Mafia 119: MURDER AT HOTEL DEATH(GAME OVER)

[curiouskarmadog]

what I was commenting on was "claiming was a pointless task"..it wasnt...it was only pointless if I didnt expose you. And I know, I know, you keep bringing up that you are town-aligned....if you are scum, you know I am town and I wouldnt lie, so it is safe to say "our claims look alike"....you are not buying creds with me.

[curiouskarmadog]

above post was referencing this.

If CKD were to be NKd the way he claimed, wouldn't his role be shown upon death?

This is why I was asking about the specific role name earlier, if it does, in fact, state in the role name that they are joint together, then claiming was a pointless task as the name should inform people what's going on.

but the claim wont have my partner will it?...and then you wouldnt know...come on, this isnt rocket science.

The claim will give a clue as to what

your

alignment is, though (regardless of me). They can at least figure out whether or not they trust the first claim, and then from there, whatever the second claim is. This is why I'm inclined to believe your claim, because it's exactly the same as mine, and I know I'm town-aligned because of it...so you must be, too, right?

[Jack]

Do you have a case to back up your opinion?

Dude you've played with me before.

Also, cases come down to opinion anyway.

although it's true I'm not feeling this game much right now.

[singersigner]

what I was commenting on was "claiming was a pointless task"..it wasnt...it was only pointless if I didnt expose you. And I know, I know, you keep bringing up that you are town-aligned....if you are scum, you know I am town and I wouldnt lie, so it is safe to say "our claims look alike"....you are not buying creds with me.

I could say the same about you. You're bring in a whole bunch of WIFOM, so sorry if I ignore your stupidity for the time being. Believe me, we're going to need this night to talk/make up for the time I'm now having to defend my idiotic predecessor for, so it's in your best interest to keep me around. If you'd like to continue trying to change my mind, by all means, go ahead.

[DemonHybrid]

what I was commenting on was "claiming was a pointless task"..it wasnt...it was only pointless if I didnt expose you. And I know, I know, you keep bringing up that you are town-aligned....if you are scum, you know I am town and I wouldnt lie, so it is safe to say "our claims look alike"....you are not buying creds with me.

I could say the same about you. You're bring in a whole bunch of WIFOM, so sorry if I ignore your stupidity for the time being. Believe me, we're going to need this night to talk/make up for the time I'm now having to defend my idiotic predecessor for, so it's in your best interest to keep me around. If you'd like to continue trying to change my mind, by all means, go ahead.

You two are wasting so much time it's ridiculous.

Stop arguing with each other, lynch someone who isn't a neighbor. Obvious choice for today. Like I said when I claimed and clashed with Pomegranate, it's just not worth assuming that one of the neighbors could be scum to the point of lynch today because the likelihood of 4 town neighbors

IS

there.

[singersigner]

You hush. If it's important for town to hash out what they believe or not, then we're gunna go at it. If you don't think it matters for us to get everything out on the table now for the sake of the town in case something happens (or doesn't happen for that matter) to one of us, but instead wait to know "until tomorrow," that's saying something of your knowledge of the game, is it not?

In any case, you're right about one thing. Lynching a neighbor right now is useless until we can all get more information from what happens during the night, but it doesn't mean we cease to scum hunt accordingly.

[zwetschenwasser]

the mod is WIFOMing us. I don't think any of the neighbors are scum.

[singersigner]

the mod is WIFOMing us. I don't think any of the neighbors are scum.

lol.

[DemonHybrid]

You hush. If it's important for town to hash out what they believe or not, then we're gunna go at it. If you don't think it matters for us to get everything out on the table now for the sake of the town in case something happens (or doesn't happen for that matter) to one of us, but instead wait to know "until tomorrow," that's saying something of your knowledge of the game, is it not?

In any case, you're right about one thing. Lynching a neighbor right now is useless until we can all get more information from what happens during the night, but it doesn't mean we cease to scum hunt accordingly.

The deadline's pretty close, though. I'm pretty sure I have a good hold of mafia knowledge, seeing as how I can get priorities straight. Unlike some people....

I think we've said all we can about the neighbors for today. It'd be fine if any of you actually had a legitimate argument, but it's about the same things and you guys are going in circles. Get your heads on straight. This whole situation is null.

The scummiest neighbor I can think of is zwet, but I'd rather the Espy lynch above all else. The info that we have after night two will be invaluable for narrowing down the neighbors, but unless you have complete concrete proof of someone being scummy, and not "they claimed and it's SUCKY" type of arguments, kindly float back down to reality here, please.

[Jack]

Nero Caine has not posted here since the 8th (but has posted elsewhere). Several scummy posts from someone with only 8 posts = lynch

unvote, vote:nero caine

Bandwagon PLEASE, and don't ask for a case when it has been made already and it's blindingly obvious why he's scummy if you read his posts.

[DemonHybrid]

I've been keeping NC in mind, actually.

I will look at him much closer Day 2 and see how he responds if he's still alive.

[singersigner]

Nero Caine has not posted here since the 8th (but has posted elsewhere). Several scummy posts from someone with only 8 posts = lynch

unvote, vote:nero caine

Bandwagon PLEASE, and don't ask for a case when it has been made already and it's blindingly obvious why he's scummy if you read his posts.

No. I just read his ISO, and I'm not convinced. Don't ever say something is "blindingly obvious." That's a cop out for someone who doesn't have a case. Even if you don't feel like you have to interpret the posts you find scummy, at least quote which ones they are.

I don't like NC's inactivity.
I don't like DH's intervention.
I don't like Jack's last post, is his flip-flopping on votes.
I don't like CKD's defensiveness/attacks.
I don't like zwet forcing his partner to claim without discussing it (at least CKD tried to).

The only two of these that I find scummy are Jack and zwet, but I honestly don't think any of the neighbors are scum at this point. And I'm not ready for a Jack wagon. I'd rather lynch Espy and go from there.

What is he at now?

[Nero Cain]

Nero Caine has not posted here since the 8th (but has posted elsewhere). Several scummy posts from someone with only 8 posts = lynch

unvote, vote:nero caine

Bandwagon PLEASE, and don't ask for a case when it has been made already and it's blindingly obvious why he's scummy if you read his posts.

How can you read my posts if you can't get my name correct?

[PranaDevil]

What is he at now?

If Looker's count is correct he'll be at 6.

[vollkan]

I like lookers play. It is pro town, scummy or not.

Looker's play is pro-town even if it is scummy?

Opens with a solid point on zwet, follows up with pointing out Espy had, indeed, pointed out Snake's claim well before he had (I didn't even put much thought into Looker pointing it out because Espy had already shown it quite clearly by then anyway, why is Looker getting grief for that and not Espy?)

Are you fucking serious? *facepalm* Look at Espy's post!

unvote

Came in late and didn't realise that RV had pretty much finished. I shoule Watch out more I guess.

Dude, seriously?

Someone explain how the HELL you can translate that as "You shouldn't have sofclaimed"?

Looker is obv. town, he's pushing people, and pointing out things that need pointing out.

How the fuck is pointing out a softclaim something that needs to be done and is obvtown? WTF?

Someone ask me something simple about the game please.

Did you notice Snake's alleged softclaim?

Looker is scum, and when he flips as such, I think I'm gonna be taking a closer look at Prana.

^Goodposting

PD+5

@Volk: Horrors only def was that vez was guilty of the same thing as him. This does not defend the point it simply attacks Vez.

That depends on your base assumption. Let me explain:

Some people (most, actually) approach this game with a presumption that inactivity is scummy. Others, myself included, think that inactivity, being so often a product of non-game factors, cannot be treated as a scumtell.

Of course, in theory, only scum have a

motivation

to lurk, whereas Town have the opposite. But that's just it -

in theory

. The problem with that theory is that it ignores non-motivational factors (ie. real-life factors)

A player who was lurking, as HD was (though I see he disputes that he was; and frankly I don't care because it isn't scummy anyway), is most likely going to be far more likely to automatically assume that inactivity isn't scummy. In turn, they are far more likely to do the sort of thing that he did, which is turn the attack back on the attacker.

Also I think omgus does exist, however I don't base my tells on that alone.

What you are attacking here is the

tu quoque

(latin for "you too") fallacy. OMGUS is entirely different (and non-existennt)

unvote, vote cooldog

thats what I thought

Please explain.

Okay, now tell me the pro-town reasons for Espy's post there. And what you think the "Dude, seriously?" was referring to. That goes to both you HD, and Espy. What the hell was that comment referring to and what pro-town benefit that post gives us.

Valid question. I have an idea what the answer is, but I want to hear it from Espy first.

I'm here.
Sorry internet screwed up.

You shouldn't have fixed it. That was the gods trying to spare me from having to play with you.

[PranaDevil]

Okay, now tell me the pro-town reasons for Espy's post there. And what you think the "Dude, seriously?" was referring to. That goes to both you HD, and Espy. What the hell was that comment referring to and what pro-town benefit that post gives us.

Valid question. I have an idea what the answer is, but I want to hear it from Espy first.

Glad you brought this back up actually.

HorrorDude, you said why it referred to, but you still haven't informed us on any pro-town benefit from that post either.

I'm also still waiting for those pushing Looker in regards to pointing out the Watcher claim as to why it benefits scum more to point it out in thread rather than hide it. Where is the scum motivation? I can see a cock-up on the part of town, I absolutely cannot see scum doing that.

[vollkan]

Ugh..accidentally hit submit instead of preview

Fair enough, that wasn't a great thing, but Espy had already done so, quite blatantly (I will admit I ignored it in the hope others had, but I feel the need to back up Looker in that he wasn't the one and only person, nor the first, to point it out). But what about the fact you're ignoring that Looker has made good points towards Zwet, Vezo and Espy? Do they all get ignored for what I can make out as one bad post in a sea of scum hunting?

This is just wrong. Espy's wasn't that obvious, let alone to the extent that Looker could reasonably justify not pointing it out (

Looker+4

, by the way)

Just a reminder that the deadline is nearly exactly 3 days from now.

In that case:

NicolBolas*	50
Jack	50
vezokpiraka	57
curiouskarmadog	50
Stef	50
horrordude0215	50
Espeonage	57
CooLDog	58
Neo Crain	58
zwetschenwasser	50
a2rudeboy*	50
Pomegranate	50
Looker	54
SnakePlissken	52
PranaDevil	55
Demonhybrid	50
totallynotmafia	50

[vollkan]

And I now realise that, having added up my scores, my vote isn't in the right place. I normally don't end up with a tie for first place. This puts me in a confused position because a major goal of my scoring system is to enable me to remove fluffy on-the-spot judgments from my play. For now,

Unvote, Vote: Nero Chain

Pseudo-vote: CoolDog

[curiouskarmadog]

@ vollkan, bold should answer your question....the particular quote you indicated came after I asked him some questions and he posted without acknowledge my post. I had to vote him to get him to answer...

that being said, what makes you think I am voting CD for being lazy? He has stated he has read my claim (after some prodding)...

I think I have caught him in some bullshit act to look like he is scum hunting (stated this in my vote). I am going to keep backing him in the corner...(ie to see where he really wants to take this). I have a point at the end of it, but good money says he isnt going to let it get that far and will bail on the question

.

still waiting on you CD.

[PranaDevil]

Ugh..accidentally hit submit instead of preview

Fair enough, that wasn't a great thing, but Espy had already done so, quite blatantly (I will admit I ignored it in the hope others had, but I feel the need to back up Looker in that he wasn't the one and only person, nor the first, to point it out). But what about the fact you're ignoring that Looker has made good points towards Zwet, Vezo and Espy? Do they all get ignored for what I can make out as one bad post in a sea of scum hunting?

This is just wrong. Espy's wasn't that obvious, let alone to the extent that Looker could reasonably justify not pointing it out (

Looker+4

, by the way)

Please explain the scum motivation for Looker pointing out so blatantly please.

[vollkan]

Ugh..accidentally hit submit instead of preview

Fair enough, that wasn't a great thing, but Espy had already done so, quite blatantly (I will admit I ignored it in the hope others had, but I feel the need to back up Looker in that he wasn't the one and only person, nor the first, to point it out). But what about the fact you're ignoring that Looker has made good points towards Zwet, Vezo and Espy? Do they all get ignored for what I can make out as one bad post in a sea of scum hunting?

This is just wrong. Espy's wasn't that obvious, let alone to the extent that Looker could reasonably justify not pointing it out (

Looker+4

, by the way)

Please explain the scum motivation for Looker pointing out so blatantly please.

"Hey guise a watcher!" whilst also maintaining plausible deniability

[CooLDoG]

@looker, befor I finsih my reading, no I'm not voting on the jack thing. Voteing on scummy play, etc. I have limmited time, so i'm going to make this quick...

[vezokpiraka]

Hey.
Let's lynch CoolDog.
He is probably scum.

unvote vote cooldog.

[CooLDoG]

@ckd, the other guy gets the 1-shot kill correct?
@volken, glad to get the most points on that there chart. (I hope thats some sort of emote over there...)

I must be going, deadline is soon, and by the way volk, I still think that the "you too" fallicy exists, I really must run though. No time to evne check for spelling, gramar...

[CooLDoG]

the emote came off a little too evil looking for my tastes. Befor I go,

@vez, why plz...