Mini 1005: Mafiaphobes! (Game over)

[totallynotmafia]

So now your intolerence has extended all the way to sexism? Now you guys want to lynch Sotty7 just because she's a woman? Finally, you guys are starting to make some sense.

Seriously though, I wish you guys would take a bit more time to decide, because I still haven't learnt how to tie a noose knot yet. I have progressed somewhat though, and I can now tie a knot. So, if I tie this end of the rope to Sotty's ankle, and this end to this horse, and I whip the horse thusly: *whip*. There, she should be dead in about 20 minutes to a half hour.

Meanwhile, let's take a look in her purse I conveniently stole last Tuesday.

Oh look, here's her business card:

Name: Sotty7
Occupation:

Mafia Roleblocker

Innocent Townie
Phone: 555-WEKILLU

Hmmm...I'm not sure why, but I think this business card may have been tampered with. Let's see what else we have here...a little black book. Ah, I see, she was a hooker working for the mafia, preventing people from doing their jobs by shamelessly selling her body. Just look at some of the names of clients in her book: Bill Clinton, Tiger Woods, totallyno....okay let's not bore everybody with these pointless details.

Well, the blood-curdling screaming has stopped, so I guess Sotty is dead.

Sotty7, Mafia Roleblocker, was lynched Day 3

Night 3 has begun, you have 72 hours to get in all night choices.

[totallynotmafia]

Knock knock
Who's there?
Diddin
Diddin who?
Diddin see that bullet coming, diddee?

Yeah, diddin's dead. I thought I would try and alleviate some of the grief by breaking it to you guys in the form of a joke, like I did that time when I had to tell the kids that Grandma was dead, but in hindsight it didn't really work then either...some people just have no sense of humour.

Anyway, it appears that diddin was a jailkeeper. How do I know? Just look at his passport photo:



I knew I'd seen him before somewhere. Anyway, it's a sad day and a real shame that he's gone forever. He owed me 100 bucks for Waterworks.

Oh, looks like he was a neighbour too. Yeah...I don't have anything funny to say about that.

diddin, Town Jailkeeper Neighbour, was killed Night 3.

Day 4 has begun. Deadline is September 5th, 2:00 PM (GMT + 10:00). With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch.

Charter replaces Arraneas.

[charter]

Hey. It'll take me a while to read this.

[xvart]

Welcome, charter.

The diddin kill is intriguing. I have a thought, but I'll wait to propose it until after we get results from everyone. Before anyone claims, I think it would be best to hear from Vezok first, if that is okay with everyone else.

xvart.

[charter]

Alright, reading up, part one.

By the end of page one, I'd bet that Friend is scum and vezo is town.

SSBF, in your post 27, how do you see that question as rolefishing?

By the end of page two, I'm pretty certain Friend is scum.

That's all I've got time for tonight.

[Humble Poirot]

Nice to see you Charter. I'm eager to get your impressions as you go (and, if possible, the explanations attached to them).

Also, I'm shocked. I pretty much thought it was sotty + diddin + vezok. Hence, my plan to trap both of them. Sotty's comment's about a crippling setup made me think we had it in the bag.

Right now... I'm thinking xvart has to be scum due to the 2 protective roles issue. Which makes me wonder about plenty of things (considering he has been a town read from day 1). I feel weird that Oso seemed so sure about diddin's alignment (and why did he talk so much at night when we were unconfirmed?) but his claim mid-game when it wouldn't be necessary as scum still puts him in a town place. Something else I doubted was that all neighbours would be town but I can't imagine him bussing sotty in such a way.

I'll be honest. To me:
JK or doc (one had to be scum)
Watcher or Tracker (one had to be scum)

That meant diddin + vezok (plus added scummyness from both)

but now I'm starting to second guess myself (mainly about xvart).

considering both Oso and xvart were protected in different ways, why would scum go after diddin and not vezok(if town)? I'm trying to determine what would different combinations do.
EDIT: Actually, no. Diddin was the best kill and I didn't anticipate it because I thought he was scum and would kill xvart and be bussed by vezok today. Diddin was going to be pretty much cleared and role confirmed when he blocked/docced Oso. Xvart scum would be exposed anyway.

One thing we DO know now is that sotty blocked diddin n2 because Oso could still track last night. We still don't know who got blocked by sotty n1.

I guess I'll just have to read back and consider all the new information.

SSBF, q21, thoughts?

HP

PS: I also have a very interesting theory in my pocket that will have to wait until everyone gives their thoughts about the events so far.

[Oso]

I'll add my welcome to Charter as well. Welcome

..
Right now... I'm thinking xvart has to be scum due to the 2 protective roles issue. Which makes me wonder about plenty of things (considering he has been a town read from day 1).

I feel weird that Oso seemed so sure about diddin's alignment (and why did he talk so much at night when we were unconfirmed?) but his claim mid-game when it wouldn't be necessary as scum still puts him in a town place.

Something else I doubted was that all neighbours would be town but I can't imagine him bussing sotty in such a way.
..

I was pretty sure. His claim was an L-1 claim, a lot of pressure there so you could assume he made up a claim that fit the situation. He saw there was no night kill so he made up a claim that could account for it OR that he claimed his real role. Since there was no sort of counter-claim at the time, the smart play (at least in my book) was to conditionally treat the claim as true on the face of it and try to incorporate his role into what had happened in the game so far. I went the route that he had blocked killer rather than protected the target (no N1 kill and no other claimed protective or blocking role) and some other players went the other way and assumed the 'protected the NK target' part.

My suspicions of Sotty7 (or rather, my suspicions of what I thought might be happening. At that point, Sotty herself had done nothing suspicious in her play up to the point I put forward the "blocked the killer" theory) are what prompted me to follow her N2. When diddin said he jailed me but I still got a result that night I was as close to sure he was a JailKeeper(as he claimed) as I ever am about anything in a mafia game. Under no scenario could that I could come up with, would Sotty(scum) visit diddin(scum) at night. The only thing that could account for that is Sotty(town)/diddin(scum or town) but with the lack of an N1 kill, diddin had to be, by my thinking at the time, A)exactly what he claimed to be (a JailKeeper) a B)Role-Blocker or a C)Doctor. The only question I had in my mind at that point was that it could have been the exact opposite of what I thought. Sotty could have indeed been saved by diddin's jailing of her. But if she seriously entertained that as a reason, she would not have been out blocking (the only action that made sense if diddin had true claimed because I did get a result) the person that most probably saved her from an NK, that her made scum or REALLY paranoid town.

His alignment, for me, was nailed into place when Sotty flipped scum. As I said, I couldn't figure out why Sotty would visit diddin at night if they were both scum. From that, I decided diddin was confirmed until such time it might become clear I made a mistake esp. since the way the night actions were set up, I'd know (and you folks would know, providing you believed my claim of Tracker) for sure one way or the other by morning.

..One thing we DO know now is that sotty blocked diddin n2 because Oso could still track last night. We still don't know who got blocked by sotty n1.
..

"Elementary, my dear Poirot." (if I may mix up literary characters for a moment). diddin jailed Sotty7 night 1. She didn't block anyone (although, we will have to wait until the post game wash-up to know for sure if she tried to block N1 or not). And perhaps diddin even still stopped the kill. Role-Blockers are not required to block and we get back to my original supposition of D2: There was no night kill N1 because diddin had the scum tapped to make the NK in jail.

As to why I talked so much in an alignment unconfirmed night thread? No real answer except that is what it is there for, to talk at night. If you notice, none of us really talked about anything of any real substance. I posted a player read list, I did quite a lot of speculation about how the game might be set up and pretty much while all three of us relaxed a bit as the game went on, there is not now (and never really was) a lot of trust in there.

Aside from diddin talking about his possible gambit on vezo (which you correctly shot down and I agreed with you), the only real game related stuff we talked on was about revealing/not revealing the Neighbor Mechanic if one of us should be required to RC. The rest of it was basically speculation, fluff and several cautions all around not to say to say anything about night targets (this mainly directed to diddin after he claimed but before I claimed) or anything of real substance because scum might be listening. Last night was the first time we had openly acknowledged anything that had a real direct bearing on the game. And that was that we (diddin and I) stick to the planned night actions on our parts and don't go trying anything fancy. "Play it straight" was the phrase I used and, as far as I can tell, there was universal agreement in there that was the way to go.

[charter]

post 56 by SSBF is incrediscummy with how wordy, vague, and pointless the things he's arguing are.

End of 6, Don't have a town read of Vezo anymore. Don't have a town read on anyone at this point.

Top of 8 now.

[vezokpiraka]

Nothing happened at my house.
I am sure Charter will come with a claim and tell us HP is scum.

[q21]

Vote xvart

Maybe there's a jailkeeper

and

a doctor... but probably not.

[Humble Poirot]

Vote xvart

Maybe there's a jailkeeper

and

a doctor... but probably not.

That's all? Good, consistent with your lurky play. Noted. You're trying to give town no information at all with your posts, right?

I need to check your voting record but I think you've been silently in every lynch waggon without much explanations.

Another thing I find funny is how you never mentioned protection roles before.

On other news, is SSBF scum to you? Connections with Sotty? Xvart?

@Oso: When I say diddin block I mean he jailkept but, knowing sotty was scum, I don't need to assume he was protected. I'm aware Jailkeep is block+doc.

As for sotty and the possibility that he wouldn't block anyone night 0. It seems unlikely. Even more than no killing. If I was going to go for a nokill gambit, I would block someone and pretend they were scum.

I take it your reads are more or less the same as yesterday?

@xvart: You knew the plan was for you to get watched by vezok and that Oso would be jailkept by the now confirmed diddin. What information were you expecting? What's that thought you were witholding?

What do you make of the setup?

@Vezok, who do you think is scum right now?

One thing we should investigate is the whole claiming of day 2 with diddin and vezok's waggons.

I also realized that xvart + vezok scumteam does not make sense in light of Vezok's claim that Kage and xvart watched me n2. Why would he out his partner in such a way and force him to claim a PR?

[Oso]

Yes, my opinions are pretty much the same as yesterday.

I still think there is a high likelihood of vezo being a scum watcher rather than a town watcher. Currently trying to get an opinion on the non-PR players as to who might be a third member of the scum team.

Some things are in flux for me at the moment. The biggest being that since diddin has been confirmed town, that throws severe doubt in my mind on xvart's claim. Yesterday, because there was still a chance that I was wrong about dididn's alignment, the question of xvart could put off in my mind.

That is no longer the case and I am undecided at this point on that. The numbers say that the likelihood of two town protective roles is low but I won't just discard xvart's play up to this point out of hand. He has pretty much had a town read from the get go, based on the way he has been playing.

By the way, for any interested, I tracked diddin last night. No result.

@vezo, since you said "

Nothing happened at my house.

I'm assuming that you watched xvart as was suggested by Poirot and there were no visitors to him, yes?

[xvart]

Vote xvart

Maybe there's a jailkeeper

and

a doctor... but probably not.

Let's not be too hasty okay?

@xvart: You knew the plan was for you to get watched by vezok and that Oso would be jailkept by the now confirmed diddin. What information were you expecting?

I was expecting diddin to not go anywhere, since I didn't think there was a chance in hell that he was actually a Jailkeeper. The fact that the scum eliminated him and confirmed him as Jailkeeper is extremely perplexing.

What's that thought you were witholding?

The thoughts I was withholding was that I think Oso might be the likely scum, and possibly not even a tracker at all. For him to get a "no result" on diddin means diddin would have had to Jailkeep him. Why would town diddin JK Oso when that would have cleared him today? Especially considering diddin was a likely lynch today based on the end of day discussion yesterday. Yesterday, I think most people believed me being doctor over him being Jailkeeper, so why would scum kill a probable lynch, unless diddin would expose scum? We never directed diddin on whom to Jailkeep, so non-tracker scum Oso would not be able to predict where he went last night, and would therefore expose Oso when diddin counterclaimed an alternate target. I'll have to go back and check to see Oso's timing on his results to see if he had any inside information before it was discussed in thread.

The other thing I can't quite wrap my head around is the N1 actions by Sotty and diddin. They both claimed to have blocked each other, and I don't have any reason to think they didn't; but again I still need to go back and check the timing on Sotty's claim to see if the watcher/tracker results are in prior to claiming. This still leads me to believe that my protection of Humble is what saved the NK.

What do you make of the setup?

To be honest, I'm completely demoralized by the setup, since everything I have thought has been pretty much wrong. In terms of setup speculation and balance, it might be

Roleblocker/Watcher/Goon

vs

Doctor/Jailkeeper/Cop (insane?)/4x VT/Lynchee

vs

Lyncher

. With there being two protective roles I feel more confident about Charter being a lyncher since that would eliminate two non scum bodies if he was successful and help the potentially under balanced scum team.

Nothing happened at my house.

Explain in greater detail, please.

xvart.

[Oso]

..

What's that thought you were witholding?

The thoughts I was withholding was that I think Oso might be the likely scum, and possibly not even a tracker at all. For him to get a "no result" on diddin means diddin would have had to Jailkeep him. Why would town diddin JK Oso when that would have cleared him today? Especially considering diddin was a likely lynch today based on the end of day discussion yesterday. Yesterday, I think most people believed me being doctor over him being Jailkeeper, so why would scum kill a probable lynch, unless diddin would expose scum?

We never directed diddin on whom to Jailkeep, so non-tracker scum Oso would not be able to predict where he went last night, and would therefore expose Oso when diddin counterclaimed an alternate target.

I'll have to go back and check to see Oso's timing on his results to see if he had any inside information before it was discussed in thread.
..

I may be misunderstanding what you are trying to say but here:

..
This is what I think should be the plan for tonight in case I can't make it before the lynch.
if Sotty flips roleblocker and diddin is scum. He is lying about being a jailkeeper so he can't really block.

Therefore, diddin should protect/block Oso.

xvart should protect Oso regardless.
Vezok watches xvart.
Oso should track diddin. If he receives a result. diddin is lying.
..

As far as I can see, that was the agreed upon plan at end of day yesterday (the only person who voiced any objection was vezo and that wasn't much of an objection but a pointing out that had felt exposed).

I got the impression you agreed with it when you said this:

Go with Humble's Plan.

Since the results coming through on Oso depend on me protecting Oso does the scum want to do a little WIFOM tango during the night on whether or not I actually will or will I try and save Humble or q21? I think those are the two that are most vulnerable tonight with the state of the game and the night plans.
...

Diddin was directed and he confirmed in the neighbors thread that he did in fact, send in his night action according that plan. And I also confirmed my part in that plan, that I sent a track on him.

[xvart]

Shit. You're right. Scratch that. But why would the scum kill diddin? He was a more than likely lynch today.

xvart.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

Welcome to the game, charter.

I'm going to look at connection between other players and Sotty7.

SSBF, in your post 27, how do you see that question as rolefishing?

See #30 for reasons. If that doesn't work, I'll explain it to you.

SSBF, q21, thoughts?

I agree that either the tracker or the watcher is lying. In that case, I am leaning toward vezokpiraka being scum due to his overall much scummier behavior then those of Oso's. I also think that q21, a claimed Vanilla Townie, is also likely scum. I'll vote for either vezokpiraka or q21 today. I think xvart might be telling the truth. If xvart flips town, that will confirm you as town, as according to him, he protected you Night 1.

[charter]

I pretty much skipped everything on page 8 and 9.

No idea what Jay was doing with that claim he made.

Page 11 wasn't useful either, though excruciatingly long, Oso and Kage are mainly to blame for this...

Based on Sotty's first post, I'd give some scumpoints to Oso and some to one of the people she didn't mention. Especially when she comes in and says "I'm going to go ahead and say that I think Oso and Humble's little back and forth feels like a town v town logic fight to the death."

Oh man, 294, Dddin using "scumspects". Awesome.

Page 14. What. The. Hell. Didn't read that, because I'm pretty sure my eyes would fall out.

I'm on 18 now. I'm pretty sure at least one scum can be caught through claims, since no one died night one, but I haven't gotten to any claims yet.

[charter]

I really don't see any breadcrumb from Kage in his first post day two.

DDdin's first post might indicate that he jailed Humble. I'll need to go back and see who he was suspicious of at the end of day one. Actually, reading further, I don't think that's likely. I wish he had made it more obvious who he jailed, since I have no idea.

Oh man, 457 by Sotty. That's a mighty blow against Vezo. She basically said "I'm still trying to get Dddinthetownie lynched, but remember I think that Vezoscum is scum, I'm just not going to push for his lynch at all".

459!?!!!!!!?!?!?!?!? BWAH?!?!?!??!??? Incrediscummy.

My suspicion is there is at least one scum in the neighborhood.

Oso's 534 is pretty contradictory. He says he believes the claim, but he isn't finding Sotty suspicious.

Damn. Humble, your posts are way too big.

Ok, looks like Oso isn't scum. This is increasing suspicion of Humble.

I'd think the either q21 or SSBF is scum with their votes on Tazaro (though to be honest I haven't been reading Tazaro's posts) but they both completely ignored Oso's stuff on Sotty. (Page 25)

621, Sotty votes q21. Pretty weak reasons, no attempt at convincing anyone else he is scum. I'll have to see if she follows up on this later.

Good lord. As I glance down 26, Tazaro might as well just vote himself with how terribly he's playing.

Holy !@@$##@$. Humble, you need to make shorter posts or include a tl;dr at the end. I've read maybe five of your posts since you came in.

Alright, I think I've missed some stuff, because 747 isn't making much sense. I'll have to pick up a little before that when I'm not tired.

[Oso]

..
Page 14. What. The. Hell. Didn't read that, because I'm pretty sure my eyes would fall out.
..

Yes, that page may not have some of the longest walls in ms history, but I bet the page by itself ranks among the TOP 25 in length in ms history.

But maybe not, I haven't read every game
[/offtopic]

[Oso]

...
Alright, I think I've missed some stuff, because 747 isn't making much sense. I'll have to pick up a little before that when I'm not tired.

Post 747 was my pre-claim.

I wanted vezo's second player that visited HP for 2 reasons.

1)(Primary reason) - If vezo named Sooty7, then vezo had been messing with his results. We had pretty much conformed that vezo was a watcher in that KG had visited me. vezo named him and he confirmed. My concern was that, if I were in vezo's position, I'd have watched either diddin or KG, the only other 2 PRs in the thread at that point. That he didn't and watched Poirot instead made me suspicious. While I'm pretty sure that vezo wouldn't lie about who actually did show up, I wasn't convinced that he wouldn't add something to it to give a fellow scum member an alibi. But the only way I really could have confirmed that (at least to my satisfaction) was if he did name Sotty. He didn't.

2)(Secondary Reason) - By Night 2, I already knew we were pretty PR heavy in this game. Watcher, JK, KG(turned out to be cop) and myself (but I hadn't claimed yet by that point). When vezo claimed a second person had visited Poirot, with the game being PR heavy at that point (at least in my mind) I wanted to confirm that it wasn't me he had seen. I know the chance of a redirector of any sort being present in a normal mini is low AND there was no reason for me to think anyone had a inkling I was anything other than vanilla (or scum), but the chance I was wrong about that was just high enough, in my mind, that I wanted to confirm it. If it had been me vezo had seen, then I'd have made the same case I did after my claim, but it would have been against Poirot rather than Sotty7 as I would have actually been tracking him instead of Sotty.

[q21]

Vote xvart

Maybe there's a jailkeeper

and

a doctor... but probably not.

That's all? Good, consistent with your lurky play. Noted. You're trying to give town no information at all with your posts, right?

I need to check your voting record but I think you've been silently in every lynch waggon without much explanations.

Another thing I find funny is how you never mentioned protection roles before.

On other news, is SSBF scum to you? Connections with Sotty? Xvart?

Yes, I've been on every lynch wagon. quadz was a good Day 1 lynch. Tazaro deserved to die for his play. Sotty was scum.
No, I don't think I've mentioned the protection roles yet. That fact is, however, null as it doesn't contradict any of my previous play and it is a perfectly valid point all on its own. We have one confirmed protective role and one claimed one. Short of bastard modding (which should not happen in a mini normal) the not confirmed one is be scum.

[Humble Poirot]

xvart's #837

I was expecting diddin to not go anywhere, since I didn't think there was a chance in hell that he was actually a Jailkeeper. The fact that the scum eliminated him and confirmed him as Jailkeeper is extremely perplexing.

I was asking about the fact that you were waiting on Vezok to give his information out TODAY. If vezok had to watch you, according to the plan, did you really think he would say anything but "no one visited xvart"?

The 2nd paragraph makes practically no sense. It's really bizarre (and scummy) coming from you.

Diddin was not a likely lynch because he would be confirmed by Oso. He was town (scum knew that) so killing him was a great choice. If he lived, you'd be facing the same predicament of being the non-confirmed claimed protective role.

Added to that, once diddin was confirmed, Vezok would have to watch him every night, erasing the possibility of killing him (or trading one scum player in the process).

The fact that you *seemingly* forgot you agreed with my plan is disturbing.

The other thing I can't quite wrap my head around is the N1 actions by Sotty and diddin. They both claimed to have blocked each other, and I don't have any reason to think they didn't;

You have no reason to dis-believe confirmed scum?

diddin is town so he was telling the truth.
diddin: n1 sotty, n2 Oso (Oso could track), n3 Oso (Oso couldn't track)
Sotty: n1 diddin (unknown), n2 diddin (likely due to Oso being able to track sotty)

Sotty's n1 action can only be true if xvart is town because there was a nokill that night.

@q21: Ok. Let's assume xvart flips scum. Any ideas for a third partner? Now let's assume he is town. Same thing.

@Charter: Your posts might be funny and brief but they're pretty useless if you expect people to do all the research for you by browsing throughout the game to find what the heck are you talking about when you say

#Number: Oh God! scummy!
#Number: What the hell
#Number: Yeah, definetly scum.
#Number: Lame, didn't read.
#Number: Doesn't make sense.

If you explained why you said any of those things and offered a quote or a link things would be easier. So far, I don't know what you think or what you plan to do.

The whole charade of reading without apparently knowing about the flips looks fake to me. The first page contains all the flips and I don't believe you missed that. The link in your role pm should link to page 1 and you're talking as if you were guessing who was which role.

My posts may be long because I quote the information I'm referring to.

SSBF, Charter, we're the only ones who still haven't claimed. We should do it to make sure we're not missing anything.

I am a Town Neighbour (no added abilities) written with U.

[vezokpiraka]

Nobody targetted Xvart.

Charter more like scum now.
I can see jay saying he got a cop inspect on HP and try to lynch him. We would then lynch him the other day.
The thing is the scum tried to kill HP. We know that based on xvart claim. Or they didn't NK but that is a 1% chance or somehting.
So jay may be a lyncher on the mafia side to balance some things?

[Humble Poirot]

Charter more like scum now.
I can see jay saying he got a cop inspect on HP and try to lynch him.
We would then lynch him the other day.

Huh? Rephrase in a way that people can understand what you mean, please. Jay's claim that I was 100 % scum came on day 1 so there was NO possibility of inspection even if he was a cop.

Also, how would he benefit from that move if he was scum?

The thing is the scum tried to kill HP. We know that based on xvart claim.

No, we don't. diddin blocked sotty n1. If sotty made the kill that's a perfectly possible explanation.

Or they didn't NK but that is a 1% chance or somehting.

Is it?

So jay may be a lyncher on the mafia side to balance some things?

Bullcrap. Lyncher on the mafia side? Did you even research the role?

Vezok is, as always, an awesome lynch.

[Oso]

Nobody targetted Xvart.

Charter more like scum now.
I can see jay saying he got a cop inspect on HP and try to lynch him. We would then lynch him the other day.

The thing is the scum tried to kill HP. We know that based on xvart claim. Or they didn't NK but that is a 1% chance or somehting.

So jay may be a lyncher on the mafia side to balance some things?

The bold part: We don't know that.

It is certainly possible though. But until endgame, we won't know for sure that xvart saved Poirot or the N1 kill was prevented by diddin. Just because diddin jailed the Scum RB doesn't follow that Sotty wasn't the one designated to make the kill. Remember, even if you disbelieve my claim or disbelieve vezo's, we have a town role(s) that watches or tracks specific players. The only way that works (to catch scum) is if scum have to 'designate a hitter'.

Point being, just because Sotty was the Scum RB, doesn't mean she couldn't have also been designated the killer on N1. Granted, that might point to her not blocking anyone at all N1 (she was busy trying to kill) but even that makes sense if vezo is scum (I'll re-iterate my reasons if you folks wish on that) as the ONLY person who had even given a clue to themselves being a PR on D1 was vezo. All of my case against Sotty (before I tracked her) was based on the belief that vezo would have been the target of a scum NK on N1 and he was still alive D2. That pointed to vezo having been protected (he wasn't, at that point our only claimed protective role on D2 was diddin, he claimed a jail on Sotty) or the killer having been blocked (again, diddin jailing Sotty explained that, at least to my satisfaction).

We now know that xvart says he protected HP N1/N2, so that could explain the the no-kill N1. Even if I grant that xvart is exactly what he says he is, I don't grant that he prevented a kill N1. I'm convinced, at least in my mind, diddin prevented that by BLOCKING Sotty.

Now granted, what I just said weakens my case on vezo, alot. But not fatally so. Sotty7 blocking vezo's softclaimed (whatever role) makes sense. Sotty7 jail by diddin, vezo gets a result because Sotty is blocked. So, where is the N1 kill? We have xvart claiming to have protecetd HP so we a have

POSSIBILITY

that 2 towns roles got lucky enough to totally thwart scum on N1. I'm not going to quantify the chances of that happening randomly.

What makes more sense is that Sotty was the designated hitter N1 because they had no real candidate to block, she didn't try to block anyone because vezo was (and is) scum. Who they actually tried to kill I have no clue as D1 was fairly chaotic and I don't see anyone's play being an outright danger to scum.

So here is my dilemma:

xvart makes a better lynch off the numbers. 2 protective roles in a mini normal game is exceedingly rare because that overpowers town. diddin is confirmed as a town protective role (JailKeeper). xvart's claim (Doctor) would overpower town (the possibility of another scum power role out there does exist though). The flip side to that is, at least in my opinion, xvart's play. Aside from a couple of things, he wouldn't even be on my 'possible scum' list except for his claim and diddin's flip.

vezo still stands a chance to be town though, depending on what xvart flips. If xvart flips almost any sort of scum (or town) PR that would have a reason to visit a townie(HP) w/o killing them, then vezo can still be a town PR. If xvart flips a plain vanilla goon or any scum PR that would actually help the target, then vezo lied about seeing xvart at Poirot's N2. He most likely told the truth about KG visiting but added something to help out a partner's claim/gambit. The flip side, again play in the game so far. vezo is far scummier based off pure play than xvart is.