Mini Normal 2316 | Halloween | Endgame

[Black]

Maybe you're right python. I want to trust my gut here though

[usesPython]

Maybe you're right python. I want to trust my gut here though

I think if you're trusting a gut read hard enough to give Hu Tao a pass here you might be too tunneled

[Black]

Ok

[Black]

OWER/python/x

Maybe Shea? But I think he could actually be town here

[usesPython]

OWER/python/x

Maybe Shea? But I think he could actually be town here

Crazy that Hu Tao isn't on there

[usesPython]

We're literally saying that a doctor claim after a no kill isn't a mech clear and asking for a fullclaim, how is that not an obvious soft

I read that as you thinking Hu Tao was lying but I didn’t think you were trying to soft something. That makes sense now though

BlackStar/Hu Tao not paired, I think if scum!BlackStar knew Hu Tao was fakeclaiming they would have seen the soft

[usesPython]

We're literally saying that a doctor claim after a no kill isn't a mech clear and asking for a fullclaim, how is that not an obvious soft

I read that as you thinking Hu Tao was lying but I didn’t think you were trying to soft something. That makes sense now though

BlackStar/Hu Tao not paired, I think if scum!BlackStar knew Hu Tao was fakeclaiming they would have seen the soft

Like I think if both of them were scum their first instinct wouldn't have been "Python thinks Hu Tao is lying" but "Oh shit person whos night action Hu Tao is stealing is coming out"

[usesPython]

OWER/python/x

Maybe Shea? But I think he could actually be town here

Crazy that Hu Tao isn't on there

Like legitimately if you think an uncontested BP claim after a no kill is scum cause we're going after Hu Tao over OWER then you really need to go and reset for a bit

[Thestatusquo]

This game has been awful. No one can scumread anyone without getting flamed for it. This whole "FUCK YOU FOR THINKING ITS ME" bullshit really ruined the game for me. The rules literally say to be kind and no personal attacks and that never gets enforced. We have a literal mod in here breaking the rule on multiple occasions. It's disgusting

Bruh on the real there has been almost nothing in this game outside the normal realm of Mafia game play and if you're really blowing your top and calling the game awful over anything in this game as anything other that ate you should really reevaluate.

On the one hand I agree with you that people should be nice to each other but on the other hand when someone decides that the mildest stuff is toxic and starts ate-ing about how awful everyone is being when it's just a normal ass Mafia game just because people don't agree with her and scum read her it also makes the game toxic. Sometimes you really need to take a look in the damn mirror dude.

[Thestatusquo]

Like I can't make a comment that is super relevant to the game about how you're overreacting to 2 votes. I.e. something Mafia FREQUENTLY do in order to try to seem like a voice of reason in response to a wagon without you acting like it's somehow a personal attack.

It's not. And it's extremely frustrating that you keep interacting with everyone who disagrees with you or scum reads you this way.

[Thestatusquo]

Confirm VOTE: black

In really fucking sick of how you're playing.

[SmileyDude1]

It's late, so i don't have time for this now, but I do have some players that I'll probably reread within short order (probs tomorrow).

OWER- A slot that I kind of town leaned based on vibes day 1 and then zoned out from my head. Reading back through day 1 votes on Wartortle, I came out thinking their vote felt the worst out of those on the front end of that wagon due to their 556 vote feeling more on the sheepy side (it was essentially restating the original case) and then a lack of followup on that vote afterwards. Warrants a deeper look

usesPython- Kind of zoned the slot out this day phase, so want to reread there. Might also be good to reread day 1 to see if it helps clarify my read there

Blackstar- A slot that I haven't really paid much attention to in general. Hoping to get a more concrete read on the slot upon reread.

Ooof, I fell asleep last night before I could post the results of this. Sorry for the wait .

OWER- After rereading, this slot goes down a good amount for me. Rereading through Black's case of them in 561 I found myself leaning towards agreeing with them in terms of their reads being hedgy. Feel worse about the 556 vote after realizing it was a 1 post progression from town to scum in regards to Wartortle there. Reading their argument on Roden (and Blackstar's counterargument afterwards), I find myself agreeing with Blackstar that there are some jumps in logic being made here. I don't think on it's own that it's particularly scummy, but I don't find it endorsing either.

usesPython- I think I have them as a town lean again after rereading their ISO. Looking back at my 911, I had originally lowered them due to being worried about their vote having potential to be more of an opportunistic one on the early-middle part of the Wartortle Wagon. Thinking it over, I think pretty much all of the middle wagon on Wartortle (myself included) jumped on due to agreeing with the front end of the wagon in regards to Wartortle which makes sorting the intentions of the wagon members a bit complicated. Going deeper, I think I vibe with usesPython's content post-Wartortle vote from a solving standpoint about as much as I do my own at this point (I think usesPython's shift towards Wartortle came off as more sudden then my own, but I think they did a better job interacting with Wartortle and others afterwards). Skimming over their day 2, I'd say I'm liking their content here as well. I'm getting good vibes out of their Blackstar interaction and they're action as a mediator at points this daay phase (gives me vibes of town who wants to keep the game on track).

Blackstar- Through reading, my general conclusion is that this is just a really solid ISO to me. Plenty of solving, reconsideration of points that they may have been wrong on (527), the defense of Roden after their self-vote (I doubt scum in Blackstar's position sticks their neck out for Roden like that regardless of what Roden's alignment is. Also bonus points for giving a new perspective to the Black/Roden interaction) there's a lot of towny things here. Think I have them as a townread now.

[SmileyDude1]

Kinda have this gut feeling that this is a losing gamestate. All the fights feel TvT and every time we push on the lurkers they give decent responses but there's also 0 town cohesion and half the playerlist is off doing their own thing

So how about everyone gives a lim pool of three and we'll consolidate from there?

Would say right now i'm at Hu Tao, OWER, Enchant.

Hu Tao- Was on the verge of winding up in here regardless for me due to lack of a strong read, the doctor claim and retract is pretty bad in my eyes though (to say the least). @Hu Tao, unsure if you've already answered this, but can you explain why town you would elect to fake a doctor claim here?

OWER- Yeah looking back through their ISO, I think their vote on Wartortle was pretty bad in hindsight. It's both the intensity of a shift in opinion that happened in the course of 1 post and the lack of follow through on the vote afterwards that are giving me pings here. I don't think their day 2 was all that bad, but I also don't get anything that overrides the day 1 shift here.

Enchant- Getting pinged for reasons that could be found in my 1105. Don't think it makes too much sense to come up with a tenative solve like that and then vote outside of it so quickly after. Part of me wants to wave it off due to the player, but then Enchant kind of doesn't do anything with the solve or the OWER afterwards either, like they're kind of just here for the ride. As people have mentioned, Enchant does have a semi-serious gamesolving side to them and I just don't think this behavior tracks with that. It's not helping that the more I think about Enchant's position towards me, the more my brain gets paranoid that they're trying to shade me.

[SmileyDude1]

VOTE: Hu Tao

While I await your response.

[SmileyDude1]

That's E-3 (functionally maybe an E-2) btw

[TheHoldSteady]

VOTE: OutworldER

I don't like everything I've seen from Black, but with the Macho watcher claim I feel like we can afford to leave her alone for today. I townread Smiley and Python right now. POE on Wartortle's bandwagon yesterday is telling me that its Outworld

[usesPython]

THS rn has that slimy "Oh shit my partner did something dumb" playing both sides vibe going on where he "has" to react to the doctor claim but also doesn't really wanna have that be the focus of the thread while trying to pull back to the OWER lim

I'm making the doctor claim the focus of the thread because I'm not resting until Hu Tao answers

VOTE: OutworldER

I don't like everything I've seen from Black, but with the Macho watcher claim I feel like we can afford to leave her alone for today. I townread Smiley and Python right now. POE on Wartortle's bandwagon yesterday is telling me that its Outworld

[TheHoldSteady]

I haven't forgotten about the doctor claim, don't worry.

[TheHoldSteady]

Why do you want me to suspect Hu Tao so badly?

[Black]

Like I can't make a comment that is super relevant to the game about how you're overreacting to 2 votes. I.e. something Mafia FREQUENTLY do in order to try to seem like a voice of reason in response to a wagon without you acting like it's somehow a personal attack.

It's not. And it's extremely frustrating that you keep interacting with everyone who disagrees with you or scum reads you this way.

For the record I don't think your L-5 comment was a personal attack or disrespectful. My 1374 was about some of the stuff you said before that

In really fucking sick of how you're playing.

Ditto

[TheHoldSteady]

Hu Tao you have 24 hours to explain why you claimed Doctor or else I'm voting you and not switching.

[usesPython]

Why do you want me to suspect Hu Tao so badly?

Don't twist our words, we're calling you out for doing the scum thing you said you wouldn't be doing

[TheHoldSteady]

Why do you want me to suspect Hu Tao so badly?

Don't twist our words, we're calling you out for doing the scum thing you said you wouldn't be doing

That's what you're saying, but what it really feels like is you're indirectly pressuring me to vote Hu Tao.

[Enchant]

VOTE: SmileyDude1

Amogus

[usesPython]

Why do you want me to suspect Hu Tao so badly?

Don't twist our words, we're calling you out for doing the scum thing you said you wouldn't be doing

That's what you're saying, but what it really feels like is you're indirectly pressuring me to vote Hu Tao.

That argument only works if Hu Tao flips red