Animal Rescue: petsPick (Game Over!)

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Vote: jason

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Unvote, vote: Quilford

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He's scum. Just read his iso.

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C.E.S. Can you actually show us please? I am not really getting anything scummy on Quil. In fact, I would be more likely to examine the wagon on him for potential scum.

I can't, mostly because I was making it up.

Unvote, vote: lew

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I did but I don't understand what Angry Birds has to do with this and now my brain hurts ow ow ow

It was a dumb joke anyway.

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<-- totally bussing

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Fairly sure you haven't.

<-- totally bussing

Are you being, as Fate would say, a cheeky scumbag?

Too late! You already called me town, can't take that back.

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For the most part, yes. I get more serious as the game progresses.

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Role =/= Alignment

To have my role confirmed overnight, I need a player to claim what animal is his pet today. I will confirm the truth of the information at the beginning of day 2.

How you think this confirms your role, is beyond me.

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78

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Since when? It's a good plan. Pie'd be proud.

Unvote, vote: jason

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Oh hey, it does. Still, if we can force the scum's hand that way, that's good for us.

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I see no indication that multiple pets are possible.

And of course the role is beneficial to the town. Extra town-directed kill is always good regardless of the limitations it has - even if none of the scum are cats, you could vig someone suspicious who had claimed his pet and save us a lynch.

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UNVOTE, VOTE: LLAMA

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Amrun gets it.

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aka he's a limited vig

This is not a difficult concept.

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Save a lynch, duh.

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(And not disappointing Pie.)

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No, it saves us a lynch. Next thing you'll say we shouldn't mass claim D1.

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*Next Day*
Lewarcher82: "Gosh, I'm still alive. I don't know what happened, Mafia must have either roleblocked me or maybe glowball was lying about her dog-claim."

And then he gets lynched. Lynching him D2 instead of D1 is not particularly meaningful.

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I see no reason to assume scum have a roleblocker.

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I don't believe it at all, it doesn't account for multiple pets or pets other than cats/dogs.

Hypothetical problems are the very best kind.

Did xvart counter-wagon attempt to save scum-partner lewarcher82 by trying to push cases on town-jasonT1981 & town-Quilford?

No.

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I'll unvote and sheep you if you can give me a plausible explanation for why town-lewarcher82 would have said the above now that you know his full claim.

'Cause it's true.

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You know what other role kills regardless of alignment? EVERY OTHER KILLING ROLE.

He's just a limited vig.

(Hint: see Vanilla Vigilante in PYP5, works fairly similarly)

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Well, for one, in this case lewSK's best bet'd probably be to try and shoot scum and then claim it as a vig shot.

Whoops, sorry. I meant to say that he apparently kills pets arbitrarily.

Arbitrarily how?

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Just look at the vanilla vig (i.e. could only vig vanillas) in PYP5, Quilford. Roles were distributed by a draft system, so alignments of the vanillas was fairly random (as it turned out, none of the scum were vanilla) - still a completely valid role and beneficial too.

IT'S ARBITRARY WHO HE KILLS. NO MATTER WHO HE PICKS, WHETHER HE THINKS THEY'RE TOWN OR SCUM, HE WILL DIE UNLESS THEY'RE A CAT. HOW THE SHIT IS THIS FAIR ON HIM UNLESS HE HAS SOME WAY TO DISCERN WHO SOMEONE'S PET IS, HMM?

Because people are never in a position where they'd claim their pet. (This observation basically amounts to "he's better off not using his action early on"; not a big deal.)

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Also:

Govern: lewarcher

Booyah.

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so

who wants to test it?

Zorzor'll announce it, no worries.

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Ah, but here, Role PMs were written after alignment was randomised.

Which means, given say 2 scum cats, it makes even more sense as a role? I don't see the problem.

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Last, no animals were harmed in the production of this game. Human owners are killed, not their pets. The mafia is trying to kill people so they can take their pets to Petvana. Know that even the mafia wants what is best for your critter.

I am Mao-Tse-Tung, and I am a town assassin cat. Each night I can decide to visit a player. If that player has a cat, I will kill him. If that player has a dog, I will die. The flavour is connected with the real biography of my former cat Mao, who was killed by a dog.

But why does he kill other cats? What's the flavor reasoning for that?

NINJA'D. Mao was an extremely aggressive cat. No other cat in the neighborhood as long as he was alive.

@Cogito Ergo Sum - Why are you so terrible at this game? Why waste a governance on someone who is clearly scum and you would lynch tomorrow anyways?

Okay, that might be a valid point. But part of the plan I was in favour was him getting lynched tomorrow if he was still alive, so don't know what you're complaining about with the second comment.

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You do realize this entire discussion has been made moot by my governing lew, right?

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So CES totally has one post to clarify whether he actually governed lewarcher, since zoraster didn't visibly register anything. I'll pay my end forward.

Apparently, zorzor is a stickler for using the provided syntax.

Governate: lewarcher

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Grrr

Governate:

lewarcher

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Of course my govern works outside of twilight. Zorzor's just being a syntax nazi; he'll tell you all about in the next VC.

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It almost makes me think there's a role out there whose functioning is somehow dependent on syntax.

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Vote: VP

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The main downside to claiming Census Taker results is probably having to claim Census Taker, so yeah.

Not sure who I like for scum the most right now.

VP

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Why do I need to explain my fake governing? It's in essence just a reverse fake daykill. It probably would've worked better if lew had been active, but on the whole I think it was useful.

P.S. VP still scum.

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Why do I need to explain my fake governing? It's in essence just a reverse fake daykill. It probably would've worked better if lew had been active, but on the whole I think it was useful.

Useful for what? What info did you gleam from it?

A bunch of people responded well (glowball, UT, you, Amrun). I don't like that 'marble completely ignored it. Jason arguing it was fake based on mechanics after I had given up trying to convince people it was real seems less likely coming from daytalking scum.

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How was it obvious? Governing lew made sense given what I had said in thread and I even said zorzor would confirm it.

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'Marble, I'm currently displeased with the votescape, so one of two things is going to happen:
1) you switch back to VP
2) I switch over to your wagon.

It's your choice.

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If you suspect one person the most, there's no reason to vote for suspect #2 in most cases, at least without an explanation.

Oh, you. So naive.

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I disagree with that sentiment to the point that I haven't even bothered to think about whom I find more suspicious out of VP and 'marble. There's nothing special about one's #1 suspect.

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Haha, joke's on you. I totally don't mind a Ghostlinwagon.

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Are you still on that, Vi? Yeah, you ruined that beautiful little play, but I'm over it now.

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the governor ploy last night seemed a big distraction ploy to me with not much effect

^scum

(I mean, jeez, distraction ploy, really. That's barely even a thing. If I did it as scum, it'd be for town cred.)

There, Vi, you got something out of me. (Really, you seem to pick the worst games to be in with me so far.)

the proportion of obviously Town things he has done hasn't been that high.

I've done obviously town things?

Unvote, vote: 'marble

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Should've checked the VC.

Unvote, vote: Ghostlin

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Unvote, vote: 'marble

Vi, with me!

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FoS: Vi

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You're on the 'marblewagon now, Vi. Stay faithful.

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The Obnoxious Lurkers Tier is the best tier.

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Reck might currently be the best player on MS.

Maybe if he bothered to show up for all of his games.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt mostly because we have plenty of good suspects.

Unvote, vote: Ghostlin

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More likely is that he forgot.

Jason is towns.

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If he's trying to argue that the third party isn't a killer, the how are the odds of VP Baltar being scum increased?

Third party being a killing role need merely be a possibility for the logic to work. The reasoning is sound; the conclusion just isn't nearly as strong as you guys are making it out to be.

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Cogito Ergo Sum: Null or bad scum

That one's easy: null. I pretty much rock as scum.

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I don't like this plan. It requires basically a role reveal from VPB to accomplish. :/ I can't think of any real alternative, though.

It's a role madness game, so not really.

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You know you want to vote for Ghostlin, Vi. Listen to the tiny Triceratops of Reason inside your head. It knows what it's talking about.

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For far out speculation, I'd go with "Quilford's pet must be a horse who stomps its hooves when counting something" to get a role like that. But I'm not going there.

Quilford's pet is Kluger Hans?

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On Ghostlin, preferably.

(Sotty7, llamarble, Jason and saulres should vote for Ghostlin too.

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Jasonwagon is silly.

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*gasp* DDD is pushing the lynch of a townie.

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2) It's not the same at all. Hearing the word 'third party' and thinking SK is not the same as saying 'there was only one kill last night, therefore VP is the SK.'

Good thing no one is saying that then!

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Yes they are. Try reading the game.

No, they aren't.

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You do realize I'm just not guessing as what people have said, right? Both xvart and 'marble's comments were far more reasonable than what you're describing.

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and which is making me very confused about Llamarble's alignment because I'm not sure whether a one-shot Tracker and a full Tracker would exist on the same faction

1) This is entirely possible.
2) Role madness
3) Zorzor's recent mini had 2 Town Trackers.

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Go go Ghostlinwagon.

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if someone with more time could get everyone's short lists then maybe we could find a common target to get rid of?

Ghostlin

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Also I'm not sure of a Ghostlin lynch anymore, but whatever.

Why do you hate America?

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Is it weird that I want to say there were no scum on the Day 1 lynch?

Yes.

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I feel like I have been manipulated onto the Ghostlin wagon by CES and VPB in particular.

I'm such an evil mastermind.

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I remember I moved my vote off Ghostlin because I was worried he might flip town.

You only vote for confirmed scum?

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I would've governed Jason anyway.

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P-edit: yes, L-1.

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roles resolving outside their stated resolution order

The census taker ability doesn't need to resolve before the nightkill for Quilford's result to make sense; it just needs to give him information about an earlier point in time. It seems like a valid way of running a census taker role to me.

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2 quick points, saulres:
1) the Census Taker role doesn't care for current information, so a Mod obviously has more freedom there
2) Census Taker is not Investigative (in fact, the category Zor uses is called "Investigations" which makes it even clearer); a Census Taker isn't fooled by Godfathers, Millers, Framers or Lawyers.

So now I'm going to make a flavour argument: what does an Census Taker do during the Night? I would imagine he either asks some Oracle the amount of scum, town and third-party in the game (e.g. at the end of D1) and the Oracle tells him or he tricks people into taking an online poll during the Night from which then deduces said information himself, in which case incorporating that Night's nightkill into the results seems somewhat unnatural.

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its*

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Haha, you totally stole Sotty's thunder. Sweet.