Mini 954 ~ Mafia at the 11th Hour (Game Over!)

[VP Baltar]

I now think ToD is town

lol

Feel free to explain this because it looked to me like the main reason you found him scummy was that he was attacking you, which hasn't really ceased.

[Jahudo]

What does Pom having a suspicious town read on SOG have anything to do with ToD attacking me?

[VP Baltar]

So that's the only reason you voted ToD? How did that reason become any better when ToD replaced in as opposed to when I originally started the Pom wagon?

[Jahudo]

I didn't vote ToD. I've been on Porkens this whole time. Its still the larger wagon, so unless that changes everyone else should compromise with us.

[VP Baltar]

Sorry, was thinking you had voted.

Anyhow, you were talking about compromising for that lynch when Porkens lynch is still very viable, which I took as you starting to come around. Did anything change your view of ToD temporarily that has now switched back?

[Jahudo]

This:

Percy: seems town.
<snip>...
I'm inclined to see Porkens as town.

I think ToD is serious about thinking I'm scum. If he was scum, its a sure thing either Porkens or Percy is town and I would think he would have been more open to joining one of those wagons than starting a new one on me.

Compromise to me is when you're on the short wagon and know it won't get any bigger. Right now we still don't really know what dramonic thinks about ToD, or what several people now think of me as a lynch for that matter. So if it came to be that the Porkens wagon decreased, I would have felt OK about helping the ToD wagon. Now I'm thinking a Jahudo wagon/lynch would be good for information if we can't get Porkens.

So if you really think I'm potential scum, you should vote now and see who else can justify a compromise on me.

[Vi]

Vote Count XLII:

- Get everything and the stuff together

Porkens (L-

3

) ~ Herodotus,

Percy,

Jahudo, dramonic
Trumpet of Doom (L-3) ~ VP Baltar, d3x
Jahudo (L-3) ~ Trumpet of Doom, Percy

Percy (L-4) ~ Porkens

Minimum (L-5)

Battery Power:

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

|

(16%)

[dramonic]

sig

[Percy]

Um no. As I recall you were unwilling to switch so I had to compromise so we wouldn't get a no lynch. And we don't know that Cobalt/Hero is town, though I'd bet he is town.

@Jahudo

: Let's start with the "compromise" situation. You vote Cobalt thusly:

We can still discuss the lynch, but I want to see that my vote counts. Cobalt's my top pick today.

Vote: Cobalt

Then you comment on the SOG lynch and talk about why you still think Cobalt is scum:

I don't mind a SOG lynch, but I prefer Cobalt and some people I think are town seem to prefer him too. The reason I didn't talk about him more was that the wagon was well in hand and I was speaking my mind about VPB. I explained why I thought SOG was scum, and I didn't have anything else to ask him.

Cobalt and Porkens reads went hand in hand, and I flipped them after mulling over how Nikanor might have been playing yesterday. I like my basis of thinking now more than I did previously.

So Porkens town, Cobalt scum was how it flipped around in your head.
Now here is the post where you vote SOG:

Not an alignment tell ≠ towntell. How could a nulltell give you doubts? What do you think about the rest of his play?

I haven't been able to read him, so I have a nulltell and a neutral read on him without looking at Nik. And I don't think you have made a case for him outside what I call a nulltell.

Again you dismiss the case based on WIFOM. This verges on "2scum4scum".

I'm not sure what that second part means, but maybe that's accurate. Tony looked scummy, and there are clear doubts about why SOG didn't elaborate on the Nik wagon beyond a simple "I'm not feeling it".

unvote;
Vote: semioldguy

Now the important things to note:
1. Your vote on SOG seems extremely weak, especially since your vote was so crucial. You quote me, and despite admittedly not understanding half of it, you use that reason to vote him. Especially when you (theoretically) could have convinced DDD in the remaining time of the viability of the Cobalt wagon, especially given he had

said how badly

he wanted to kill Cobalt.
2. Today, your reads on Cobalt/Porkens have flipped

again

. This was somehow due to SOG flipping town, but I still don't understand why you didn't even discuss this possibility yesterday. Porkens becomes your

top suspect

at the start of the day due to this Nikanor wagon interaction, despite your

discussion without conclusion

along the same lines before backing up to "he is not a good lynch for these reasons" in

this post

the previous day. You dismissed the Nikanor interaction as null!

Where did you have the same ideas?

I already linked to them in reply to d3x. I said very early on that I thought the Cobalt slot was town due to the Nikanor interaction.

SOG and DDD were still alive yesterday. I thought Nikanor might've been buddying Tony to DDD (or less likely DDD to Tony). Once I knew both were town, it was clear he was waiting for the loser to emerge and become the mislynch.

Let's look at what you said:

Hero (Cobalt/Sera) is downgraded as a suspect now that we know DDD and Tony are both town. I think Nik was just waiting to see if Tony would be lynched without his support. So when Nikanor voted Seraphim for throwing suspicion on DDD and bandwagoning Tony, it now looks like he was hoping to setup Seraphim as the scum presence on the Tony mislynch.

The most important thing to note is that the Tony wagon was already dead. Seraphim wasn't even voting for Tony anymore. Your read of the situation makes no sense at all.

---

[T]he way people just pushed [Porkens' wagon] and then went quiet bothers me a bit. Too much complacency for such vast support of it.

On the other hand, why are you open to another lynch suddenly Percy? You've been pushing Porkens pretty hard all day without much care elsewhere. Was it just ToD's case that changed your heart (even though you do still say Porkens is scum and there is wagon support there)?

For the first part, I agree. I pushed hard, but Porkens seems like a player that is very difficult to lynch... My read has somewhat weakened, and I would like to hear more from Porkens, though I still maintain my points against him.

I've had my doubts about Jahudo for a long time. Firstly

when I point out

the "competing wagon" shenanigans with you,

the hole in his case against you

, in the same post where he uses meta to excuse Porkens which he also does

later

, I've also been

suspicious of his passive power

that he got somehow (though it didn't activate as a result of him getting to L-1), I

explained how unsettled I was

at Jahudo's scumread of Cobalt, and though the rhetoric about clearing Cobalt

initially threw me off

, it makes no sense as I've explained in this post.

To say I haven't had much care about the Jahudo slot is false. We should lynch Jahudo today.

[VP Baltar]

I was referring to caring about Jahudo lynch today Percy, not so much all game. Anyhow, right now we are at a three way tie and not much time is left for deadline (two days probably). dram apparently isn't going to be doing anything. I would support any of the top three choices because a lynch is definitely necessary and they've all be scummy to various degrees. If I had to pick an order right now, I would go with Jahudo, ToD, Porkens. Everyone needs to get in here and vote accordingly. I will try to be around for deadline, but I do have to work this evening and tomorrow from 1 p.m.-8p.m. EST, so let's try to decide with some kind of authority and not dawdle.

Unvote, Vote: jahudo

[Jahudo]

Great. Lurking townies and a closing deadline. Not much time to right this ship and LOST is on tonight. :/

1. Your vote on SOG seems extremely weak, especially since your vote was so crucial. You quote me, and despite admittedly not understanding half of it, you use that reason to vote him.

That's called compromising with someone who wouldn't give any leeway. I was making sure there wasn't a no lynch. Seems like you would twist this around either way and call it scummy.

This was somehow due to SOG flipping town, but I still don't understand why you didn't even discuss this possibility yesterday.

SOG and DDD. If one of them was scum, he wouldn't have been very at ease in thinking either way it turned there would be a mislynch. Having them both be town changes the dynamic of how he was treating other people, like Seraphim. So it had everything to do with the townflips and its amazing how you don't acknowledge how that might be possible.

Porkens becomes your top suspect at the start of the day due to this Nikanor wagon interaction, despite your discussion without conclusion along the same lines before backing up to "he is not a good lynch for these reasons" in this post the previous day.

I was initially overlooking the obvious with Nikanor's suspicion of Porkens. There are no 3rd party roles, so he was obviously not trying to get Porkens mislynched. It was a distancing ruse all along and I initially fell for it. You either missed my turnaround or neglected to mention it.

My wagon is at the worst scum-driven, and at the best founded on tunnel visioned judgement. Percy has repeatedly ignored entire posts from me where I explain my changes of opinion. He doesn't acknowledged any of my stances, just the speculative outcomes. He's not investigating me.

And I think I'll know if he's scum or not after his next post.

unvote;
Vote: Percy

[Porkens]

juhado percy fight huh?

[Percy]

Yeah, I'm as surprised as you are. Considering Jahudo has only ever placed me at #4 on his scumlist, besides this gem from today:

I think its likeliest that 2 of {Percy, Hero and Porkens} are scum, and my gut right now says Percy is town

... and now he's abandoning his wagon on you because his lynch is looking like a viability and instead attacking me. I'm now much more sure of my scumread of Jahudo.

That's called compromising with someone who wouldn't give any leeway. I was making sure there wasn't a no lynch. Seems like you would twist this around either way and call it scummy.

You miss my point. Not only was DDD available to you, who had expressed a willingness to kill Cobalt; but you also switch to SOG for no other reason than to secure his lynch, rather than trying to make a case against him or any other suspect at that crucial time.

SOG and DDD. If one of them was scum, he wouldn't have been very at ease in thinking either way it turned there would be a mislynch. Having them both be town changes the dynamic of how he was treating other people, like Seraphim. So it had everything to do with the townflips and its amazing how you don't acknowledge how that might be possible.

I find it amazing that you ignored one of the most crucial points from my post - that the wagon was already dead, so your interpretation makes no sense.

I was initially overlooking the obvious with Nikanor's suspicion of Porkens. There are no 3rd party roles, so he was obviously not trying to get Porkens mislynched. It was a distancing ruse all along and I initially fell for it. You either missed my turnaround or neglected to mention it.

I don't understand why you conclude that it was distancing, rather than some good old-fashioned mudslinging. I also don't understand why, if your read is so strong, you are now voting for me, the person Porkens has been voting all day. He's done everything short of jumping through my screen and cutting off my head. Now you abandon the wagon on Porkens and join him in wagonning me? LOLWUT

Percy has repeatedly ignored entire posts from me where I explain my changes of opinion. He doesn't acknowledged any of my stances, just the speculative outcomes. He's not investigating me.

I haven't ignored anything; I've found your explanations lacking and have strong suspicions that they are scum rationalisations. I acknowledge your stances. I just think they're lacking. Given the fact that I have spent a good deal of the game discussing your play and asking for clarifications, concluding that I'm not investigating you is ludicrous.

[Vi]

Vote Count XLIII:

- The future is coming very quickly...

Jahudo (L-2) ~ Trumpet of Doom, Percy, VP Baltar

Percy (L-3) ~ Porkens, Jahudo
Porkens (L-

4

) ~ Herodotus,

Jahudo,

dramonic
Trumpet of Doom (L-4) ~

VP Baltar,

d3x

Minimum (L-5)

Battery Power:

||||

|

||||

|

(10%)

[d3x]

I don't see us securing a Lynch on anyone else and I really think that No Lynch is a bad idea. Plus, the points against are rather compelling.

UnVote/Vote:Jahudo

[dramonic]

=_=

town on town action, much?
Quite so!

However it's better to mislynch than NL. Unless Jahudo has some way to prove his towniness (barring the fact he looks sharply town to me <<) I'll be hammering tomorrow.

[VP Baltar]

deadline is probably today isn't it?

[Jahudo]

TOWN

dramonic
Herodotus
VP Baltar
d3x
ToD
Percy
Porkens

SCUM

You miss my point. Not only was DDD available to you, who had expressed a willingness to kill Cobalt; but you also switch to SOG for no other reason than to secure his lynch, rather than trying to make a case against him or any other suspect at that crucial time.

When? As I recall you weren't willing to settle, I did make a case that you wouldn't debate with me, and DDD never said he could override either one of us. Deadline came after little discussion and I had to act.

[Jahudo]

deadline is probably today isn't it?

Maybe if we spam the thread we'll get an extra day.

I don't mind if someone wants to hammer me right now. I'm not going to pull some crazy gambit to get a different lynch. Even though I really want to. I'm just a townie who's immune to desperation stuff.

[dramonic]

Allright then...

Unvote
Vote: Jahudo

You will be missed ;_;

[Vi]

Vote Count XLIV:

- A heroic(?) sacrifice

Jahudo (LYNCH) ~ Trumpet of Doom, Percy, VP Baltar, d3x, dramonic

Percy (L-3) ~ Porkens, Jahudo
Porkens (L-

4

) ~ Herodotus,

dramonic

Trumpet of Doom (L-5) ~

d3x

Minimum (L-5)

Battery Power:

|

(1%)

---

--- Jahudo ---

Miles Edgeworth (from Ace Attorney Investigations: Miles Edgeworth)

--- Lynched Day 3...

-Night 3 will continue until 2100 EDT on May 27, 2010.

[Vi]

--- dramonic ---

King DeDeDe (from Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards), Town

--- Struck by Lightning Night 3.

----

Vote Count XLV:

- This is where we make our stand!

Minimum (L-6)

Not Voting:

d3x, Percy, Trumpet of Doom, Porkens, Herodotus, VP Baltar

-It is now Day 4! With 6 alive, it should take 4 to lynch.

--CAUTION--CAUTION--

--You are in MyLo!

--CAUTION--CAUTION--

Battery Power:

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

||||

|

(100%)

[Herodotus]

--You are in MyLo!

We should probably no lynch, but I'd like everyone to check in first just in case someone has a good reason why lynching would be better (eg. investigation results or an ability that could give us two lynches in one day.)

[d3x]

I agree. No Lynch doesn't seem to have a down side at this exact moment.

[Porkens]

Vote: No Lynch

I am leaving for Brazil tomorrow, and I'm sketchy on internet access for a couple days. VLA for a bit.