13p Normal [TM2015]

[Thor665]

To clarify: if Boon *did* that in this game. I would happily lynch him.
I am not going to policy lynch him on the *idea* he could do that.

[Trojan Horse]

If you don't have scumreads, do you have townreads? Do you have reads?

Nope! I'm feeling pretty mentally checked out. I intend to do a nice thorough reread eventuality, but I don't know if that will happen D1. Have I mentioned how much I hate day ones?

I think I'm with you on day ones, SK.

Current reads (more gut than anything else):

Leaning town: pie, Fen, STD, Egg

Null: SK, sthar, Mala, Micc

Leaning scum: Jason, Boon, Thor (my teammates have pushed me in that direction), Delta (I think Delta went overboard in his argument with STD; he may have been provoking STD just to distract the town)

Let's see where this takes us. VOTE: DeltaWave

[SleepyKrew]

Why are you trying to shift the focus off of one of your scumreads?

[SleepyKrew]

Let's try phrasing that more comprehensibly:
There's been a lot of pushing on jason lately (including my killer case). Why are you trying to start something on Delta, when jason is a scumread of yours?

[Save The Dragons]

There's been a lot of pushing on Thor lately (including my killer case). Why are you trying to start something on Delta, when Thor is a scumread of yours?

[Trojan Horse]

Because there hasn't been a lot of pushing on DeltaWave lately. There's enough on Jason and Thor that I can try to make an evaluation of them. But it looks like Delta has slipped back into lurker mode. He needs some pressure.

[SleepyKrew]

There's been a lot of pushing on Thor lately (including my killer case). Why are you trying to start something on Delta, when Thor is a scumread of yours?

So we agree that Trojan's up to something?
I don't wanna start something on him though D:

[SleepyKrew]

Because there hasn't been a lot of pushing on DeltaWave lately. There's enough on Jason and Thor that I can try to make an evaluation of them. But it looks like Delta has slipped back into lurker mode. He needs some pressure.

This doesn't sound like someone that wants to get D1 over with

[Trojan Horse]

Also, I've spent the afternoon going back and forth between Jason's iso and Thor's iso, trying to decide which one is likelier to be scum. I'm tired of agonizing over it. I figured that, if I'm having this much trouble, perhaps the best move is to go for a third option.

Yes SK, pushing for a new bandwagon will probably prolong day 1. But if that's what it takes to find scum, so be it.

[SleepyKrew]

I'm not convinced you know what "finding scum" actually means.

[Boonskiies]

Sigh...Jason, I've done it as town as well. Quit being ignorant and nitpicky.

[Fenchurch]

Not moving goal posts - solid fact

Scum game Boon boasts about hammering town.
This game Boon boasts about hammering town.

There is no town motive to boast about hammering town.

Scum

jason:

This

is the game where Boon actually quickhammers his town-read. It's Ninja Mafia - the first of the links he posted in #241. The quickhammer was anti-town and he took a lot of flak for it. But Boon wasn't scum.

[Side note: you say he boasts about hammering town, but actually he was boasting about hammering his 'town-read'. In that game, Thor was a town-read of Boon's who had gained a wagon on Day 1, and Boon decided he'd rather get the lynch done than trust himself on his read, and placed the hammer. The play was a poor one, but the quickhammer was on scum.]

That's why you seem to be lynching him for a playstyle/policy argument, rather than a scumhunting one. No one is arguing that some of Boon's claimed play is anti-town, but you're failing to say why his play here connects

more

to his scum game than his town game.

[Fenchurch]

So we agree that Trojan's up to something?
I don't wanna start something on him though D:

I know what you mean.

[Save The Dragons]

Ffrey is reading the game and has offered some thoughts as well.

'The tooth fairy is reading the game and has offered some thoughts as well' is about as convincing as this statement btw.

[Save The Dragons]

There's been a lot of pushing on Thor lately (including my killer case). Why are you trying to start something on Delta, when Thor is a scumread of yours?

So we agree that Trojan's up to something?
I don't wanna start something on him though D:

Like I said Trojan's bothered me. I don't know if it's him being weird or him or scummy.

Like, I thought Thor's target besides Jason was pretty obvious. Maybe I'm too close. But I'm sure someone could have surmised that. So that question kind of looks like asking a question just to appear engaged in the game.

I still don't like it. Not my fault.

Choosing to dismiss with 'not my fault' instead of trying to help me make sense of your town motivation isn't really winning me over.

[Thor665]

Ffrey is reading the game and has offered some thoughts as well.

'The tooth fairy is reading the game and has offered some thoughts as well' is about as convincing as this statement btw.

I was asked, specifically, if Ffrey was reading the game.
I wasn't using it as an argument for or against anything.
What the hell is this derp?

[Thor665]

I can't get over how derp and scummy that Save The Dragons post is.

"Is Ffrey reading?
Yes.
That's not very convincing!
...bwuh?

Like, what is the magical convincing it's supposed to generate? I didn't claim it supported or attacked anything, but he attacked it anyway after *asking* me to state it.
I don't think he's reading, I think he's just attacking.

[Egg]

Ok, so back on Page 13, I'm finding myself siding with Delta over STD, especially after STD's OMGUS.

I don't like Jason insisting that nothing about his Boon push was policy. At first, it very clearly looked that way. I'm referring to the "liability" post and the "don't want around late in the game" stuff. Granted, he presented other points and some of them were even before this. But those two posts are him using policy points to sell his case even if he didn't call it that. It feels like he is pretending not to realize that.

Thor, I know you said it's a mild read, but can you explain why you lean scum on Trojan?

She's following the game. She's still trying to figure Jason out.

No idea why, but this felt untrue the first time I read it.

I get the feeling Boon is intentionally avoiding voting Delta at the bottom of Page 14. Top of the next page doesn't convince me otherwise.

Our conversation is getting pedantic and neither of us are budging so I'm going to stop.

I can't help but wonder if STD's team told him stop arguing with Thor or he's gonna end up lynched.

Thor, what about Jason's token thing bothered you?

Thor, you mentioned twice that you wanted me to vote. I've been behind for most of the day. Without a good chunk of the info that this game has to offer, I haven't been comfortable voting.

Delta makes a good point about STD's OMGUS and it's along the same lines as what I was thinking. He didn't just OMGUS and be done with it. He tried to justify it.

There's nothing left for me to argue with you so I'm going to do my best to nip this conversation in the bud before it become too verbose

Ok, maybe this wasn't a "don't argue with Thor" thing and that's just how you end arguments...

Keep in mind, these are page 11 reads! Don't go over exaggerating everything like you all have been. I'll give you 6.

Yes. it's page 12. How are you possibly town reading all of those?

Is it just me or is this exactly the kind of exaggeration you warned us all about and now you're the one doing it to STD?

Not especially, but I'm sure I would've been lynched on the spot if I had done that...

You...weren't...just posting that to try and get a flash wagon going on BS, were you?

Pie can be town, but misguided I think on the Thor vote. I'm not exactly strong town reading Thor, but his style isn't really "work to solve the game". It's more "Guys, I solved the game early Day 1. Now follow me or you're dumb". And that's exactly what he's doing here. Well, to an extent. To be fair, he doesn't seem to be looking for the support the way he normally does and that's the one thing that stands out to me about his play.

Page 18 update on my scum reads. Nothing has changed with Boon/Jason. I think there is scum there. The only slight change is that I'm less convinced this could be scum cross bussing. STD has slipped into a scum read for me. The Trojan gut town read has dropped to maybe scum. Not scum with Jason though. I still don't see Fenchurch or sthar as being exactly obvtown. Fenchurch is still gut and if I ever decide I want to pursue that, I'll try to figure out why. But for right now, that's a very weak read. I'm on the fence on Mala and Thor. I respect both of their play and would probably be town reading them if I didn't know them to be good players. Consider them both weak town. Micc and Sleepykrew are gut/PoE town reads. Delta and Pie feel like town. Best guess at a scum team would be STD, Fenchurch, and one of Boon/Jason. Unfortunately, I'm more sure that one of Boon/Jason is scum than I am of either of the other two being scum so I'd like to sort that today. I realize I am, what's the word? "Watchful", maybe? of a lot of players here. I don't normally have many more scum reads than the number of scum in a game. But paranoia and gut reads seem to be getting the best of me here. When my V/LA is over, I want to get stronger reads on those players (Fenchurch, sthar, Trojan, Thor, Mala). That will be a priority for me.

Can you read in English? Egg never asked me for thoughts. He just announced that I was scum.

Something stood out to me and I said is much. I assumed you'd respond and you did. Just because I didn't ask anything specific doesn't mean I wasn't expecting a response from you. It's kind of how mafia works. Someone sees something scummy, points it out, and lays a vote. Person being voted responds. Response gets judged. Repeat until decision is made.

Oooh dismissive strawman. You can take that shit right back to wherever you bought it. Actually, it is just good scumplay to foster apathy and inactivity in the town. By attacking my immediate entrance into the game and painting my attempts to figure people out as scummy, Egg puts me on the defensive. I'll have trouble engaging if I'm spending time defending my first impressions, it makes getting into the game an uphill battle, and since I wind up spending time not generating game content it might make me into a viable mislynch.

LMAO. So you think I voted you just to make you not care about the game and easy to lynch? Sorry, but it's a huge stretch to think that I'd think along those lines and even if I did you aren't the player I'd fear most if I was scum. That's not at all how I play anyway.

I know I'm mad fucking close, but I'm out of time on the library computer (well, 4 min remaining but...lol). I've read up to my last content post. Should be able to finish by tomorrow hopefully.

[Save The Dragons]

I was hoping you'd have some forethought to read into the question

Like I dunno
"hey thor, Ceph wants to know if ffery is reading this game."
"yes."
"...uh...okay..."

So what the smurf is she saying? How the smurf should I know if she's reading the game if you're going to say yes or no and nothing more?

[Save The Dragons]

I can't help but wonder if STD's team told him stop arguing with Thor or he's gonna end up lynched.

fuck

Like seriously, the second people realize I'm not an entirely shitty player at this game the better off everyone's going to be.

[Save The Dragons]

Delta makes a good point about STD's OMGUS and it's along the same lines as what I was thinking. He didn't just OMGUS and be done with it. He tried to justify it.

It's impossible for me to develop a scumread on someone attacking me when I perceive their reasons to be poor.

Ok, maybe this wasn't a "don't argue with Thor" thing and that's just how you end arguments...

Do you want me to answer every question of Thor's in painstaking detail so he can respond and I can respond and we can clutter the thread in quote walls over and over? I'm willing to take the fucking hit to stop the madness. If you're reading this game, it's pretty clear I think he's scum and he thinks I'm scum.

If you think there's much more to be gained by talking to each other, you're crazy. It's not that fucking hard to figure that out, pretending like I stopped the argument because I was "losing" or "I looked bad" or "because I'm scum" is fucking stupid.

[Thor665]

Thor, I know you said it's a mild read, but can you explain why you lean scum on Trojan?

Mostly Nacho and Ffrey. Llamarble likes the slot and thinks he's team building...(?) but the other two find him a little shallow and empty. I agree with their takes. None of the reads are particularly strong but he feels opportunistic in a way to me, like he's drifting with the wind rather than planting and saying stuff - which I find extra strange in this format because, functionally, he should have lots of extra opinions being tossed at him. Makes it feel strategic.

Thor, what about Jason's token thing bothered you?

Basically that any non token talk equates to likely scum use of tokens - ergo; greater than random chance for scum from that team in any and all games they are part of.

So what the smurf is she saying? How the smurf should I know if she's reading the game if you're going to say yes or no and nothing more?

So when you said "that's not convincing" what you meant is "could you tell me some of her thoughts?"
Bollocks.
Here's one of her thoughts - she is actually town reading your slot.
I am convinced she is a fool because you are doing scum gak like this.

[Save The Dragons]

Like, what is the magical convincing it's supposed to generate? I didn't claim it supported or attacked anything, but he attacked it anyway after *asking* me to state it.

Why the smurf can't I just ask you a smurfing question and get a smurfing answer? You make a big show out of it and claim it has to do with 'supporting' or 'attacking' or anything. I want to know because I don't believe you; you're going to have to do better than 'yes' or 'no' to convince me of smurf.

I think you're talking from your smurfing smurf and I would like to be convinced otherwise on the off chance you are town which if you were by the way you really should lose the smurfing attitude because if I'm town and you're town you're getting me smurfing riled up and is that what you want? I doubt it but I doubt you considered it; you haven't needed to because you're scum.

If half the arguments against me are going to boil down to "well, he's not very good" then I'm smurfing tired of this smurf maybe you should just smurfing lynch me already so you can realize how wrong and dumb that belief is.

Look. I admit my statement was a bit tongue in cheek, but it makes its point...you threw that out like it was nothing, if someone is scum reading you, how the smurf are they supposed to believe you. Like, honestly. No, you aren't thinking like I could be town, you never have, that's why I think you're scum because you're solely focused on smearing my name.

Thor is scum
Boon is his buddy
Anything else, I dunno yet. One of them should hang.

[Save The Dragons]

So when you said "that's not convincing" what you meant is "could you tell me some of her thoughts?"
Bollocks.

No you smurf

Ceph would like to know if ffery is reading this game.

^
THAT MEANS TELL ME SOME OF HER THOUGHTS

Can you honestly sit here and tell me "oh yeah, I think he'll be satisfied with a yes or no to that question, that's what he meant by that."

[Save The Dragons]

Here's one of her thoughts - she is actually town reading your slot.

Why was that so smurfing hard

For the love of god

Seriously

Fuck me