was reading in the game thread and learned people's personalities

Not that Papa Zito doesn't have some words for me about that...

TBH not getting a scum vibe from anyone posting yet. Dun worry, there's still time for EMPScum to out himself to my satisfaction

[silverbullet999]

Well my retirement is postponed... andd....
so many people i know... this is gonna be chaotic woo!

VOTE: Agar

cause he became a fun loving zombie last we played if memory serves me right?

-Pine

I'll post TL;DR summaries when it occurs to me to do so.

Good boy!

[Calcifer]

Let's see where this gets us.

Vote: GreyICE

.

[Pine]

Pine, why don't you like random voting stages when you're implying that you can gain information out of these "not-so-innocent" votes?

I think I missed this, and just now caught it as I went through to do the aforementioned detailed analysis. I don't like

truly

random voting because I feel it is pointless and misleading. Instead of providing useful information, as my first post attempted to do, it instead allows scum a chance to use the excuse of random voting as a shield to hide their first mistake behind. I would rather have the first round of posts be introductions and announcement of play styles, as I did. This provides some solid information that can be fact-checked against the player's history where applicable (i.e. go to my Newbie thread, you'll see the same play style there, and same on the Myth-weavers.com Game 4A, wherein I was a Cop.)

I'll let Nacho handle the RVS. My RVS antics are...less than appreciated.

Let's see where this gets us.

Vote: GreyICE.

These seem not to match up, Calcifer. Care to explain?
Preview Edit: It occurred to me that this might have been Nachomamma finally making himself known on the Calcifer Hydra. Challenge not retracted, however, as with a hydra, I feel it is easy to pass little mistakes off as the fault of the other head. Explain, please.
----End of Page One----

I'm fully capable of explaining the reads in detail, but feel it'd be anti-town to do so at this moment.

In what way is explaining suspicions anti-Town? If they're genuine and well-founded, then by all means share your reasons. If they aren't founded in some sort of reasoning, then making that list was a rather scummy thing to do. In my book, pointing fingers without explanation is a scum tactic. For that matter, asserting that an individual is Town or probably Town without backing it up, or defending anyone without obvious reasons this early in the game, is just as suspicious.

You both have Friend in your sights already, but aren't providing any reasons. Please do so.

My reasoning was given. Friend is trying to look town.

Vote; Friend

- Trying to get C-Worl to have an avvatar. Not completely random.

That's your reason? Among the few things more suspicious than pointing fingers without good reason at this stage of the game is pointing fingers without good reason, and standing by those inadequate reasons. If this were a later Day Phase, I'd think you might be a cop with a guilty result and an inept way of going about executing it. But it's Day One. Provide a good reason. There's no 'or unvote' attached to that, by the way, it's hard to believe that someone would stick to an RVS vote without a reason, and I would like to hear yours.

P.P.S. If that was a short wall from Pine, I say we report him to the moderator, Mastin is running two accounts. My god man, take a minute or two and edit your post down into something that makes sense. I've been diagnosed with ADD, that doesn't mean you have to inflict rambling wallposts on the world

I am not Mastin. Correlation does not imply causality.

Anyway, I'll just Vote: No Lynch because I've done it a few times and Mastin is metaing me, so he should see that I'm town when I do it

As much as I can understand fucking with someone's head, a No Lynch vote is just...I'm not sure there's a good word for it. Given the explanation, I'm inclined to not think it as scummy as I would otherwise, but...No Lynch isn't a good thing for Town.

I'll post TL;DR summaries when it occurs to me to do so.

Good boy!

I am not your dog. You may be confusing the wolf pup in your avatar with me. Additionally, I may be new to these boards, but I don't appreciate being talked down to.

I think that's all for now. Posts, votes, and discussions not critically assessed were deemed either empty, pointless, or already-addressed. Please note again my distaste for genuinely random voting. Also, if I have yet to comment on you, it is probably because I don't feel your posts thus far were noteworthy. Please contribute. It is only through analysis and discussion that the Town can reliably root out filth, and if you don't participate, you're not helping us towards our WinCon. And only ~1/3 of us want that, and I think you know which third I mean.

--------
Sorry folks, no TL;DR summary. In-depth analyses like this rarely will contain them, because a full enumeration of the points for and against those involved is more-or-less the point.

[Jerbs]

Vote: Pine

He's scum

[Pine]

...I am stunned and impressed by your concise and well-considered post, Jerbs. Bravo.

[Parama]

Pine, your walls will not be read by me. Just FYI.

[Friend]

But Pine, none of these votes are truly random - you're making a conscious decision to vote who you want to vote for.

Pine definitely seems like he's trying too hard (and I concur with the lack of wall-reading). That sarcastic response wasn't good either.

DLG does too but I've played with him before and that might just be his meta. I just think it's hypocritical to call people out for not offering anything when all he's done is tell people to offer things.

[GreyICE]

They're horrifically pointless too.

It kinda reminds me of MoI's scum games, where he posts these long meandering quote walls that just don't get anywhere. Pine, however, seems to put some thought into them sorta, while MoI is just like "quote, question, quote, question" for 4 billion lines (I stand by the fact that he EARNED the nickname I gave him).

Pine, please try and trim them down. They're less 'your thoughts' and more IoA. No IoA, more thoughts about other players. NOW.

@Calcifer: My first vote! Lets wagon!

[silverbullet999]

-Pine

I am not your dog. You may be confusing the wolf pup in your avatar with me. Additionally, I may be new to these boards, but I don't appreciate being talked down to.

Your sensitivity is as fragile as the leaves of a pine tree...
the good boy was not meant as an insult... i'll rephrase it to... good "insert whatever you like in a noninsulting manner here"

I'll read what you post to me... and your TLDR's... but that's about it.

[Cookie_of_Death]

I'm brash and aggressive, and like to challenge everyone, a few people at a time. So don't be surprised if I suddenly launch into a detailed analysis of your actions so far and read entirely too deeply into them.

Bugs me not to know which pronoun to use.

Clearly, you didn't see Black Swan.

If you're going to sell yourself as hyperTownie, I'd expect the unrelated fluff-n-stuff to disappear. Is anything grabbing your attention, yet?

@Empking and Calcifer
You both have Friend in your sights already, but aren't providing any reasons. Please do so.

Preview edit: Similar thought here, Parama.

@ evilpacman18
So, ConfidAnon's joke was trite. Do you have anything other than hypersensitivity to a random vote on you to offer?

UNVOTE: TwoHeadedBoy

No need for a random vote when things are picking up already.

Something's off about this post. It tries to "get serious" but kind of fails in that:
a) it nitpicks at Pine
b) it fails to note or question the ton of other "reads" Mastin dished out (he also doesn't realize the futility of questioning empking, but that's not a scumtell)

Vote: Pine

He's scum

I don't like this post.

It smells funny.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jerbs