Mini 1029: Boondox Mafia (GAME OVER!!!! )

[don_johnson]

nix the replacement talk. i'm here and by god i'm going to help the town fight crime. or maybe i'm a criminal...

confirmatious!

LET'S DO THIS!

[don_johnson]

Well, I just have a quick question for everyone: What's your experience with mafia?

record is in my sig. as far as i can remember its pretty damn accurate, although i have been on an insane town win streak lately. i think i've been with six or seven winning towns in a row. not sure if that means i'm getting better, or if i've just been lucky. join date is accurate.

[don_johnson]

vote: don_johnson

damnit. i love bacon.

[don_johnson]

unvote, vote kagelord

excellent point, scott.

[don_johnson]

i sincerely hope that isn't a lynch. but i will be lmao if it is.

seriously, skill? you couldn't find anyone else to vote?

unvote, vote: skill006

[don_johnson]

love it. not only does he win world championships, but he's an excellent interogator...

[don_johnson]

unvote, vote: mysterio

i believe he may be scum.

[don_johnson]

in case you're wondering, it's a math thing.

[don_johnson]

math is what it is. i can't fully explain it, as i'd have to discuss ongoing games, but i'm pretty sure its about time for mysterio to be scum. that said, i am beginning to think el simo may be scum as well.

[don_johnson]

Maybe if mysterio was posting more like the town I've known him to be, then I wouldn't think my math was so reliable.

[don_johnson]

wow. mysterio is playing terrible. vote stays.

oh, and the "i play every game different" thing is my thing. so knock it off.

more mysterio votes please.

[don_johnson]

Um, no. I don't think you're convincing anyone. We have no idea what is making you believe he's playing terribly, not to mention we have no idea why you voted him in the first place. Meta from unfinished games, or because he hasn't been scum yet? Both are super unreliable and weak.

mathematics is what it is. you can't argue that. if you place twelve names in a "random" generator, you can then generate odds as to the chances a certain name has to come up. the numbers may be "unreliable", but they are still numbers. in

this

game, mysterio is avoiding the spotlight. much more so than in my previous experience with him. he isn't scumhunting. don't pigeonhole my reasoning. and no. i don't have to explain it to you. you can figure it out yourself. what makes you think i am scum and not mysterio? because i'm voting him? because you disagree with my reasons? how do we know that you're not scum?

in any case. my vote moves when townmysterio shows up. the whole "i play differently every game" is a bit he stole from me. go ahead and read DNA Evidence.

Also, questions (for everyone):

1. How would you define your playstyle?
2. Do you plan to play differently this game than in your other games, or will you be sticking to your meta?
3. Do you know your win/loss record here on MS? What is it?
4. Can you link us to any of your past games?
5. What is your opinion on lurking?
6. How active will you be this game?
7. Are you scum? If so, who are your scumbuddies?
8. Which people here do you know and/or have played with before?
9. How large will your posts normally be?
10. What do you think players should do when a thread is open for pre-game chat?

1. i wouldn't.
2.

i always try to play differently.

3. in my sig.
4. don't link.
5. its detrimental to town. but it has its perks.
6. i have a v/la coming up from the 6 to 13, but otherwise i plan on being as active as i can.
7. no. i wouldn't tell you if i was, but i'd scum it up with zwet any day of the week.
8. zwet. i think only once or twice.
9. depends on what i have to say.
10. chat.

mysterio didn't answer the question. he was my mason buddy in this game.

[don_johnson]

here's another gem from our quicktopic in that game after i asked him if he was an alt:

Yeah, I'm sure we can wing something decent. I'm sure we'll have more information to pick through when N1 rolls around. And no, not an alt.

Just registered a week ago

.

granted the game started weeks ago, but one doesn't develop an "anti-meta" playstyle in two to three games.

long story short:

mysterio is not being original. he's being fake. why would a townie be fake? answer: they wouldn't.

conclusion: mysterio is scum. he's just trying to fit in so he ripped off an answer to some heat on him by tossing out an answer he'd heard somewhere before. will you vote him now?

[don_johnson]

Ok don you really haven't provided us with any information as to why mysterio is scum. You claim he is playing terribly, that he is playing different to other guys you have played with him where he has been town and that your math backs up your case fairly strongly, yet you don't say what is so terrible about mysterio, you don't show us how he is playing different, you won't reveal your maths to us and instead just provide with some quotes of yours in previous games. Trying to push a case off this is terribly poor town play.

the math is inconsequential. which i already explained. the quotes represent the fact that mysterio is SPOUTING BULLSHIT. the quote from our quicktopic is from august 3. do you really think a player can develop an "anti-meta" playstyle in 24 days? just because i couldn't articulate what it was that rubbed me the wrong way, doesn't mean i should ignore it. so i didn't. i voted where my suspicions were even though i couldn't explain them. then i looked over what mysterio was saying and picked out a quote that he basically STOLE FROM ME in one of our other games together. what aren't you getting here? how is providing CLEAR and CONCISE evidence of VERBATIM THEFT "terribly poor town play."? do you think mysterio is town? if so, why?

Why all the hate on mysterio? Just because he "acts differently" that doesnt mean he is mafia. Actually it probably means he is either mafia or a power role, trying not to draw attention. Also, I think he s right on Raivann, since apparently mysterio and I are suspicious because of reasons not expressed. And that we voted for him. BTW, just a coincidence we keep being mentioned together, i think.

i could by that he's playing differently for "town" reasons, but the blatant lie he spewed about his playstyle has no business coming from a townie. he could have answered the question honestly. "hey guys, i've only played a few guys. this is my first month on mafiascum, i don't think meta arguments can honestly be made." but no. he claims to have developed some sort of "anti-meta" playstyle. i've been on this site over a year. and i've been playing "anti-meta" for some time, but not in my first month. not to mention the HUGE COINCIDENCE that the way he described it matched MY ANSWER from our game as mason buddies. could he be a townie who made a bad decision? maybe. but i'm thinking he's scum. now all he's doing is omgusing. he's not even looking at anyone else.


for instance, scumfakegod could be attempting to chain townie lynches right now. (no offense fg, i will gladly accept your support, just not your "either/or fallacy".) but theres no comment there. just an omgus vote.

mysterio: how many times has anyone tried to lynch you on meta? can you link to any games where this has occurred? i would like us to explore how in roughly 30 days you came to the realization that you needed an "anti-meta" playstyle.

[don_johnson]

not sure what you mean by shrill. i'm simply explaining myself. as for the math let me make this simple:

3 games with you. one finished. you were town. second game: ongoing, cannot discuss. third is this one. you figure it out. i obviously have notions of your alignment in the second game.

the math is not the "case" against you. the math was part of the reason you initially aroused my suspicion. the case against you is your laughable suggestion that you have somehow managed to develop an "anti-meta" playstyle in your first month. so basically you are using your "anti-meta meta" as defense against a case you are discrediting because you believe it to be based on "meta". in other words, you are telling me to scumhunt based on whats in this thread, but your defense is based on whats outside this thread. if you want me to drop my case, then start scumhunting. all you are doing now is laying out a hypocritical omgus vote.

please link to games where you "lurk". that has not been your tendency in either of the other two games we've played.

again. the case is not "meta". the case against you is that you are not posting "original". if others want to believe that the quote i pointed out from our mason quicktopic, and my answers in that game thread are simply coincidence, then they don't have to vote you. to me its obvious you are scum.

your posts do not read genuine to me IN THIS GAME. your only defense so far is hypocritical at best. hint: best way for you to get me off your back is to engage someone else. its called scumhunting. try it. you have no defense against what i have said. stop trying to make it look like you do. if you are town, you should be moving on and acknowledging your poor play. not defending it with more lies.

[don_johnson]

i guess one thing that strikes me here, is that you call my case "weak". but you're not really explaining what's "scummy" about it. yet you're voting me. scum make meta cases? sure. but so do townies. I haven't stated my case is "100%". i've asked for others to vote based on my gut read. when asked to explain my "gutread" i brought up the mason quicktopic quote, and the oneliner you seem to have ripped from me verbatim. even if you don't agree, can you really argue that the evidence i have produced doesn't support my point of view?

all in all: you seem to be overreacting. its almost as if you're worried about my vote on you. if you're vanilla or town power, a single vote with "weak" reasoning shouldn't worry you at all. but this one has you so consumed that you can't seem to address anything else. had you initially shrugged it off, i might buy your towniness, but you didn't. you've done your best to "turn the tables". it just seems... odd.

sorry, i see you have two votes. in any case. you should have more.

[don_johnson]

Nice avoidance. Ur not lynching me.

How's bout I join ur Rai wagon?

Wud u mind going over the Rai case again?

[don_johnson]

Mysterio: Ok. Here's the deal. Hopefully this will save us from polluting the thread with unnecessary discussion.

I'm a vigilante. You produce scum today and I might not shoot u tonight.

Deal?

Skill: response to you when I get home.

[don_johnson]

U let me worry about that...

[don_johnson]

^^ this guy just keeps knockin it outta the park...

[don_johnson]

and to quote myself in response:

Proof is in the pudding. U can't really judge the pudding while the bakers still stirring. Time will tell.

i want the mysterio lynch. i think he's scum. if i don't get him, he makes a perfect vig target. i have a plan here. if he wants to bus one of his partners, he is free to do so. if we lynch him, i reevaluate based on the flip and the surrounding actions. my role is not compulsive, meaning i don't

have

to shoot. the claim was to avoid a giant argument between us and also cause a vig claim is almost always pro-town when done correctly. not only do i run the chance of drawing a roleblocker/scumjailkeep etc, thus allowing any town investigators to go about their work unharmed, i can also engage in a giant wifomic night action menagerie with scum. i also open myself up to inverstigations, etc. well before a vig claim becomes a problem for town. so yeah... trust me. this is gonna be fun.

[don_johnson]

Make all the suggestions u want.

[don_johnson]

only 4 votes on him.

quit stalling and vote your scumbuddy.

[don_johnson]

wishy washy voting isn't a scumtell. unless mysterio flips scum. anyone who wants to post suggestions, i'm all for it. if we're lynching mysterio(which we should since he's all but dissappeared) then please format your suggestions in the form of:

scumflip: kill X
townflip: kill Y

or "DON'T SHOOT, YOU MANIAC!"

[don_johnson]

no. i won't be announcing plans, and if i do, it will only be to wifom the scum. i think having everyone produce a suggestion in the format i laid out might actually be used as a scum hunting tool in case i wind up dead.

i would like doc protection if we have one, btw. but i understand if i don't get it. i have a feeling that mysterio is scum, and that i will be targeted for nk. as far as scum is concerned, if i'm not vig, i'm sk, and so they would be glad to be rid of me either way. especially if mysterio flips scum. they don't need another killer running around. in any case, i'm pretty good on this lynch, so i'd like players thoughts, lists, suggestions, etc. and then some type of hammer would be nice.

no premature hammers, though. thanks.

[don_johnson]

wishy washy voting isn't a scumtell.

Since when?

since, like, forever man. wishy washy voting is more of a playstyle than a bona fide alignment indicator...

at least that's my opinion. the only time it becomes an issue is when alignments get revealed. i.e. mysterio flipping scum would make it more of a scumtell. a town flip could indicate a cautious townie. its still day 1, too. many games aren't really able to be figured out until later days. but we'll see.

maybe i'll shoot you.

its good to be the vig.

[don_johnson]

Yeah I'm at a lost as to who to shoot,

I'll leave that in your capable hands

.

if i do shoot you, its because of this. blatant sucking up.

[don_johnson]

*giggles*

[don_johnson]

*giggles*

?

??

[don_johnson]

why do you think i killed rai?

[don_johnson]

let me rephrase:

skill006: why do you "think its safe to assume" i killed rai?

[don_johnson]

Handing out scum/town lists is never a good idea for town. Don who did you kill and why?

there are probably better questions than this that need to be thought about. whoever i attempted to kill, it was because i thought that the chances of them flipping scum were pretty good. i had scum reads on both of the dead players, so i don't see relevance in answering this. i'd rather discuss who we are going to lynch. i'd like skill to answer my question. cloud: if you don't think handing out lists is good for town, what do you suggest we do?

[don_johnson]

Huge difference in making scum lists and focusing on say, a couple of people. Don, what is a better question that needs to be thought about?

vote: cloudocean

hows about: are you scum?

i'll be rereading day 1 in light of the flips. talk later.

[don_johnson]

the most common scum play in that situation imo. is to roleblock the vig(if possible), or let the kill go through, then try and orchestrate a lynch by accusing the vig of being an sk. my only guess is that they were confident i wouldn't hit them? or maybe there are two scumgroups and i actually

was

roleblocked...

in any case, that is a very good question for us to think about. don't you agree cloudocean?

[don_johnson]

i'm not shooting us into a loss. we need scum today.

i'd like to reread. i would like to see more from our resident active lurkers as well.

skill: why mongoose over bunny?

to those voting bunny: why bunny over mongoose?

oh, and in the meantime...

vote: bunnylover

that's L-1. lets get a claim?

[don_johnson]

but...

w
h
y
?

[don_johnson]

neither was on our townie lynch, and both were on the other town wagon. of individual contributions, mongoose seems to have a more town mindset. he didn't really defend mysterio, but he questioned the wagon sensibly. of course, had rai flipped scum, i'd be more confident in him.

I find this scummy and wouldn't be too surprised to find they are partners.

interesting theory.

i need to actually reread before i cast judgment, but i think bunny should claim. it may help clear things up.

[don_johnson]

up to page 5.

bunny is non existent.

main suspects: kage/skill/fakegod

fakegod:

I often shift my RVS vote to the highest wagon I see.

can you link and/or reference 2 or more games in which you've shifted your rvs vote to the highest wagon?

[don_johnson]

oh yeah, and el simo. suspicious as shit.

[don_johnson]

U were the lead wagon. Then suspicion shifted to Rai/mysterio. U tellin me we wagonee three brownies day 1? I also noticed some suspicions others had of u yesterday just kind of disappeared. U coaster thru the day.

[don_johnson]

Damn smart phone. Brownies Shud be townies. Wagonee Shud be wagoned. Coaster Shud be coasted.

[don_johnson]

I do as I please.

[don_johnson]

Kage, ur question is a bit odd. Have u even been reading the game? Ur rehashing a discussion which has already been settled.

unvote: vote kagelord

What possible motive might u have with this line of questioning?

[don_johnson]

kage: the question you answered is not odd. the question you asked is. now you're blaming me for getting us "into this mess"? really?

my point is that you seem to be casting sideways suspicion at me. if you have something to say then say it. as it stands you seem to be beating around the bush trying to instigate others into suspecting me. classic scum move. gives you an out if a wagon doesn't materialize. also, attacking the claimed nightkiller is an easy way to coast through the day without having to do any actual scumhunting.

me saying "i won't shoot us into a loss" is the end of the discussion. people can post their thoughts, but you asking me that particular question is redundant as it has already been answered.

i haven't claimed a kill because i didn't shoot. last time i was vig i shot the entire town. i've grown.

[don_johnson]

most likely. i was simply hoping to draw scum power my way in order to free up town investigative roles. it doesn't look like anyone came away with a guilty though.

[don_johnson]

i think i've got mini normals with two scum groups. one was out of balance, though. i do have restrictions/other facets to my role, so another "vig" type role is not out of the question, but if its two anti-town factions, i'd bet on sk/scum group as opposed to scumgroup/scumgroup.

i think i kage is a good bet for scum as of now, but i haven't finished rereading. bunny should be our default lynch at this point. he's just not contributing and his "vanilla" status doens't help him either. i have shit to do today, but i'll try and finish up a full analysis by tuesday night.

[don_johnson]

i say we get rid of the deadweight here. lynch bunnylover, if he flips scum i'll take el-simo's advice and shoot mongoose. town flip and i hold fire... maybe. then mass claim tomorrow(if applicable).

[don_johnson]

scott: i am actually about 100% on kagelord scum right now. i think he is the best lynch today. bunny second.

[don_johnson]

Skill. Fakegod. El Simo.
U heard it here first.

unvote, vote fakegod

[don_johnson]

Skill. Fakegod. El Simo.
U heard it here first.

unvote, vote fakegod

And your 100% on KageLord went.....?

out the window... apparently. it was something he posted that caught my eye, but on reread seemed reasonable. i've got a real vibe on these three. if fg flips scum i'll shoot one of the other two. still working on more analysis, though. talk later.

[don_johnson]

Siigh, if you think I am scum I'd really hope you'd let the town hear your case, because I'm pretty sure you are the only one who shares this view. I'd hate to be killed by the vig because we had two wagons on townies on day 1.

if fakegod flips scum then your death would not be in vain as it would confirm you for town and give us a good position for the day.

your vote reads like a bus. and your worry about your own skin doesn't help. i said you

or

skill. what do you think of skill as a partner to fakegod? and who else might you pair with fakegod?

[don_johnson]

you seem awfullly worried about this...

does that mean that you are extremely confident that fakegod is scum?

please esplain this isea that mongoose is "buddying" to fakegod(or whatever it is that you are implying as the connection between the two)? if you convince me otherwise, then there is less probability i will shoot you. of course, this all depends on fakegod flipping scum. so...

let's get the bastard to L-1, get a claim and then decide between him and bunny, no? or does someon want to make a case for a better lynch candidate?

[don_johnson]

FG lynch is a go!

if he flips town i shoot bunny? thoughts?

[don_johnson]

mod: votecount please?

[don_johnson]

please do not self hammer if you are town.

[don_johnson]

^^ says mr. useless.

[don_johnson]

if everyones just going to lurk then i think mongoose should hammer.

[don_johnson]

I am soooo shooting you. Good nite.

[don_johnson]

mod: please post a vote count.

either dana is fuckin with us or someones a null voter.

[don_johnson]

i tried to shoot bunny. not sure why that didn't go through. doesn't make any sense for scum to block the vig and

not

kill the doc.

i actually considered opa for the kill, he doesn't make much sense as a scum driven nk as his hammer was entirely scummy yesterday. bunny seemed a surefire lynch today, so i figured shooting at him made sense. kagelord was my second choice.

why did you protect kagelord? and why are you voting in a possible lylo?

please remove the vote. i am an even night vigilante mason. i know who killed rai. and no, my partner isn't claiming until necessary.

[don_johnson]

in any case, i hope we have a cop, because it is clear that i have been blocked both nights. meaning if we have a cop he has been allowed to investigate unfettered. with me and my mason partner confirmed, cop should be able to add a couple innocents or possibly a guilty to the known information.

simo, who did you protect night one?

mass claim is okay, but we need to talk first. brosius, you've been townie to the core, why do you think you are still alive?

[don_johnson]

You were blocked both nights? But I thought you were only even-night vig?

I have no idea why I am alive.

no. i

think

i was blocked both nights. i shot at bunny last night. claimed doc says he protected kagelord, so my kill didn't go through. i assume i was blocked night one since scum most likely have a roleblocker.

time to reread, but we need more input. there is no sk. i was fishing for reactions(and telling the truth) by denying i shot on night one. kagelord had a post which gave me the "100%" read on him yesterday. i'll dig that up...

I was just waiting to see how that whole thing with don turned out first. There didn't seem much point in me voting someone else in the middle of that back-and-forth. Now though, I'm not quite sure that the leading wagons are appropriate. Sure Bunny and mongoose have been mostly inactive (and mongoose's voting someone on his 3rd post and sticking with it throughout the day without reinforcing it or trying to convince others doesn't help), but isn't it just as likely that they're just not playing good town? I'm just a bit wary of voting someone for reasons like that given that we probably

have an SK (or a lying vig),

meaning 2 possible town deaths a night. Lylo might be coming very soon (maybe as early as tomorrow), so I just want to have a very good reason when I vote right now. If Bunny and mongoose aren't scum, this is just looking ideal for scum (easy mislynches coming and possible help at night from SK or vig).

i read the bolded as scummy. implying that the vig would be "lying" doesn't make sense. only someone with night action information would suggest this imo. i don't know. i need to start over with this thread.

simo, your vote is misplaced. unless you are scum. why would scum block the vig and shoot someone besides the doc?

[don_johnson]

read my claim bunny. "even" night vig. i didn't target anyone on night one. my partner killed rai.

I have no idea why I am alive.

i'm a cop out.

[don_johnson]

sorry, change "i'm a cop out", to "this is a cop out".

we need everyones input. 7 players alive. most likely 3 scum. anyone lurking at this point(i.e. over the next 24-48 hr.s) is most likely scum. townies should be "in it to win it".

[don_johnson]

Since the deaths so far have been VT's, I think the cop should announce who he/she has invistigated already so we can get some named clear then look at who is left.

please tell us who you think is scummy before asking for a cop claim.

questions for all:

do you believe el simo's claim? why or why not?
who do you think is scum? why or why not?

when everyone has answered these questions, then we can discuss mass claim. please include more than one scum suspect. in fact, it would serve us well if everyone called out their pick for "scum team".

please answer in this order:

scott brosius
bunnylover
kagelord
mongoose
skill006


do not claim your roles. just answer the questions.

go.

[don_johnson]

ok. claim time. i'm holding my analysis until we have the rest of the info.

popcorn style.

skill006 goes first. then they choose who goes next and so on...

my partner will be claiming vanilla of course.

skill. you're up. then you choose mongoose, brosius, or kagelord.

[don_johnson]

skill?

claiming takes a minute. crafting a useful fakeclaim... an eternity.

hop to it.

[don_johnson]

chill out. my partner will claim

after

the mass claim. reasons being that it is unnecessary for my partner to claim. i'd rather see everyones suspicions/scumlists/claims etc. before my partner is revealed. i like your claim, though. good job. mongoose next. i think i have this figured out, but lets continue. i want everything on the table before i blow your minds with the entire scumteam.

[don_johnson]

vote: bunnylover

stand united. i am thinking skill is a roleblocker. brosius for scum # 3. either way, we should shoot simo tonight just to be sure.

[don_johnson]

!excellente!

*crosses fingers*

[don_johnson]

if it ain't you, then its skill/kage/brosius. two scum would be a stretch, but possible. o well.

mod: vote count please?

[don_johnson]

if simo is scum i will be nominating him for best claim.

[don_johnson]

skill/brosius/bunny

that's the scum team. simo is town.

[don_johnson]

i hate waiting. if scum has won they should be speaking up. lynch isn't going to reverse itself.

[don_johnson]

simo is town due to his claim, its timing and context. there is no scum motivation for him to do that when he did. too many variables could have ruined the game for his scum team if it was a gambit.

[don_johnson]

Well played. I don't think u cud hav put together a better endgame, Kage. I'm surprised mongoose voted u. I was baffling between the two of u, but I couldn't find the scum motivation for the tracker claim. As scum, ur chances wud hav been better as vanilla.

[don_johnson]

Honestly, this game was painful to read after my idiotic lynch. Although, it didn't help that KageLord's tracker claim was so pathetic. Man, I just want to forget about this game.

actually, your lynch was kind of fun.

you can't win 'em all.

[don_johnson]

this is an awesome set-up, i agree with scott. scum didn't necessarily need two roleblockers. i thought bunny was going to flip nk immune gf, then i figured it was scott. i liked the mason/vig combo. i should have claimed odd night, it may have enabled the skill shot to get through.

mongoose: you played awesome. 50/50 shot at the end for you. i was a little worried when i claimed. wasn't sure how you'd take it, but i think it worked out well. if its okay with you we should post our quicktopic.