Mini 2321: Classic Commercials (Postgame)

[Hu Tao]

If you wanted a cop to investigate me, and no one has claimed a guilty on me. Why are you trying to push me today?

[Flavor Leaf]

Leaf I think this is just another Yessiree situation where a scum PR claimed No Result on a bad target when they shouldn't have, and Hu Tao is just in my position from that game

Nah, it goes a lot deeper than that. Hu Tao is protecting themselves more than protecting Celebloki here.

Hu Tao has also been threat preventing me without trying to engage all game and dumb playing when I’ve put large posts and cases together on why Hu Tao is scum.

Like I’m actually more positive on Hu Tao scum here than Celebloki, but i don’t think it’s impossible they’re both scum here.

[Dunnstral]

People playing in the background this day phase: AnimatedWiz, Hu Tao, RCEnigma, SirCakez, Thomith

I dont feel like I'm playing in the background. Ik less active today for sure, but that's because I've been busy. I feel like when I have been contributing I have been putting myself out there, rather than only chiming in to defend myself or the like.
Is there anything specific you think I'm doing to "fade into the background" that I can respond to/understand why you think that?

You are going off the assumption that mafia are scrambling to try to save me and piling onto you. I'm not mafia so likely mafia are instead sitting back doing nothing, if you are town. I find Thomith's current position suspect, they apparently want to vote me out but are voting for you instead. AnimatedWiz's iso is 85% about me and 10% defending themself. I mean look at this:

Spoiler:

Hu Tao pops in every so often to say we should eliminate someone but gives no reasoning and then makes a filler post and leaves, and then 24 hours later comes back in and says we should eliminate the same person again with no new reasoning. SirCakez seems to be busy but is angling for you in their latest post - it's a bit of a mystery what they think about me. RCEnigma's last post is saying we need votes for pressure and they're the only player not voting. They have offered some talk of the wagon but not much else, including not giving a clear stance - they just call it 'interesting'.

I voted cele because of the random fluff posting midway through the day that pinged me, and haven't seen a reason to unvote since.

I am also aware that I may be tunelled on you, so am exploring other ideas.

Most of your posts today have been asking other players questions without it being clear what you are getting from it, and lazily continuing your push on me.

Spoiler:

In all seriousness, Bingle/Dunn have partner equity imo.

Why do you think they have partner equity?

How come?

For Flavor Leaf I don't like the way they pushed yesterday and now today. For AnimatedWiz I get the sense that they are playing back and trying to blend in while asking others their thoughts while occasionally trying to steer things towards an elimination on people pushing them.

You don't like the fact that they are pushing or you don't like exactly how they are pushing?

Interesting night kill?

What do you mean by this? Why was Kyouko an interesting night kill?

I think I trust Hu Tao

Why?

Thom who do you scumread the most today?

I still feel suspicious mostly of Dunnstral, As I've said before I suspected him early on, and I haven't really seen much to make me feel any better about him so far today.

I do not think that is good logic.

Why not?

VOTE: Dunn

E-2

How about slowing down a bit? E-2 when we have like 8 days left?

Who are you scumreading?

I have someone else I want to put some pressure on, but I think I want to wait a bit for people to come in and react to the current things before I move on.

I’m open to a Dunn/Wiz town/town world.

Is it thomith? I bet it’s thomith. Hey everybody, if you vote thomith now you can accuse FL of sheeping you in the post game.

Did you think I should be pressured?

I have someone else I want to put some pressure on, but I think I want to wait a bit for people to come in and react to the current things before I move on.

I’m open to a Dunn/Wiz town/town world.

Is it thomith? I bet it’s thomith. Hey everybody, if you vote thomith now you can accuse FL of sheeping you in the post game.

Did you think I should be pressured?

Yes. I have embarrassingly few reads and it feels like scum is leading town around by the nose here. Ime that means there’s scum in the “well they make sense so they’re town” pile, and you’re like… poster child for that pile.

I feel like I'm not one of the main people leading the game, so why do you think I make the most sense as being scum here when there are others doing more leading than I am, if you feel scum are "leading town around by the nose"?

[Thomith]

It feels like such a weird thing to lie about though?

It is, but I've seen scum do this before. I think it's just a botched claim.

I believe the no result claim. He could be scum neap, which isn't something I considered until FL pointed it out, but yeah.

[Flavor Leaf]

It feels like such a weird thing to lie about though?

It is, but I've seen scum do this before. I think it's just a botched claim.

I believe the no result claim. He could be scum neap, which isn't something I considered until FL pointed it out, but yeah.

Then town blocked them and would be able to confirm that, but i don’t think anyone else should claim this day phase.

It’s the target that is poor more than the No Result for me.

They can’t fake a result on anyone else other than me with the Neap claim, and if they claimed to investigate me, they’d have confirmed me as town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I also was one of the biggest pushers of Gob yesterday, Celeb thinking I’d be nightkilled is kinda wack too.

[Dunnstral]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

[Flavor Leaf]

If you wanted a cop to investigate me, and no one has claimed a guilty on me. Why are you trying to push me today?

If I had tried to push you today, this day would have been a lot louder.

But i like how you focus on one small thing in all of it on an action directing statement too

____

Celebloki stated they wanted someone low profile, and they chose Kyouko, a louder presence of Day 1 who was basically obv towned up, instead of Hu Tao who was by their own statements, deliberately ‘literally doing nothing’.

[Roden]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

I always tell myself when I roll PRs, I'm gonna refuse to claim them but I never do. I'm just gonna full claim it and my target.

I'm a Town Neapolitan. My N1 was a waste because I targeted Kyouko. Interestingly I got a 'No Result' response. I assume because she died.

A Vanilla Townie will return a result of "target is a Vanilla Townie"; other players will give a result of "target is not a Vanilla Townie". If the action fails (e.g. due to a roleblocker), the result will be "Your action failed, and you did not receive a result".

[Thomith]

People playing in the background this day phase: AnimatedWiz, Hu Tao, RCEnigma, SirCakez, Thomith

I dont feel like I'm playing in the background. Ik less active today for sure, but that's because I've been busy. I feel like when I have been contributing I have been putting myself out there, rather than only chiming in to defend myself or the like.
Is there anything specific you think I'm doing to "fade into the background" that I can respond to/understand why you think that?

You are going off the assumption that mafia are scrambling to try to save me and piling onto you. I'm not mafia so likely mafia are instead sitting back doing nothing, if you are town. I find Thomith's current position suspect, they apparently want to vote me out but are voting for you instead. AnimatedWiz's iso is 85% about me and 10% defending themself. I mean look at this:

Spoiler:

Hu Tao pops in every so often to say we should eliminate someone but gives no reasoning and then makes a filler post and leaves, and then 24 hours later comes back in and says we should eliminate the same person again with no new reasoning. SirCakez seems to be busy but is angling for you in their latest post - it's a bit of a mystery what they think about me. RCEnigma's last post is saying we need votes for pressure and they're the only player not voting. They have offered some talk of the wagon but not much else, including not giving a clear stance - they just call it 'interesting'.

I voted cele because of the random fluff posting midway through the day that pinged me, and haven't seen a reason to unvote since.

I am also aware that I may be tunelled on you, so am exploring other ideas.

Most of your posts today have been asking other players questions without it being clear what you are getting from it, and lazily continuing your push on me.

Spoiler:

In all seriousness, Bingle/Dunn have partner equity imo.

Why do you think they have partner equity?

How come?

For Flavor Leaf I don't like the way they pushed yesterday and now today. For AnimatedWiz I get the sense that they are playing back and trying to blend in while asking others their thoughts while occasionally trying to steer things towards an elimination on people pushing them.

You don't like the fact that they are pushing or you don't like exactly how they are pushing?

Interesting night kill?

What do you mean by this? Why was Kyouko an interesting night kill?

I think I trust Hu Tao

Why?

Thom who do you scumread the most today?

I still feel suspicious mostly of Dunnstral, As I've said before I suspected him early on, and I haven't really seen much to make me feel any better about him so far today.

I do not think that is good logic.

Why not?

VOTE: Dunn

E-2

How about slowing down a bit? E-2 when we have like 8 days left?

Who are you scumreading?

I have someone else I want to put some pressure on, but I think I want to wait a bit for people to come in and react to the current things before I move on.

I’m open to a Dunn/Wiz town/town world.

Is it thomith? I bet it’s thomith. Hey everybody, if you vote thomith now you can accuse FL of sheeping you in the post game.

Did you think I should be pressured?

I have someone else I want to put some pressure on, but I think I want to wait a bit for people to come in and react to the current things before I move on.

I’m open to a Dunn/Wiz town/town world.

Is it thomith? I bet it’s thomith. Hey everybody, if you vote thomith now you can accuse FL of sheeping you in the post game.

Did you think I should be pressured?

Yes. I have embarrassingly few reads and it feels like scum is leading town around by the nose here. Ime that means there’s scum in the “well they make sense so they’re town” pile, and you’re like… poster child for that pile.

I feel like I'm not one of the main people leading the game, so why do you think I make the most sense as being scum here when there are others doing more leading than I am, if you feel scum are "leading town around by the nose"?

My questions are made in attempt to get people to elaborate on otherwise under explained statements, in attempt to understand peoples reasoning, or potentially finding contradictions or slip ups by ensuring people do explain everything they are saying, and are not just getting by on saying generic statements without expanding.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

I think Roden is arguing a semantics thing, which is something they do.

And i don’t agree with that necessarily, but Roden could be right, it’s really the stalled claim + way different vibes of Celebloki + the inconsistency with their reasoning for target + the only target they could state without having to guess/confirm a townie.

[Dunnstral]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

Isn't a No Result him being told his action failed though?

Neap specifically does not get a No Result PM, they get told that their action failed. I don't think this is a mod error either, considering both Gamma and DE have been keeping an active eye on the game.

OK you are right this doesn't line up with the wiki.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

I always tell myself when I roll PRs, I'm gonna refuse to claim them but I never do. I'm just gonna full claim it and my target.

I'm a Town Neapolitan. My N1 was a waste because I targeted Kyouko. Interestingly I got a 'No Result' response. I assume because she died.

A Vanilla Townie will return a result of "target is a Vanilla Townie"; other players will give a result of "target is not a Vanilla Townie". If the action fails (e.g. due to a roleblocker), the result will be "Your action failed, and you did not receive a result".

Yeah, this might actually be a technical scum slip by Celebloki too.


So I should know this, but it’s still new with these tags, Simple labeled games DO NOT give No Result to a roleblocked.

This is specifically different in Simple games is what’s being said?

Every other queue it would have been ‘No Result’

[Flavor Leaf]

If Celebloki flips scum, I am also confirmed town as Vanilla town, which means scum have to kill me as Vanilla lol.

[Thomith]

It feels like such a weird thing to lie about though?

It is, but I've seen scum do this before. I think it's just a botched claim.

I believe the no result claim. He could be scum neap, which isn't something I considered until FL pointed it out, but yeah.

Then town blocked them and would be able to confirm that, but i don’t think anyone else should claim this day phase.

It’s the target that is poor more than the No Result for me.

They can’t fake a result on anyone else other than me with the Neap claim, and if they claimed to investigate me, they’d have confirmed me as town.

True.

I do agree that the target of Kyouko was a little weird, but celeb saying he was trying to find a town core may kind of make this make sense?

[Thomith]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

I always tell myself when I roll PRs, I'm gonna refuse to claim them but I never do. I'm just gonna full claim it and my target.

I'm a Town Neapolitan. My N1 was a waste because I targeted Kyouko. Interestingly I got a 'No Result' response. I assume because she died.

A Vanilla Townie will return a result of "target is a Vanilla Townie"; other players will give a result of "target is not a Vanilla Townie". If the action fails (e.g. due to a roleblocker), the result will be "Your action failed, and you did not receive a result".

Yeah, this might actually be a technical scum slip by Celebloki too.


So I should know this, but it’s still new with these tags, Simple labeled games DO NOT give No Result to a roleblocked.

This is specifically different in Simple games is what’s being said?

Every other queue it would have been ‘No Result’

Where does it say that Simple Games have to clarify that an action failed?

[Flavor Leaf]

It feels like such a weird thing to lie about though?

It is, but I've seen scum do this before. I think it's just a botched claim.

I believe the no result claim. He could be scum neap, which isn't something I considered until FL pointed it out, but yeah.

Then town blocked them and would be able to confirm that, but i don’t think anyone else should claim this day phase.

It’s the target that is poor more than the No Result for me.

They can’t fake a result on anyone else other than me with the Neap claim, and if they claimed to investigate me, they’d have confirmed me as town.

True.

I do agree that the target of Kyouko was a little weird, but celeb saying he was trying to find a town core may kind of make this make sense?

Why would they say things that don’t make sense as scum?

I don’t think that lines up, though.

They already town read Kyouko, and everybody was talking about Kyouko being obv town.

If they wanted to build a town core, they would have gone elsewhere.

They could have confirmed me.

Never trust a PR action claim from someone going down on the Night Killed player.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why would I say I got a No Result on kyouko if I was lying about my claim though. I could just as easily say I got VT on her. I honestly didn't feel like my crumb was very well hidden and I regretted crumbing it. My best guess is scum have a roleblocker and saw my crumb and used it on me. Might as well flip me, they'll just keep role blocking me so I get no information.

I'm not too sure it makes sense to flip you just because of setup spec of Mafia potentially hand a role blocker that saw your soft, because I dont actually think it was that obvious personally. It's a potential, but there are other things that could explain it instead.

I'd rather keep celeb around for now I think, to see what happens in future nights?

This is a Simple set up, so only Roleblocker and Jailkeeper could have messed with his action. The results he claimed don't match up with the wiki though because he should've been blatantly told that his action failed.

What is wrong with the claim of no result? Is that not when you get when you are blocked?

I always tell myself when I roll PRs, I'm gonna refuse to claim them but I never do. I'm just gonna full claim it and my target.

I'm a Town Neapolitan. My N1 was a waste because I targeted Kyouko. Interestingly I got a 'No Result' response. I assume because she died.

A Vanilla Townie will return a result of "target is a Vanilla Townie"; other players will give a result of "target is not a Vanilla Townie". If the action fails (e.g. due to a roleblocker), the result will be "Your action failed, and you did not receive a result".

Yeah, this might actually be a technical scum slip by Celebloki too.


So I should know this, but it’s still new with these tags, Simple labeled games DO NOT give No Result to a roleblocked.

This is specifically different in Simple games is what’s being said?

Every other queue it would have been ‘No Result’

Where does it say that Simple Games have to clarify that an action failed?

I was trying to get it clarified myself.

The quote that was given by Roden does seem to imply it that way.

[Flavor Leaf]

Thomith, you are in a Hu Tao pocket.

Look at how you react to this situation compared to how Hu Tao is.

You are questioning everything.

Hu Tao is not, even though pages before they were talking about them being able to see it as scum.

I believe Celebloki is getting advice from Hu Tao in the scum PT.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hu Tao also would still get the defense of “why would I defend my own partner that way? I just thought they were town”

Which is going to convince multiple players.

[Flavor Leaf]

Celebloki/Hu Tao team, Celeb flips, scum can’t get rid of me anymore without killing me, a claimed Vanilla, which is a terrible spot for them to be.

[Thomith]

Thomith, you are in a Hu Tao pocket.

Look at how you react to this situation compared to how Hu Tao is.

You are questioning everything.

Hu Tao is not, even though pages before they were talking about them being able to see it as scum.

I believe Celebloki is getting advice from Hu Tao in the scum PT.

I'll be real, I feel like I'm in a situation right now where either you have me pocketed or Hu tao has me pocketed so I'm not sure what to do right now if I'm being honest.

[Hu Tao]

I'm just confident in people I see as town

[Hu Tao]

Thomith, you are in a Hu Tao pocket.

Look at how you react to this situation compared to how Hu Tao is.

You are questioning everything.

Hu Tao is not, even though pages before they were talking about them being able to see it as scum.

I believe Celebloki is getting advice from Hu Tao in the scum PT.

I'll be real, I feel like I'm in a situation right now where either you have me pocketed or Hu tao has me pocketed so I'm not sure what to do right now if I'm being honest.

It's possible we are all 3 town. Flavor just likes to do these things

[Flavor Leaf]

Regardless, if we are all 3 town, Celebloki is scum