Newbie 2119: Pictures of People Wearing Cool Hats | GAME OVER

[Black]

Hello everyone! It is I, your honorable Scum Queen and I hereby claim the second post of the game and announce that I unfortunately have received a green PM

VOTE: Delta

[Black]

Kawaii you seem to be a bit lurk-ey in playstyle but I hope we get chances to interact this game

Kawaii is generally pretty active but the past week or so it seems like he's fallen off a cliff

[Black]

Welp, pack it up guys. We'll try again next page

[Black]

Maybe on page 2

[Black]

I will be...

[Black]

TOWNREAD

[Black]

Page 2 is when I really start to hit my stride tbh

[Black]

therefore you are confirmed mafia rolecop.
Just kidding, there's no mafia roleblocker in this setup.

What?

[Black]

For real though I don't think I like this entrance by Black so my RVS vote has turned semi-serious.

What don't you like about my entrance?

[Black]

hey patches!

[Black]

It upsets me how many people want to play scum lol

Give me town every day of the

game

week

Ew town roles are being

[Black]

Boring* thank you mobile

[Black]

1 - Timezone?
2 - Prior experience with mafia + games?
3 - Favorite alignment to play and why?

1. Central US
2. Played like 15 years ago when I was a kid and I've played about 5 or 6 since joining MS in January
3. Mafia of course. I'm the Scum Queen. I enjoy lying and manipulating what can I say?? Also I suck at town too. I have poop reads and I can't really figure out wolf motivations for things. Oh and I tend to tunnel as town and once I get going on that everything you do will seem scummy to me. I hate it

[Black]

Nothing from Dragon on page 1 screams town to me tbh

[Black]

It struck me all as proactive where I feel like a scum player might be more comfortable sitting in the back engaging in RVS humour and not drawing focus to themselves.

Not me as a scum player. I will try to act as proactive as possible because that's what townies should do and I'm sure good scum players also adopt this technique. The question is...is Dragon a good scum player?

[Black]

@Dragon how would you classify your own wolf game and have you been wolf on this site before?

[Black]

we should play more games together so we can roll scum together sometime. that'd be great

You know I'm down for this

[Black]

Trying to get townread without doing anything townie

Oh so you don't like my jokes? I don't need to try to get townread, it just happens naturally regardless of what my alignment is

[Black]

Tbh I was highkey hoping to roll scum with you so you could teach me the trade secrets

My techniques are littered all throughout the Road to Rome, just requires a little light reading and then YOU can be scum royalty too!

[Black]

black i vividly remember 2113 and you were like there and barely contributing (it looked like you were) and everyone believed you were town. you're that good

You must not have that vivid of a memory because I had like 300 posts that game lol

BBT however just lurked the entire game and only came around to hammer people and y'all were like "this guy is definitely town" XD

[Black]

Actually patches I think you were the only one that suspected BBT iirc

[Black]

they**

I don't read newbie games I'm not in but maybe I should start. I don't know like half this playerlist but I do recognize some names

[Black]

VOTE: Kawaii

Get in here the party is starting without you

[Black]

You weren't really doing much though iirc. You definitely got quite a few policy reads earlygame I think, you weren't making many strong pushes that I can remember asides from empath (and that's because we went on and on about empath for a good forty pages)... So yeah, not much

Ok that's fair but I still did more than you

WAIT SHEA IS MODDING THIS GAME

YES and that's part of the reason I joined this one. That and the playerlist looked dope af

[Black]

My professions include IT sales and Tunnelling Scum!Black but not having the conviction to see it through.

I am DEAD over here XD

[Black]

Let's make a truce not to tunnel each other all game Delta

*spits in hand*

[Black]

Dragons play is weird

Can you elaborate on this?

[Black]

Honestly not until I'm more lucid. Just on a skim I was like 'huh that's a bit silly and goofy'

That's fair. Now go get some rest, I promise we won't lim anyone until you get back

[Black]

@Dragon rude of you to not throw my like 2 serious posts in that list

[Black]

Do you mean 65 and 66?

39 and 63 too

G'nite!

[Black]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

I'm confused what this is in response to

[Black]

Also it's not hard for a wolf to lack conviction in their reads. It actually seems pretty common for wolves to ride the fence because it makes it easier for them to flip flop later

[Black]

I'm also confused about what this is in response to.

It seemed like Bella was saying wolves aren't likely to vote based off weak reasoning and I disagree

I've been staring at Bella's comment for like an hour trying to figure it out. I'm not sure who she's talking to or what she's talking about and I'm really not sure what she's talking about re: town!Bella

[Black]

Dragon this seems a bit like an overreaction from you but idk if it's AI or not

[Black]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

Hmmm. If it is a PT slip then the first half of Bella's comment is them referring to their Venmar vote

Yeah I think we should pressure this

VOTE: Bella

[Black]

I agree Venmar. I'm not liking the content from Bella so far. Seems weird for them to say Dragon is "townie af" based on page 1 posts that are pretty non-alignment indicative IMO. Could be an attempt to pocket Dragon

[Black]

Also not hard evidence but if that was a scum slip then I think in terms of linking to a partner, Delta would be my top pick atm due to timing and the topic.

I think it could be you tbh. It feels like Bella went out of their way to say they aren't townreading you yet in 124. Feels kinda distance-y

[Black]

To me, 127 reads a little defensive, like Bella's wolfmate was telling them that their post was scummy and she was saying how it could easily come from town!Bella

Not sure who this implicates really

[Black]

I can definitely see Delta trying to coach it up in the PT if he's a wolf. I don't know Comet enough to tell if this is something he'd do

[Black]

The more I read 127 the more I'm convinced it's a slip. I'm not sure there's anything Bella could say that can convince me otherwise but we'll see

[Black]

I'm getting town vibes from Venmar

[Black]

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

Wait is thisa PT slip?
specifically talking about town!Bella means Bella was talking from the POV of scum!Bella

VOTE: Bella

Ahaha no, it's a response to delta talking about dragon: I like this post because it's the kind I see myself making as town, so I town read it. It's not that deep

Where did Dragon say he saw something weak?

[Black]

Meh.

I kinda believe Bella. Her partner could have easily spoon fed her this explanation and if Bella is wolf then I think Comet is too simply because he already thought of a way out in 144, but rn I'm not even convinced of the former

UNVOTE:

[Black]

at the time it striked me as fairly NAI

Are you saying you thought #124 was NAI at first?

[Black]

Nvm ignore that, I thought #124 was the "slip" post

[Black]

Fun fact: 19 people posted whilst I was composing that post.

Yeah you seem to have a tendency to spend a lot of time on your posts whereas it seems like most people don't mind just firing them off. also you don't really have to include Ninja in every post, you can just submit and then respond to other stuff next

[Black]

I like #186 from Comet because it's almost exactly what I was gonna say

Venmar v Delta feels a little tvt on the surface

[Black]

I also don't mind Venmar's stance on Bella post-slip explanation. I like that he admits it might not have been a slip and I would have found it pretty sus of he continued to push that angle

[Black]

Friendly reminder to @mod and @everyone:

I'm rarely here on weekends but I do pop in from time to time

[Black]

I'm getting dizzy reading this

[Black]

@Black You should vote Bella or Delta

Why?

[Black]

Compelling reasons...

Tbh I still think Bella is the scummiest slot in the game but that's probably due to a lack of other scumreads. I believe them about the slip not being a slip but I don't like the TR on Dragon page 1. It feels forced and pockety

I'll use my vote how I see fit but thank you for the suggestion

[Black]

Delta said it about dragon. Delta said that dragon was scummy for....talking through his shit vote? Which feels town to me

2. When exactly did Delta point that out as scummy? I thought they were attacking me for "criticizing people for being inactive" and for saying weird things. But then again, that wouldn't be a very sesnsible course of attack, so maybe my reading comprehension DOES suck.

This is a good question

[Black]

Dangit Dragon now you are making me second guess this

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

@People who have previous experience playing with Bella: do they normally speak like this when townreading other people? I feel like the normal way to write this would be "I can see that post coming from town!

Dragon

fairly easily" but instead they said they could see it coming from themselves as town

[Black]

"I don't think scum

sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak

and votes anyway?"

@Bella, where did Dragon say he saw something weak? And where did he tell us it was weak?

[Black]

I can definitely see Delta trying to coach it up in the PT if he's a wolf. I don't know Comet enough to tell if this is something he'd do

BTW, Comet is a she.

good to know!

[Black]

lol yeah delta and venmar are def tvt

Definitely? Idk, I think Delta is more than capable of replicating his town game as scum. I can't say for certain though because I haven't seen a scum game of his yet

Venmar feels pretty town atm

[Black]

Also you say I'm throwing shade but like 'until she meaningfully contributes '. Like...bruh.

Would you mind answering 240 when you get a chance?

[Black]

Oof. This game is going to grow 20 pages over the weekend isn't it? I'll have to play catch-up Monday ig

[Black]

"I don't think scum

sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak

and votes anyway?"

@Bella, where did Dragon say he saw something weak? And where did he tell us it was weak?

I just feel like I'm not getting a straight answer for this question

[Black]

Maybe I'm dumb and it's just the wording throwing me off but Dragon didn't see anything weak and he definitely never said anything was weak

[Black]

I also realise that above I fat fingered and put 'nom' committal. Hah.

nom nom nom

[Black]

@black, I thought dragon was casting doubt on his own thought process, a thing I often do and struggle with as town, especially with 'uncommon' scum reads. I read his post and was like....oh, cool. Then delta aaa like 'this is a bit shit ' and my repsinse was 'meh, why would scum basically admit to their thought process being a bit shit' but I'm hindsight, I think I added a ton more to dragons post that was there because I over identified with something.

Is that clear?

Yeah, thank you

I'll have to process this another time though. The weekend is here to sweep me away

[Black]

Delta - I am going to sleep now so will look at it more seriously tomorrow, but have a look at voting either Black or AurorusVox?

Can y'all at least wait til Monday to pressure me for unknown reasons? I said a couple times I'm not here much on weekends

[Black]

Alrighty I'll be able to do a nice little catch up post later tonight before I go to bed. I want to do a reads list too and see where I stand with everyone. Right now a lot of people are lumped together and it seems like (most) everyone is trying their best to seem townie so I need to solidify my reads and start to sort

[Black]

OK, so when I was last here we were on the tail end of the whole bella "slip" ordeal. I just looked over this situation one more time before closing the book on it. I can still see a scenario where the slip is real but ultimately I think the likelihood of it is low. I don't even think bella's response to it was all that great because a lot of it was her interpreting Dragon's post wrong, but I want to give her the benefit of the doubt, at least with the slip

Some thoughts as I catch up:

Bella's 309 - curious why you SR Comet here?

Dragon's 312 - feels kinda like he's really worried about how bella reads him? Here he asks bella for the second time to clarify if she still TRs him, then criticizes bella for saying the "slip wagon" was scummy and tells her she should point to scummy individuals and not a group. Sounds like he doesn't want any dirt on his name and this isn't the first time I got this vibe from Dragon

Actually I want to ISO this real quick because yeah, Dragon has pinged me as really caring about how people read him a few times now...

In 46 he wants AV to explain his vote on him. In 81 he wants AV to explain how his entrance is bad. In 105 he gets a little jumpy over Delta calling his play weird and asks if it's "townie weird or scummy weird". In 118 he asks Bella if she still TRs him. In 225 he wants Delta to explain why he voted him, and also why he unvoted him. In 229 he mentions again he wants Delta to explain the vote on him. Delta says his play is weird and in 230 Dragon says "but why is weird scummy?". In 292 Dragon seems exasperated that Delta votes him again.

That's up to where I've read but there could be more after this, I'll have to see. I think Dragon seems a little TOO self conscious of how people read him. Both town and wolves care about this but I think it's scum indicative to openly care THIS much

My catch up post got derailed by looking into Dragon behaviors so I'll continue in a second post

[Black]

Bella's 315 - ok...so you are SR comet and me for "going with the flow too much"? You say I post a lot but don't have reads or impact. That's somewhat fair. My reads aren't very solid yet, and my impact has pretty much been just me asking questions and feeling things out. Maybe I haven't gotten the chance to get good footing in the game but I'm hoping this catch up helps there

Delta's 317 and 318 - I'm not feeling the language argument against Venmar...but I do think scum could benefit from the bella push and could've easily been on the "slip wagon". Then there's a Comet vote in 322 based on her not voting bella over a self-hammering thing. I disagree with the reason behind this vote and I don't think Comet is scummy at all for that

Comet's 326 makes perfect sense. I'm naturally townreading her tone here. IMO Comet responds to the Delta vote well in 327-330

I'm not liking Venmar's 332 - I see nothing wrong with the Bella progression, other than a sliiiight feeling of buddying. Venmar puts a vote down here in 333 and explains in 334 that he thinks Delta is definitely scum and Bella might be his buddy

patches posts some catch-up posts here. Gives a TR of Delta in 339. Kind of agree here that Delta is within his town range but I'm not sure if he's actually town or not yet. Not much else from patch here. They kinda just give some surface level stuff and dip. Getting sheepy/surfacey vibes from patch this game. Actually I want to ISO this too

patch sheepy/surfacey posts

68 - says Dragon v Black didn't ping them either way
241 - calls bella scum over the slip
246 - says "idk how to feel" about bella's response
247 - says a Venmar post "feels town" but "mostly unsure"
254 - riding the fence on bella here. Also echoes my statement that Delta v Venmar feels tvt
261 - kinda sheeps Dragon here

This is up to the point where I'm caught up but I already see patch riding the fence in 341 (re: Bella) and 342 (re: Comet) if I look at the next 2 posts in the so. Not getting great vibes from this at all

Catch-up post derailed again. Part 3 incoming I suppose

[Black]

Dragon's 344 gives me vibe that he's trying to get Delta to look into people besides himself. Suggesting Delta vote AV (on vacation) or me (gone for the weekend) feels really weird. This kinda goes in with what I was saying a bit ago about Dragon. He's so concerned with people pushing him/SRing him

Dragon asks patches who they are SRing in 346 - worried it might be him?

patches throws out reads in 349 - TRs on me, Dragon, and Venmar. Can't say I completely agree with the reads but I do like this post

Dragon votes Delta in 351 based on associatives with bella? Here Dragon basically says Delta/bella is the solve

I like Delta's 355 minus the language argument. I don't like his 357 regarding Comet's "not wanting to vote b/c hammer" thingy. Delta pushing this is weird but also well within his town range if I look at it from a meta perspective

Completely agree with Delta's 358 - I already said it was weird that Dragon suggested he vote for AV/me

Delta throws out reads in 364 - SRs on Dragon, Venmar, Comet. Stark contrast from patch's reads earlier (TRs on Dragon and Venmar). Kinda feeling these reads a little more if I had to align myself with one of them, but the Comet read is off. She is a big TR for me

Dragon and Delta go into a small 1v1 here. Dragon says Delta is too scummy to be a wolf in 373. Odd take...I'm not seeing that at all. He accompanies this opinion with an unvote

I do like Dragon's 376 - we agree on Comet

I like Venmar's 389, 390, and 391. I think he responds to Delta well here and we have a similar read on Dragon's 373. These posts are giving me town feels

patch sheeps this read by Venmar a bit in 393. Add it to the sheep post list. 401 too - fence riding on Dragon saying he "radiates townie" but he's sketchy? Idk about that one...

bella says her strongest read is town!patch in 404. Huh. Not seeing that one at all. Can you elaborate bella?

I just wanted to catch up... I didn't mean for these to be walls...

[Black]

Alright I'm sleepy. I'll finish tomorrow and maybe post a reads list

TL;DR

I think Comet and Venmar are pretty town. Delta is...Delta but he's in his town range. Patches and Dragon feel kinda scummy. Bella is null leaning slightly scum. Haven't seen anything from AV or kawaii yet

[Black]

AV shows up in 410 but doesn't say too much. I like that he's questioning Dragon here


I like Comet's analysis in 412 and 416 and find myself agreeing with her on Venmar

Like, I kinda scum read you (but mainly black) for this go with the flow vibe, although if I had to chose one I think it's black.

Why though?

I don't feel patch is a good elim, partially because I feel it's low info because of their slightly low impact posting.

Didn't you say earlier that I don't have much impact either? What makes a Black lim better than a patch one?

[Black]

Venmar's 437 feels honest and genuine

lean scum; Bella, Delta
null but somewhat lean scum; Comet (if i had to make a lean but this isn't a confident read)
Neutral; Aurorus (not enough content yet), Kawaii (lurker)
null but somewhat lean town; patchwork, black
Lean town; Dragon

Not really understanding the Comet SR or the Dragon TR here but you did kinda explain re: Comet in 449

[Black]

Venmar; Comet

Delta

AV; Kawaii

Bella

Dragon; patch

After catching up this is where I stand. I think Dragon is overly concerned with people SRing him and I think that is more likely to come from a wolf. Patch is riding the fence on a lot of positions and also not really coming up with many original takes of their own. I did this unknowingly in my first scum game on the site and I'm seeing shades of that here

VOTE: patch

[Black]

Patch being town is probably the strongest read I have

Bella can you explain this read?

[Black]

fence riding on Dragon saying he "radiates townie" but he's sketchy?

also curious about how this is fence-riding

Saying his vibes are super town but his behavior is sketchy gives you the opportunity to fall either way here depending how the game goes

[Black]

241 - calls bella scum over the slip

confused about how this is "sheepy" lol, it definitely looked like a slip
what am i supposed to say, "bella is town for making a post that looks like a scumslip" ?

I was basically pointing out posts where you had a read that wasn't original. I think new scum does this a lot tbh

kinda sheeps Dragon here

agreeing with someone =/= sheeping

That's fair, but in this context I wanted to point out instances where you went with the flow instead of against the grain

[Black]

i hope you don't expect me to convince you i'm town

Not really. Most of why I think you are scum is behavioral atm

[Black]

oh boy
newbscum
lol

gestures to my singular completed scumgame, micro 1072.... im way better at scum i promise you

I don't think newscum = badscum. I play that way some too and I think my wolf game is ok. Some behaviors are just more common in less experienced wolves I think

[Black]

it's literally just a townread idk why you're reading so deep into it

It's not just a TR. You also said he's acting strange which has been said by a couple people already. That's part of the sheepy/unoriginal reads thing I was talking about. It's not just one post and when you pick them out individually most of them are not not inherently scummy, but when I look at the nature of all of your posts together that's when I see the trend

[Black]

patches I'm hoping you can give us a reads list soon. It feels like you are mostly just TRing people and the few people you have SRed felt kinda thread consensus

[Black]

Take your time though. I saw #452. There's no rush

[Black]

But at the same time I'm also not in agreement with others like Black that Dragon is scummy for stuff like being overly defensive and inquisitive over how others read him; I would find this behaviour more concerning coming from a more experienced player but tbh I don't think this is particularly alarming in and of itself coming from a newbie, I was definitely a bit like this when I was a newer player and even then I think being self-centered is a NAI trait for many players.

I agree that caring about what others think about you isn't necessarily scummy, I think what is pinging me here is the borderline obsessing over where people stand on him...almost to the point where it seems like he needs to keep tabs on people's Dragon reads every few pages to know what kind of behaviors he needs to correct. I definitely don't think it's a surefire wolf read but I don't really like it

Dragon does have some posts that I like though so maybe he's closer to my orange tier

AV's recent posts have been ok ig but I'm not really following the bella progression. Let me do a follow up post real quick

[Black]

So I’m sat in a towel drying off after a shower and have read this page and this page only.

Purely based on that I like Patch, for their reaction to dragons TR

This means I vibe with Bella

I’ve seen venmars quoted post in the dragon quote nest and I’m onside with dragons post dinging at the point venmar took issue with it so I like venmar too

Now to the dragon post in question, I’m gonna need it explaining to me as maybe I’m missing context here but

@dragon how is delta asking if you scumread them for disagreeing with you too scummy to be scum?

Like, have you made it super clear why you scumread them earlier on? Is delta misrepping you or do you just purely think the question itself is “nonsensical”?

I’ll read further back later as I’m dry now lol

Bella posts this page have been like I want to townread them because they sound genuine

but there’s also a bit of umm…inconsistency there?

Like she says she sounds like she’s pocketing comet while having a kinda scumread on them, but also doesn’t want comet in her lim pool for today. The strength of the patch townread also doesn’t really jive with the explanation she gave of it?

Bella I know you prefer people to ask you questions than speak about you so: is “not done anything scummy = patch town” stronger than “done something scummy = black/venmar scum” (the two people left in your limpool)?

I’m also intrigued by the final post on this page; venmar thinks you and delta are scum and you said that he’s asking for a vote between people who sr reach other (you and delta) but you also don’t have delta in your limpool…why is delta not in your pool if you sr them (especially to the point that it should be of note to venmar)?

I don’t want to vote until I’m fully caught up but atm

I’m most suspicious of Bella and is where my vote would go

~

I just don't see the progression from vibing with Bella, to wanting to TR her posts but noticing a couple inconsistencies that are making it hard for you to do so, to then saying she's the most sus to you and you will probably vote there

This is especially weird to me considering it seems like you SR Dragon for more solid stuff than just minor inconsistencies? Didn't you accuse him of manufacturing their position back to Delta here:

Noted, dragon has seemed okay in their reply to my post (hence my unvote) but based on posts further down it looks like dragon has used other people (namely you) to move them (back) onto voting delta. It feels a little manufactured. I go into more detail on this under the post itself.

AV do you SR Dragon or am I misunderstanding you here?

[Black]

Patch's Initial take 'maybe dragon is sketch town' is kinda fine, I feel like dragon 'buddies' as either Alignment, but their response to black is bad. Hmmm

Yeah... I don't like how they resorted to meta so fast to say "this isn't how I play as wolf"

[Black]

Did people actually think Bella had posted in this thread instead of a scum pt

???

This stinks so much of the omi pr hunting push from our last game together, that was a push I stoked as scum because there were so many townies on board with what was objectively a terrible thing (but realistically so unlikely).

Actually enough to make me reconsider my suspicions of Bella, what page did this start on? I want to see how people responded to it once I’ve caught up these latest pages.

This doesn't feel like a natural progression. Re: the blue... uhh, how did you miss that when you were catching up? Are you really implying you missed over all the bella slip stuff? It seems like you are conveniently noticing this or remembering it to flop on Bella

Based on this page I’m now probably more suspect of dragon than Bella fml

Huh. Really convenient timing here after my 495 and 499

[Black]

Everyone aboard, Venmar has changed direction

Thoughts on AV flipflopping on Bella/Dragon just now?

[Black]

Yeah like

Let me be clear

I’ve only read page 17+ so not seen anything about the slip, I asked if someone can link me or tell me what page to start on so I can look into it more but like.

Ok yeah... looking at your ISO you did say you were just commenting on the recent pages. I don't understand that approach but you do you lol. If I tried that I feel like I would be missing pieces to the puzzle. A lot of your questions could probably be answered by just going back and reading where the read/opinion originated

[Black]

So my #504 is probably a null point but I still don't like the Dragon/bella flip flop. Doesn't feel organic to me

[Black]

Patch did you genuinely think Bella mistook this thread for the scum pt?

yeah
usually i view the threads i need to check thru the "your topics" thing and when i was playing 1072 i almost accidentally sent a message to my hood pt instead of mafia pt

idk if bella does that but it's possible

I agree with this. I'm super conscious about where I'm posting because I'm always going to topics from the "Your Posts" page. I think it's very possible

[Black]

I read through first two pages and already found that we are either going for column A or C
but dragon saying that sounds more like a spew
keeping eyes on that

He said the role talk was an inside joke from another game

I don't think we know what column we are in and we shouldn't speculate or talk about who has what roles at all. That type of talk only benefits the wolves at the stage imo

[Black]

How is this a possible pt slip? Is it not just Bella saying whatever she noticed is something she would do as town? (Negates dragons accusation)

It doesn’t make sense to be explaining bellas venmar vote (black’s accusation) because she didn’t say it was weak when voting it? And also why would she then go on to post the explanation in the pt AFTER posting the vote if she’s checking it with her partner?

The theory is that she was talking about her weak SR on Venmar in 124, and the "votes anyway" would be referring to the vote in 121 and decision to keep the vote there in 124. Then her scum buddy calls these two posts out for being scummy in the PT and Bella goes to justify them by saying "I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily." In 127 aka "the slip" she's defending herself by saying "scum doesn't see [a weak Venmar SR], tells you its weak, and votes anyway?"

Like I said it's not likely and her explanation makes enough sense to give her the benefit of the doubt, but you can't say that the possibility of a slip doesn't exist

[Black]

@Vox: Bella is in your lim pool despite you flopping back to her probably being town? Can you explain that for me?

However a pile on over a scumPT slip

makes me think Bella is probably town

who was being pushed by scum (hence why that’s my first thing to look at after I’ve caught up on recent pages)

[Black]

So are there 2 scum in [dragon/venmar/black]?

Also where does scum!bella fit into this solve?

[Black]

Like…
Are you reading what I’m writing or just looking for reasons to scumread me?

I did read it. I think I just misread it, sorry

Can you answer 534?

[Black]

Like after looking at it, the slip incident was not enough to shake the trs I had on you and venmar or the sr I had initially formed on Bella

Ok, so just to make sure, you don't think Bella is probably town getting pushed by scum over the slip?

[Black]

Black kind of stands out to me as she hasn't really contributed with reads I think
reading her iso makes me think her slot kinda passive, mostly building on the Bella thing and responding with answers without actually giving us real new information.

If you'd like to know where I stand you can check out 457-460. I give reads and thoughts on every player. Oh and I have a readslist in 470 that could use a little updating now that AV has said a lot more

Question for you: if I stand out to you as having no reads does that mean you feel like I have provided the least reads/information in the game?

[Black]

Well, I read all of your isos, and yes, you do not have many reads, would like you to stop replying, but to push someone more. This is the way.

Gotcha. And yeah I'll push things as I see fit

Who are your biggest townreads so far?

[Black]

Tbh I don't understand how one could look at my ISO and say I'm not giving reads or information. I wonder how other ISO's stack up?

Spoiler: 36 posts? I'm either giving reads or looking for them

Nothing from Dragon on page 1 screams town to me tbh

It struck me all as proactive where I feel like a scum player might be more comfortable sitting in the back engaging in RVS humour and not drawing focus to themselves.

Not me as a scum player. I will try to act as proactive as possible because that's what townies should do and I'm sure good scum players also adopt this technique. The question is...is Dragon a good scum player?

@Dragon how would you classify your own wolf game and have you been wolf on this site before?

Dragon this seems a bit like an overreaction from you but idk if it's AI or not

I agree Venmar. I'm not liking the content from Bella so far. Seems weird for them to say Dragon is "townie af" based on page 1 posts that are pretty non-alignment indicative IMO. Could be an attempt to pocket Dragon

Also not hard evidence but if that was a scum slip then I think in terms of linking to a partner, Delta would be my top pick atm due to timing and the topic.

I think it could be you tbh. It feels like Bella went out of their way to say they aren't townreading you yet in 124. Feels kinda distance-y

To me, 127 reads a little defensive, like Bella's wolfmate was telling them that their post was scummy and she was saying how it could easily come from town!Bella

Not sure who this implicates really

I can definitely see Delta trying to coach it up in the PT if he's a wolf. I don't know Comet enough to tell if this is something he'd do

I'm getting town vibes from Venmar

Meh.

I kinda believe Bella. Her partner could have easily spoon fed her this explanation and if Bella is wolf then I think Comet is too simply because he already thought of a way out in 144, but rn I'm not even convinced of the former

UNVOTE:

at the time it striked me as fairly NAI

Are you saying you thought #124 was NAI at first?

I like #186 from Comet because it's almost exactly what I was gonna say

Venmar v Delta feels a little tvt on the surface

I also don't mind Venmar's stance on Bella post-slip explanation. I like that he admits it might not have been a slip and I would have found it pretty sus of he continued to push that angle

Compelling reasons...

Tbh I still think Bella is the scummiest slot in the game but that's probably due to a lack of other scumreads. I believe them about the slip not being a slip but I don't like the TR on Dragon page 1. It feels forced and pockety

I'll use my vote how I see fit but thank you for the suggestion

Dangit Dragon now you are making me second guess this

Eh, I don't think scum sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak Ans votes anyway? I can see that post from town! Bella fairly easily

@People who have previous experience playing with Bella: do they normally speak like this when townreading other people? I feel like the normal way to write this would be "I can see that post coming from town!

Dragon

fairly easily" but instead they said they could see it coming from themselves as town

"I don't think scum

sees something a bit weak, tells you it's weak

and votes anyway?"

@Bella, where did Dragon say he saw something weak? And where did he tell us it was weak?

lol yeah delta and venmar are def tvt

Definitely? Idk, I think Delta is more than capable of replicating his town game as scum. I can't say for certain though because I haven't seen a scum game of his yet

Venmar feels pretty town atm

OK, so when I was last here we were on the tail end of the whole bella "slip" ordeal. I just looked over this situation one more time before closing the book on it. I can still see a scenario where the slip is real but ultimately I think the likelihood of it is low. I don't even think bella's response to it was all that great because a lot of it was her interpreting Dragon's post wrong, but I want to give her the benefit of the doubt, at least with the slip

Some thoughts as I catch up:

Bella's 309 - curious why you SR Comet here?

Dragon's 312 - feels kinda like he's really worried about how bella reads him? Here he asks bella for the second time to clarify if she still TRs him, then criticizes bella for saying the "slip wagon" was scummy and tells her she should point to scummy individuals and not a group. Sounds like he doesn't want any dirt on his name and this isn't the first time I got this vibe from Dragon

Actually I want to ISO this real quick because yeah, Dragon has pinged me as really caring about how people read him a few times now...

In 46 he wants AV to explain his vote on him. In 81 he wants AV to explain how his entrance is bad. In 105 he gets a little jumpy over Delta calling his play weird and asks if it's "townie weird or scummy weird". In 118 he asks Bella if she still TRs him. In 225 he wants Delta to explain why he voted him, and also why he unvoted him. In 229 he mentions again he wants Delta to explain the vote on him. Delta says his play is weird and in 230 Dragon says "but why is weird scummy?". In 292 Dragon seems exasperated that Delta votes him again.

That's up to where I've read but there could be more after this, I'll have to see. I think Dragon seems a little TOO self conscious of how people read him. Both town and wolves care about this but I think it's scum indicative to openly care THIS much

My catch up post got derailed by looking into Dragon behaviors so I'll continue in a second post

Bella's 315 - ok...so you are SR comet and me for "going with the flow too much"? You say I post a lot but don't have reads or impact. That's somewhat fair. My reads aren't very solid yet, and my impact has pretty much been just me asking questions and feeling things out. Maybe I haven't gotten the chance to get good footing in the game but I'm hoping this catch up helps there

Delta's 317 and 318 - I'm not feeling the language argument against Venmar...but I do think scum could benefit from the bella push and could've easily been on the "slip wagon". Then there's a Comet vote in 322 based on her not voting bella over a self-hammering thing. I disagree with the reason behind this vote and I don't think Comet is scummy at all for that

Comet's 326 makes perfect sense. I'm naturally townreading her tone here. IMO Comet responds to the Delta vote well in 327-330

I'm not liking Venmar's 332 - I see nothing wrong with the Bella progression, other than a sliiiight feeling of buddying. Venmar puts a vote down here in 333 and explains in 334 that he thinks Delta is definitely scum and Bella might be his buddy

patches posts some catch-up posts here. Gives a TR of Delta in 339. Kind of agree here that Delta is within his town range but I'm not sure if he's actually town or not yet. Not much else from patch here. They kinda just give some surface level stuff and dip. Getting sheepy/surfacey vibes from patch this game. Actually I want to ISO this too

patch sheepy/surfacey posts

68 - says Dragon v Black didn't ping them either way
241 - calls bella scum over the slip
246 - says "idk how to feel" about bella's response
247 - says a Venmar post "feels town" but "mostly unsure"
254 - riding the fence on bella here. Also echoes my statement that Delta v Venmar feels tvt
261 - kinda sheeps Dragon here

This is up to the point where I'm caught up but I already see patch riding the fence in 341 (re: Bella) and 342 (re: Comet) if I look at the next 2 posts in the so. Not getting great vibes from this at all

Catch-up post derailed again. Part 3 incoming I suppose

Dragon's 344 gives me vibe that he's trying to get Delta to look into people besides himself. Suggesting Delta vote AV (on vacation) or me (gone for the weekend) feels really weird. This kinda goes in with what I was saying a bit ago about Dragon. He's so concerned with people pushing him/SRing him

Dragon asks patches who they are SRing in 346 - worried it might be him?

patches throws out reads in 349 - TRs on me, Dragon, and Venmar. Can't say I completely agree with the reads but I do like this post

Dragon votes Delta in 351 based on associatives with bella? Here Dragon basically says Delta/bella is the solve

I like Delta's 355 minus the language argument. I don't like his 357 regarding Comet's "not wanting to vote b/c hammer" thingy. Delta pushing this is weird but also well within his town range if I look at it from a meta perspective

Completely agree with Delta's 358 - I already said it was weird that Dragon suggested he vote for AV/me

Delta throws out reads in 364 - SRs on Dragon, Venmar, Comet. Stark contrast from patch's reads earlier (TRs on Dragon and Venmar). Kinda feeling these reads a little more if I had to align myself with one of them, but the Comet read is off. She is a big TR for me

Dragon and Delta go into a small 1v1 here. Dragon says Delta is too scummy to be a wolf in 373. Odd take...I'm not seeing that at all. He accompanies this opinion with an unvote

I do like Dragon's 376 - we agree on Comet

I like Venmar's 389, 390, and 391. I think he responds to Delta well here and we have a similar read on Dragon's 373. These posts are giving me town feels

patch sheeps this read by Venmar a bit in 393. Add it to the sheep post list. 401 too - fence riding on Dragon saying he "radiates townie" but he's sketchy? Idk about that one...

bella says her strongest read is town!patch in 404. Huh. Not seeing that one at all. Can you elaborate bella?

I just wanted to catch up... I didn't mean for these to be walls...

Alright I'm sleepy. I'll finish tomorrow and maybe post a reads list

TL;DR

I think Comet and Venmar are pretty town. Delta is...Delta but he's in his town range. Patches and Dragon feel kinda scummy. Bella is null leaning slightly scum. Haven't seen anything from AV or kawaii yet

AV shows up in 410 but doesn't say too much. I like that he's questioning Dragon here

I like Comet's analysis in 412 and 416 and find myself agreeing with her on Venmar

Like, I kinda scum read you (but mainly black) for this go with the flow vibe, although if I had to chose one I think it's black.

Why though?

I don't feel patch is a good elim, partially because I feel it's low info because of their slightly low impact posting.

Didn't you say earlier that I don't have much impact either? What makes a Black lim better than a patch one?

Venmar's 437 feels honest and genuine

lean scum; Bella, Delta
null but somewhat lean scum; Comet (if i had to make a lean but this isn't a confident read)
Neutral; Aurorus (not enough content yet), Kawaii (lurker)
null but somewhat lean town; patchwork, black
Lean town; Dragon

Not really understanding the Comet SR or the Dragon TR here but you did kinda explain re: Comet in 449

Venmar; Comet

Delta

AV; Kawaii

Bella

Dragon; patch

After catching up this is where I stand. I think Dragon is overly concerned with people SRing him and I think that is more likely to come from a wolf. Patch is riding the fence on a lot of positions and also not really coming up with many original takes of their own. I did this unknowingly in my first scum game on the site and I'm seeing shades of that here

VOTE: patch

Patch being town is probably the strongest read I have

Bella can you explain this read?

fence riding on Dragon saying he "radiates townie" but he's sketchy?

also curious about how this is fence-riding

Saying his vibes are super town but his behavior is sketchy gives you the opportunity to fall either way here depending how the game goes

241 - calls bella scum over the slip

confused about how this is "sheepy" lol, it definitely looked like a slip
what am i supposed to say, "bella is town for making a post that looks like a scumslip" ?

I was basically pointing out posts where you had a read that wasn't original. I think new scum does this a lot tbh

kinda sheeps Dragon here

agreeing with someone =/= sheeping

That's fair, but in this context I wanted to point out instances where you went with the flow instead of against the grain

i hope you don't expect me to convince you i'm town

Not really. Most of why I think you are scum is behavioral atm

oh boy
newbscum
lol

gestures to my singular completed scumgame, micro 1072.... im way better at scum i promise you

I don't think newscum = badscum. I play that way some too and I think my wolf game is ok. Some behaviors are just more common in less experienced wolves I think

it's literally just a townread idk why you're reading so deep into it

It's not just a TR. You also said he's acting strange which has been said by a couple people already. That's part of the sheepy/unoriginal reads thing I was talking about. It's not just one post and when you pick them out individually most of them are not not inherently scummy, but when I look at the nature of all of your posts together that's when I see the trend

But at the same time I'm also not in agreement with others like Black that Dragon is scummy for stuff like being overly defensive and inquisitive over how others read him; I would find this behaviour more concerning coming from a more experienced player but tbh I don't think this is particularly alarming in and of itself coming from a newbie, I was definitely a bit like this when I was a newer player and even then I think being self-centered is a NAI trait for many players.

I agree that caring about what others think about you isn't necessarily scummy, I think what is pinging me here is the borderline obsessing over where people stand on him...almost to the point where it seems like he needs to keep tabs on people's Dragon reads every few pages to know what kind of behaviors he needs to correct. I definitely don't think it's a surefire wolf read but I don't really like it

Dragon does have some posts that I like though so maybe he's closer to my orange tier

AV's recent posts have been ok ig but I'm not really following the bella progression. Let me do a follow up post real quick

So I’m sat in a towel drying off after a shower and have read this page and this page only.

Purely based on that I like Patch, for their reaction to dragons TR

This means I vibe with Bella

I’ve seen venmars quoted post in the dragon quote nest and I’m onside with dragons post dinging at the point venmar took issue with it so I like venmar too

Now to the dragon post in question, I’m gonna need it explaining to me as maybe I’m missing context here but

@dragon how is delta asking if you scumread them for disagreeing with you too scummy to be scum?

Like, have you made it super clear why you scumread them earlier on? Is delta misrepping you or do you just purely think the question itself is “nonsensical”?

I’ll read further back later as I’m dry now lol

Bella posts this page have been like I want to townread them because they sound genuine

but there’s also a bit of umm…inconsistency there?

Like she says she sounds like she’s pocketing comet while having a kinda scumread on them, but also doesn’t want comet in her lim pool for today. The strength of the patch townread also doesn’t really jive with the explanation she gave of it?

Bella I know you prefer people to ask you questions than speak about you so: is “not done anything scummy = patch town” stronger than “done something scummy = black/venmar scum” (the two people left in your limpool)?

I’m also intrigued by the final post on this page; venmar thinks you and delta are scum and you said that he’s asking for a vote between people who sr reach other (you and delta) but you also don’t have delta in your limpool…why is delta not in your pool if you sr them (especially to the point that it should be of note to venmar)?

I don’t want to vote until I’m fully caught up but atm

I’m most suspicious of Bella and is where my vote would go

~

I just don't see the progression from vibing with Bella, to wanting to TR her posts but noticing a couple inconsistencies that are making it hard for you to do so, to then saying she's the most sus to you and you will probably vote there

This is especially weird to me considering it seems like you SR Dragon for more solid stuff than just minor inconsistencies? Didn't you accuse him of manufacturing their position back to Delta here:

Noted, dragon has seemed okay in their reply to my post (hence my unvote) but based on posts further down it looks like dragon has used other people (namely you) to move them (back) onto voting delta. It feels a little manufactured. I go into more detail on this under the post itself.

AV do you SR Dragon or am I misunderstanding you here?

Patch's Initial take 'maybe dragon is sketch town' is kinda fine, I feel like dragon 'buddies' as either Alignment, but their response to black is bad. Hmmm

Yeah... I don't like how they resorted to meta so fast to say "this isn't how I play as wolf"

Did people actually think Bella had posted in this thread instead of a scum pt

???

This stinks so much of the omi pr hunting push from our last game together, that was a push I stoked as scum because there were so many townies on board with what was objectively a terrible thing (but realistically so unlikely).

Actually enough to make me reconsider my suspicions of Bella, what page did this start on? I want to see how people responded to it once I’ve caught up these latest pages.

This doesn't feel like a natural progression. Re: the blue... uhh, how did you miss that when you were catching up? Are you really implying you missed over all the bella slip stuff? It seems like you are conveniently noticing this or remembering it to flop on Bella

Based on this page I’m now probably more suspect of dragon than Bella fml

Huh. Really convenient timing here after my 495 and 499

@Vox: Bella is in your lim pool despite you flopping back to her probably being town? Can you explain that for me?

However a pile on over a scumPT slip

makes me think Bella is probably town

who was being pushed by scum (hence why that’s my first thing to look at after I’ve caught up on recent pages)

Like after looking at it, the slip incident was not enough to shake the trs I had on you and venmar or the sr I had initially formed on Bella

Ok, so just to make sure, you don't think Bella is probably town getting pushed by scum over the slip?

[Black]

This is a good observation and I see your viewpoint here but I don't think this is necessarily a scummy thing from Dragon - newbies tend to be a little focused on 'looking/playing good' and this seems pretty in-line with how Dragon played our previous game (as town) in my opinion.

Yeah I've been mulling this over. I think I'm having a hard time viewing Dragon as a newbie but I agree here at least

[Black]

also we want to gamesolve this, we need some claims d2.
simple pr claim works,, bu definitely d2 so th mafia don't kill the pr.

No

[Black]

I like #610 and #611 from Delta/AV respectively. It doesn't make sense for happy to encourage others to push and ask questions but not do so himself

[Black]

Ironically I asked happy a question in #570 and he ignored it

[Black]

That's a really weird take on what I've been doing. Delta has SPECIFICALLY ASKED ME to name who they should be looking into voting. I gave him 2 names which I thought could be potential alternative wagons if we decide not to push him or Bella (which was implied in his question to me of who to alternatively vote).
How is that being concerned about being scumread? How is that diverting attention from myself?

That's fair. I had to go back and look because I didn't remember Delta asking you that in #306. After reading it back I'm less suspicious of you just randomly throwing me and AV into the mix

[Black]

Honestly right now one of the biggest things in your favour is that you reacted first to the 'slip': it feels like a pretty wild gambl for scum to take.

How so? I'm not saying Dragon is scum for pointing out the slip but wouldn't it benefit the wolves to push that if they see it?

[Black]

What is the VC atm? Can we pressure someone already?

Your push on bella seems to have fizzled out. Might I interest you in a patch or AV push?

[Black]

Like I might not be objective but at least FMPOV I haven't reacted any different to being scumread than in any other game.

And Patch definitely hadn't been fence sitting OR sheeping this game.

How am I supposed to know that?

I disagree

Why do I have the feeling that you don't like my catch up because some of it is throwing shade at you?

[Black]

1. You could read any of my completed games, or ask, or do anything except assume my behavior is weird.

My suspicions of you don't really have anything to do with your other games. It pretty much boils down to me thinking wolves care more about how people read them than townies do, but as others have pointed out newer players sometimes feel this way too. So it could definitely be NAI for you

2. Well why don't we each explain our reasoning?

I explained mine and provided several examples. I'm getting surface level vibes from patch but I need to determine if that's AI or not. As of right now I'm leaning yes but others have pointed out that might be in her town range

[Black]

That's a blatant lie.

I'm not lying. That's the vibe I get from a lot of your posts. I just need to determine if it's scum motivated or not

[Black]

Also your reliance on meta is almost unironically triggering me, in particularly the reference to self-meta. We're playing Newbie 2119, not 2114.

I kinda agree here. Dragon has tried to use meta twice on this page to prove a point

[Black]

Also, I fucking voted Black,

the one who I said was blatantly lying.

Wait what?

[Black]

Trust me, I’ll be happier than anyone else when I’m finally caught up and can just read current stuff lol.

I feel like you could just read those few missing pages instead of reading what people are posting now. Like you read the whole Delta case on Dragon instead of reading pg 12. This kinda goes into what I was saying earlier about how I wouldn't be able to play this way. I can't try to solve a puzzle when I'm missing key pieces. The fact that you are trying to do this makes me think you're not

actually

trying to do real solving here, instead you just want to look like you're doing stuff. People pointed out you even discredited the Bella slip before even reading it too

I'm getting bad vibes with the way you're approaching the game and I'm comfortable moving my vote here for now

VOTE: AV

[Black]

I'm voting for you because I think the way you are approaching the game is scummy. It's not just one or two instances. You've been in a constant state of catching up for like 2 days now but instead of just using some of that time to read the game you are trying really hard to seem present. I think that type of catch up is likely to come from a wolf but I could be wrong

[Black]

Like seriously wtf that’s pissed me right off
How dare you tell me how to spend my time when I’m juggling this and looking after my kids

Like get the fuck outta here

You’ve been making shitty takes on my post since I started catching up, most of the time misreading or missing what I’ve actually said. Vote me for any of those shitty takes, I don’t really care, but don’t you dare tell me I should have read 4 pages of content while I’m sat with my kids

Nobody is telling you how to spend your time. Calm the duck down?

[Black]

You can play the game this way if you want but I'm not going to just ignore that it's scummy to me

[Black]

@Black, AV aside, maybe I missed this in my skimming of your posts but what's your stance on Bella? I think you had her as a scum lean but why is AV/Patch higher on your priority than her?

I've liked a lot of Bella's content since the slip. I'm not sure if I TR her but my initial SR over her Dragon stance page 1 has kinda dissolved away, and I haven't seen much scummy stuff from her since

[Black]

Bella seems like a good wagon for scum to sit on. It's called limbait I think? That's what she seems like to me

[Black]

I'm not vibing with this overreaction and AtE by AV. Also I'm kinda sick of playing in games where people blow up and get so upset over nothing. Like no one is telling you to ignore your kids to play Mafia my guy. Maybe stop live posting for 10 seconds and go catch yourself up on the 1/3 of the game you haven't even read

[Black]

Can you point to any posts she's made that is making you TR her? Sounds like your read might've evolved a fair bit since #470?

Not really off the top of my head, and I'm not sure if I TR her quite yet. I would say my updated version of #470 would have her as null. Maybe with a slight townlean I suppose

I like the way she has been interacting with the thread. It feels like she's asking questions and trying to solve by pointing out things she doesn't like and chiming in on things

Re: your 2nd question, I still TR you pretty heavily. I'm not sure if you're the only one voting Bella but I'm kinda referencing the Bella push in general. I think there are a couple others that have said they would be ok voting Bella but now I can't think of who they are

I saw you post about why you think she's scummy and I can't say that I agree with you

[Black]

As confusing as av's catch up is, it's better than not doing it *cough* happy *cough" and also doesn't vibe with his meta (sorry) from the last two scum newbie games, where he aggressively pushed an agenda.

Yeah that's fair

I still think the approach is kinda scummy but I don't think a wolf just bites my head off for suggesting that. It's almost too big of an overreaction looking back at it

UNVOTE:

The meta argument is also interesting, ty for that insight

[Black]

black I don't know why you didn't defend yourself there
*raises eyebrow*

I have no clue what you are talking about

[Black]

Regarding AV. I've just been sitting here thinking about the interaction. My SR definitely wasn't super strong and was mostly based on things I wouldn't do as town, but I'm glad I voted because I think AV's reaction kinda pulled me over to thinking he's probably town now. I've seen scum try to pull this off but idk, this felt more genuine to me

[Black]

I'm going to try to solidify my D1 lim pool today at some point

[Black]

Just saying "wait what" does not help in any way. Why did you not attempt to retort Dragon's accuse of lying?

In order to retort Dragon's accusation I first need to know what he's accusing me of. You can be patient and let it play out

[Black]

AT LEAST ASK WHY he thinks that you are lying
the caps are important.

"Wait what?" is me asking why he thinks I'm lying

[Black]

gonna push black in like an hour or so

Yeah I'm eagerly waiting this one. Your stance on me since replacing in has felt really weird and contrived. You started by saying you read everyone's ISO and that I stood out as giving the least amount of reads which is crazy. Now you have an issue with the way I'm asking Dragon to explain his lying comment

Give me a proper push because at this point your position on me just seems personal

[Black]

Ninja'd: Ugh I'm agreeing with Black, that's not a good sign

The Scum Queen is known to show mercy to those that kneel

[Black]

AT LEAST ASK WHY he thinks that you are lying
the caps are important.

"Wait what?" is me asking why he thinks I'm lying

no no
tone difference
If you stop him with a cold hard "why." I would be much better with that
the tone of "wait what?" seems shocked, and in a way, forced.
also not sound like determination to defend self.

I mean that's how you're reading it, but you're wrong. And I was shocked because I don't remember calling him a liar. I'll defend myself as soon as I know what I'm being accused of, thanks

[Black]

@Black why do you call yourself th scum queen
you know that's a p big flag to most people right?

Lol. Is this part of your push?

[Black]

I don't like that Black agreed with Dragon over that scumslip with not much extra information
patch and comet just have wrong ideas.

You do know that patch and Comet also thought it could be a scumslip too right?

[Black]

@Black why do you call yourself th scum queen
you know that's a p big flag to most people right?

Lol. Is this part of your push?

YES this is my part of my push.
Literally why would you use that in your entrance given that it is a MAFIA game and you might be unintentionally claiming scum and I do not like that, seems like a throw to me, policying this. VOTE: Black

I am the Scum Queen, but I am not always scum aligned (contrary to popular belief)

Hopefully this helps

[Black]

The word 'also' was used, meaning that you agree with Dragon. However, no real extra information was given which makes me think you might be blindly followinng him and sheeping him, while comet and patch put some thought in this post, and no votes were cast.

Yeah, that's fair. We were all blind in regards to Bella's slip and I felt like we should pressure it, hence the vote

[Black]

You shouldn't even be bringing up 'scum queen' in your posts.

I didn't think anyone would be silly enough to vote me for it XD

[Black]

well I am paranoid enough to push and vote you for it.
definitely

So you don't like that I call myself Scum Queen and you didn't like that I voted for Bella over her "slip"...is that it?

[Black]

I need more evidence and I will post it soon

This reads as you don't have any more evidence and need to go find some. Why do I get the feeling that you don't really think I'm scum?

[Black]

It struck me all as proactive where I feel like a scum player might be more comfortable sitting in the back engaging in RVS humour and not drawing focus to themselves.

Not me as a scum player. I will try to act as proactive as possible because that's what townies should do and I'm sure good scum players also adopt this technique. The question is...is Dragon a good scum player?

don't like how nobody focused on this
"because that's what townies should do" seems like a slip and trying to blend in.
"I'm sure good scum players also adopt this technique" is p straightforward. This line speaks for itself i think.

No one focused on this because this isn't even remotely close to what a scum slip looks like

[Black]

2 pieces of evidence is far less than enough
as we all say the more the merrier
so yes, I require more evidence.

So you've decided I'm scum before finding the evidence? That's an unorthodox way to play the game...

[Black]

I don't see the reason behind that post.

Idk about you but I like to be here when I'm being pressured. I have no issues being pressured but what's the point of doing it when I'm gone and won't be able to respond to it?

[Black]

Alright happy, my turn

I want you to explain 564 in detail. You claimed to have read everyone's ISO, so I want you to point out specifics regarding the 7 other players and what makes you feel like they have provided more reads than me

[Black]

Also, why do you think the PRs should claim D2?

[Black]

also, I seen more hard to find scumslips. at least this one's fairly obvious if you look at it closer come on guys.

It's not even remotely close to a scum slip. You have to take that out of context to even begin to think that way

[Black]

Am I the only one not scumreading Delta?

[Black]

This isn't scummy but just kinda. ??? ???? ???

Ok?

[Black]

Why didn't you TR him before?

He didn't do anything to warrant a TR

Pedit: idk why both you and AV seem to think my push was related to his OOG stuff. I made it pretty clear I have an issue with the way he's interacting with the game without being caught up

[Black]

especially considering how vox wasn't really trying to seem present because we all just sort of accepted he wasn't going to be able to be there?

He posted like 40 times yesterday. I would say he's trying to seem present

[Black]

Yeah but his posts themself don't really show that sort of vibe
He pops in once in a while, posts five times, and then leaves

That's kinda exactly my point. It's the being here without really being here for me. I feel like that's how a wolf might engage with the game

But after AV's response I'm not really interested in pushing that any further atm

[Black]

Keep in mind his posts aren't like fluff or anything, they're all catch-up posts that have a decent amount of analysis

Actually I'm gonna be honest I haven't really been paying much attention to the vox slot, I've mostly just been skimming his posts

I'm not sure how you reached this conclusion in the first quote if the second quote is true?

[Black]

Dragon is p straight forward: there is this list of all the people in post 4hundred something, with only two nulls, one being the slot i subbed into

Uhh? How does this give you the impression that Dragon has more reads than me? I have a reads list too lol

And what about the other 6 players?

I think your initial claim of "Black has the least reads in the game" is absolutely bogus and you're not able to back it up

[Black]

In Black's case, the question mark emphasizes the shock

Exclamation points are used to emphasize shock. The question mark is there to show you it's a question

[Black]

I do not have anything else to say other than just giving her a warning not to use it because it gives me scummy vibes.

oh I'm gonna use it

[Black]

Am I the only one not scumreading Delta?

Probably

That's awkward

[Black]

Idk if I'm townreading patch's recent posts because they are townie or because they are agreeing with me...

[Black]

Idk if I'm townreading patch's recent posts because they are townie or because they are agreeing with me...

Where'd I agree with you again I forgor
there's a lot going on rn

We just generally agree that Happy's posts kinda stink and you pointed out a lot of stuff to him that I agree with

[Black]

I was mostly skimming through isos when I subbed in

Now you say you were just skimming? Why didn't you say that originally when you gave the read? You even doubled-down on it like Delta said. It wasn't until I forced you to expand on the read that you conveniently admitted you didn't actually read the isos

[Black]

Idk if I'm townreading patch's recent posts because they are townie or because they are agreeing with me...

Where'd I agree with you again I forgor
there's a lot going on rn

We just generally agree that Happy's posts kinda stink and you pointed out a lot of stuff to him that I agree with

Oh okay
guess we there
now I actually have to catch up STOP GIVING ME NOTIFICATIONS GUYS they're too crunchy i cant handle them

RIP your inbox

[Black]

Dragon flips then Venmar flips too

Why?

Also can you explain why you TR AV?

[Black]

My current limpool is (iamveryhappy, dragon, venmar)

Why is dragon in your lim pool if he's in your "null" category?

[Black]

I have never pushed him? I've consistently TRead or NAI'd him. Feel free to point to posts I haven't

OH SHIT my bad i must've misremembered, you can go into null MY BAD

Wait why does Venmar go up to null after you said he was scummy for thought process, vibes, and continuity?

[Black]

Sorry patch I'm just having some mental issues with your list. The two questions above plus I'm curious why I'm in the top TR category off of just a viberead

Also I'm getting major pockety vibes from you towards AV but I could just be making that up

Sorry I'm not trying to overload you with too many questions

[Black]

good post
I more of believe you are town now, guess I deathtunneled bruh
sorry

Didn't you just say patch and I might be buddies? Do you not think I would write #850 to my buddy?

[Black]

Tacking onto Black's post Patch, if I am your second highest scumread, why am I absent from your limpool?

Good point, I didn't notice this...

[Black]

My current limpool is (iamveryhappy, dragon, venmar)

Why is dragon in your lim pool if he's in your "null" category?

thought he was towny, less sure, feels more scummy now but i don't want to jump to conclusions about alignemtn until i can look at iso in detail

I guess what I'm asking is why would you be ok limming him if he is null and hard to read?

[Black]

Also talking of fuck, the tone of that dragon post was super weird.

Which one?

[Black]

(black/delta? Who I basically tr)

I'm not the only one that trs Delta!!!

[Black]

I think my lim pool today is {happy; Dragon; patch}

[Black]

You seem to be posting today as the whims strike, which...feels risky for scum..

I noticed this too, but one thing I will say is the only two times they didn't respond immediately was when 1) I questioned them about null-Dragon being in their lim pool and when 2) Delta questioned them about scum-Delta not being in their lim pool

The inconsistencies between patch's lim pool and reads list is throwing me way off rn

[Black]

@black sorry for swearing at you, i got triggered a bit there last night. I’ll try to read whatever you’ve put here with a cooler head.

I'm not sorry for voting you but I do feel bad that it upset you so much. I never want to hurt anyone's feelings. I hope you're having a better day today

[Black]

VOTE: delta. this might be pointless given about half of you townread him but i'll look into him, after i do that venmar analysis.

I think it's just two people that TR Delta. Most seem to have him in their lim pool

[Black]

The one happy used to push your reaction black, the one about lying, felt a bit fake

The whole push seemed fake to me, idk. It was pretty convenient for happy to say he only skimmed ISOs after he used my ISO to launch his case against me. From the very beginning the whole thing felt very inorganic

[Black]

then patch has a series of bad looking pages and then some townier ones and I think I'm just at null!town?

Are patch's town pages the one where she's love posting on a whim? Because I don't really see that as hard to do as a wolf. Especially considering there were some inconsistencies in the posting, like maybe they were posting too loose? I'm still perplexed why patch has Dragon as a null read but would be fine limming him

[Black]

Ninjad: vote me all you like, that wasn’t what got me angry, it was the way you were telling me how I should have spent my time reading pages and pages of content. Anyway I’m caught up to p16 now so only another 8 pages to go…

I just wanted you to read pages instead of posting on current events. I never wanted you to sacrifice time with your children, I just wanted you to sacrifice some of your posting time to finish reading the thread. But I totally understand why you're catching up the way you are even if I wouldn't do it this way. Anyway, sorry, I'll try to be more considerate I guess

[Black]

Ninjad again: I don’t mean to respond to new stuff instead of catching up ( ) but who TRs delta atm?

Bella and I

Not sure about others

[Black]

Keep in mind his posts aren't like fluff or anything, they're all catch-up posts that have a decent amount of analysis

Actually I'm gonna be honest I haven't really been paying much attention to the vox slot, I've mostly just been skimming his posts

I'm not sure how you reached this conclusion in the first quote if the second quote is true?

I still find this post from patch really weird and I don't think they ever responded to it. IMO patch has been trying to pocket AV so much that if they flip scum then I'll be pretty convinced AV is town. I don't think wolf!patch treats AV like this if he's their buddy but I can totally see it if AV is town

[Black]

Patch and vox giving each other a mutual skim pass is odd tho

I don't think they are both scum but I could be wrong

[Black]

I do appreciate it and I am much happier returning to the thread today after a lovely morning together - we’ve had lots of playtime and been to the library and got our first library cards, and now they’ve just had a nice long nap at home rather than in the car

I'm really happy to hear this!

Although one of them left me a present in their nappy during their sleep…

...not so much this XD

[Black]

Finishing up page 28 and Black's been involved in loads of conflicts suddenly. I'm still town-reading her and honestly think she comes out of the arguments looking good in my eyes, but I'm not sure if this has any significance.

That's true. Everywhere I look for scum people just get mad at me for it. First patch, then Dragon, then AV. Happy seems to like the fact that I kinda SR him?

This game definitely got interesting over the last couple of days

[Black]

vc

You couldn't have waited 3 more posts for pagetop? smh

[Black]

Wait why does Venmar go up to null after you said he was scummy for thought process, vibes, and continuity?

And the scumcase????

I had forgotten about patch's Venmar case until you brought it up. I think it's a valid point. Venmar got moved up to null for seemingly no reason?

[Black]

Wait why does Venmar go up to null after you said he was scummy for thought process, vibes, and continuity?

And the scumcase????

I had forgotten about patch's Venmar case until you brought it up. I think it's a valid point. Venmar got moved up to null for seemingly no reason?

Fixed*

[Black]

vc

You couldn't have waited 3 more posts for pagetop? smh

Black has been modkilled.

Spoiler: The role

AnNoYiNg

Spoiler: mods eyes only

you know you love me

[Black]

Can you link me to that, comet?

viewtopic.php?t=90590

I kinda want to spend some time looking at this game

Patch is looking like the best lim today imo

[Black]

Patch's first post in that game feels familiar...

HI FURTIVE!

VOTE: dragoneater

This is the correct vote

VOX HI!!! HI VOX

Just the first thing I noticed but obviously that's not a good argument for scum!patch here

I'm gonna keep reading

[Black]

Patch is looking like the best lim today imo

I would be alright with it. Still wish Delta would have responded to my posts against him - especially after he asked me to throw some questions at him.

Delta isn't normally one to avoid questions so I'm sure you'll get something today

I don't think we lim today anyway since the level of discussion is pretty high

[Black]

...wait, patch gets accused to scum slip in that game and doesn't mention it here??? That's Sus af, right?

I got caught up looking at other stuff but yeah that does seem a bit weird. That situation would directly relate to this game so why would town!patch not being it up? I can only see reasons for scum!patch to avoid this

[Black]

Okay as promised a readlist:

Black

- good reading, loads of content, even in her posts that I've disagreed with I still understand her logic, all around been nice to have in this game

Venmar

- I'm buddying you, vote me for it Venmar

AV

- Some earlier confusion over timing but honestly I have been liking their reads - only reason he's not among the top reads is because it's retroactive analysis.

Dragon

- Has had a few stumbles but honestly I'm still seeing this as town.

Happy

- I don't see new scum playing like this, despite the aggression it did spark a lot of discussion. I think site playstyle/meta accounts for scummy vibes?

Bella

- Bella reading you is difficult and you're probably fluctuating the most for me. Kinda tempted to put you as null but I'm going with my gut and going light scumlean.

Patch

- Has been knocked down by latest posts.

Delta

- Hasn't answered my questions since four days ago, still see him as scummy for reasons stated in my previous scumpool.

I don't agree with some of these but I don't really have any issues with this list

Comet seems like an open book. I'm just getting smacked in the face with her overwhelming beacon of towniness

No body is locktown though, at least not in my eyes. I have a terrible habit of townreading wolves (see Hallowed Knight)

[Black]

I think blacks post to dragon was fine but I can at least see happys point in terms of the sort of stronger response they’d want to see

In an argument the stronger response generally comes after the accusation has been explained. There's nothing wrong with me asking Dragon how I'm lying before jumping down his throat for it, and I think this comes off as a bit forced by Happy. He was actively looking for things to confirm his SR

[Black]

I feel like I can read patch based on vibes and the vibes aren’t giving me scum

, but that could be arrogance/ignorance/desire to be spirit animals on my part.

But I haven’t really had any scumpings from patches posts, a lot of it is like…ehh. Neutral.

Can you elaborate here? Why do patch's vibes this game give you null/town? And what type of vibes do you expect from them as scum?

I mean you admitted yourself you just skimmed patches posts so I'm not sure the lack of scum pings really says anything. Also I'm curious where the neutral vibes come from if you haven't really read their posts in detail

[Black]

@black what parts did you find townie about patch’s posts on the low 30s? I thought their push on happy for confirmation bias was pretty shaky.

I think I have a tendency to TR posts that agree with me or say what I want to say but in better words. Patch did that a couple times with happy. It's a pretty weak TR though and it's almost all gone now after thinking about patch some more

[Black]

Purely based on that I like Patch, for their reaction to dragons TR

Huh. Ok. So this is the patch read that made you file them away as town?

Also I'm finding it a little concerning that you're so willing to trust patch simply because y'all are bffs and also the fact that they defended you when you were away from the thread

I think you should form a real read on patch here before the EOD, if you have the time

[Black]

Bella tr delta is like…
Bella/delta scumpair likelihood increasing

Does wolf take this stance with their buddy? Being one of only two people to TR Delta seems risky imo

[Black]

Loooool I legit actually laughed out loud

Shea is NOT funny

[Black]

@black my read is leaning scum atm tbh, as above moreso than dragon who kinda faded a bit? I have open questions for patch that will help solidify that read hopefully

And yeah I got a gut townvibe there and then there was nothing to really rock it based on what I was reading until I realised I was kinda giving patch a pass and started to interrogate their posts more, I think this also coincided with a few of their dodgier / more inconsistent takes and posts?

I like this read and explanation, thanks

[Black]

Would also be very happy to see a delta wagon when they’re back

There's only like 3 days left in D1 so I'm not sure Delta is going to make it back in time

[Black]

Tip: breadcrumbing, just this post.

Tip: it's not breadcrumbing if you make sure people are looking when you are putting down the crumbs

[Black]

oof i cant tell if i'm starting to townread delta because i agree with him or if it's just because that post gave me better vibes

Do you think you would feel any different about Delta's post if he didn't TR you?

[Black]

ok ali

[Black]

I like Delta's 1010 but the flipflop on patch is kinda throwing me off

[Black]

So far only two of the hats have been cool, Shea, I'm very dissatisfied

also I lol'd

[Black]

Yes he is. You are leaning town in his eyes

[Black]

I think we should start sharing 2-3 people each that we'd be ok limming today

I'll compile a list of the lim pools and maybe we can reach a consensus lim?

I see Bella's on the last page and mine is {Dragon; patch; happy}

[Black]

1. Black - (Dragon, patch, happy)
2. Bella - (Dragon, patch, Comet, AV)
3. happy -
4. Dragon -
5. patch -
6. Delta -
7. Comet -
8. Venmar -
9. AV -

[Black]

1. Black - (Dragon, patch, happy)
2. Bella - (Dragon, patch, Comet, AV)
3. happy -
4. Dragon -
5. patch -
6. Delta -
7. Comet -
8. Venmar - (Bella, Delta, happy/patch)
9. AV -