Mini 739 ~ Mafia Jailbreak, Game Over

[bionicchop2]

----
@BC, yes thank you, I will. Does that mean you thought I was the most likely scum N2? What about Jahudo? What about Moriarty or Rishi, both of whom we knew didn't make an action N1 and therefore were also good JK targets?

On N2 I started thinking a slightly different angle. I talked about Jahudo during the day. Moriarty and Rishi had not turned in kills the night before. I figured with a jailer around and the info I targeted my top remaining suspect on N1, scum would have someone who wasn't a top suspect turn in the kill. Part of why I don't like jailers is because I don't like town-sided RBs due to the potential to prevent town roles from functioning. The jailer adds to this because you can prevent a kill and not know which way is was prevented - saving target or blocking killer.

[Rishi]

Got my prod. Will catch up once I'm over this flu.

[CF Riot]

Vote: Rishi

10 days to DL. Most likely lylo. The will-post-later excuse isn't cutting it for me anymore. This goes for Moriarty and Huntress as well. That said, I will probably be LA from Friday to Monday of this week. =P I will be back before deadline though. Speaking of which,

Vi, April 17 is a Friday.

People tell me I'm good at missing blindingly obvious things too often for comfort x.x ~Vi

[Vi]

Vote Count:

Huntress (L-3) ~ Jahudo
Rishi (L-3) ~ CF Riot

Minimum (L-4)

Not Voting:

bionicchop2, Huntress,

CF Riot,

Moriarty147, Rishi, SpyreX
[size=0]bionicchop2 - 0 | Huntress - 2 | Jahudo - 1 | CF Riot - 0 | Moriarty147 - 1 PROD1 2 | Rishi - 0 PROD1 1 | SpyreX - 1[/size]

First Deadline Review: Monday, April 13 2009
Current Deadline: Friday, April 17 2009

(10 days left)

[SpyreX]

I was actually wondering why Rishi fell off the radar, so to speak, considering how hard his late lynch came in yesterday.

I'm finally committing on something I've been going back and forth about: I believe Bio. I wish he was more active but with the way things went down day 1 I can't stomach that much guts for that little scum gain.

I'm still hard on Rishi / Huntress with a third still unknown.

[Jahudo]

Here's more Huntress case: The Huntress vs. Spyrex Deluxe Edition.

What I think:
-She rarely gave a reason for finding him first noteworthy, then a #2 suspect, then the top suspect.
-She retroactively gave reasons that don't ideally match up with the time line of her increased suspicions.
-She didn't have a problem with Spyrex voting RC on day 1, only minutes after he did so, but she made it a major point of her case against him day 2.

The Timeline:

Post 301 : She had suspicions on Spyrex (and CFR) but couldn’t explain them until she read what they were, and even then they might not be enough for a case. It turns out (from post 559) that she didn’t have enough to make a case.

Post 402 : She says her suspicions on Spyrex are increasing but she doesn’t explain how and why. She says she needs to look closer, which sounds an awful lot like “checking her notes” from post 301. It feels like she hasn’t read into her notes since before post 301, or else she might be more specific about her rising suspicion.
@Huntress: Are there any parts of 402 that you felt, at the time of writing them, were tells against Spyrex, or were you just gathering information?

Post 459 : Spyrex becomes her #2 vote choice. No reason provided.

Post 482 : She admits that she hasn’t given any reasons for suspecting her #2 lynch candidate (and that she hasn’t given a detailed account of her suspicions on Pops, her #3 candidate) even though she has already considered having a back-up vote.

Post 500 : Admits that she would switch her vote to her #2 lynch candidate, Spyrex, even though she has not provided any reason to find him suspicious.

Post 524 : Now it’s day 2 and she votes for Spyrex but does not provide a reason, just that he was her next candidate in line that’s alive from day 1. There’s no sign that anything changed her mind from day 1 to day 2.

Post 552 : Finally gives a reason why she thinks Spyrex is scummy, not at the request of Spyrex but from pops. Her reasons are Spyrex’s post 303 where he said RC was town, and post 497, where he votes RC. Regardless of whether these posts as tells (I don’t think so), Spyrex didn’t vote for RC until after Huntress was willing to switch her vote to him. And in Huntress’s post directly after Spyrex voted for RC, mere minutes apart, she does not bat an eye at this vote change. She vaguely says she could vote for him but not why. If she felt that way then, about his stance on RC, she should have said something.

Post 559 : Huntress explains that in post 301 Spyrex had done something to peak her interest but in retrospect it was not enough for a case.
@Huntress: What had he done?

On the count of Spyrex changing his vote to RC, Huntress has a problem with his quote “Well, hells bells, I was as wrong as you can be about RC I guess”.
@Huntress: Why does that quote make any difference? Did his believe that two jailers were doubtful look truthful, and was it a reasonable reason to vote one of the two jailers because of that doubt?

[Jahudo]

RE: IAUN’s Post 659 case against Rishi

Point 1: Using the word interesting.

I understand the principle of this tell in the way he describes it, but I’d bet town often slouch into describing someone’s words or actions are interesting as a way of saying “It’s note worthy but maybe not possible to dissect yet or I just don’t have the time to explain”. If someone uses this language of avoidance as a crutch I can certainly see it as a tell, but in moderation I don’t think it’s a big deal.

Point 3: Rishi thought Rhino slipped in assuming 4 scum.

First he asked for an explanation before voting, which seemed like a fair way to handle Rhino. Then he makes his conclusion in post 345 that Rhino had slipped. I suppose it’s possible that Rishi truly felt it was a slip, but I don’t see it that way. Rishi did back off when he decided that it wasn’t a slip. I think the way he backed off looked natural.

Point 4: Says he’s willing to switch to avoid a no lynch

I think town do this as often as scum who want to look town, that is to say all the time. The follow-up means a little more to me. Rishi’s vote was on RC who was the top wagon most of the time. Typically someone will offer to switch their vote if they are on a lesser wagon near deadline. And IAUN points out that Rishi didn’t discriminate between the Rhinox or pops wagon, which could mean a lot (he didn’t care which hanged because he’s scum) or not so much (he didn’t care which hanged because he read them equally, which is what he said in that post). I can buy that actually, since Rishi said Rhino’s AtE looked like it came from town early on day 1, and later on Rishi stopped feeling that Rhino had slipped in saying “assuming 4 scum in the game”. I don’t get the feeling that Rishi had a strong opinion on pops one way or the other.

The bolded part

I do agree with that part to an extent. There were times when Rishi went on an attack or asked questions but he was also indecisive and withdrawn from several conversations. Post 590 is a good example.

Rishi defended (in post 672) that he doesn’t typically take a strong stance Day 1, that he tends to be more cautious and that a lot of other people weren’t active. Cautious sounds like survival strategy.

To that list, you can add this post, which looks like a big fat wagon hop, Moriarty's waffling at the end of D2, and this post, which isn't really saying "I think Huntress is scummy," but is saying, "I think enough people think Huntress is scummy for me to lynch her." I've also noted that Rishi and Moriarty are both calling Jah scum now out of absolutely nowhere.

I need to look closer at the suspicion and voting time lines of RC day 1 and Huntress recently to see if Rishi is really jumping on to these wagons (Post 200 and 753 respectfully). It could be that he was late to the RC wagon due to his cautiousness or late to Huntress suspicions from inactivity. So far Rishi adds up to moderately suspicious, borderline scummy.

[SpyreX]

I'm waiting for replies to the above with baited breath.

[Vi]

Vote Count:

Huntress (L-3) ~ Jahudo
Rishi (L-3) ~ CF Riot

Minimum (L-4)

Not Voting:

bionicchop2, Huntress, Moriarty147, Rishi, SpyreX
[size=0]bionicchop2 - 1 | Huntress - 3 PROD1 0 | Jahudo - 0 | CF Riot - 1 | Moriarty147 - 2 PROD1 3 | Rishi - 1 PROD1 2 | SpyreX - 0[/size]

First Deadline Review: Monday, April 13 2009
Current Deadline: Friday, April 17 2009

(9 days left)

-----

Prodding Huntress for the first time today.

[Huntress]

Here's more Huntress case: The Huntress vs. Spyrex Deluxe Edition.

What I think:
-She rarely gave a reason for finding him first noteworthy, then a #2 suspect, then the top suspect.
-She retroactively gave reasons that don't ideally match up with the time line of her increased suspicions.
-She didn't have a problem with Spyrex voting RC on day 1, only minutes after he did so, but she made it a major point of her case against him day 2.

The Timeline:

Post 301 : She had suspicions on Spyrex (and CFR) but couldn’t explain them until she read what they were, and even then they might not be enough for a case. It turns out (from post 559) that she didn’t have enough to make a case.

My original suspicion of Spyrex was because of small things, such as his assumption in post 62 that someone had self-voted, which showed a willingness to accuse without checking facts, and some of his comments in post 119, part of which I referred to in post 161. At that point all my suspicions were low apart from RC.

Post 402 : She says her suspicions on Spyrex are increasing but she doesn’t explain how and why. She says she needs to look closer, which sounds an awful lot like “checking her notes” from post 301. It feels like she hasn’t read into her notes since before post 301, or else she might be more specific about her rising suspicion.
@Huntress: Are there any parts of 402 that you felt, at the time of writing them, were tells against Spyrex, or were you just gathering information?

One thing that increased my suspicion of him was his "Lynch whomever" comment in post 367.

Yes, I thought that the fact that he seemed to be ignoring my case against RC, just quoting a comment I made at the end and implying that was all I had said to back up my vote, was a tell. Also his statement "when RC is lynched and comes up town", which could indicate that he knew RC's status.

Post 459 : Spyrex becomes her #2 vote choice. No reason provided.

I named Spyrex in response to CFR's question as to who I would vote if RC wasn't likely to be lynched. My suspicion of him still wasn't that great.

Post 482 : She admits that she hasn’t given any reasons for suspecting her #2 lynch candidate (and that she hasn’t given a detailed account of her suspicions on Pops, her #3 candidate) even though she has already considered having a back-up vote.

I was still concentrating on RC at the time, he was the only one I strongly suspected.

Post 500 : Admits that she would switch her vote to her #2 lynch candidate, Spyrex, even though she has not provided any reason to find him suspicious.

That was just a quick note following the claims to confirm I was keeping my vote on RC and implying I was not prepared to switch to Rhinox or Pops.

Post 552 : Finally gives a reason why she thinks Spyrex is scummy, not at the request of Spyrex but from pops. Her reasons are Spyrex’s post 303 where he said RC was town, and post 497, where he votes RC. Regardless of whether these posts as tells (I don’t think so), Spyrex didn’t vote for RC until after Huntress was willing to switch her vote to him. And in Huntress’s post directly after Spyrex voted for RC, mere minutes apart, she does not bat an eye at this vote change. She vaguely says she could vote for him but not why. If she felt that way then, about his stance on RC, she should have said something.

Post 497 was the one that really raised my suspicion of Spyrex. I was too short of time to say anything when I wrote post 500 and I didn't expand on it in my reply to Pops because I was planning on following up with a proper case when I finished my re-read. Unfortunately March was a bad month for me and I was unable to concentrate well enough to do it.

Post 559 : Huntress explains that in post 301 Spyrex had done something to peak her interest but in retrospect it was not enough for a case.
@Huntress: What had he done?

See above.

On the count of Spyrex changing his vote to RC, Huntress has a problem with his quote “Well, hells bells, I was as wrong as you can be about RC I guess”.
@Huntress: Why does that quote make any difference? Did his believe that two jailers were doubtful look truthful, and was it a reasonable reason to vote one of the two jailers because of that doubt?

It just seemed to be too much of a U-turn for him to assume that RC was lying when he had previously been so sure that he was town (see post 419). Particularly while saying that he had been expecting that RC would more likely than not claim jailer. It was too melodramatic and didn't ring true.

[Jahudo]

@Huntress: Why did you downgrade your suspicion of pops from day 1 to day 2 and why did you upgrade your suspicion of ToD/OGML from day 1 to day 2?

It just seemed to be too much of a U-turn for him to assume that RC was lying when he had previously been so sure that he was town (see post 419). Particularly while saying that he had been expecting that RC would more likely than not claim jailer. It was too melodramatic and didn't ring true.

I think you have a point. He expected the jailer claim and he expected town, so that should have just enforced his read. But I can see why he changed his vote under the circumstances.

[SpyreX]

Wow, finally. Something to dig in and respond to.

My original suspicion of Spyrex was because of small things, such as his assumption in post 62 that someone had self-voted, which showed a willingness to accuse without checking facts, and some of his comments in post 119, part of which I referred to in post 161. At that point all my suspicions were low apart from RC.

Part one:

Yep, I hadn't caught up.. but accused? Accused who of what?

Ohh goodness another game starts with a self-vote spurring madness.

I'm out with work meetings all day, I'll try and post something of substance later on / tomorrow.

Part two:

How was it a shield? And where did I call out MME? I used him as an example to question Rhinox and later I followed up a comment that pops made about him but I never accused MME of anything.

Thats the only reference you made to anything I had said. Interestingly enough, it was about you.

So, assuming my 62 actually contained an accusation.. it'd be of you.
And 161 references me... in regards to you.

One thing that increased my suspicion of him was his "Lynch whomever" comment in post 367.

Yes, I thought that the fact that he seemed to be ignoring my case against RC, just quoting a comment I made at the end and implying that was all I had said to back up my vote, was a tell. Also his statement "when RC is lynched and comes up town", which could indicate that he knew RC's status.

Ok, again:

Funny thing is that, normally, I'm not abrasive. I become abrasive when I'm dealing with shit like "I'm anti-game" or "a tool" or what have you.

I'm not "abrasive" with the majority of this game. Just a few of you. Wonder why that is.

@Bio, et al:

I just dont have it in me to give a "real" case on either of them. So, I'm done raging against the machine for Day 1.

I'm still holding by my group of three having at least A scum in there. And, ohh yes, expect a whole lot of "I told you so's" when this awesome wagon flips town (whichever it is).

So, yea, I'm takin it quiet for the next few days. Lynch whomever, I'll check in and throw my vote if it looks like we're going to hit a NL.

I put that in for context. Notice my "lynch whomever" statement

contextually

isn't "anyone" but a very small subset: Rhinox and RC. Whom I said over and over I thought were town. Hence my "when RC is lynched and comes up town" comment. I *gasp* was pretty sure I was right and lo and behold was.

It just seemed to be too much of a U-turn for him to assume that RC was lying when he had previously been so sure that he was town (see post 419). Particularly while saying that he had been expecting that RC would more likely than not claim jailer. It was too melodramatic and didn't ring true.

Context. Context. Context. Seriously.

IF it wasn't a matter of Bio (whom I found to be very towny) CC'ing him after everything else then yes it would have been quite the "U-Turn".

All data at that point suggested one of them was lying. It made more sense for the CC to be the one telling the truth.

As for melodrama. Yea, I thought I was wrong about something I was very sure of, so yea a little melodrama.

But, guess what.

Vote: Huntress

Every bit

of that is from Day 1. After that... nothing. You voted me on Day 2 out the gate and since then you have not voted nor even really put actual suspicion on anyone. You've floated on a sea of "busy. post later." and the only time you actually did is when you were about to go up the creek at lylo.

I'm gonna go ahead and call the entire scum team too. Ready for this:
Huntress, Rishi, Moriarty.

If I'm right about Huntress, which I think I am, Jah is <3. I cant see the bus coming out like this. Bio, by nature, I've come to accept is a jailer.

So, this lynch goes through my internal meter has 2 towns for sure tomorrow regardless of the NK. When Rishi blows I'd put my money on Moriarty for the last.

Swish.

[Moriarty147]

Except the issue with your scumteam concept is that it seems to be based primarily on the concept that lack of content = scum, automatically. While lurkers are never good, they are not necessarily guaranteed scum.

I believe I already explained my vote switch from Rishi to pops already. If not, here goes: it was one of those moments when I was pretty certain pops was scum, but then at the same time decided that he was too scummy to

be

scum at the same time as his AtEs got to me. So it was essentially just made of wavering. Plus I highly doubted that a Rishi lynch would have gone through after all.

Reading through the posts from SpyreX and Jahudo:
Need to do a quick peer through everything on D1 and D2 again, but I'm not entirely sure why Huntress had such horrible tunnel-vision on SpyreX. Spy was never at any danger of being lynched (he pretty much seemed and still seems one of the most pro-town people here), so why all the posts suspecting him and having little evidence? The only way I can see Huntress-scum is if both Huntress and SpyreX are scum, and this honestly seems unlikely at the moment.

I am not going to believe CFRiot is scum, and I'm inclined to believe BC. That leaves Spy, Jahudo, Rishi and Huntress, with a pick of 3 scum. Out of this, I'm not sure what to gather. Of these, Rishi is the only one that I actually think is scum (a lot of my suspicion went down on Jahudo with the last post)

Will post a bit more detail once at least the next 2 exams are over, on the 13th.

[Huntress]

Every bit of that is from Day 1. After that... nothing.

That's because I was replying to Jahudo's post, when I reached the end of that it was too late at night to write any more. It isn't the whole case and I know there are other questions I haven't answered yet. But if you are not scum then your vote might well cost us the game as we're in lylo.

I've got to go out now but when I get back I should have a bit of time for this.

[bionicchop2]

The only way I can see Huntress-scum is if both Huntress and SpyreX are scum, and this honestly seems unlikely at the moment.

Could you explain this?

That leaves Spy, Jahudo, Rishi and Huntress, with a pick of 3 scum. Out of this, I'm not sure what to gather. Of these, Rishi is the only one that I actually think is scum (a lot of my suspicion went down on Jahudo with the last post)

Combined with this, the last statement doesn't make too much sense. You made a list which would pretty much mean you think one of Huntress and Spyrex are scum, but you just said it seems unlikely at the moment.

[CF Riot]

I am not going to believe CFRiot is scum...

I'm flattered, really, but can you explain why exactly? Also, why is SpyreX in your list of possibles if, "he pretty much seemed and still seems one of the most pro-town people here"? Even though you've said you've cooled on Jahudo, can you explain why you were suspicious of him originally?

Huntress's case on Spy is now (if it wasn't already) obviously bologna, but I'm still not seeing why Huntress-scum needs to make a crappy case on Spy. I'm getting more of an OMGUS and tunnel-vision feel from it. Rishi has consistently been behind only popular wagons, and me too-ed his way through the entire game. Huntress is an okay lynch. Rishi is a good lynch.

[SpyreX]

Huntress has latched on to that "case" on me

and that is all she has done this game

. Not a vote, nothing since eearly day 2. Its been riding the wave, as it were.

I'll give you that its 6 of one, half a dozen of the other. They're both scum for

similar

reasons.

A big reason why (although I'd vote for either) I'd like to see Huntress now is the town++ it gives me in my head to Jah. With Rishi already under the wagon, no reason to throw the other in a bus.

Hence, Rishi, Huntress, Moriarty.

[CF Riot]

Remind me to post something from my notes after Moriarty addresses my last post. Basically, Spy, I think you're getting ahead of yourself.

[Vi]

Vote Count:

Huntress (L-2) ~ Jahudo, SpyreX

Rishi (L-3) ~ CF Riot

Minimum (L-4)

Not Voting:

bionicchop2, Huntress, Moriarty147, Rishi,

SpyreX

[size=0]bionicchop2 - 0 | Huntress - 0 PROD1 1 | Jahudo - 0 | CF Riot - 0 | Moriarty147 - 0 PROD1 4 | Rishi - 2 PROD1 3 | SpyreX - 0[/size]

First Deadline Review: Monday, April 13 2009
Current Deadline: Friday, April 17 2009

(8 days left)

[Rishi]

Vote: Rishi

10 days to DL. Most likely lylo. The will-post-later excuse isn't cutting it for me anymore. This goes for Moriarty and Huntress as well. That said, I will probably be LA from Friday to Monday of this week. =P I will be back before deadline though. Speaking of which,

Vi, April 17 is a Friday.

This really seems odd to me. You're acknowledging that it's lynch-or-lose, but are making, what essentially is a pressure vote to get me to post. IN LYNCH-OR-LOSE. To me, this gives me a reason to be suspicious of you, where I wasn't before. Also, the fact that no one else is piling on your vote makes me think that you and your scumbuddies are waiting to see if you can get a townie to vote for me and then pile on for the win. A quickhammer is harder to coordinate with three scum, but it can be done, especially in a game with fairly low activity like this one.

Also, some minor slips from CF which may be nothing but are certainly interesting:

Moriarty's waffling between Rishi and Pops says scum team to me. (Originally I thought Pops + Mor, now I'm thinking Rishi + Mor.)

Sounds like CF is assuming two man scumteams. Then a couple posts later:

And if it's a 3 man scum team like I think it is, they could have guessed that there wouldn't be a SK in the game so there wouldn't be a risk of the person he targeted dying (which would bust a JK claim).

Okay, three man scumteams now. Something about the "like I think it is" is bothering me, especially because about two kazillion people have brought up that it's probably one three man scumteam at this point. This strikes me as CF consciously trying to say that he has no inside information.

There's also lots of better lynches today, like Rishi.

Better lynches today? Why the emphasis on today? Hmm. You do realize that if you lynch me, the game is over and the scum have won. In LYLO, there's no such thing as "better" or "worse" lynches, I think. There's just "scum" and "not scum."

What all of this adds up to is that I don't get a sense of panic from CF in the form of "OMG! LYLO! LYLO!" that I feel like I should be getting from him. There's something about the way that CF is playing that seems to assume there's going to be another day after this one. Not sure what to make of it, but it's nagging at me. Like a two-man scumteam that CF is part of? I don't know. In lynch-or-lose, everyone tends to look like scum to me.

Point 4: Says he’s willing to switch to avoid a no lynch

I don't remember if I responded to this point when IAUN said it, but the reason I made the post was to basically say, "Hey. I'm here. I know deadline is looming, but assume that I am reading the thread and will switch if I need to." Didn't have anything else to say at that point. That was it. I thought RC was the better lynch, but considering how I had been kind of in-and-out on Day 1, I felt it was important to say that I had not forgotten about the game in the face of a deadline.

Rishi defended (in post 672) that he doesn’t typically take a strong stance Day 1, that he tends to be more cautious and that a lot of other people weren’t active. Cautious sounds like survival strategy.

Yeah, but I play that way in all my games, for better or for worse, as both town and scum. It's a null-tell at best for me.

I know I still owe you guys a read on Jahudo, but I hope this gives you all something to chew on. We have 8 days. Assuming nothing else goes horribly awry (big assumption considering how my life has been going lately), I should be around for most of those.

[Jahudo]

Except the issue with your scumteam concept is that it seems to be based primarily on the concept that lack of content = scum, automatically. While lurkers are never good, they are not necessarily guaranteed scum.

Are you defending yourself and Huntress with this statement? Why are hers and your situation different than Rishi? Because lack of content was the reason you preferred a Rishi lynch day 2, so what's the difference?

[Huntress]

I'm going to do a deeper review, but if I was throwing my vote down right now it would be Huntress. The play has been suspicious but culminated in the wanting a massclaim yesterday AND wanting to lynch versus the no lynch. The waiting around for what Rishi claimed business today also strikes an odd chord.

You are misrepresenting the facts here when you claim that I wanted a mass claim AND a lynch. I did not. As for the waiting, at that point neither Moriarty nor Rishi had posted to comment on the mass claim and I had already stated that I wanted to see Rishi claim early so why should waiting for them strike an "odd chord"?

Logistically, the play yesterday in regards to the lynch REALLY bother me as well.

What really bothers you about it?

Yep, I hadn't caught up.. but accused? Accused who of what?

I didn't say "accused"; I said "willingness to accuse without checking facts". You said that the game had started with a self-vote which it hadn't.

Thats the only reference you made to anything I had said. Interestingly enough, it was about you.

So, assuming my 62 actually contained an accusation.. it'd be of you.
And 161 references me... in regards to you.

I don't follow this at all.

Notice my "lynch whomever" statement

contextually

isn't "anyone" ...

I never said it was.

Huntress has latched on to that "case" on me

and that is all she has done this game

. Not a vote, nothing since eearly day 2. Its been riding the wave, as it were.

First, I haven't made a "case" on you until now. Second, the part you put in italics is quite clearly not true. Third, I admit I was mostly absent during day two for reasons not related to this game but you can hardly claim I did nothing on day three when you have used what I said then against me.


Following on from post 784 I think that post and this one cover everything I have on Spyrex. My vote on him at the beginning of day two was in response to post 497. It was the most I had on anyone at the time so I acted on it. Add to that the things mentioned above and it confirms his position as one of my top suspects.

Need to do a quick peer through everything on D1 and D2 again, but I'm not entirely sure why Huntress had such horrible tunnel-vision on SpyreX. Spy was never at any danger of being lynched (he pretty much seemed and still seems one of the most pro-town people here), so why all the posts suspecting him and having little evidence?

What makes you think I have tunnel-vision on Spyrex?


I still have to reply to posts 754 and 785 and write up my thoughts on Rishi and others.

[Vi]

Vote Count:

Huntress (L-2) ~ Jahudo, SpyreX

Rishi (L-3) ~ CF Riot

Minimum (L-4)

Not Voting:

bionicchop2, Huntress, Moriarty147, Rishi
[size=0]bionicchop2 - 1 | Huntress - 0 PROD1 2 | Jahudo - 0 | CF Riot - 1 | Moriarty147 - 1 PROD1 5 | Rishi - 0 PROD1 4 | SpyreX - 1[/size]

First Deadline Review: Monday, April 13 2009
Current Deadline: Friday, April 17 2009

(7 days left)

[SpyreX]

You are misrepresenting the facts here when you claim that I wanted a mass claim AND a lynch. I did not. As for the waiting, at that point neither Moriarty nor Rishi had posted to comment on the mass claim and I had already stated that I wanted to see Rishi claim early so why should waiting for them strike an "odd chord"?

Hmm:

I'm going to have to think some more about the lynch/no lynch choice although at the moment I'm favouring no lynch based on the numbers. I can see advantages to both but I haven't really thought it through yet.

Is it too soon to talk about a mass claim?

Next post:

Actually I don't think it's too early to talk about it if we really are in lylo

, which we more or less are if we have a group of three scum, but perhaps you know otherwise? Why don't you think it's a good idea? When do you think would be a better time?

Having thought about a No lynch I've come to the conclusion that the ones who have most to gain from it are the scum

, especially if one or more of them have been attracting attention. Or maybe it's just seeing that my two top suspects are the first to vote for it that is putting me off for the moment.

Yea, I can see how I would misrepresent them. I mean its not like you mentioned them together in the same post, or anything right?

As for the odd chord - everyone chimes in saying they want you to go early. You reply with "I want Rishi

or

SpyreX to go first." I acquiesce (because, get this, as a vanilla it doesn't matter to me the order) and you STILL wait for Rishi.

Now, if you were a power role and mayhaps thought Rishi was going to claim so you could CC...maybe. Alas, vanilla. Thusly, it makes no sense.

What really bothers you about it?

The fact that a mislynch yesterday would have been the game? The fact that a massclaim in mylo is "Hey, lets out our PR's and hope to god we have a doctor so they aren't picked off".

Really, the fact that the combination of the two is about the worst maneuver the town could have done is what bothers me.

I didn't say "accused"; I said "willingness to accuse without checking facts". You said that the game had started with a self-vote which it hadn't.

And my reply was: how was it an accusation? What was I accusing? In fact, the ONLY way that could be considered an accusation instead of a general statement would be in regards to... you.

I don't follow this at all.

The only time you've made any reference to me was directly in regards to you. If one wants to

appear

to be scumhunting versus actually doing it: what is a good way to do that?

I never said it was.

One thing that increased my suspicion of him was his "Lynch whomever" comment in post 367.

You didn't? Then what the hell does the above mean?

First, I haven't made a "case" on you until now. Second, the part you put in italics is quite clearly not true. Third, I admit I was mostly absent during day two for reasons not related to this game but you can hardly claim I did nothing on day three when you have used what I said then against me.

Following on from post 784 I think that post and this one cover everything I have on Spyrex. My vote on him at the beginning of day two was in response to post 497. It was the most I had on anyone at the time so I acted on it. Add to that the things mentioned above and it confirms his position as one of my top suspects.

Yes, you haven't made a "case" on me until now - and you've been riding this since Day 1.

Aside from me, what have you done this game? I mean sure you can bring up the asking for a massclaim early and wanting a lynching in mylo. That's not what I mean - I mean looking for scum, but sure you can bring that up as a rebuttal.

I'd really like to see her lynched right about now. Seriously.

[Jahudo]

I'm gonna go ahead and call the entire scum team too. Ready for this:
Huntress, Rishi, Moriarty.

In terms of independent suspicion I agree with this team. But with their interactions it is a little hard to see Moriarty partnered with Rishi, that's the only thing that worries me. She/he made a case day 1 and day 2 against him and mostly preferred him to the mislynches.

From Rishi's side I can see exactly where he starts to suspect Huntress and it can certainly be interpreted as bussing. Huntress has had growing suspicion on her since day 1 and any scumpartner would see the need to bus late in the game to the extent that someone like Rishi is doing.

It has felt like Huntress and Rishi have somewhat ignored Moriarty, but I can't help but feel everyone has interacted with this player less than any other. I don't know what to make of it. Does anyone have an opinion on this?

And finally Huntress has skated by on this Spyrex case that never fully developed which in the long run looks very counter-productive and anti-town. Even if she's been V/LA for parts, she's ignored alot of important events and made some logical moves which is why she's most likely scum.