Open 135 - Polygamist Mafia, Incomplete/Mod Error before 775

[AceMarksman]

What the adorable robot said.

[Archon]

Archon (so far) has also acted similarly like sekinj.

Active pre-game and conservative on his comments and posts right now.

What? I have been?
Maybe because we're in another game together...

i feel stupider now

*Makes strange face, laughs maniacly*
Agreed

You know the irony here is? I used the same (or a similar) technique that you were trying to use on me. I didn't mind you fishing for reactions by voting for me.

I place my vote on you and you immediately call me out for OMGUS.

(Kinda unrelated) question: Do you think Wall-E's, Archon's or Ace's reasons for voting for you are sound?

I'm still voting for him? It was a random vote. Wow.

Unvote

Hello, all

I am replacing AndyTony. I've got the Easter Sunday family thing going on this afternoon, but I will catch up on the game and jump in tonight.

Regards,
Jazz

Hey Jazz!

A note to all;

A lot of stuff will be happening in the near future, so I may not be that active.

[Tenchi]

Archon, your last five points have been totally empty:

1. Self-meta or some empty comment on sekinj, which doesn't really justify you being actively lurking on this thread.

2. More fluff

3. An unvote, which relieves pressure from zwet.

4. Fluff for Jazz

5. And more excuse to lurk.

Just wow.

[ortolan]

kk, finally got around to a read.

Zwet-Ace connection noted, but not neccesarily scummy.

Based on their pre-game banter alone?

Lovers setups are very interesting, in that they take away the buddying-up and connections scumtells by a large amount. Scum will definately behave differently this game, distancing possible but bussing utterly surreal. Keeping an eye on wagons and the reasoning for votes should be a main priority throughout.

Good advice.

Don't like 48 by PIP and agree with Wall-E's response to it, possible PIP-as-scum being nervous about being on a townie bandwagon, even though he was nowhere near lynch.

Correct, but I detest random bandwagons and the RVS in general. I feel what I stated in my above post, that the bandwagon, that seems to be based on nothing in particular, will do little good besides Tenchi claiming a Lover (He could fakeclaim, of course, but we would have little evidence of such to begin with), which I don't believe would be particularly beneficial to the town. I fail to see any benefit that a random wagon gives us in this game, simply because we'll have no way of knowing if Polygamists are fakeclaiming lovers, or if we have legitimate lover claims. It may also put pressure on Techi, but at the moment he has absolutely nothing to defend against, so the pressure will be weak at best. I'd prefer to wait until I see something legitimately scummy to vote, and potentially for a bandwagon to form.

The whole point of the random voting stage is to get bandwagons going, so one can judge people's reactions to them. I have not yet seen a claim/lynch based

solely

on a random voting wagon. However your reaction itself was (mildly) scummy, which now gives us something to work with.

It was rather obviously part of a joke. I was random-voting, unaware that you had already voted him, and that Wall-E would follow my vote.

The third random vote in a 7-to-lynch scenario means absolutely nothing.

Wait... are you seriously asking that?

unvote, Vote zwet

Why did you interpret this comment as serious and scummy?

pie seems a little nervous...

Really? I don't see where that interpretation comes from, and I'm pretty good at reading the tone of my posts. I'm a tad confused, but not nervous.

She's right, you do come across as nervous. It's not so much the "tone" of your post but simply the content (freaking out over a meaningless 3 random votes in a 12-player game).

Why is Pie still alive?

Explain to me where I lied zwet, and we can discuss it. This accomplishes nothing.

Why is Pie still alive?

Wait... are you seriously asking that?

unvote, Vote zwet

Have you played with zwet before Archon?

No, but it was like... what?

Many people make half-serious comments like this, it's not only zwet.

I should have said it more clearly. They won't fakeclaim lovers persay, they'll claim lover pairs. So yeah, they'll claim lovers. However we won't be able to tell, through a random bandwagon, whether or not such a lover claim is legitimate, and it would therefore not be particularly useful to the town.

Again, the result of Tenchi's bandwagon has ironically not been a read/claim on him so much as a read on you.

Pie seems very twitchy. There's no need to flip out when someone gets to three random votes. It's seven to lynch. This was pretty funny:

Another agreement with the perception of PIP.

I'm bored.

Vote: Pie

Does this have serious intent behind it?

By the way, I'm pretty sure that we're going to massloverclaim before this day is up.

The hell we are. What would be the advantage for a mass claim, eh? Everyone has a viable claim partner (including the polygamists), so it would only tell the polygamists who their best kill would be.

Vote: mikek

I believe it's recommended you do lover-claim at some point- not sure whether (later) in day 1 is better or to wait until day 2 though.

Personally I don't see Pie as jumpy, just upset at the speed with which the bandwagon formed on Tenchi. As for me, I tend to err on the side of risky plays, so I like a good early-game wagon, but certainly I know that not everyone is like me and Pie's caution is therefore justified (even if faked to cover jumpiness).

I'd also like to point out that it's possible Pie was bussing his partner to keep the scum off his trail? He seems to be the only one who was concerned with Tenchi's life.

Tenchi's vote on him would suggest otherwise, though, and if they are not partners I don't think Pie is scum. Tenchi wouldn't have pushed the distancing further with his vote.

Unvote: Vote: Tenchi

Hi Tenchi!

How confident are you in semi-clearing PIP like this?

I respect Wall-E's interpretation of my actions (eventhough I think it is wrong).

What does "respect" mean? If you think he's a good player that's all well and good but do you think his vote on you is

reasonable

or

scum-motivated

?

This is interesting, in that not only does he seem to be defending zwet against a non-existant issue (His one-liners, that is his playstyle BTW), but he also states that "can't afford a policy lynch", when not only did zwet only have one vote, but it was a result of something irrelevant to policy.

Now, mikek could have been referring to mykonian's threat to vote zwet as a result of his one-liners. However, I fail to see how that single vote would lead to a policy lynch.

This is a fair point.

I despise random bandwagons. Not only are they (obviously) based on no reasoning, but if they go on for too long, they can spiral out of control and result in a lynch for the town. Does it always happen? No. But I've seen in happen, and it really puts the town at a disadvantage. In addition, since they're not based on actual reasons, the reactions that you obtain from them are a lot less valuable than the reactions from bandwagons with legitimate basis.

Please link to previous game where this has taken place.

It gives the polygamists information on whether they will be able to push certain lynches. (IE- "Ok, this pair has a scummy player, but the other player has been acting pro-town, so it might not be best to press a case on them. However, this other pair has been scummy, and the other player is not considered particularly pro-town. Let's go for them!) It also leads to some questions (Should we lynch a lover that has acted pretty pro-town just because we find the other lover scummy? Should it be ok if two players seem to be tunnelling on the same target just because they're lovers?) That would protentially distract from actual scumhunting, which only benefits those sinful, dirty, l33t-speak using, Uwe-Boll loving polygamists.

I believe that it gives a good deal of information to the scum, and not too much to the town, and could actually turn out to be a distracting factor.

I agree that it could potentially help the polygamists, but your second point, rather than being another negative is more the pro-town counterpoint. e.g. it's quite beneficial to consider whether to lynch one player if their lover isn't scummy, because we know in this setup either they're both scum or neither are. If one is acting scummily in a fashion they usually do, and the other is pro-town, then we are more likely to be able to write off the former's play as simply being consistent with their meta. I don't see how this discussion could "distract" us at all.

Connection between Wall-e and pie, while not scummy, has been noted.

This is a useless filler post.

94 by mikek is a very good assessment of the pros and cons of lover claiming.

Massclaim is not the way to go, your cons heavily outweigh the pros.

You provide no argument for this. Do you think it's useless even on the verge of a lynch on day 2?

ATTENTION TOWN: I have a problem with what's happening.

I don't know if it's just me or this game is moving too slow/cautious, especially discussion wise. The biggest power of town lies in catching scum in their foursome association, and we can't do it with this kind of activity.

What happened to the excitement last during the confirmation stage. I feel like almost everyone went into hiding!

Vote: Zwet

Stop voting without any justification, please, it's not making you look more town. I also view calls for more activity as a slight scumtell (easy way for scum to feign "helping" the town).

OMGUS ALERT!!!

Unvote; Vote: Tenchi

What is your problem? This vote is OMGUS

confirm vote: zwet

Mod: tenchi just voted zwet as well, you missed it in the vote count

Please, that confirm vote stuff is confusing.

@ Wall-E's 109, do you think zwet is scum or not? If not why are you voting him? I hate policy lynches, especially of players like zwet.

I do hope you're just trying to coax zwet into being helpful, because such a lynch in this game would be disastrous. We only have two chances to catch scum, remember. Whatever your feeling on zwet's playstyle, lynching him for it just ain't an option.

Agreed.

For what it's worth, I agree that Tenchi wasn't calling Pie suspicious, but I do think his vote against Zwet seemed fairly OMGUS. Voting for someone without stating your reasons is generally unhelpful.

I believe zwet OMGUS'ed him, and not the other way round? Either way I don't believe zwet has expressed any reasons for voting Tenchi either. It goes both ways, you know.

(Kinda unrelated) question: Do you think Wall-E's, Archon's or Ace's reasons for voting for you are sound?

I would very much like an answer to this as well.

Oh, wait, is no your answer to 128? If so, then why?

Please answer, zwet.

everyone stop feeding the troll so much

zwet stop being intentionally cryptic for attention

HAEL NAU or whatever you said is

not

obviously the words, "Hell no." You really expect anyone to understand that? Being cryptic is anti-town in this case.

I thought it very clearly meant "hell no". My problem with it was that he didn't actually give any

reasons

why. And as you called him a "troll" rather than scum (which implies you don't actually think he is), I would still like to see a good case against him from you/anyone else.

Tenchi's 152 rings true from what I recall of Archon, I didn't see Archon really do much (obviously this was up to now hypocritical but I'm making up for it now with my first proper post).

[AceMarksman]

Having a quote of your show up in an ortolan post feels akin to a freezing knife being stabbed repeatedly into your skull.

why are you in all of my games!!!

.

anywho, for actual content:

You provide no argument for this. Do you think it's useless even on the verge of a lynch on day 2?

My argument was "your cons in your previous post outweigh the pros IMHO." And this standpoint was for today, and I never supported not claiming at all, just massclaiming. We've got to see our position tomorrow to determine if a massclaim is needed.

[ortolan]

Yer I do apologise for the wall of text(s) but it's usually when I haven't been keeping up with a game for an extended period of time (this was really my first post of content in the game at all).

[ortolan]

My argument was "your cons in your previous post outweigh the pros IMHO." And this standpoint was for today, and I never supported not claiming at all, just massclaiming. We've got to see our position tomorrow to determine if a massclaim is needed.

The point was you made kind of a "massclaim sux" statement without extrapolating why. I want to gauge how strongly you feel about claiming; in what circumstances; and why. What about the pros and cons of massclaiming don't you like?

[Archon]

Archon, your last five points have been totally empty:

1. Self-meta or some empty comment on sekinj, which doesn't really justify you being actively lurking on this thread.

2. More fluff

3. An unvote, which relieves pressure from zwet.

4. Fluff for Jazz

5. And more excuse to lurk.

Just wow.

You are accusing me of activley lurking? I've been busy. Apparently I must tell you my schedule from Friday night.

Friday;
Play practice from 6-9 PM
Sleep till 10:00 AM next morning
Saturday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to dentist, 11:00
go to Play practice, 1:00
Come home and prep/serve dinner to friends, 5:00
Have a sleepover. Rest of night
Sunday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to other freind's house, 1:00
Attend another play. 5:45

Is this enough to tell you I'm not lurking?

FOS techni

for lies.

I'M BUSY, TECHNI. Apparently you can't understand that.

[zwetschenwasser]

^blatant appeal to emotion

[Archon]

^blatant appeal to emotion

Me?!

[zwetschenwasser]

Um. Yeah. We don't really need to feel pity for your insane schedule, you know.

[Archon]

Um. Yeah. We don't really need to feel pity for your insane schedule, you know.

I'm not asking for pity, smart one. I'm telling Techni that I had a reason for not posting, and that hes a liar for accusing me of active lurking.

[zwetschenwasser]

Liar.

[Tenchi]

You are accusing me of activley lurking?

I've been busy. Apparently I must tell you my schedule from Friday night.

Friday;
Play practice from 6-9 PM
Sleep till 10:00 AM next morning
Saturday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to dentist, 11:00
go to Play practice, 1:00
Come home and prep/serve dinner to friends, 5:00
Have a sleepover. Rest of night
Sunday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to other freind's house, 1:00
Attend another play. 5:45

Is this enough to tell you I'm not lurking?

FOS techni

for lies.

I'M BUSY, TECHNI. Apparently you can't understand that.

I "accused" you of actively lurking on

Mon Apr 13, 2009 12:39 am, PST

. Whatever side of the planet you are on, you should have posted that on Sunday or Monday.

This makes me wonder why you use your Friday activities to defend your Saturday/Sunday actions.

Also, instead of typing out your schedule, you could have used that time to read the game, which isn't that long actually.

[zwetschenwasser]

^the posting of a man with insight^

[Tenchi]

I'm bored.

Vote: Pie

Does this have serious intent behind it?

The intentions behind this has been discussed/requested on page 6.

I respect Wall-E's interpretation of my actions (eventhough I think it is wrong).

What does "respect" mean? If you think he's a good player that's all well and good but do you think his vote on you is

reasonable

or

scum-motivated

?

I think he's a good player and I thought his vote on me was reasonable.

ATTENTION TOWN: I have a problem with what's happening.

I don't know if it's just me or this game is moving too slow/cautious, especially discussion wise. The biggest power of town lies in catching scum in their foursome association, and we can't do it with this kind of activity.

What happened to the excitement last during the confirmation stage. I feel like almost everyone went into hiding!

Vote: Zwet

Stop voting without any justification, please, it's not making you look more town. I also view calls for more activity as a slight scumtell (easy way for scum to feign "helping" the town).

I have addressed the concerns on the vote on page 6. My call for activity is some wakeup call on what this game has degenerated to, and I believe that the only way we can make the most out of the mid/late-game claims is if we all be active.

Even if we claim later, but then we don't even have a clue on what the other players opinions on each other, then we have not much to go on.

[Tenchi]

I have addressed the concerns on the vote on page 6. My call for activity is some wakeup call on what this game has degenerated to, and I believe that the only way we can make the most out of the mid/late-game claims is if we all be active.

Even if we claim later, but then we don't even have a clue on what the other players opinions on each other, then we have not much to go on.

This is also to emphasize that, compared to regular games, that activity is much more critical to this game since we are basing our lynches (generally) on associations.

[sekinj]

I'm asking for replacement! Sorry, I just have too much going on with looking for a new job, looking for a new apartment and moving. I think it's best to replace out of a game that has only just started.

[zwetschenwasser]

Why you s...

[sekinj]

but for the record we should definitely claim later

[Tenchi]

EBWOP:

You are accusing me of activley lurking?

I've been busy. Apparently I must tell you my schedule from Friday night.

Friday;
Play practice from 6-9 PM
Sleep till 10:00 AM next morning
Saturday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to dentist, 11:00
go to Play practice, 1:00
Come home and prep/serve dinner to friends, 5:00
Have a sleepover. Rest of night
Sunday;
Wake up, 10:00
Go to other freind's house, 1:00
Attend another play. 5:45

Is this enough to tell you I'm not lurking?

FOS techni

for lies.

I'M BUSY, TECHNI. Apparently you can't understand that.

I "accused" you of actively lurking on

Mon Apr 13, 2009 12:39 am, PST

. Whatever side of the planet you are on, you should have posted that on Sunday or Monday.

This makes me wonder why you use your Friday activities to defend your Saturday/Sunday actions.

Also, instead of typing out your schedule, you could have used that time to read the game, which isn't that long actually.

[zwetschenwasser]

HAEL NAU!

[Tenchi]

HAEL NAU!

No to what?

[zwetschenwasser]

To sekinj's extremely scummy suggestion.

[mykonian]

ok, back from easter, rereading now.