Large Normal 246: Game Over

[Naerys]

Roden

(E-0): Broccoli Quest 2, Dunnstral, ssbm_Kyouko, davesaz, Hu Tao, Guillotina, Elements, Naerys,
Hu Tao (E-6): Random Nurse, Roden,
Elements (E-6):

Keyleth

, Andresvmb,
Naerys
,
Dunnstral (E-8):
Broccoli Quest 2 (E-8):
Keyleth (E-8):
ssbm_Kyouko (E-8):
Celebloki (E-8):
TimmerRC (E-8):
Andresvmb (E-8):
Naerys (E-8):
davesaz (E-8):
Guillotina (E-8):
Random Nurse (E-8):

Not Voting: TimmerRC, Celebloki,

With 14 alive it takes 8 to eject a player from the Game.

Deadline is (expired on 2023-12-17 14:00:00).

Mod Notes: None!

Well, Enchant slot sat out while important scum PR was yeeted

[Naerys]

Vote Count 5.1

Prince of Paterson

(E-0): Broccoli Quest 2, Naerys, Hu Tao, ssbm_Kyouko

Hu Tao

(E-4):

Dunnstral

(E-4):

Broccoli Quest 2

(E-4):

Enchant

(E-4):

ssbm_Kyouko

(E-4):

Naerys

(E-4):

Not Voting

: Prince of Paterson,

Enchant

,

Dunnstral

,

With 7 alive it takes 4 to eject a player from the Game.

Deadline is Nah.

Mod Notes: Thank you everyone for the patience the last week or so as I dealt with some personal issues. I should be back on a more normal modding schedule, and am pleased to announce that I am no longer being held hostage by United Airlines in Texas.

once again enchant sat out while we yeeted scum

[Enchant]

I agree. Considering how concerning mafia with bussing, i think i should be conftown for not being on mafia wagons.

[Naerys]

I agree. Considering how concerning mafia with bussing, i think i should be conftown for not being on mafia wagons.

Do you think scum bussed both of their partners, then?

[Enchant]

There were brief moment where both gamma and guilo voted you unison, so perhaps?

[Enchant]

I don't really care who voted who.


I just know that usage of 1-shot FN on Doctor claim is outrageous.

[Enchant]

I really think you are better than this, so you are mafia. As town you simple don't make this blunder.

[Naerys]

There were brief moment where both gamma and guilo voted you unison, so perhaps?

I am not scum though. And i find suspicious that you were not at either of those 2 scum wagons

[Naerys]

As town you simple don't make this blunder.

outrageous is thinking that scum buddies would tie themselves so closely together

[Enchant]

If i am mafia i know in advance that Guilo will be guiltied by RN.

So i have time to prepare "oh so betrayed" post to bus effectively.
... Or considering i was already confirmed as vanilla, i frame Hu Tao by killing RN beforehand instead of leaving RN alive for no fucking reason and clearing Hu Tao. Killing... Who the hell was that second FN i forgot already, fine who cares, can wait.

Only thing you really can blame me for is not acting on my suspicions beforehand and hammering Jackson, but i was not only idiot who didn't, so.


If i am mafia, i dedicated in ruining my own chances of win for no benefit whatsover. Nosense.

[Enchant]

As town you simple don't make this blunder.

outrageous is thinking that scum buddies would tie themselves so closely together

I considered it.

If you can fail as town like that, you can do same as mafia. It's both outrageous mistakes you can make.

But as mafia, you can try to pass as incompetent, without really making said blunder if you was real town in this position.


So it doesn't really clear you or anything.

[Dunnstral]

Hey Broccoli Quest 2, can you briefly explain why it was a good idea for Guillotina to perform no kill last night.

[Broccoli Quest 2]

I have no idea what you mean considering:
1. There WAS a kill last night
2. Guillotina is both replaced out AND dead

[Broccoli Quest 2]

Welp, I was trying to keep Guilll hidden with my claim, but oh well.

Where did you see Guillo indicate that they are doctor before this?

there are bold letters in this post that spell out "I'm doc":

Pre-Flip Associations analysis Part 1

For this analysis,

I

'm going to look at the game from a third party perspective, pretending Guillotina is just another player.

The following are not Mafia/Mafia together:

Kyo/Guillo based on the following:

Holy shit you're here
VOTE: Guillotina
For that one time in that one game

Dunn/elements based on the following

Reason: The way he questioned ele

m

ents there. It was designed to attract attention on elements.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Elements/Dave based on the following:

Reason: Mafia dont pocket each other in RvS, they instead

D

istance.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Why not the same amount of puzzlement at both?

I like this
You can be town too, for now

Black/Elements based on this post:

Reason: Black's attack is too visceral and emotional to c

o

me from a partner imo.

Elements you have 13 posts on this page. Can you chill

I did pre-emptively apologise

Why is your plan to spam the thread with a bunch of nothing posts?

Elements you have 13 posts on this page. Can you chill

I did pre-emptively apologise

Why is your plan to spam the thread with a bunch of nothing posts?

I feel you're being too dismissive of Elemental's posts, she's asked,

Does anyone else think it's scum indicating when someone isn't voting?

Defended you as town
Apologized for her playstyle

Constantly vote switching is confusing, I want to know why she switched to Nono, any explanation/elabaration is good
Even if it's "spam" she's observing, questioning, defending

At the time I had counted 9 relevant posts and 10 spammy ones. That's a lot of posts for two pages. Elements said she's bored with no impulse control so I'm just gonna let her do her thang

Kawaii/Kyo based on the following:

Reason: The way Kawaii brought attention to kyo's vote patterns was done in a very discrediting way to

c

ome from a partner.

VOTE: Nono

Why Nono?

To see if the null vote is to do with kyouko or nono

VOTE: nono

VOTE: Guillotina

Kyouko voted Nono then voted Guilotina, nulling her Nono vote

I'm not sure. Dunn's claim felt like a joke with it being the first post of the game. Kyouko's feels more real but I'm not familiar enough with her to tell if it's coming from scum

I feel Duun's claim is genuine, millers often claim miller in their opening posts. Duun's miller claim feels straight up, unlikely that mafia plays this directly. Kyouko feels real/potentially opportunistic, shielding herself behind the initial miller claim if she is mafia

VOTE: ssbm_Kyouko

Gamma/Elements based on the following

Reason: Question was formulated as a shade.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Why not the same amount of puzzlement at both?

I like this
You can be town too, for now

The post you are referring to is in response to me, so thinking we are the same slot would mean your reason for thinking Dave is town does not make sense

I think that us probably where the confusion came from
Your names being right next to each other and so relating to each other in my head. Then when I made the post where I called you town they got mixed up together

That seems odd
You didn’t question why someone would quote themself?

Hu Tao/Timmer based on this interaction

VT

I understand why people claim miller early on, but why throw out a VT claim on page 1? I'm coming to this site mostly from a background where claiming was against the rules, so I would love to hear how claiming this helps the town.

So scum will not target me and I can last till end game. I believe in myself to find scum as long as I'm alive long enough. Now I just need to be towny enough to not be voted out. I've eliminated half of the work.

Gamma/Random Nurse based on the following

Reason: RN's reaction to Gamma on the faking being a noob accusation was too personal and emotional for mafia/mafia

Is 4:13 the most likely breakdown with 17 players?

These questions get old real fast

Is 4:13 the most likely breakdown with 17 players?

These questions get old real fast

Well aren't you a peach.

I know who you are, so the act doesn't fool me.

Guillo/Kawaii based on this post

Reason: Guillo's question was formulated in a way to bring attention on Kawaii.

VOTE: Nono

Why Nono?

To see if the null vote is to do with kyouko or nono

VOTE: nono

VOTE: Guillotina

Kyouko voted Nono then voted Guilotina, nulling her Nono vote

And not her vote on me whom had not posted at the time?

Black/Guillo based on this post

My preliminary reads:

Town

Black
Kawaii

Mixed Feelings

Kyouko

Scum

Naerys
Hu
Gamma
Celebloki

Why do you have mixed feelings about kyouko?

VOTE: Kyouko

VOTE: Kyouko

Why did you 2 vote Kyouko?

I think she could be scum and I wanted a wagon

Not really liking Guillotina's unvote

I had been voting Guillo right before this but immediately unvoted when I saw the crumb.

[Enchant]

...
If i knew about this post existance, i condemn Guilo on spot.

[Broccoli Quest 2]

I know, Enchant.

All players from towniest to scummiest:

BQ2

Enchant
Naerys

Kyo

Dunn

Therefore
VOTE: Dunn

[Enchant]

I rightly understand that you think mafia must be between Dunn-Kyoko?

[Broccoli Quest 2]

No. I think Dunn has the least reasons to be town, but if he flips town I will need to re-evaluate. And if I get nightkilled then you will need to re-evaluate.

[Enchant]

Then i wonder why you bother at all with readlist.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Welp, I was trying to keep Guilll hidden with my claim, but oh well.

Where did you see Guillo indicate that they are doctor before this?

there are bold letters in this post that spell out "I'm doc":

Pre-Flip Associations analysis Part 1

For this analysis,

I

'm going to look at the game from a third party perspective, pretending Guillotina is just another player.

The following are not Mafia/Mafia together:

Kyo/Guillo based on the following:

Holy shit you're here
VOTE: Guillotina
For that one time in that one game

Dunn/elements based on the following

Reason: The way he questioned ele

m

ents there. It was designed to attract attention on elements.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Elements/Dave based on the following:

Reason: Mafia dont pocket each other in RvS, they instead

D

istance.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Why not the same amount of puzzlement at both?

I like this
You can be town too, for now

Black/Elements based on this post:

Reason: Black's attack is too visceral and emotional to c

o

me from a partner imo.

Elements you have 13 posts on this page. Can you chill

I did pre-emptively apologise

Why is your plan to spam the thread with a bunch of nothing posts?

Elements you have 13 posts on this page. Can you chill

I did pre-emptively apologise

Why is your plan to spam the thread with a bunch of nothing posts?

I feel you're being too dismissive of Elemental's posts, she's asked,

Does anyone else think it's scum indicating when someone isn't voting?

Defended you as town
Apologized for her playstyle

Constantly vote switching is confusing, I want to know why she switched to Nono, any explanation/elabaration is good
Even if it's "spam" she's observing, questioning, defending

At the time I had counted 9 relevant posts and 10 spammy ones. That's a lot of posts for two pages. Elements said she's bored with no impulse control so I'm just gonna let her do her thang

Kawaii/Kyo based on the following:

Reason: The way Kawaii brought attention to kyo's vote patterns was done in a very discrediting way to

c

ome from a partner.

VOTE: Nono

Why Nono?

To see if the null vote is to do with kyouko or nono

VOTE: nono

VOTE: Guillotina

Kyouko voted Nono then voted Guilotina, nulling her Nono vote

I'm not sure. Dunn's claim felt like a joke with it being the first post of the game. Kyouko's feels more real but I'm not familiar enough with her to tell if it's coming from scum

I feel Duun's claim is genuine, millers often claim miller in their opening posts. Duun's miller claim feels straight up, unlikely that mafia plays this directly. Kyouko feels real/potentially opportunistic, shielding herself behind the initial miller claim if she is mafia

VOTE: ssbm_Kyouko

Gamma/Elements based on the following

Reason: Question was formulated as a shade.

Gamma and Black probably town

Gamma has done what so far?

Why not the same amount of puzzlement at both?

I like this
You can be town too, for now

The post you are referring to is in response to me, so thinking we are the same slot would mean your reason for thinking Dave is town does not make sense

I think that us probably where the confusion came from
Your names being right next to each other and so relating to each other in my head. Then when I made the post where I called you town they got mixed up together

That seems odd
You didn’t question why someone would quote themself?

Hu Tao/Timmer based on this interaction

VT

I understand why people claim miller early on, but why throw out a VT claim on page 1? I'm coming to this site mostly from a background where claiming was against the rules, so I would love to hear how claiming this helps the town.

So scum will not target me and I can last till end game. I believe in myself to find scum as long as I'm alive long enough. Now I just need to be towny enough to not be voted out. I've eliminated half of the work.

Gamma/Random Nurse based on the following

Reason: RN's reaction to Gamma on the faking being a noob accusation was too personal and emotional for mafia/mafia

Is 4:13 the most likely breakdown with 17 players?

These questions get old real fast

Is 4:13 the most likely breakdown with 17 players?

These questions get old real fast

Well aren't you a peach.

I know who you are, so the act doesn't fool me.

Guillo/Kawaii based on this post

Reason: Guillo's question was formulated in a way to bring attention on Kawaii.

VOTE: Nono

Why Nono?

To see if the null vote is to do with kyouko or nono

VOTE: nono

VOTE: Guillotina

Kyouko voted Nono then voted Guilotina, nulling her Nono vote

And not her vote on me whom had not posted at the time?

Black/Guillo based on this post

My preliminary reads:

Town

Black
Kawaii

Mixed Feelings

Kyouko

Scum

Naerys
Hu
Gamma
Celebloki

Why do you have mixed feelings about kyouko?

VOTE: Kyouko

VOTE: Kyouko

Why did you 2 vote Kyouko?

I think she could be scum and I wanted a wagon

Not really liking Guillotina's unvote

I had been voting Guillo right before this but immediately unvoted when I saw the crumb.

...
. . .
Not gonna lie I didn't read those posts - I looked back at them a couple of times to see who he was saying couldnt be scum with who but I just wasnt going to read walls upon walls of preflip associations.

Kinda clever to put such an obvious crumb in such an unreadable post, it would excuse why he wasn't shot if he ever pointed it out or if any town ever found it

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I didn't even read that time. I saw the bold capital I and I trust the rest is there. Jesus

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Hu Tao actually dying is odd

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I think it means there is no blocker, or it's meant to make us think there is no blocker. Killing Hu Tao acknowledges that she was confirmed town by RN. Which means scum aren't willing to play the "what if RN was blocked" card in ELO.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

If there is no blocker the last scum could be a goon.

What do you think a Rolecop thinks if he sees "Doctor" when investigating Guillo? Probably Town since the only TPR that can kill in the setup is Babysitter. Our vig couldn't kill. And I just realized something because it came up in another game - scum can have vigilantes in complex normals. It would be weird to think RNs role is scum if rolecopped, but it is technically allowable under the complex rules. What I'm getting at is the rolecop had a lot of innos on town's side - and we've now seen a false inno flip from scum. Rolecop seems to be weaker than we gave it credit for.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Dave neighborizes were
N1: Dunn (failed)
N2: Enchant/Keyleth (success)
N3: BQ2 (success)

Thing is, Mafia Doctor was a way to provide a false inno versus RN's role I think. Doctor would supersede Bodyguard I'm pretty sure because the golden rule - the Bodyguard action doesn't result in the Bodyguard dying if the target is already protected by a Doc, so the Doc would stop the shot, RN would live, and if he targeted Doctored Mafia they would appear innocent. Likely scum tried this every night, but RN ended up targeting Guillo, so this was not effective.