MtG: Parallel Universe Mafia (fl's subgame): Game Over

[SpyreX]

Fair enough. Lets shake this up.

Zito, Porkens, Tajo:

I propose we form

THE UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCE

.

It will have the following goals in mind:

1.) To lynch Sociopath.
2.) To vig Mufasa if possible.
3.) To descend on dissenters like a pack of wolves. There will be no quarter. There will be only allies and enemies.

* This alliance will break if, and only if, we remain and have a sinner amongst us.

If you agree to these terms, simply vote Sociopath.

Thank you,

SpyreX Industries
Keepin' it Real.

[Mufasa]

i wish to join this unbreakable alliance haha

unvote vote: sociopath

[Yosarian2]

The sig thing might very well be game related, but I'm not entierly clear on how that makes him more likely scum.

The fact that he would have blatantly lied about it several times.

Explain to me exactally what you are saying here. Are you speculating that there is a scum role that has to announce his kills in every single post he makes, or that otherwise gets some special power from doing something that blatent and then lying about it?

Discribe to me how a role like that might work, please. I am having a hard time imagining it, personally.

[SpyreX]

I'd love to know too.

Mufasa can be the UA's banner.

[Yosarian2]

Fair enough. Lets shake this up.

Zito, Porkens, Tajo:

I propose we form

THE UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCE

.

It will have the following goals in mind:

1.) To lynch Sociopath.
2.) To vig Mufasa if possible.
3.) To descend on dissenters like a pack of wolves. There will be no quarter. There will be only allies and enemies.

Vote: SpyreX

I was close to voting Sociopath, but now he can wait. This may be the single most anti-town plan I've ever heard proposed on day in a forum mafia game.

[Papa Zito]

You all should do something about that. I know one game that would have passed it's deadline review. I also know of one game that probably won't at this rate. Can you guess which is which?

Eek.

I propose we form THE UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCE

lulz. Arrite then.

unvote: Debonair Danny DiPietro
vote: SocioPath

[Yosarian2]

Edit: "on day one", that should have read

[Papa Zito]

i wish to join this unbreakable alliance haha

unvote vote: sociopath

lolwut

[Yosarian2]

Also, if by some chance odd chance SpyreX is actually town here, then both Mufasa and Papa Zito look really, really scummy because of their reactions to his "alliance" proposal.

[Yosarian2]

On an unrelated note, this is also a scummy post.

Vote Spy

for saying he won't read the other game and ignoring Porkens' question about a softclaim.

FTR, I'm not caught up. I'm on Page 3 here and haven't seen the other subgames yet, but I intend to.

Plus, I'd just like to note here that we still haven't heard anything from Quagmire.

[SpyreX]

Ohh its not odd but I'll spell it out:

1.) I find sociopath to be scummy:
--- For his push on me being anti-town which makes no sense considering my PM.
--- The super secret powerful scum role that is "state your targets in the thread".
------ The "tar setup" justification that is objectively wrong.

2.) Due to 1, by nature I have less issue with Porkens AND Zito.
--- Zito for his statement regarding said PM
--- Porkens for the "ohh shi scum".
--- Tajo was just a nice good ol' gut move.

3.) Nothing was happening. I guarantee this will make things happen.
--- This is not a "lol reactions" or "lol gambit". I'm dead serious. I'll push through with this and let the scum deal with "uncofirmed daymasons hoo" OR push a lynch on me and let the egg be on their face.

I dig your reaction, although it'd be what I'd expect a scum reaction to be if I was correct in my educated guesses.

But, lets see what sifts out.

[Yosarian2]

SpyreX: This is the way I see your plan turning out.

If one of the 3 of you is scum, the scum would kill one member of your group close to endgame, and let the other member continue the UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCE with the scum until endgame when it costs the town the game.

If 2 of you is scum, then it almost certanly will cost the town the game, unless those of us who are town go after this "alliance" basically right from the start.

If none of you is scum, then your plan MIGHT not cause a guarenteed town loss, but then the scum would again just kill one of you off, making the alliance basically useless.

And it's even worse since people in your ALLIANCE might not even have to be killed, they could just be moved to another game by some role, then perhaps moved back later; if the scum have any kind of role that can do that, they could totally abuse your alliance to their advantage.

In other words, if you're serious about this, you're betting the entire game on two other people being pro-town, based on a read only 2 days and 6 pages into a game, and in a situation where if you're right about them both being town it dosn't even help all that much.

It's possible you might do that as town, I've seen people try stuff like that before as town, but it would be a bad play, a very bad gamble on your part. I could easily see you doing it as scum, since it's an easy way for scum to win the game here if people go along with it.

In any case, I am not willing to bet the entire game on all 3 of you being town right now, and I would have to be willing to do that in order to let you get away with this "unbreakable alliance" crap. You can either abandon your horrible plan, or you can be lynched today. Those are really the only two options, from my point of view, unless you can somehow convince me that all 3 of you are very probably town, and I highly doubt you'll be able to do that on day 1.

[Papa Zito]

I think he's jealous that he wasn't invited.

[SpyreX]

Really the question you need to be asking yourself, and your whole tone bespeaks the issue with this is - is this a

scum

maneuver?

If you think its join and free pass ohh hoss no. In fact, I've painted a huge red X on myself and smaller ones on the people I've called out. If I'm right and it goes well the group does become a huge NK target. If I'm wrong then any scum in the group have the tightest of ropes to walk.

So, not only do the people I've picked out now have more reason to find scum even if they are scum but they damn well dont get to go "ohh yea me too" except for Sociopath.

Could one of them be scum? Possibly.

Could two of us be scum? Only in the case that the "us" includes myself as part of the scum. In which case I've all but set myself up for a lynch down the road.

So, disagreement with the plan or not, the real question is do you think I am scum for it?

Your vote sure says one thing but the previous post doesn't quite mesh.

[SpyreX]

*Only in the case that I'm scum or I am the best backwards scum-finder the world has ever seen.

[Quagmire]

Hey sorry I'm late can someone catch me up on the first six pages? Detailed review, thanks.

[SocioPath]

--- For his push on me being anti-town which makes no sense considering my PM.

No one cares that you can read your own PM.
Until after you're dead, nothing you say about such is concrete.
You can claim different roles, abilities, and restrictions until you are blue in the face, but at the end of the day, it is still just a claim.

--- The super secret powerful scum role that is "state your targets in the thread".

Oh yes, because scum is the only threat you could possibly worry about. Very naive.
SK? Unlikely for the amount of attention drawn, but I wouldn't rule it out.
Cult recruiter? Well someone has already claimed non-recruitable as part of their role.
Or possibly some other anti-town role.

------ The "tar setup" justification that is objectively wrong.

Oh please enlighten me.

Hey sorry I'm late can someone catch me up on the first six pages? Detailed review, thanks.

Its closer to 20 pages.

[Yosarian2]

Really the question you need to be asking yourself, and your whole tone bespeaks the issue with this is - is this a

scum

maneuver?

It certanly could be.

If you think its join and free pass ohh hoss no. In fact, I've painted a huge red X on myself and smaller ones on the people I've called out. If I'm right and it goes well the group does become a huge NK target. If I'm wrong then any scum in the group have the tightest of ropes to walk.

Not really. Assuming there's one kill, one lynch, and our claimed lover gets sent over to the other game tonight, tommorow there will be only 9 people left. Which means there's only 6 people not in your ALLIANCE. It's 5 votes to lynch. If there's 1 scum in your ALLIANCE and two scum outside of your ALLIANCE, then assuming that the people in your alliance don't vote each other, then there's no possible way for the town people not in your alliance to lynch a scum in your alliance, at all, unless the scum help, which they won't. And it only gets worse from there, as your alliance becomes a bigger and bigger part of the town.

Basically, if the town allows this alliance to happen today, and there is one scum in it, town loses. Period. So we won't.

So, disagreement with the plan or not, the real question is do you think I am scum for it?

That's not the only question. The real question is, does allowing you to do this raise or lower the town's chances of winning, compared with just lynching you today. My goal is to have the town win this game; lynching scum is just a means to that end.

There are two, mostly unrelated, reasons I am voting you now.


A. Your plan is anti-town.
Town needs to stop your plan, today, or else it will probably lose the game for the town.
So, the only options are either 1. you drop this plan. 2. You somehow convince me that all 3 of you are town and therefore I don't have to worry (unlikely) or 3. You die today.

-------------------

B. Your plan is scummy.

If you are town, your plan significantly lowers your side's chances of winning the game. If you are scum, your plan significnatly raises your side's chances of wining the game. Therefore, the fact that you suggested this plan increases your odds of being scum.
-------

So, yes. I'm both trying to pressure you to stop acting in an anti-town way, and going after you because you're likely to be scum. Either one would be enough reason to vote you now. Reason B, I could be convinced to change my mind on, depending on how you act and if anyone else looks scummier today; it's only a moderate scumtell, because I could see town making that mistake. But reason A is ironclad; you need to stop acting in an anti-town way, or you need to die today. There's no margin for error or compromise there.

[Yosarian2]

I think he's jealous that he wasn't invited.

Zito, why are you going along with this? Are you really that confident that they are both town, or are you scum taking advantage here?

[Papa Zito]

I think he's jealous that he wasn't invited.

Zito, why are you going along with this? Are you really that confident that they are both town, or are you scum taking advantage here?

I'm operating under "It's so ridiculous it has to work" theory.

Honestly, I can't see a scum player making a move like this. Especially since a group of townies working together is absolutely devastating to scum.

[populartajo]

Ill reread the thread later.

[Flava Flave]

Spy, I think I misread something. No idea how I got that, but I thought Porkens had asked you if you softclaimed.

Unvote

Zito, why do you know that DDD has a fakeclaim?

Porkens, I didn't like that Spy wasn't going to read the other subgames. Still don't. They are still part of this game and knowing what happens there can't hurt. Also somehow thought he softclaimed and ignored it when asked about it, but I think I accidently made that up somehow. I wasn't caught up because I only had about 5-10 minutes to get through what I could.

Yos, I agree completely about Mufasa and Zito's reactions to Spy. Both scummy as hell. The strength of your opposition is a little weird too though.

I'm gonna go read the other subgames now.

[Yosarian2]

Honestly, I can't see a scum player making a move like this.

Why not? IF he's scum, it's got a decent chance of just autowinning him the game, right from page 5 of day 1. It'd be a gambit, sure, but they potential payoff if he's scum is huge.

Especially since a group of townies working together is absolutely devastating to scum.

Lol. Yes, that is true, but that's the kind of thing that happens naturally, when multipule townies figure each other out. ANd they still don't form an "unbreakable alliance", that's just stupid.

[Papa Zito]

Zito, why do you know that DDD has a fakeclaim?

Benmage has one.

Why not? IF he's scum, it's got a decent chance of just autowinning him the game, right from page 5 of day 1. It'd be a gambit, sure, but they potential payoff if he's scum is huge.

Games are too fluid for this to be true.

Lol. Yes, that is true, but that's the kind of thing that happens naturally, when multipule townies figure each other out. ANd they still don't form an "unbreakable alliance", that's just stupid.

It's not stupid if it works.

This thing seems to be scaring you more than it should.

[Yosarian2]

This thing seems to be scaring you more than it should.

This thing seems to be scaring you a hell of a lot less then it should, if you are town.