Open 231: My Name is Earl (Game Over)

[d3x]

VOTE: Budja for replacing an Elder Dragon.

Chromium was always the best anyway...

[d3x]

If NB had been here, he'd have received my RV for being infinitely inferior to Chromium in the first place. As I believe in honesty in all things, Budja gets my RV in his stead.

It's Wagon time.

UnVote/Vote:AururusVox

obvScum.

[d3x]

Why not Aururus?

[d3x]

I tend to agree with the good Col. about NB being lame and Adrien hasn't posted yet.

[d3x]

Yeah, I'd like to point out you've spelt my name wrong.

Sorry 'bout that. You'll be initials from here on in. Get used to it, though. I'm 2 letters and a number and people still f* it up.

Beef20- This reaction seems too strong, imo. Plz explain how L-2 on page one with no real chance of a Lynch happening is a bad thing.

XS21- Plz define 'Coaching' for me. I understand the concept, but I want to hear how you define it before following up with more questions for you.

Xite22/23- Do you believe taking us out of the RVS early is a bad thing? How long would you like an RVS go on? Do you buy the 3rd Vote ScumTell?

the 3rd

{Vote}

in a game this size should not be a crap reason

Why?

Adrien25/29- Thoughts on anything legitimately happening in the game? Do you feel that staying in the RVS longer benefits Town or Scum?

AV27- You're contending that not putting a reason stalls discussion, yet Budja not listing a reason

is

a main focus of the discussion. Plz clarify.

---------------------------------------------

Right now I'm most interested in hearing a lot more from Beef, Adrien, and Grimmy {obv}.

[d3x]

Only a few minutes to post atm. Followup questions...

@XS- Now that we agree on Coaching, how plausible of a situation would it be in your opinion to see an inexperienced player coaching a much more experienced {based on join dates}?

@Adrien- I'll allow that I asked the question in an odd manner. Let me rephrase... Please comment on something actually happening instead of RVS crap. What are your thoughts on what is legitimately happening in the game {as opposed to the back and forth with Xite}. I tend to agree that the RVS benefits Scum more, thus I'd like us out of it.

More later...

[d3x]

Umm... yup.

UnVote/Vote:Beefster

[d3x]

Actual discussion? Check. Out of the RVS? Check. d3x is now happy.

Things to note {and remember for later}-
Adrien answering for XS in p59.
AV gaining Town points across pages 3&4.

@XS87- When you say...

It's not scummy

Are you refering to Voting w/o reasons listed? I don't want to put words in your mouth, I'd just like a little clarification before following up with possible questions.

@Xite89- Are you kidding me? No. Side note- Why do you assume that there are 2 Earls? Do you have/are you a ScumRB and want to know if there's a Cop/Doc combo out there? If Beefy didn't continue his dominance of scummy play, I'd be switching to you. Just sayin'.

[d3x]

/facepalm

[d3x]

^ was directed @ Xite

[d3x]

@

Xite101

- Stop with this line of thought. I highly doubt that D1 with no information what-so-ever, the game would be that easy to break open. Otherwise no one would play Open setups.

@

Xite107

- Let's say that Scum both Claim VT. We have 2 PRs at minimum and 3 at most. That'd be 6-7 VT. Are you saying that this is a for sure Win for us? That's ridiculous. Factoring in inevitable MisLynches of random VTs and the equally inevitable NKs of the outted PRs, we're no closer to a victory than without a Claim D1. I'd say we're actually in a worse spot. That's not even taking into account that we get the added bonus of keeping around our PRs {assuming we have any and the Scum judge poorly}. At this point, I'm willing to assume that you're closer to VI than Scum with an RB but I will be keeping an eye on you.

@

Xite115

-

Then it's easier for town to blend.

What exactly does this mean? {Also, I'm sorry to hear about your hospital troubles. Feel better!}

@

XS116

-

voting without a reason is scummy

Voting without reasoning is anti-town

You are aware that these are 2 completely different things, right? Yeah, you are.

It's not scummy, it's anti-town.

Considering you just clarified that you were specifically talking about Voting without a reason, I find you stretching to make a case. You're flipping back and forth to try and gain steam. I call that scummy.

Vote: Xite
Xite is hiding information, breadcrumbing power role and rolefishing for Earl.

The irony is not lost.

UnVote/Vote:XScorpion

Explain to me how RoleFishing Xite is ProTown considering you just finished saying that it's a main reason you're Voting him/her. You're even suggesting that Xite may in fact be a PR.

*sniff...sniffsniff*

Something smells scummy around here.

Hey XS- What

do

you think of Beefster? Thus far you've only mentioned him to bring a case against Budja and myself. And if we're Scum together for it, how do you account for Col's "terrible" Vote in p83 and nocase's FoS in p98?

[d3x]

@XS149-

Semantics.

That's your quote. You are the one making the distinction between AntiTown behavior and scummy behavior. I'm pointing out that you are blurring your own lines of distinction to suit your 'case'.

If it's a verb, then I'm not rolefishing

It is a verb and you are RoleFishing. You even say that {s}he could be a PR. let me show you in my next point...

Now you're putting words in my mouth. How many times do I need to say I think Xite ISN'T a PR, and is actually scum?

Huh. Well, let's check.

If you actually are town, or god forbid a real PR, you just completely screwed yourself by hinting to scum who you are.

If you are a PR, that is insanely anti-town.

How many times must you say it? Well a first would be nice. Aside from that, if you're not suggesting that {s}he is a PR, then you sure are allowing for the possibility.

Beefster got lynched on day 1 in an ongoing game as town for the same reasons you guys are attacking him now.

And you didn't think it worthwhile to bring this up until now because...?

I would like to ask why you suddenly decided to start explaining your votes though. Is there a reason why I'm worthy of making a case but Beefster wasn't?

Well therein lies the difference. I Voted Beefy, I'm building a case on you. As big of a difference between these as there is between AntiTown and scummy behaviors. But don't worry, I haven't forgotten him...

Beefy- Way to come to the rescue of your ScumBuddy once he has come under fire. I love this game... But why the FoS and no Vote? What does Budja have that I don't?

@nocase/XS- On topic plz?

[d3x]

@XS158- AntiTown behavior is something that most likely comes from misguided Townies. Scummy behavior is something that most likely comes from Scum. There's a huge difference and yes, it matters. If it didn't, then why would you directly say a behavior is not one, it is the other. And then when you're called on it, you say it's the same thing and cry 'semantics debate'.

You are RoleFishing Xite because you are allowing for the possibility that {s}he is a Town PR. You are pushing for information that is 'hidden' and you and Budja already had it out over PRs hiding information from the Town. You are trying to force a Claim and that's RoleFishing. Btw, you didn't start by calling the play horrible, you started by trying to out Xite...

Xite is hiding information,

breadcrumbing power role

and rolefishing for Earl.

{

emphasis mine

}

Because it's not my responsibility to defend other people.

If you have a meta read on a player that is well on the path to a MisLynch {and you're fighting to get a counterWagon going}, why would you not say anything? I'm not asking you to defend someone else, but helping the Town to avoid a MisLynch

is

something you're supposed to do... if you're Town.

@Beefy174- It's posts like these that make me sad I UnVoted you in the first place. I'm happy with a Beefy Lynch or with an XS Lynch from this point forward. They're interchangably on top of my ScumList.

Speaking of things that make d3x grumpy...

@Adrien- Are you really talking about someone else not having content? You said that you were going to reread and post your thoughts. Is that it? Also, please go a little more in depth into the following...

My vote on Budja isn't looking so hot anymore

Explain.

[d3x]

@Budja- I find it odd that you would say Adrien and Beefy are the Lynches you'd end the Day with, yet you go for starting the new Wagon on Adrien rather than the previously established one on Beefster {especially considering the amount of people who have weighed saying they'd be fine/happy with a Beefy Lynch}. Do you think Adrien has more of a probability to be Scum? Why/why not? Why the switch from Adrien Wagon over Beefy Wagon?

I'll get to everything else later; it's bedtime.

[d3x]

My skim tells me that I'm still ok with Beefy and/or XS getting the rope.

These last couple days have been busier than anticipated. I'll hopefully be able to post in the next day or so. Sorry guys.

[d3x]

Based on what went down at the end of yesterday, I'm most curious about Budja's "stagnation" switch, AV's final post of the Day, ConA's Hammer then move on nocase, and The Buttonmen's whole existence.

@ConA- Do you figure nocase's position on the Beefy Lynch just to be bussing?

[d3x]

And apparently I forgot to Vote.

VOTE: XScorpion

[d3x]

was called out for forgetting about beefy. From that point on, was pretty much "ok with either beefy or xscorp lynch"

Can you point out where this happened? Because I'm pretty sure you're making things up to make me look bad.

@nocase- Care to discuss p160 now?

[d3x]

Why XS what? Why is he Scum?

If so-
I think that the whole 'Townies play this way' from D1 feels very forced {mostly related to Voting with reasons}. I think the clear discrepency between AntiTown and scummy play is very pertinent {along with the strawman of calling it a semantics debate immediately after being called out}. In responce to me pointing out the difference between his own statements, he started flailing and imo stopped any real ScumHunting. I don't like his interaction with Beefy at all from either side {especially the part about having weak meta on Beefy being Town and Beefy's noncommital jump to defend XS}. The RoleFishing on Xite. His reaction to the FakeClaim. The last ditch effort to stop the Beefy Lynch.

That pretty much sums up my feelings on him.

[d3x]

@AV- I'd thank you not to answer for me.

@nocase- I think it was an over-reaction followed by an attempt to lend credibility to the FakeClaim. Generally, I call it a slip.

[d3x]

I'll be on later tonight {hopefully} with game stuff, but let this serve as warning.

Mod

- Plz note the sig. Thx.

Noted.

[d3x]

@nocase- That's why I called it a slip. I don't think he consciously would. I'm not ruling it out of the realm of possibilities that it was a WIFOM gambit, but I do think it was a slip at bare minimum.

I liked C.C's early play. Then he disappeared. Now I'm not too keen on TBm, but he hasn't done anything that I would deem obvScum.

[d3x]

Howdy peoples. I'm back and catching up.

[d3x]

I'm just a Townie.

Vote:XS

Budja's also making me nervous. There's no real analysis going on and he's now just pushing the popular Wagons of people who weren't on Beefy's Lynch.

I find it interesting that the same people who were absent from the Beefy Lynch were also absent from the AV Lynch.

@Rhinox- I think you and nocase are probTown.

[d3x]

@Rhinox- I'm pretty confident {~75%}.

[d3x]

If that's what it takes to finally Lynch XS come tomorrow, then so be it.

[d3x]

/sigh...