Mini 749 - Antarctic Mafia [Game Over]

[Fishythefish]

Fish, you didn't acknowledge the post where you said you "no longer want L-k lynched." If you no longer want something, it implies that at some point you did want it.

Since I acknowledged in my post that I did indeed want L-k lynched if he didn't agree to follow orders, I thought this unnecessary.

But that's all semantics. It's just not credible that you moved from thinking LK was the SK and wanting to keep him alive so that he could keep killing, to that he might not be the SK and shouldn't kill tonight as a test (a lame test, as I've pointed out).

More accurate would be to say I wanted to keep him alive so as not to waste lynches. My analysis assumed he would kill no matter what we said (indeed I assumed he was compulsive- to a significant extent because he wouldn't agree to no kill). Whether we should keep L-k alive if we

can't

direct him and what we should do if we

can

direct him are very different matters.

It feels a lot more like you, DtF, and HR pushed LK to claim species (expecting to be able to follow up with your "man with a gun = SK" argument), then when LK lied wanted to promote the LK lynch without having your vote on the same guy as DtF, then realized the LK lynch was a mistake and trying to cover your tail.

I never held a position that would have lead to the lynch of L-k, unless he is mad enough not to agree to follow our orders when about to be lynched.

As for my explanation of LK, I think it's the only sensible explanation. The other two options are
- He's anti-town, and decided instead of claiming the obvious choice of human, going for the even more anti-penguin animal.
- He's really a killer whale, but didn't notice the weirdness when DDD's death scene was posted and joked about being the guy with a nice shiny gun in post 484.

As for why he's not confirming my theory, probably because he's still pretty suspicious of me - you should have noticed that he's already trying to figure out whether the alignment of one of us is indicative of the alignment of the other.

I think both the options you present are much more likely (and I don't think killer whale, in this context, is more anti-penguin than man- penguins eat krill, whales eat penguins. It's all good.). If this was a falseclaim, he would have said so earlier than this- indeed before you made this hypothesis. Overthinking this seems silly- the obvious explanation is that his claim is real and he's either vig or SK, or more likely that it's fake, and he decided to choose something that can kill.

I'll respond to Jazz later.

Stop trying to make fetch happen! It's not going to happen!

JereIC - 1 (Netlava)
FishytheFish - 3 (Light-kun, Jazzmyn, JereIC)
Looker - 2 (HowardRoark, FishytheFish)
Jazzmyn - 1 (Looker)

Not Voting - 1 (DraketheFake, tubby216)

9 alive, 5 to lynch

-Mod

(Vote Count accurate as of Post 694)

[Fishythefish]

Fishy also said (on Day 2 long after the fact) that “by maybe post 230, it was clear that DDD or freeko was likely to be lynched.” This looks to me like Fishy trying to give himself an out after the vote analysis led to him as a suspect. Back when post 230 was written, there was no looming deadline, there was no reason that other players could not be discussed, there was no reason to drop discussion on other suspicious play by others or to stop scumhunting by post 230. It is also suspicious to me that Fishy chose to cite post 230 as the delineating mark of Day 1, as that post was not one of his own posts, but rather a post by LightKun which only put freeko at 3 votes. Looks like Fishy was trying to ‘blame’ someone else by choosing that post by LightKun as the do-or-die mark, rather than one of his own posts/votes, when it was actually Fishy who tipped the balance, not LightKun, and that wasn’t until Fishy’s post 271.

Firstly- you say that my quote was "long after the fact" as if that was a bad thing. I'm hardly going to say that on day 1- everyone should be keeping an open mind. Also, I never in any way tried to blame L-k. The balance I tipped in 271 was

between

DDD and freeko. I think that it was clear long before then that one of them was the likely lynch.

I also contend that Fishy's insistence that the flavour of the game somehow makes LightKun's claim "very likely false" is ridiculous. I note, as well, that Fishy continues to ignore the fact that the flavour of the game makes it 100% clear that those of us who are townie penguins are also cannibals (cannibals!) feeding on fellow townies who are krill. It is one thing to have an idea about how the flavour might play out and to suggest that Light's claim might be false as a result of what you thought, but once it has been established beyond doubt that the flavour is, in fact, somewhat odd and inconsistent (i.e. those of us who are townies are cannibals), it is quite another thing to cling to your idea and to ignore the proven reality that the flavour is unreliable as a means to support your belief.

I still believe that having conflicting species and a kill method which doesn't fit are on a different scale of unlikeliness. Regardless, there's no good scummy motive for my actions.

Do you really believe a SK would go against the town's orders?

Where do you get from my posts that I think that?

You say that directing L-k's kills tests his claim. This is only true if L-k the SK can be distinguished from L-k the vig by directing his kills. The relevance is that if directing L-k's kills is not helpful in this regard, it is less important.

As I said, Fishy’s response here was both strawmanning and unsatisfactory. The former because instead of addressing what I actually wrote, he asked “Do you really believe a SK would go against the town’s orders?” when that is not what I said at all. The latter, because when I asked Fishy where he got from my post that I thought that which he attributed to me, he completely misrepresented my post. He left out what I actually said in favour of what he wanted others to believe I said. What I actually said in the post to which he purported to reply was that I was also suspicious of him “for being so against the idea of having the town direct LK's night kill

or no-kill

, purporting to prefer to let him choose independently, despite the fact that we need to test Light-Kun's claim since he could just as easily be a SK as a Vig.” Fishy misrepresented my post by ignoring the fact that I specifically said that we needed to direct LK's kill

or no-kill

in order to test him since he could be a SK rather than a Vig. The duo-combo of strawman and misrepresentation only reinforces my suspicion of Fishy.

Your post implied that you believed a SK would go against the town's orders, because you thought that directing a SK/vig was a good way to test a claim.
I can see why you think I misrepresented your post. If you look at it in the context of the next sentence, the quotation is "Do you really believe a SK would go against the town's orders? The main reason I changed my mind was because I think there's a fair chance that, if L-k is SK, he won't be able to follow our orders to no kill." The intended meaning of this, in full, was:
"I thought letting L-k act independently was sensible because testing his claim is impossible. Do you really believe a SK would go against the town's orders? The main reason I changed my mind was because I think there's a fair chance that, if L-k is SK, he won't be able to follow our orders to no kill- so I now agree that testing his claim is not impossible."

But it wasn’t stated explicitly at all. Rather, in the "post in question", which I note that Fishy didn't cite, he asked a question “by the way”, and then said that “incidentally” he had come to the conclusion that most of us had come to a long time ago, and that he was against until then. The post was this:

By the way, a question to any experienced players: in a normal game, how common is it for a serial killer to be able to no kill? This is obviously relevant to testing L-k's claim.
Incidentally, on reflection I no longer support letting L-k choose his own kill. The benefits are marginal, and if L-k is the SK, his interests may not align with ours, particularly over the matter of whether or not he should be shooting at all.

That doesn't look or sound to me at all like someone who is 'explicitly stating' their rationale for an about-face. The first sentence is prefaced with "by the way" followed by a question to experienced players. The second sentence is prefaced with "Incidentally" Neither looks to me like explicit rationale for changing his mind all of a sudden and coming around to the view that many, if not most, of us had already expressed. The first is just asking a question of experienced players, which suggests that Fishy has not come to any conclusions at all. As for the second, when one prefaces a statement with “Incidentally,” that means to me (and to most people, I would think) that it is not specifically related to what you said just prior, but rather that it is something that you just want to add to something that had been discussed elsewhere, previously, or nowhere at all. Perhaps that was Fishy just misusing the term, but that’s how it read to me, so I do not know how anyone would be expected to take from that post of Fishy's that that was his rationale for changing his mind all of a sudden. Given the strawman and misrepresentation above, I am more inclined to think that Fishy's further misrepresentation is deliberate rather than accidental, though.

The "incidentally" and the "by the way" do of course both mean that they are not specifically related to the prior thing- in this case, the prior post, made by me on a very different topic. I think these statements are pretty obviously related- particularly by the words "particularly over whether or not to shoot at all".

If I was scum, I'd sure as hell want to know whether he was a vig or a SK.

Makes sense. Wouldn't you also want to know if you were town?

I'd just love him to get lynched.

And? Again, it isn’t clear to me what point you’re trying to make.

Knowing his target couldn't hurt either.

Makes sense, but the tradeoff is that as town, we need to be able to test his claim and control his kill or no-kill.

Why did you just ignore those? I didn’t ask the questions for no reason, you know, and I don’t post just to see myself post. It is not at all sufficient to say, after the fact, and after you’ve wholly ignored those portions of my post that “the next 4 are all completely covered by my next point- viz that if there is no reason for scum to take my position, it’s not scummy. You were asking why I brought a few things up- this was the answer to all of them (and that was obvious).” This answer is wholly insufficient. I was not, as you claim, simply asking ‘why you brought a few things up’. I was asking you specific questions and you ignored them. You also ignored (again) the fact that I referred to the necessity of controlling LK’s kill

or no kill

– which you later went on to pretend I hadn’t mentioned.

Your three points pretty well ask for explanations for the bits of my post you quote. All of them are covered by the fact that I was illustrating that there was no scummy motive for my actions. The answers to your specific question is clear, and I believe my post answered the spirit of your points completely.

You say that you had made your case fully before; this really isn't true. That wall of text clarifies your position for me, and makes me much happier about it. It was needed to make your vote on me reasonable.

unvote

Suicide time- I don't like looker's play. Fine, lurking and lack of explanation is a style, its even looker's style by my meta on him. However, his recent "fish or jazz" comment is even worse than usual. To me it stinks of scum egging on a town vs. town clash.

vote: Looker

[Looker]

Due to recent developments, i.e., Jazz's vote, I now decree Fishy off the hook. The scum is either Jazz or me...

[Fishythefish]

Due to recent developments, i.e., Jazz's vote, I now decree Fishy off the hook. The scum is either Jazz or me...

That's unexpected to say the least. I hate to be the one to say this, as it's kind of nice not having enough people wanting you dead for a lynch, but.... what vote?

[JereIC]

That piqued my interest. Looker: wut?

[Jazzmyn]

Due to recent developments, i.e., Jazz's vote, I now decree Fishy off the hook. The scum is either Jazz or me...

Huh? What are you talking about? And did you just claim scum?

Regards,
Jazz

[HowardRoark]

HR - as I said before, it makes no sense for the actual doc to claim in DtF's circumstances. A real doc wouldn't think, "Gosh, I don't want to get shot by LK tonight, so I better tell the mafia that I'm the doc!" Granted, it doesn't make much sense for scum to fake-claim doc right now either, but maybe he's trying some sort of Hail Mary pass to expose the doc.

They are all valid possibilities. I can see why DraketheFake would claim, believing that Fishythefish was on the brink of being lynched and that he would be the [vig]Light-kun target. He appears to believe the vig claim enough so that if Light-kun were to kill tonight he has a higher chance of hitting scum.

Honestly, Looker . . . your play . . . no worthwhile content . . . reminding me of Light-kun . . . frustrating . . .

[JereIC]

Also gonna announce that I'll be on V/LA from May 2 to May 4.

[Light-kun]

*Checks in*

Posting may decrease in upcoming weeks. I will try my best.

[DraketheFake]

Three pages since my last post. Sorry about that, long weekend in the bathroom.

i thot i unvoted

unvote

but my opinion still stands until i figure out why i did it...

Really? Really? I understand that you're playing this partially for laughs, but A. We're past that point, and B. This and the "drunk vote" make you look pretty bad.

"Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game."
Well... we know that flavour is bound to have a slight impact on this one. For example, DtF claimed Emperor Penguin. Now, the scum could have that role- but I doubt it as they are predators. DtF could have fakeclaimed Emperor Penguin as scum, but that's a very famous species of penguin. The chances of a counterclaim would be unacceptably high. So in my opinion his claim is made more believable by the species claim. In a similar way, yours in made less by a species claim which doesn't fit your kill method.
I honestly don't know how much trust to put in flavour. I have no experience of it. Anyway, we will have much more information after tonight, so I see little point talking about your alignment today unless people want to lynch you.
Do you really think a genuine doctor would not counterclaim DtF? I think he almost certainly would.

This post is a pretty good summary of a lot of my thoughts on the argument Jazzmyn and L-k have been making against those of us who think that L-k's claim is almost certainly false based on flavor. The statement "Flavour is not allowed to have any grand impact on the game" sounds like yet another raft being desperately clung to - most, if not all games with multiple killing factions have a way of distinguishing between kill methods, traditionally being split along Mafia = Gun and SK = Knife. Obviously we're dealing with slightly different flavor here, due to the animal nature, but that fact that your species claim has no conceivable way of creating a small red hole, combined with the fact that that you didn't outright claim your species, should make it cut-and-dried for anyone in the town that the claim does not compute.

During the JereIC/Fishy interaction on 26, I don't like the way JereIC basically posts the blueprint for fakeclaiming, continuing to point to the Krill-Commuter role as the gold standard of flavor not mattering in this game. I also don't like the way Fishy appeals to JereIC not to leave the hammer in the hands of a "drunk voter," and I think JereIC's response is spot-on. However:

Net- To make my position clearer, I think LK is pro-town, and is clumsily trying a lie that he thinks will expose scum. I think it's worked to an extent. With respect to the part of the kill-'em-all discussion you quoted, that actually makes sense. I'll concede the point.

This is a completely ridiculous backtrack, or else I didn't read carefully enough the first time. More on that in a minute.

Tubby's 641 is a bad, bad post. He starts with a joke, attempts to extract real analysis from this game's RVS, then says "I really do not like your posts they are very DDD like where you say a whole lot but you are not telling me anything" without referencing anything specific. He also says:

No the doc would never counter claim if he is smart because once he is exposed he cannot protect himself and scum kills him then our faithful cop will have no protect for when he claim a guilty,,

You have played this game before right??

I suppose as the Doc I may be a bit biased based on the fact that I did this, but this is a pretty critical day for us given the numbers and the relative likelihood that L-k is telling the truth. I guess the whole "Me-claiming-out-of-the-blue-as-scum" thing relies on Fishy being scum and me trying to distract, and since I don't believe that to be true it's a tough sell. Other than that you're also making the assumption that the town even has a cop.

Fishy, the emperor penguin=doctor doesn't make any sense. Either he's lying or the flavor doesn't make sense. This means that either he and I are both scum, or flavor is bs. Since you still think I'm scummy due to flavor, but haven't said anything about him except defense. Why do you prefer him? Because he's your scum partner.

Reads pretty frustrated to me. A third option obviously exists: that I'm not lying and that the flavor does make sense. What would have made sense for the "doctor" role in this game? A penguin with a med kit? You're grasping at pitiful straws here, and I can't believe nobody else is calling you on it.

- An interesting point on the killer whale. I had merely been thinking of it as something that couldn't hold a gun. But I don't quite understand- you thought L-k was lying when he claimed his species, as did I. This discussion is about whether it's plausible I predicted this. His actual claim isn't all that relevant.

It's relevant because your case seems manufactured. Let's say you are pro-town, and suspect LK of being anti-town. You press him to claim species. Your theory is that if he is anti-town, he will have a bad-sounding species, and so may claim a cuter-sounding species. Therefore, you see two possibilities: (1) he claims to be a harmless species, in which case you press the case because he clearly isn't harmless, or (2) he claims to be a human hunter, in which case he hasn't lied and you have to press him another way. Then, when LK went for "(3) killer whale," you would have been surprised: his claim doesn't fit into either course you anticipated, so you can't go after him yet, but you can't just move onto to a different test. In this case you would have pressed him on his claim, and tried to figure out if he was joking, had unusual flavor, was a particularly ballsy scum, or something else.

In the real world, you said we should lynch him (although maybe not immediately). You're not behaving like the pro-town player in my hypothetical situation, which means you either have different motives (such as neutralizing an anti-mafia player with killing ability) or extra information (like you're a cop/sk-hunter and investigated LK last night). You haven't dropped any hints about being a cop, so it's more likely you have motives that aren't those of a pro-town player.

This is another false dilemma, and one that you sort of admit is one in the very same post. The words "you're not behaving like a pro-town player in my hypothetical situation" should never be used in a serious case.

Net strikes me as pro-town: his case against me and for you may be weak, but I think he honestly believes it.

Yeah, this doesn't make a ton of sense either.

And the problem with your idea that L-k is running some kind of gambit to catch scum is precisely that

you'd think L-k would have gone ahead and mentioned that by now

, since that's the main charge of everything that's happened today. You trying to give him an out like this is unbelievable, and the fact that he hasn't taken it means that you're just plain wrong, and for you to continue to maintain that he's lying BUT pro-town is absurd.

L-k's 658: Filled with more terrible logic (the JereIC/Fishy scum/not scum shell game), ad hom (in the balls? Really?), and needless speculation on a third killing role.

Looker's 661: To be expected, I suppose.

ok so since noone else wants to hammer the the fish I will

unvote

and i reserve the right to hammer if someone else decides to vote for the fish

You... unvoted so that you could hammer? But still think Fish is the best lynch?

You know, come to think of it, it's essentially Nuwen's fault that 2/3 of the players in this game have only wanted to talk about the overlap on the freeko/DDD wagons today.

I'm going to do Jazz's posts in a separate, individual analysis. I'll say this, though: it's not helping that our replacements today have been so hopelessly tunneled (Jazz on the Nuwen trio of me, Jere and Fishy, Netlava on Jere, tubby on Fishy, and Looker on saying things that don't make sense.)

As far as this page, Looker.... yeah I don't know either. I hope alcohol was involved in that post, though due to generally correct grammar I have my doubts.

[JereIC]

During the JereIC/Fishy interaction on 26, I don't like the way JereIC basically posts the blueprint for fakeclaiming, continuing to point to the Krill-Commuter role as the gold standard of flavor not mattering in this game.

But you make the same basic argument (flavor doesn't make sense) to support your Doc = Emperor Penguin claim.

Net- To make my position clearer, I think LK is pro-town, and is clumsily trying a lie that he thinks will expose scum. I think it's worked to an extent. With respect to the part of the kill-'em-all discussion you quoted, that actually makes sense. I'll concede the point.

This is a completely ridiculous backtrack, or else I didn't read carefully enough the first time. More on that in a minute.

It's only a backtrack from my post 557. Since then the worst thing I've said about LK's claim was that it's an "incredible lie."

<JereIC and Fishy quotes cut for brevity>
This is another false dilemma, and one that you sort of admit is one in the very same post. The words "you're not behaving like a pro-town player in my hypothetical situation" should never be used in a serious case.

a) It's not a false dilemma. Fishy said he pushed for LK's species claim because he anticipated LK making a false claim (you did too, btw). There's no way he can argue that he anticipated LK would make a false claim that made LK look even scummier then he did from the flavor. Therefore, the fact that he immediately concluded that LK was anti-town looks opportunistic and scummy.
b) I showed what a pro-town player would do in Fishy's situation. That's the hypothetical. I showed how Fishy acted differently. Showing that he's not acting like a pro-town player is a serious case.

Net strikes me as pro-town: his case against me and for you may be weak, but I think he honestly believes it.

Yeah, this doesn't make a ton of sense either.

Care to explain?

And the problem with your idea that L-k is running some kind of gambit to catch scum is precisely that

you'd think L-k would have gone ahead and mentioned that by now

, since that's the main charge of everything that's happened today. You trying to give him an out like this is unbelievable, and the fact that he hasn't taken it means that you're just plain wrong, and for you to continue to maintain that he's lying BUT pro-town is absurd.

He hasn't refuted it either, and it's clear he's been reading my posts.

[Fishythefish]

a) It's not a false dilemma. Fishy said he pushed for LK's species claim because he anticipated LK making a false claim (you did too, btw). There's no way he can argue that he anticipated LK would make a false claim that made LK look even scummier then he did from the flavor. Therefore, the fact that he immediately concluded that LK was anti-town looks opportunistic and scummy.

I haven't argued that I thought L-k would make a false claim

that made LK look even scummier than he did from the flavour

. (Also, it is absurd to think the Killer Whale looks worse, or as bad, as man with a gun). I did anticipate L-k would make a false claim- and the type of false claim L-k made has no bearing on this. You misrepresent me.

[JereIC]

I haven't argued that I thought L-k would make a false claim

that made LK look even scummier than he did from the flavour

.

And no one accused you of that. My case is based on the fact that your motive for pushing for his species claim, then concluding he was the SK (and softly pushing for his lynch) don't make sense if you're pro-town.

(Also, it is absurd to think the Killer Whale looks worse, or as bad, as man with a gun).

Guy with a gun could be a wildlife research who has a gun for self-defense, or a vet who has a gun for euthanasia, or a hunter who's here to hunt albatross or seals. There's lots of not-quite-anti-town possibilities.

Killer whales eat penguins. There's not a lot of flavor wiggle room with that.

I did anticipate L-k would make a false claim- and the type of false claim L-k made has no bearing on this. You misrepresent me.

Ok, why did you anticipate him making a false species claim?

[Fishythefish]

I haven't argued that I thought L-k would make a false claim

that made LK look even scummier than he did from the flavour

.

And no one accused you of that. My case is based on the fact that your motive for pushing for his species claim, then concluding he was the SK (and softly pushing for his lynch) don't make sense if you're pro-town.

You said "there was no way I could argue <stuff>". I think that implies I was trying to argue <stuff>, when in fact I wasn't.

Ok, why did you anticipate him making a false species claim?

This was my thought process:
1. L-k shot someone last night.
2. Therefore, L-k is likely to be a man.
3. Man is an anti-town species.
4. It is therefore in L-k's interests to claim a different species, and so he may falseclaim.

This was quite a long shot, of course. I didn't "anticipate" L-k's false claim in the sense of being confident it was coming. I did think it was a possibility.

The thing about killer whale is that its inconsistency is precisely the inconsistency of krill. This is a point where the "krill means flavour is BS" argument does apply- we know that killer whales as pro-town is possible. Maybe I'm alone here, but if you asked me what the likely role of a man was, I'd think probably a SK (more generally, not town aligned, given that there

probably

isn't a man in a town of assorted antarctic creatures). Given the krill factor, I'd feel much more comfortable claiming killer whale.

[Looker]

i'm sorry but i honestly think that jazz is the scum!

[HowardRoark]

Seriously folks . . . read Looker in iso and tell me why he shouldn't be lynched!

[Looker]

and tell me too cuz im confused

[Jazzmyn]

Looker, your 677 made no sense, and you were asked repeatedly to explain it, and you haven't. Frankly, the only conclusion I can draw from your recent posts is that you are a mafia goon trying to protect Fishy from being lynched, which leads to the conclusion that Fishy is one of your scum partners with a more powerful role than your own.

Regards,
Jazz

[Light-kun]

Fishy, the emperor penguin=doctor doesn't make any sense. Either he's lying or the flavor doesn't make sense. This means that either he and I are both scum, or flavor is bs. Since you still think I'm scummy due to flavor, but haven't said anything about him except defense. Why do you prefer him? Because he's your scum partner.

Reads pretty frustrated to me. A third option obviously exists: that I'm not lying and that the flavor does make sense. What would have made sense for the "doctor" role in this game? A penguin with a med kit? You're grasping at pitiful straws here, and I can't believe nobody else is calling you on it.

You're pretty stupid. Emperor Penguin is a predator penguin that would eat the krill (town) that just flipped yesterday. Why wouldn't you eat some of the reveal species instead of saving them? And claiming "Emperor" as "king" thus giving a decree of protection is also fairly stupid. I'm not saying that any of this is NOT the author's thought process, but my point is Fishy has favoritism for you for some reason. Maybe he thinks you're harder to lynch or maybe you are his scum partner. I think the latter, at the moment.

Howard: Looker always plays like absolute crap. I'm not surprised and I don't support a policy lynch.

[Netlava]

A post will be posted tonight! *exciting*

[Netlava]

Here it is. I think tomorrow sounds better, anyway.

[Fishythefish]

L-k; on "favoritism" for DtF's claim. I have given two valid reasons why I don't disbelieve DtF's species claim and I do disbelieve yours. To repeat:
1. The inconsistency in DtF's claim is only of a kind that we already know exists in the game (from the krill).
2. The species he claims is one that is pretty likely to be in the game; hence would be a dangerous falseclaim for scum.
There's absolutely no reason to think he's lying, and a slight reason to believe he's telling the truth.

Howard: Looker always plays like absolute crap. I'm not surprised and I don't support a policy lynch.

This is true. I support a lynch on the grounds of looker's suspect pattern.
1. He jumps on the most likely bandwagon
2. He goes for a Jazz/fishy false dilemma- this really looks like scum trying to escalate the situation between town-Jazz and I, and get one of us lynched with the other taking much of the blame.
3. The moment I vote for him, he withdraws his suspicions on me.
There's obviously not much to go on from looker, but what there is makes me think he's scum.

[DraketheFake]

You know who else's posts in isolation everybody should read? Jazzmyn's. I'm working on a larger post, but her 692:

Looker, your 677 made no sense, and you were asked repeatedly to explain it, and you haven't. Frankly, the only conclusion I can draw from your recent posts is that you are a mafia goon trying to protect Fishy from being lynched, which leads to the conclusion that Fishy is one of your scum partners with a more powerful role than your own.

Regards,
Jazz

Is an extremely scummy post indicative of her strategy all day. She has repeatedly refused to consider anybody but me, Fishy, or Jere to be scum (except for in her replace-in catch-up post, the reasoning in which she barely ever mentions again), and when she does allow that other players might be acting scummy - as she did above - she uses that as reasoning why her target, Fishy, must still be scum.

Longer post forthcoming.

[Jazzmyn]

She has repeatedly refused to consider anybody but me, Fishy, or Jere to be scum (except for in her replace-in catch-up post, the reasoning in which she barely ever mentions again), and when she does allow that other players might be acting scummy - as she did above - she uses that as reasoning why her target, Fishy, must still be scum.

You raise a good point here, to the extent that you've made me realize that I am tunneling too much, and I really shouldn't. It's not that I

refuse

to consider anybody but you, Fishy or Jere to be scum, but I do sometimes struggle with tunneling and have to make a conscious effort to avoid it, so I appreciate you raising it.

I think that Fishy's take on Looker makes a lot of sense, and I owe this game a re-read with my non-tunneling goggles on. I will do that this weekend, barring any unforeseen catastrophes, etc.

Regards,
Jazz

[JereIC]

Howard: Looker always plays like absolute crap. I'm not surprised and I don't support a policy lynch.

So you're not suspicious of her at all? And why so non-chalant about about it?

Fishy, you say that krill=town is the same kind of flavor inconsistency that killer whale=town is. What kind of inconsistency is that, and how is it distinguishable from man=town?