Mini 749 - Antarctic Mafia [Game Over]

[Netlava]

Wait, hold on, no one hammer fishy, especially not while I posting right now.

Are we human? Or are we dancer?

JereIC - 1 (Netlava)

FishytheFish - 4 (Light-kun, tubby216, Jazzmyn, JereIC)

Looker - 1 (HowardRoark)
Jazzmyn - 1 (FishytheFish)

Not Voting - 2 (DraketheFake, Looker)

9 alive, 5 to lynch

FishytheFish is L-1

.

-Mod

(Vote Count accurate as of Post 636)

[Netlava]

So apparently, looker voted fishy while drunk. I hope she's sober enough now to give reasons, and maybe explain why she still hasn't unvoted or given a follow-up on her L-1 vote.

So, yeah, no one hammer, not while we have a "drunk vote" on the wagon. Also, tubby hasn't offered a reason for his vote either.

As I said previously, Fishy is most suspicious to me. He went V/LA for a bit, which is the only reason I didn't vote him sooner (see prior posts) but nothing he has posted since his return has changed my mind.

Fishy did not go V/LA in this game. He posted limited access at one point, but continued posting normally.

@JereIC: You still haven't answered though whether you think LK is SK or scum.

You quoted the part of my kill-'em-all plan discussion where I said there was a big risk that there was only one scum in the group, so killing us all would screw town, and said a townie wouldn't consider "this". Later, you said that a pro-town wouldn't suggest himself as a lynch target. That explanation seems inconsistent with the part you quoted - how do you get from me criticizing the plan to me suggesting myself as a lynch target?

I believe you were the one who brought up the plan.

[Fishythefish]

On Jazz: his first post gives four suspicions. These players are hardly mentioned again, and his reasons for suspecting them never mentioned again; probably because I became a more convenient target.
When Jazz comments on L-k (saying we should direct the latter's kills) he does not yet find me suspicious for taking the opposite view. This waits until he is trying to justify a vote on me.
There's not much to analyse in Jazz, and nothing in pacman. But what there is is scummy.

L-k-

Dear DTF: If we lynch scum, and mafia miss by your all powerful Doctorness (Sarcasm), I will shoot you tomorrow night. And I repeat for Howard who is obviously hard of hearing: TOMORROW NIGHT.

Why post this? Your shots should most certainly depend on flips, deaths etc., no way is looking forward to tomorrow helpful.

You know, the only arguable idea I have about flavor is that, even though I targeted Debonair doesn't mean I killed him. It is entirely possible that a serial killer and I targeted him, and when I "found him dead," I did nothing. Therefore, maybe a serial killer and I both targeted him. However, your narrow minded concept that I am serial killer for, essentially, flavor and/or "fucking up my species claim" (paraphrased) is absurd because:

I wouldn't screw up a claim if it were easy to do. If I were a mafia member, for example, I claim vig, town doesn't want me to shoot, I skate bye by paying attention to stuff like that. This aside...

In a mini NORMAL, flavor isn't allowed to have any grand impact on the game. In fact, if this game did have that included, allowing me to clear myself with teeth marks in Debonair's corpse or something, this game would then techinically be a mini theme, and Orange was in Peguin.

Finally: Flavor arguments are bullshit anyway.

I suppose there could be a vig and a SK. Seems like an awful lot of death roles in a 12 player game. If so, we are currently headed to bad places happens. The flavor, if it is as I think it is, couldn't be used to clear you. Only to catch you in an obvious lie.
Your last point, that flavor arguments are bullshit, may be a valid one.

Second Point: I find this to be deflection, which is scummy. I see no defense here nor do I see a requested claim.

There's no deflection, it is a direct response to Jere's post on me. I've said why I refuse to claim. The bandwagon on me is of a shockingly low quality, I think that I should be able to avoid the lynch without a claim (if this town is halfway reasonable), and unnecessary claims are bad for the town.

Another point against L-k shooting himself is that this gives any roleblocker the mafia have two free kills; L-k's and DtF's lynch when it is "proven" he is not a doctor. Altogether, an unworkable idea.

[Fishythefish]

*EBWOP: we are currently headed to bad places

whatever

happens.

[Looker]

i thot i unvoted

unvote

but my opinion still stands until i figure out why i did it...

[Light-kun]

L-k-

Dear DTF: If we lynch scum, and mafia miss by your all powerful Doctorness (Sarcasm), I will shoot you tomorrow night. And I repeat for Howard who is obviously hard of hearing: TOMORROW NIGHT.

Why post this? Your shots should most certainly depend on flips, deaths etc., no way is looking forward to tomorrow helpful.

I know. Mostly to show that DTF pissed me off. And that I think he is scum.

You know, the only arguable idea I have about flavor is that, even though I targeted Debonair doesn't mean I killed him. It is entirely possible that a serial killer and I targeted him, and when I "found him dead," I did nothing. Therefore, maybe a serial killer and I both targeted him. However, your narrow minded concept that I am serial killer for, essentially, flavor and/or "fucking up my species claim" (paraphrased) is absurd because:

I wouldn't screw up a claim if it were easy to do. If I were a mafia member, for example, I claim vig, town doesn't want me to shoot, I skate bye by paying attention to stuff like that. This aside...

In a mini NORMAL, flavor isn't allowed to have any grand impact on the game. In fact, if this game did have that included, allowing me to clear myself with teeth marks in Debonair's corpse or something, this game would then techinically be a mini theme, and Orange was in Peguin.

Finally: Flavor arguments are bullshit anyway.

I suppose there could be a vig and a SK. Seems like an awful lot of death roles in a 12 player game. If so, we are currently headed to bad places happens. The flavor, if it is as I think it is, couldn't be used to clear you. Only to catch you in an obvious lie.
Your last point, that flavor arguments are bullshit, may be a valid one.

All of them are valid. 1, and complete wifom except to me, I wouldn't fuck that up. 2, Flavor ISN'T allowed to have ANY grand impact on a game. That is pretty much a requirement of NORMAL games. 3, you agree with so meh.

Second Point: I find this to be deflection, which is scummy. I see no defense here nor do I see a requested claim.

There's no deflection, it is a direct response to Jere's post on me. I've said why I refuse to claim. The bandwagon on me is of a shockingly low quality, I think that I should be able to avoid the lynch without a claim (if this town is halfway reasonable), and unnecessary claims are bad for the town.

Another point against L-k shooting himself is that this gives any roleblocker the mafia have two free kills; L-k's and DtF's lynch when it is "proven" he is not a doctor. Altogether, an unworkable idea.

[/quote]
Meh, the point is that I find the "doctor" claim convenient. Real doctor knows better than to counter claim, assuming we have one, and the doctor can't be easily proven. As a result, I don't care for it too much.

[Fishythefish]

"Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game."
Well... we know that flavour is bound to have a slight impact on this one. For example, DtF claimed Emperor Penguin. Now, the scum

could

have that role- but I doubt it as they are predators. DtF

could

have fakeclaimed Emperor Penguin as scum, but that's a very famous species of penguin. The chances of a counterclaim would be unacceptably high. So in my opinion his claim is made more believable by the species claim. In a similar way, yours in made less by a species claim which doesn't fit your kill method.
I honestly don't know how much trust to put in flavour. I have no experience of it. Anyway, we will have much more information after tonight, so I see little point talking about your alignment today unless people want to lynch you.
Do you really think a genuine doctor would not counterclaim DtF? I think he almost certainly would.

[HowardRoark]

Dear DTF: If we lynch scum, and mafia miss by your all powerful Doctorness (Sarcasm), I will shoot you tomorrow night. And I repeat for Howard who is obviously hard of hearing: TOMORROW NIGHT.

{snip}

DtF: I might shoot myself tonight just to test your Doc Claim. Anyone object?

. . . and you wonder why I am still uncertain that you will follow the town's kill orders.

Your "I'll shoot myself" plan is beyond horrible.

----------

On Looker . . . Neither he/she nor his/her predecessor have brought much of anything useful to this game. na85 was slightly involved with the ZEEnon, Debonair Danny DiPietro, and freeko situations but nothing more. Looker has been lurking, trolling, and tossed an L-1 vote while drunk. While we battle over DraketheFake's claim and Fishythefish's L-1 situation and deal with Light-kun's distractions, Looker has sat back and just watched it all happen. (Based on his reaction to L-1, I am content to label Fishythefish as most likely town.)

Looker is not the only one . . .
Netlava posted once (the second I am not counting as it should not be counted as an EBWOP) two days after the L-1 vote was in place . . . without a comment about it.
tubby216 promised a post "tomorrow" yesterday, but has yet to check in and comment on the L-1. At least his vote is on Fishythefish: putting his money where his mouth is.
JereIC intended to hammer, but wanted a claim first and has yet to post again. He also threw the hammer on freeko (for that I don't blame him, but it is interesting none-the-less).

This is why I believe in lurker lynches. We, as probably mostly town, are near lynching Fishythefish. Meanwhile, these four players sit back and let it happen. While they cannot all be scum, I would bet a large wad of money that one of them is; I'd even bet a good bit of change on two of them being scum.

_______________
Let's go Pens!

[Jazzmyn]

I'm terribly sorry, folks, but real life and unexpected contingencies are absolutely killing me this week. I am doing my best to keep up, but writing substantive posts is a real challenge in light of current circumstances. I hope to be able to be back in full stride this weekend.

Regards,
Jazz

[JereIC]

Net - I think LK is pro-town. Yes, I brought up the up the kill-'em-all plan. You quoted the part where I tore it down. Why?

First off, d'oh about you unvoting LK. My bad.

"Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game."
Well... we know that flavour is bound to have a slight impact on this one. For example, DtF claimed Emperor Penguin. Now, the scum

could

have that role- but I doubt it as they are predators. DtF

could

have fakeclaimed Emperor Penguin as scum, but that's a very famous species of penguin. The chances of a counterclaim would be unacceptably high. So in my opinion his claim is made more believable by the species claim. In a similar way, yours in made less by a species claim which doesn't fit your kill method.

The other message to take away is that the connection between species and claims is going to be pretty squishy. The Krill-commuter link wasn't terribly obvious, but there it was. Doc-Emperor Penguin also wouldn't be terribly obvious if it's true. I think DtF is telling the truth about his species. However, he could be mafia, and his backstory is that he's trying to push the little Adelie penguins out. Considering how squishy the connection is, there's really not a lot of obvious reasons to lie about your species. That's why I find this argument:

On asking for species claims: L-k shot someone. The obvious read on this is "man with a gun". The obvious read on "man with a gun" is serial killer. I certainly thought there was a possibility that L-k would not want to claim a species for which "serial killer" made the most sense. In this case, he was very likely to claim a false species. Where is the ridiculous leap of logic you suggest? Once you start thinking about species, and thinking about the only claimed person, this is not a big step.
Also, it's pretty hard to see how this boast of this being my plan all along would be a scum move; outing L-k does not gain me town points, as L-k's lynch would be at least as good for the scum as the town.

unconvincing. In general, you can pick any species, make up any role, and if anyone questions you about it, point to Krill-commuter as precedent that the roles and species don't make a whole lot of sense. So, when somebody is asked to claim their species, they have two options: claim truthfully, and cite to Krill-commuter if it doesn't make sense, or lie, and risk being counterclaimed and lynched. Because of that, I think it's unreasonable to expect anyone to lie about their species when you're pushing for them to claim. I do think LK is lying, although I didn't expect him to (especially since he'd already hinted that he had a gun), but that's because he's got a plan, much like the Cylons.

Jere: a while back you said that you found me scummy because my defences were weak. When I asked about this, you said, quite reasonably, that this were your immediate thoughts after asked, and that you would expand if voting for me. Well, the time has come for you to explain, if this is part of your rationale for being close to hammering.

Here's what I saw, and my reaction to it:

• Your DDD to freeko vote switch wasn’t scummy, because both wagons were equally viable at the point you switched. As you later acknowledged, it was pretty obvious that the freeko bandwagon was gaining steam while the DDD one was losing steam.
  
• Having LK not kill tonight will test his claim. As I’ve said before, I don’t think it’s a good test of his claim because if he’s an SK, he might be one who doesn’t have to kill every night.
  
• The inconsistency of you first accepting LK’s claim, and later wanting to test it, is not scummy because… I’m actually not sure what defense you were trying to make. But the only good motive I can see for asking for LK to confirm his vig claim (with no kill tonight and the species claim) is that something happened that made you more suspicious of him. What was that? The obvious scummy motive was that you expected him to claim human with a gun, and were planning to get him lynched on flavor.

Also, never saw you respond to my point about Nuwen’s 243. If there's anything I missed, please point it out and I owe it to you to make a counter argument.

Since Looker unvoted, I feel ok about this, and it helps me get over my crippling addiction to hammers, which HR pointed out:

Vote: FishytheFish

[Fishythefish]

That's why I find this argument:

On asking for species claims: L-k shot someone. The obvious read on this is "man with a gun". The obvious read on "man with a gun" is serial killer. I certainly thought there was a possibility that L-k would not want to claim a species for which "serial killer" made the most sense. In this case, he was very likely to claim a false species. Where is the ridiculous leap of logic you suggest? Once you start thinking about species, and thinking about the only claimed person, this is not a big step.
Also, it's pretty hard to see how this boast of this being my plan all along would be a scum move; outing L-k does not gain me town points, as L-k's lynch would be at least as good for the scum as the town.

unconvincing. In general, you can pick any species, make up any role, and if anyone questions you about it, point to Krill-commuter as precedent that the roles and species don't make a whole lot of sense. So, when somebody is asked to claim their species, they have two options: claim truthfully, and cite to Krill-commuter if it doesn't make sense, or lie, and risk being counterclaimed and lynched. Because of that, I think it's unreasonable to expect anyone to lie about their species when you're pushing for them to claim.

At that time, I was assuming that L-k was something that could shoot a gun (anything else was an inconsistency I felt was much worse than that of the krill). I had not thought that people would use the krill to justify

any

flavor oddness. On lieing; well, the risk of being counterclaimed is small unless you pick a penguin claim. It's not unreasonable to expect someone to lie about their species when their species is likely to be an intrinsically scummy one.

Here's what I saw, and my reaction to it:

• Your DDD to freeko vote switch wasn’t scummy, because both wagons were equally viable at the point you switched. As you later acknowledged, it was pretty obvious that the freeko bandwagon was gaining steam while the DDD one was losing steam.
  
• Having LK not kill tonight will test his claim. As I’ve said before, I don’t think it’s a good test of his claim because if he’s an SK, he might be one who doesn’t have to kill every night.
  
• The inconsistency of you first accepting LK’s claim, and later wanting to test it, is not scummy because… I’m actually not sure what defense you were trying to make. But the only good motive I can see for asking for LK to confirm his vig claim (with no kill tonight and the species claim) is that something happened that made you more suspicious of him. What was that? The obvious scummy motive was that you expected him to claim human with a gun, and were planning to get him lynched on flavor.

Also, never saw you respond to my point about Nuwen’s 243

First point is fair. I was wrong about that, to a certain extent (while I still think DDD's wagon wasn't dead at this point).
I was (and am) under the impression that SK's always or nearly always have to kill. Is this wrong?
Things that happened to make me more suspicious of L-k: predominantly his suspicions of me, which were a parody of tunnelled. His play was hopelessly anti-town. He would not say he would no kill. Even otherwise, there is no inconsistency between being inclined to believe a claim and wanting to test it. Also, I made it clear where and why my stance on directing L-k changed. It was because I realised that directing him to no kill would actually be an effective test.
I was never against testing L-k's claim. Once I realised that there was an effective test, I was in favour.
If L-k was a vig, he would have a credible vig claim. If not, he wouldn't (at least, that was my assumption). Mafia and town alike could only get a lynch of L-k the serial killer out of flavour. I think that my reaction to L-k's probable false claim shows that this was not my intention.
Your point on 243 consisted of mentioning it. I'm afraid I didn't and don't understand the reference.

Leaving the hammer in the hands of known drunk-voter who is suspicious of me looks unwise.

[tubby216]

i apologize for being lurktastic as of late but real life has gotten in my way expect soemthing tomorrow

[Netlava]

Netlava posted once (the second I am not counting as it should not be counted as an EBWOP) two days after the L-1 vote was in place . . . without a comment about it.

I hadn't noticed that fishy was L-1 yet.

Net - I think LK is pro-town.

Earlier you said this:

> First, the reason I think LK is lying is not just that it doesn't make sense flavor-wise.

Uh, these are polar opposites...

Yes, I brought up the up the kill-'em-all plan. You quoted the part where I tore it down. Why?

Does it make a difference? You still brought up the plan. I quoted the part:

> However, if only one of us is scum, and there's three scum total, then killing all three of us screws town.

Because it illustrates my point. My point being that I don't think town would say "one of us is scum."

[JereIC]

Fishy-

• If somebody has a species that is so scummy they can't make it look pro-town in a claim, they're not going to pick an animal that hunts, kills, and eats penguins. Even if you expected LK to claim something other than human with a gun, you should have suspected something else was going on when he claimed killer whale.
  
• In my experience, SKs usually have the option to not kill. But I wasn't on the site from 2006-08, so things may have changed in that time.
  
• The point of 243 is that you called the kill-'em-all plan crazy, but didn't similarly criticize Nuwen's discussion of killing claimed townies.
  
• Don't try to pin another person's vote on me. I'm only responsible for my sober vote, and I wouldn't be voting for you if I didn't think you were scum.

Net- To make my position clearer, I think LK is pro-town, and is clumsily trying a lie that he thinks will expose scum. I think it's worked to an extent. With respect to the part of the kill-'em-all discussion you quoted, that actually makes sense. I'll concede the point.

[Fishythefish]

- An interesting point on the killer whale. I had merely been thinking of it as something that couldn't hold a gun. But I don't quite understand- you thought L-k was lying when he claimed his species, as did I. This discussion is about whether it's plausible I predicted this. His actual claim isn't all that relevant.

- Thanks.

- On 243: well, mostly that's because it's completely different. Nuwen's discussion was on killing claimed vanilla townies, not three players who (in my opinion) have been picked pretty much at random.

- You are responsible for your vote. You are also responsible for the forseeable consequences of your vote. At different times in the game, votes on people need different levels of certainty. Right now, with the bandwagon on me being how it is (ie. very weak and susceptible to hammered hammering), you should be extremely certain about me being scum to put me at L-1. I don't believe your case justifies that certainty.

- L-k has nowhere suggested that he lied, to expose scum or otherwise. I think this position is completely unjustified.

[Fishythefish]

Some questions for Jere:

- What are the motives of the 4 players voting for me?
- All 4 of the other players attacking me are either unable to participate fully at the moment or consistently refuse to explain their reasons for voting me. Are you ready for my lynch under these conditions?
- Who are my likely scumpartners? Bear in mind that if even one of the players attacking me was not, my lynch would be pretty unlikely, instead of extremely likely (as the other three players have all said they think me town). Netlava sits back and pushes a case which is getting no support. DtF and Howard are vocal in their support for a likely lynchee, having been suspicious of me earlier in the day- a huge risk if we were scumpartners.
- What do you think of my point that it seems unlikely that I was trying to get L-k lynched based on flavour grounds, given that I didn’t try to get L-k lynched based on flavour grounds?
- Where is the inconsistency in my treatment of L-k’s claim?

[tubby216]

/confirm

~

this is where it all started to go downhill for you,,, lol j/k

Here is JereIC, completely changing his reason for voting for me! At first, he says I am a bit fishy, but when other players bring up another line of argument, he jumps on it, even after I have clearly demonstrated that it is nonsense! What is this, if not trying to force through a townie lynch, with no thought for logic, reason or debate?
At this point I think JereIC is obvscum. There is no need for a claim- I cannot think of a claim which could make me think about lynching anyone else. The only question that remains, before we lynch this vile scum, is who his partner(s) are. One, I think, is obvious- ZEEnon. It has struck me throughout that these two players are very carefully and deliberately completely avoiding ANY contact with one another. Add this to the excellent points Drake has recently made against ZEEnon, and I think we have tomorrow's lynch

4th post of the game and you already get into OMGUSand a lil WIFOM thrown in,,, booo bad fishy.

My problem with picking two lynch targets is it is very good for the mafia if they have a roleblocker- they roleblock if and only if LK is hitting one of them. If LK is a SK, he will surely be shooting for scum at this stage (even if we lynch scum that looks like the right move for him)? For this reason, I'd be tempted to let him choose his target. Note that if LK is really a SK, he'll still probably be nightkilled in the upcoming day or two, as the scum can't tell between the two, and don't like SK's anyway.
Overall, I think if we ask any doctors out there not to protect LK, the risk he poses to the town is minimal, and we should let him act alone for now.

Ok fist off the info gain from two very real wagons with the possible death of both players is a very useful tool if wielded correctly by the town. Plus there are only so many scum in this game it would be very difficultr for them to influence correctly both selections to their advantage, and to do all of that without making a mistake or giving away a tell.

See and as I am reading you in isolation here, I really do not like your posts they are very DDD like where you say a whole lot but you are not telling me anything, To me with every post its more and more info to try to confuse and cover yourself in.

At one point you even come out to support LK and his claim then spend 8 posts denouncing it on the grounds of flavour,,

Did you ever claim??

"Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game."
Well... we know that flavour is bound to have a slight impact on this one. For example, DtF claimed Emperor Penguin. Now, the scum could have that role- but I doubt it as they are predators. DtF could have fakeclaimed Emperor Penguin as scum, but that's a very famous species of penguin. The chances of a counterclaim would be unacceptably high. So in my opinion his claim is made more believable by the species claim. In a similar way, yours in made less by a species claim which doesn't fit your kill method.
I honestly don't know how much trust to put in flavour. I have no experience of it. Anyway, we will have much more information after tonight, so I see little point talking about your alignment today unless people want to lynch you.
Do you really think a genuine doctor would not counterclaim DtF? I think he almost certainly would.

No the doc would never counter claim if he is smart because once he is exposed he cannot protect himself and scum kills him then our faithful cop will have no protect for when he claim a guilty,,

You have played this game before right??

Now granted I know this is all over the place and prolly hard to follow but its how I think and why I never make these kinds of posts, so I hope you are happy,,

Now I have the beer batter all ready can we go ahead and fry this fish now the fat guy in hungry.


..... in a side note nothing i said was meant in a mean or heartless way i was attempting to be funny by poking a little fun at you ......

Tags fixed..

[Fishythefish]

/confirm

~

this is where it all started to go downhill for you,,, lol j/k

Here is JereIC, completely changing his reason for voting for me! At first, he says I am a bit fishy, but when other players bring up another line of argument, he jumps on it, even after I have clearly demonstrated that it is nonsense! What is this, if not trying to force through a townie lynch, with no thought for logic, reason or debate?
At this point I think JereIC is obvscum. There is no need for a claim- I cannot think of a claim which could make me think about lynching anyone else. The only question that remains, before we lynch this vile scum, is who his partner(s) are. One, I think, is obvious- ZEEnon. It has struck me throughout that these two players are very carefully and deliberately completely avoiding ANY contact with one another. Add this to the excellent points Drake has recently made against ZEEnon, and I think we have tomorrow's lynch

4th post of the game and you already get into OMGUSand a lil WIFOM thrown in,,, booo bad fishy.

My problem with picking two lynch targets is it is very good for the mafia if they have a roleblocker- they roleblock if and only if LK is hitting one of them. If LK is a SK, he will surely be shooting for scum at this stage (even if we lynch scum that looks like the right move for him)? For this reason, I'd be tempted to let him choose his target. Note that if LK is really a SK, he'll still probably be nightkilled in the upcoming day or two, as the scum can't tell between the two, and don't like SK's anyway.
Overall, I think if we ask any doctors out there not to protect LK, the risk he poses to the town is minimal, and we should let him act alone for now.

Ok fist off the info gain from two very real wagons with the possible death of both players is a very useful tool if wielded correctly by the town. Plus there are only so many scum in this game it would be very difficultr for them to influence correctly both selections to their advantage, and to do all of that without making a mistake or giving away a tell.

See and as I am reading you in isolation here, I really do not like your posts they are very DDD like where you say a whole lot but you are not telling me anything, To me with every post its more and more info to try to confuse and cover yourself in.

At one point you even come out to support LK and his claim then spend 8 posts denouncing it on the grounds of flavour,,

Did you ever claim??

"Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game."
Well... we know that flavour is bound to have a slight impact on this one. For example, DtF claimed Emperor Penguin. Now, the scum could have that role- but I doubt it as they are predators. DtF could have fakeclaimed Emperor Penguin as scum, but that's a very famous species of penguin. The chances of a counterclaim would be unacceptably high. So in my opinion his claim is made more believable by the species claim. In a similar way, yours in made less by a species claim which doesn't fit your kill method.
I honestly don't know how much trust to put in flavour. I have no experience of it. Anyway, we will have much more information after tonight, so I see little point talking about your alignment today unless people want to lynch you.
Do you really think a genuine doctor would not counterclaim DtF? I think he almost certainly would.

No the doc would never counter claim if he is smart because once he is exposed he cannot protect himself and scum kills him then our faithful cop will have no protect for when he claim a guilty,,

You have played this game before right??

Now granted I know this is all over the place and prolly hard to follow but its how I think and why I never make these kinds of posts, so I hope you are happy,,

Now I have the beer batter all ready can we go ahead and fry this fish now the fat guy in hungry.


..... in a side note nothing i said was meant in a mean or heartless way i was attempting to be funny by poking a little fun at you ......

Tags fixed (If you type a post in Word, quotation marks are different)

[Fishythefish]

No, I never claimed. I don't intend to I feel that at least the majority of my attackers are making a decent pretence at being susceptible to reason.

Yes I have played this game before.

The first post you attack is entirely a joke post.

Your point on not wanting to direct L-k makes sense, I suppose. It is a somewhat obscure argument in favour of directing the kill (no one mentioned it at the time). You disagree with my ponit of view; but what you feel I have overlooked is hardly so glaringly obvious that I am scummy for it. Also, there is no motive for scum to support L-k.

You condemn me for making posts like DDD's- he was town. I am under attack, and I think most of the reasons are flawed. Of course I want to explain myself fully. If you feel I am trying to obscure the facts with sheer volume, then that is a different matter- and perhaps the only thing in you post which really expains why you think I'm scum.

I believed L-k's claim at the time, although there seems to be a serious misconception as to how sure I was. Then he made a species I regarded as very likely untrue. So I changed my mind. How is this scummy?

I would think that a doctor swapping his life for a scum's would be good for the town. In any case, it is an enormous stretch to call this opinion scummy.

Your post gives some things about my playstyle you don't like, and some opinions of mine you disagree with. Fair enough, I've made a lot of posts in this game, you are almost bound to disagree with some of them. You have every right to think I'm long winded and post too much. But most of your post doesn't say why you think I am scum. It feels like you have skimmed over my posts, looking for anything you can disagree with. I really think you need to reconsider your vote.

[tubby216]

I would think that a doctor swapping his life for a scum's would be good for the town. In any case, it is an enormous stretch to call this opinion scummy.

how is the doctor swapping his life for a scum one? what if there were and or are two docs, Yha i could see that being a valid argument if we were in an F11 set up but we're not.

and its not that far of a strectch to call it scummy, because with the doc dead or a doc dead there is little hope of the the cop to come out at all, especially if he has a ll innocent or town aligned results.

I do not have hard proof that you are scum id not like you cam out and posted and said

hey everybody i am scumm and here are my partners

or that you claimed responsibility for any of the night kills, I go off how i read you, when i read your posts i ask these questions

1 does this sound like a town post
2 would scumm use a post like this to hide
3 what is the benefit of this post town vs scum

then i account for moodiness, bad day syndrome,good day syndrome, relaxed, over thougt out, stuff like that

and after reading your posts for like the fourth time in iso and twice in the thread i find you scummy,

does that satisfy you appitie? and no I am not changing my vote i spen too much time working on my favorite beer batter

[Light-kun]

Fishy, the emperor penguin=doctor doesn't make any sense. Either he's lying or the flavor doesn't make sense. This means that either he and I are both scum, or flavor is bs. Since you still think I'm scummy due to flavor, but haven't said anything about him except defense. Why do you prefer him? Because he's your scum partner.

[Fishythefish]

Why doesn't emperor penguin = doctor make any sense?

[Fishythefish]

To clarify; if you asked me "what is an emperor penguin's role?", I'm not claiming I'd say "doctor! Duh!". But there's no actual inconsistency here, unlike a killer whale who can shoot people.
Since the odds look excellent that I'm going to die before DtF, and I think he's probably a townie anyway (mostly due to his reaction to my bandwagon today), for now at least I'm supremely unconcerned that you think we are linked. However, if you are using this as an argument that I am scum, it makes no sense. DtF's species claim has no inconsistency with any known facts.
My position on flavour started as "the flavour is unlikely to have any glaring internal inconsistencies"- in particular, clearly kill method has been thought about to some extent (a single red dot in the middle of his chest... doesn't feel like the idly chosen wording of a mod who has forgotten the killer is a whale), and I would expect it to correlate with role flavour. My position is currently this, tinted with a bit of "maybe it is all BS". There is simply no logical reason this should make me find DtF scummy.

[HowardRoark]

Netlava posted once (the second I am not counting as it should not be counted as an EBWOP) two days after the L-1 vote was in place . . . without a comment about it.

I hadn't noticed that fishy was L-1 yet.

Post 600 (at the top of the page) was a vote count post; not an "edited to add vote count" post. It included a

bolded

note that Fishythefish was at L-1.

FoS Netlava

(My apologies for the extreme brevity, but I was busy today and will be through the week-end. Y'all might see a couple more of these very brief ones until late Monday when I can come back full swing.)

[orangepenguin]

Hey guys, I am thinking about adding a two-week deadline. I am not sure if you will really need it, but if I get 5 votes in support of deadline (

Vote: 2 week deadline

) than I will set one, or 5 votes to not have one. But it has been 6 weeks, so it is entirely up to you, if you want one.

Just to clarify, the person with the most votes at the time of a deadline (May 9-13-ish, depending on when and if I set it) will be the one lynched. In the event that two people have the same number of votes, the person who has had that amount the longest will be the lynchee. -Mod.