/in-vitational Game 8 - Nito City (over) after 1015
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Zajnet Mafia Scum
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Locke Lamora Mafia Scum
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Magna: I don't see it. How does your first question lead on to anything to do with widening the meta field? Was your original objection similar to mine or not?
The above post diminishes my opinion of Zajnet further, if that was possible. Perhaps I'll put the issue in a different light; can anyone tell me why we shouldn't lynch him?If ya smell what The Locke is cookin'!
"Locke Lamora and Andrius, defying all logic since 1081."-
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Sotty7 That Damn Good
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Porochaz Oh, Prozac
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@farside Maybe its because it's been a while since Ive been in a game with you (- the PYP, which was unusual circumstances) however my read of you is your usually well reasoned, you explain your votes - or anything you do - well, you seem to be relying on your gut more, this may be because your not explaining your reasoning more, you also ask a lot more questions, which you did to a degree anyway but with a lot more volume now, you also are emphasising your votes more without really bringing anything new to the table, something that someone like Llama or tajo would do, and you are a lot more aggressive, it's like Mafia Mum has rebellious teenagers. You also didn't seem the type to do scum/town lists particularly as I thought you would prefer to keep them private due to the potential information that it gives. Oh and also letting CDB get away with what he is doing.Mostly retired. Unless you ask or it's something interesting.-
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Charlie Mafia Scum
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[quote"Locke Lamora"]Charlie: how do you go from agreeing that there are better lynches out there to putting your vote back on? Are you trying to prove to us that you can play aggressively for some reason?[/quote]
Could it be that I'm simply stumbling about trying to get some discussion going on when in actual fact I'm doing just that: stumbling about? A different playstyle should get different reactions so I can proceed accordingly.
If I'm lucky, that what will the scenario be? This is a WIFOM trap. You're suspicious for this!Sando wrote: Only if the person hammered is town, you seem to be assuming that there would be scrutiny tomorrow, and that will only happen if the person is town...
Therefore, you are assuming the person is town.
Not a bad point. I'd look into it but I'm there so...uh...Sotty7 wrote:At this point I think Charlie and Zach are both probable scum. Farside is giving me a town read everyone else is kinda mixed in there.
The process of playing differently is somewhat bad for my psyche as well...I have to consciously remember that I'm purposely not playing how I normally play here! Experimenting is tech.Zachrulez wrote:After reading Charlie's play, he's done some strange things... but I can't really classify him as likely to be scum. His actions just seem too blatant to me, actions that draw a lot of attention, which is something scum generally don't want.
Stop right there. There is a flaw. I wanted to take a side, but in no way can you said I'm inclined to pick one based on YOUR assumptions. These are mine and only mine to make. You are putting words in my mouth and I can't highlight this enough so perhapsMagnaofIllusion wrote:When you vote for Sotty at 101 it is your first mention of her. When you placed your vote on her (in the dreaded third slot) she was competing with Jack and Poro for wagon leader. You’ve repeatedly stated that you wanted to take a side in the Jack / Sotty debate but didn’t choose the side of the player who ‘confused’ you. This seems off to me.youare ever sobold.
You've mistaken cluelessness for fence-sitting! I for one am not ashamed to admit that I have no general direction of who is REALLY the mafia and am going on the concept of a dangling carrot. Thing is, if I hit the carrot hard enough people are bound to notice and maybe said carrot will hit others too and cause a domino effect of accusations thus generating discussion (is this a good or bad analogy?).MagnaofIllusion wrote:You can’t for certain determine when they are Mafia or not. That’s a straw-man attack. You commented that one of the two is exhibiting behaviour that you expect from a Mafian. You do not indicate which player it is. That’s fence-sitting, which I believe is a bad thing.
You may be right and honestly I was hoping that is not the case. Oh well, what's done is done and I cannot defend against this point now.MagnaofIllusion wrote:But hopping on a popular wagon as opposed to questioning / putting pressure on the player whose behavior you find confusing or scummy is much worse than actually following up on suspicions.
Firstly, I did not ignore it...I just wasn't sure this war warranted a reply because of the nature of the question. It can be viewed as rhetorical, but that is the problem with duality of things.MagnaofIllusion wrote:Why are you uncomfortable about others drawing conclusions based on your play?
Didn’t you chide me for not expressing opinions about people’s play earlier? You can't credibly call out someone for not expressing opinions and then attack them when they do.
A proper answer: I'm not really sure of what I'm doing. Any conclusion I give out would be dishonest because I myself am unsure/not very confident of it. All the players here know how to handle questions thrown at them and all seem to follow a 'textbook' style of play. To effectively throw the mafia off balance, one should do the unexpected and get unexpected replies. These are cross-referenced by other players who know said players from previous games and their input combined to draw a solid conclusion. I'm somewhat unorthodox, but am trying to do it right. The method isn't important, the end result is to lynch mafia.
I realize the thought process above is convoluted but that is generally what is going on right now.
Hmm. If you say so. I've already said my peace above.MagnaofIllusion wrote:Then you don’t question said players and lazily slap you vote back on me. Your actions are in conflict with your stated opinions. Scummy.
Ok? That's it! Let's get lynching people.Kindness-
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Charlie Mafia Scum
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MagnaofIllusion has been killed Night 1
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I explained my thoughts in the last post I made. I don’t think I can be any clearer. If you don’t believe what I’m saying that’s your call. I’m not going to waste any more time on it.Locke wrote:Magna: I don't see it. How does your first question lead on to anything to do with widening the meta field? Was your original objection similar to mine or not?
Regarding Jack’s meta and his play this game – here are his three most recent completed games:
Quick and Dirty Mafia – he flipped Goon.
Gears of War Mafia– he won as a Serial Killer
Alternate Vote Mafia– he was engamed as an undisclosed Town role.
Take a look at his play in each game and decide which he most resembles. I’m leaning towards Mafia based on his lethargic, listless play in this game and Q&D Mafia.
You are missing the whole point of Sando’s statement. There would be no pressure on the person who hammered if the lynched person was Town. It’s not a WIFOM trap.Charlie wrote:If I'm lucky, that what will the scenario be? This is a WIFOM trap. You're suspicious for this!
My perspective is approaching the game from a logical, Town oriented perspective. I don’t see that in your thought process. Thus I’m asking you about it. That’s not putting words in your mouth. That’s trying to determine why you are playing in an illogical manner.Charlie wrote:Stop right there. There is a flaw. I wanted to take a side, but in no way can you said I'm inclined to pick one based on YOUR assumptions. These are mine and only mine to make. You are putting words in my mouth and I can't highlight this enough so perhaps you are ever so bold.
Do you think stating that you can’t defend your action in this case mitigates suspicion?Charlie wrote:Oh well, what's done is done and I cannot defend against this point now.
@Charlie– Don’t take this the wrong way, but is English your first language?"I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.-
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Incognito Not Rex
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I'm back. ChannelDelibird has requested replacement. I'm looking for one for him.
I'll check on activity in a second.[ooc][color=black]patrickgower2006 (8:12:03 PM): all beer tastes same to me
patrickgower2006 (8:12:07 PM): like dish water
If you see Patrick drinking dish water, please try and stop him. Friends don't let friends drink dish water.[/color][/ooc]-
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Incognito Not Rex
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Vote Count #7 of Day 1
Charlie (5) <-~ ChannelDelibird (being replaced), MagnaofIllusion, Sotty7, farside22, Sando
MagnaofIllusion (4) <-~ Jack, Zachrulez, Zajnet, Charlie
Jack (1) <-~ imkingdavid
Zajnet (2) <-~ Locke Lamora, Porochaz
12 living; 7 will do it.
Deadline:Thursday, August 19th at 12 A.M. EST
-Jack has been prodded.[ooc][color=black]patrickgower2006 (8:12:03 PM): all beer tastes same to me
patrickgower2006 (8:12:07 PM): like dish water
If you see Patrick drinking dish water, please try and stop him. Friends don't let friends drink dish water.[/color][/ooc]-
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imkingdavid Mafia Scum
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Well, I was just about to replace out since I really don't have time for this game. However, since CBD is already replacing out, I don't want to put us in a position of two replacements at the same time, especially three days before deadline.
Here's my excuse, take it or leave it: I am going to be moving into my college dorm on Tuesday and have been (and will be) busy packing and getting ready. Once I get there and get settled, I should have plenty of time to sit down and play the game.
So while I know I promised a post yesterday and this is all you've got from me since then, and while I will try to find time to post as often as I can over the next few days, don't expect a great deal of activity from me.
Here's something I would like to say though: I agree with MoI on how Jack has been playing. It may be tunnel vision, which I am trying to avoid, but currently he is the only player I really have a scum read on at this point. It seems that quite a few of you are bent on lynching Charlie. I'll take a look at him and see if I agree or disagree with that and go from there.
Last edited by Incognito on Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.Naughty little fly, why does it cry? Caught in a web, Soon you'll be...eaten!-
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Locke Lamora Mafia Scum
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Sotty7 That Damn Good
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Charlie Mafia Scum
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Why is this true?MagnaofIllusion wrote:You are missing the whole point of Sando’s statement.There would be no pressure on the person who hammered if the lynched person was Town. It’s not a WIFOM trap.
Each player has their own playstyle. What you perceive as illogical may not be to others who choose to think laterally. Really, IMagnaofIllusion wrote:My perspective is approaching the game from a logical, Town oriented perspective. I don’t see that in your thought process. Thus I’m asking you about it. That’s not putting words in your mouth. That’s trying to determine why you are playing in an illogical manner.cansee your thought process somewhat logical, but not Town orientated. For simple matters, I take the simple solution. Adding a little bit of extra thought in post goes a long way, but there is a time for just going for it.
Certainly not. You and anybody else are free to use said point against me, of which I offer no defense.MagnaofIllusion wrote:Do you think stating that you can’t defend your action in this case mitigates suspicion?
Yeah, English is my first language. Perhaps the last post demonstrated a very different way of thinking that it may be confusing, I apologize for that. But that's how it is.
1) My first two newbie games, 889 and 888 long since completed were "normal" for me. Unfortunately in both those games I was mafia, both lynched. My subsequent newbie game 919, in which I was VT, was relatively "normal" and I got lynched D2 (side note: farside22 was the mod). Later, as a VT in newbie game 934 I played differently by making inane comments, poking fun at others, making jokes and references to silly things... I made it to the D3 endgame (I lost it by making the wrong decision, but that's beside the point). So what I am doing now is...well, somewhat aggressive, as reflected in my voting. Next time maybe I should try to play like Jack!Sotty7 wrote:Charlie if this isn't yournormalplay style what is? Also, why experiment if it is going to adversely effect your play? It smells like an excuse to act scummy.
2) Oh my goodness. I don't like this line of questioning, but the answer is already covered in 1).Kindness-
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Charlie Mafia Scum
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EBWOP: Sorry, I missed this one:
At this point in time, yes I believe that he is mafia. He continues to put press on the same matter without giving much room.. I would say he'd have a counter-point for every point I make. This seems too good to be true. Vote stays.Locke Lamora wrote:Charlie: so do you think Magna is mafia? It took me a while to decipher some of that post and I'm still not sure what the point of most of it is, other than to be obscure.Kindness-
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Sando Mafia Scum
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Zachrulez Jack of All Trades
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I actually prefer this lynch now.Locke Lamora wrote:Magna: I don't see it. How does your first question lead on to anything to do with widening the meta field? Was your original objection similar to mine or not?
The above post diminishes my opinion of Zajnet further, if that was possible. Perhaps I'll put the issue in a different light; can anyone tell me why we shouldn't lynch him?
Unvote: Vote: Zajnet
I still wouldn't mind Magna or Porochaz lynches at this point either, however with the lack of movement recently, I'm seeing contentment with the top wagons and it's bothering me a bit.-
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MagnaofIllusion has been killed Night 1
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It’s not. As Sando has pointed out I garbled the post. It should have read “There would be no pressure on the person who hammered if the lynched person wasCharlie wrote:Why is this true?Scum”
That said you haven’t addressed the point Sando originally made - that your presentation of the vote on my indicated that you believed I was Town.
Please elaborate on why my thought process is ‘not Town oriented’.Charlie wrote:Really, I can see your thought process somewhat logical, but not Town orientated. For simple matters, I take the simple solution. Adding a little bit of extra thought in post goes a long way, but there is a time for just going for it.
So you think it is scummy to inquire, press, or otherwise interrogate a player I think is scum? If so we have a differing opinion on what constitutes scummy play. If I feel you are making points that aren’t valid I’m going to question / respond to them.Charlie wrote:At this point in time, yes I believe that he is mafia. He continues to put press on the same matter without giving much room.. I would say he'd have a counter-point for every point I make. This seems too good to be true. Vote stays.
As the day is coming to a close I think Charlie is honestly the best lynch. I also think that Zaj, Jack, Zach, and CDB’s replacement need more scrutiny Day 2.
@Zach, Poro and IKD– Please share your thoughts on Charlie."I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.-
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Zachrulez Jack of All Trades
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Incognito Not Rex
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Ythan replaces ChannelDelibird effective immediately. Thanks, Ythan.
Deadline will remain the same.[ooc][color=black]patrickgower2006 (8:12:03 PM): all beer tastes same to me
patrickgower2006 (8:12:07 PM): like dish water
If you see Patrick drinking dish water, please try and stop him. Friends don't let friends drink dish water.[/color][/ooc]-
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Ythan SheWelcome to the HaystackShe
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Locke Lamora Mafia Scum
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Sotty7 That Damn Good
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Hi.
Why are we plodding along people? Where are you all? This game is like pulling teeth.
Unvote, Vote:Zach
Lurking: CHECK
Not being proactive: CHECK
Coasting: CHECK
Hypocritical: CHECK
You're scummy as all hell right now. Tell me why you think we should lynch Zajnet over you. The pair of you have added hardly anything to this thread, you may as well be voting for yourself.-
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Sotty7 That Damn Good
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Locke Lamora Mafia Scum
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Hmmm. Maybe. I think it might get the game going more than a Zajnet wagon, which I don't think has been greatly reinforced by Poro and Zach hopping on. Why would you rather lynch Zach over Zajnet if you think they've both contributed as much as each other?If ya smell what The Locke is cookin'!
"Locke Lamora and Andrius, defying all logic since 1081."-
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Sotty7 That Damn Good
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Because like I said earlier I have seen Zajenet play this way and flip town. Ideally we want him replaced. Also Zach is playing more and more to his scum meta and even though we are closing in on deadline I can't sit back and watch him play like this anymore.
Wagon him with me. If it doesn't take off you can go back to your Zaj wagon and I'll go back to Charlie. Right now I want to lynch either Zach or Charlie but I also want an active town. Lets make some magic happen here.
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