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In post 2655, RCEnigma wrote:
Hey! I’ve read 5ish pages, I have….varying confidence in reads but one was that meuh was town, so that’s nice I guess.
At the very least pushing to hammer in the middle of finding a replacement is !SKETCHY! So that’s also nice, I guess.
Idk what kind of bit I’m doing but I’ll probably keep it going till I get bored, I guess.
What are your current thoughts on
Spare
/
Fight
?
Well….I’m personally on the back foot having little to no gamestate knowledge so mountainous doesn’t really benefit me as a player. But that’s selfish, otherwise I wouldn’t mind playing the game straight up.
do you ever have those D1's where you emphatically believe someone is scum despite your top two townreads telling you that they are town, but you ignore that and proceed to eliminate said scumread, AND they actually flip town
that's me
that's my character arc right now
Yep, then I practice the art of shutting up and it turns out my second strongest scumread was scum that never got pushed because I stfu and it feels pretty great….
The pairing read was mostly what Dann was doing, not what Taly was doing but the reconsideration was based on what Taly was doing and not Dann.
now im curious
So my process was kind of like, based on the back and forth I think Dann is kind of townie/ Taly is kind of…eh I’ll think about it later. But iiiif Dann is scum, it’s the exact kind of nothing topic that leads nowhere and gives some room for early distancing.
Because it’s a pivot point, at any point it’s pretty easy to look back on it and go ehh yeah I guess I can see how town would think that, and hand wave it.
I think recently I saw you still pushing the dann possible scum angle and it’s enough distance from that early game to read it as provisionally genuine. Obviously I need to read the game to confirm if it’s true and that I really believe it.
Do you always bold usernames? It brings attention to the eyes but is also slightly intimidating.
I'm not new to mafia, no! Why do I give off that impression? I've played video mafia and forum mafia before although I saw undertale theme and was like 'omg I have to join this.'
I want to know more about this tbh, I thought what I said was pretty mild
saying you town lean toriel just seems like the safest possible thing you could say that can also be classified as game talk
and that is regardless of dunnstral's alignment
do you have thoughts on anyone else so far
Keyleth and Mandate passed the vibe check
Also whats safe here? I don't get how what I said is protective on a game that just began. Much less effective to try and pocket Dunn, hypothetically.
I mean I've sat here looking at this on and off for the last couple hours and I really do think this is just two scum, the way the two of them force an engagement with each other over everything else in thread at this point, the difference in tone from the surrounding commentary on actually game related materials, and the follow up behaviour. It's also worth pointing out that Keyleth in this game uses emojis exactly twice and they are both in these responses to Taly which helps to make that exchange stand out even more from everything else that the two of them have done this game.
Ok see this is the kind of posting I’m a sucker for. So.
In post 317, Lazy Shirou wrote:
I think the main thread roleplaying was even funnier at some points though
but maybe that's just me
p-edit: Sakura...townie?
she's got a lot of idc energy
In post 618, Aristeia wrote:
sakura is probably the easiest player in the playerlist to read and she's p townie so far
In post 625, Aristeia wrote:
she's more self conscious as mafia and makes posts that feel like she's thought them through more
I think Ari summarized it very well in those posts. I'm bringing her since she's your pre-predecessor and you know her alignment.
If you ask me, all i can say is that i dont have any confidence in explaining anything this game, not even myself, been lost for the majority of it and a lot have been gut pings.
Also you should know that im currently busy IRL, and so i only read and post in bursts.
I like this. I’m inclined to trust aristeia’s take.
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Post #2712 (isolation #14) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:18 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
In post 2693, Alisae wrote:
All of the people that immediately are like "OK NEXT INACTIVE" are mafia
Agreed, but I’d probably look into Shirou/key, then the others that I haven’t read posts from yet, then Ydrasse. Idk if you have deeper suspicion you’re basing the Ydrasse read on.
In post 2693, Alisae wrote:
All of the people that immediately are like "OK NEXT INACTIVE" are mafia
assuming this is subtweeting me this is also just incredibly inane
meuh has 5th most posts in the game, she wasn't being arbitrarily limmed for inactivity
I've said for a while that Ari's slot is in my PoE
I am potentially willing to buy the townslip just because I don't really think scum ali would be especially likely to fake it. Not because of not being capable just because of like, idk why e would
That wasn’t really directed at the votes on meuh, just the slots that saw meuh flip and went “well…scum is probably just not playing then” because what kind of logic leap is that when you have a whole wagon that just flipped a townie.
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Post #2715 (isolation #16) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:27 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
I’m also in a particularly interesting position knowing my own slots alignment. So on my rep in I read the page or two before, saw meuh was flipped as town. Saw Shirou immediately go, well since RM isn’t playing that’s a good next vote and thought wow that’s a really Wolfy post to make.
Given the context, even without knowing my alignment it’s just not good.
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Post #2720 (isolation #18) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 1:34 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
So the way I was reading mandate in the first errr 8 pages or so was like I was in newbie queue with a playerlist that wants to take a serious approach to mafia, which I do like in general. But from the perspective of an SE so I have a checklist of things I suggest new players look for when hunting alignments and mandate kind of hit the checklist for me.
Idk what kind of impact Ydrasse has or hasn’t made on the game yet so I’m, at least somewhat curious what the deeper context is.
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Post #2804 (isolation #24) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 10:49 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
In post 2741, implosion wrote:
0-dimensional chess is my new term for a post that seems to want to ignore the nuance of WIFOM and call something that "scum would obviously do" scummy, even when it'd definitely be apparent to that person that what they were doing was scummy, so why would they make that post in the first place. Particularly w someone like Shirou with a noted scumgame and lots of experience.
Calling something 0-dimensional chess is not the same thing as making a too scummy to be scum argument, because that phrase is loaded and incorrect sometimes whereas this new one is always accurate
I can consider wifom and Occam’s razor will still say scummy thing is probably scummy.
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Post #2805 (isolation #25) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 10:50 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
But yeah it’s like a foothold vote while I get deeper into the game. I think I’ve implied that but explicitly saying it takes away from the vote….so that’s cool now, I guess.
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Post #2817 (isolation #27) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 11:39 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
There is enough dead end probing just in the few posts you quoted that I think is scum indicative. Or at least indicative of surface solving. I don’t think there would be a drastic flip to that if I deep dive in freedoms iso but…
Also have issues with implosion recent posting but I can bin it since I see at least a possible world it comes from town.
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Post #2820 (isolation #28) » Thu Nov 16, 2023 11:53 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
Yeah idk Alisae I’m on page 15 right now and every mandate post is like….man that’s a really town process. I just don’t see scum even considering “oh I have to skirt around this overarching concept because even mentioning it could potentially invalidate catching scum in a strategy with a potentially large flaw”
The potentially parts are particularly notable to me since I often find myself setting slots up with a scum expectation and form a better read on whether they meet or move away from that expectation but that’s on a grander scale.
In post 167, Mandate wrote:
It definitely helps that this is the kind of setup where I fully expect scum to be going full on buddying each other trying to make a pseudo townbloc
Why would you expect scum necessarily to go "full on buddying each other"?
Fight route looks similar to mountainous and sparing a mafia in Mercy route through a "pseudo townblock" would cause suspicious to be cast on the people in it afterwards
I think scum would be more likely to try to buddy other players in this game but I don't understand why they would willingly associate themselves and risk diminishing their individual odds of being spared after one of them is
I think, personally this just goes to show that when you have something like this, there's a lot of unexplored ways on how a wolf could or should play it. Getting locked into the mindset of how they would is sort of exactly what I think they'd want us to do?
That's why I personally wanted to go Mercy because it's like, a lot easier to just let people show their thoughts and everything they feel in a good light vs who is trying to work the thread to their advantage.
A keyleth post I like. Shows some consistency and doesn’t come off as a cop out to not scumhunt.
In post 376, Mandate wrote:
I actually sort of feel the opposite, I think it it gets into a big game of people fighting to be the most town it becomes a lot harder to solve, but I don't think it's as important whether we spare or kill as not sparing scum!Dunnstral and not killing town!Dunnstral.
Really? In my experience of video mafia and other stuff it at least felt a lot harder for wolves to fake a townread on their teammate vs making a wolfcase on inconsistencies of weaknesses villagers do. Maybe I'm incorrect in my theory and have a bit of choo choo brain because of my urge to send over all of Dann/You/Taly
Video mafia makes sense. My first impression of forum mafia was that it would translate pretty smoothly and it did not…
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Post #2825 (isolation #32) » Fri Nov 17, 2023 12:06 am
Postby RCEnigma »
In post 389, Mandate wrote:
I haven't actually calculated the EV of either option and I want to do that before I answer that question. I think nearly always the play is spare unless I'm quite sure Dunnstral is scum but since spare + kill removes two of the most townread players per phase as opposed to Lim+NK lopping one from top and one from bottom it might actually not be as good an option as it seems at race value.
I didn’t even really consider sparing takes town power away from town just by virtue of being right. I guess it’s negligible with enough townbeards and a mechanical plan *bingle*…probably.
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Post #2829 (isolation #35) » Fri Nov 17, 2023 12:19 am
Postby RCEnigma »
Page 17 added reads
-beeboy town
-Merlyn scum, just because I just remember they existed and that doesn’t feel….Merlyn…y
-Shirou could actually be towning and the forces Dunn deeper into a scum Poe for me.
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Post #2833 (isolation #38) » Fri Nov 17, 2023 12:32 am
Postby RCEnigma »
Reads are looking like:
Town af - alisae
Town - Taly/Ydrasse
Reasonably town - brown eyes/Sakura
Growing on me - Shirou/keyleth/beeboy
Eh idk - dann
—————-
Dunn goes here
Dunno pile - shirou/implosion
Freedom
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Post #2834 (isolation #39) » Fri Nov 17, 2023 12:38 am
Postby RCEnigma »
How do I feel about that? I’m only really confident in the top three.
Brown eyes isn’t very prevalent in the game up to where I’ve read but his posting is good. That’s so vague but I guess it’s…tonal/vibe?
Same with Sakura and having an endorsement from my predecessor is a plus.
Shirou & keyleth both have positive and negatives so I can go either way with the reads until I get deeper in the game. But I guess it pushes beeboy to the front of that group.
Dann is an interesting slot that I only have this low because of datisis university where I gave him a lot of wiggle room for being loose, aggressive against slots I wouldn’t expect from scum, and having complex progressions that I didn’t expect from scum!dann. Even if I did consider him a strong scum player to begin with. So he’s kind of suffering from a shorter leash via recency bias.
In post 2401, Sakura Hana wrote:
If it's between Meuh and Alisae i... dont really know which one to vote, but i'd probably go back to Meuh now that Alisae's actually playing. I'd rather eliminate freedom tho.
then vote there but explain why
I thought I already did, but Merlyn's vote on me gave me weird feelings. VOTE: freedom
In post 2857, Taly wrote:
im not saying thats what you said, im telling you my thought process
dann
said there is not a coherent reason to scumread
ydra
and i figured it would be more effective to justify the townread rather than pushback on the wagon itself
I can't really speak for Dann on the matter but I'm trying to think of both in a context but I don't see why one is townier or wolfier than the other? Maybe I should go reread it again under new information. I jisut assumed stuff like this was playstyle clash because both accomplish the same goal it's just how you're doing it, no?
Given we plan on going spare I can see both worlds where you want your wolf teammate to be townread so they get spared but not connected because of how bad that looks flip wise ya know? However, I will sob if two of my strongest TR's are both wolves.
I know that's not what you're saying, but it's where my brain led. I like the conversation though cause if I'm wrong someone needs to bonk me.
Well the former is in good faith and the latter has the potential to be dubious.
So why you would do this as scum is that you kill multiple birds with one stone. If you as scum know X slot is town and being pushed you can push against the wagon and still get in a better standing with X slot by virtue of doing so. But you also discredit the slots that are pushing X.
It also leaves an Avenue to pivot onto X slot because you didn’t explicitly townread X slot at the time you just disapproved of the wagon for whatever reason and it seems like a more natural progression than a raw 180 on X slot.
In post 2401, Sakura Hana wrote:
If it's between Meuh and Alisae i... dont really know which one to vote, but i'd probably go back to Meuh now that Alisae's actually playing. I'd rather eliminate freedom tho.
then vote there but explain why
I thought I already did, but Merlyn's vote on me gave me weird feelings. VOTE: freedom
Is this not a thing for you anymore Sakura?
I heavily disliked Dann's vote and reasoning on me.
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Post #2880 (isolation #51) » Fri Nov 17, 2023 1:18 pm
Postby RCEnigma »
In post 2820, RCEnigma wrote:
Yeah idk Alisae I’m on page 15 right now and every mandate post is like….man that’s a really town process. I just don’t see scum even considering “oh I have to skirt around this overarching concept because even mentioning it could potentially invalidate catching scum in a strategy with a potentially large flaw”
The potentially parts are particularly notable to me since I often find myself setting slots up with a scum expectation and form a better read on whether they meet or move away from that expectation but that’s on a grander scale.
RC is actually one of the handful of players I was saying could reasonably do this as scum.