Bomb Mafia -- Game Over

[themanhimself]

/confirm, most active pre-game ever?

[themanhimself]

Jack, either you softclaimed a role that has info about the bomb or your plan is non-sensical, it's most likely that the mod is randomizing bomb times and even if not I imagine he's setting it up so that there's no pattern involved. He said in the rules that he was aiming to minimize his own influence on the deadline so ideally you'll have basically no information about when it goes off unless you have a role with that information built in and soft-claimed as Hoopla pointed out.

[themanhimself]

I would be totally alright with that if it wasn't exactly what he wants. I feel like he's scum trying to get control of the bomb so he can use it in his scummy ways. He's already said he won't pass it until right before the deadline (again, this makes no sense) and then give it to whomever he wants, so giving him the bomb is basically making a scummy player into a day-vig.

[themanhimself]

I definitely agree with the second one there, it will give us a lot of information and make the exploding process more democratic as three players would have to pass someone the bomb to doom them.

Mod: Since the pre-game has been so active could we go ahead and consider the game started? I want to start voting Jack asap

Starting it now.

[themanhimself]

I don't buy into this. Jack wants control of the bomb and if he has info about it, I think that's likely to come with a scum alignment. And like SC said, first he adamantly said that he didn't soft claim, then he claimed? He's backtracking because he found a better excuse.
VOTE: Jack

[themanhimself]

DKU's post was not a town thing to say but for D1 I don't know how much more solid we're gonna get than the Jack wagon (hah! Get it?). Let's lynch him today, DKU tomorrow and win D3

[themanhimself]

Hah! Fail Jack! I'm gonna do a re-read really quickly and do a catch-up post

[themanhimself]

But stop voting me, that's just a waste of time.

This is stupid and very, very scummy. VOTE: danakillsu

[themanhimself]

wait, what? No way that's a hammer, hang on, counting

[themanhimself]

Well, shit. I'm as sure he's scum as I was about Jack and I was right about that so here's hoping. Wouldn't have done that if I'd known it was a hammer

[themanhimself]

Well the flavor says the hoopla was shot and CES was stabbed which seems to me to pretty obviously be mafia and an SK. Mafia for hoopla and SK for CES

[themanhimself]

I don't like benmage's last post at all. Vig should not claim and it's clearly not a vig. Stabbed is always an SK. That seems to me like bussing the idea of an SK while simultaneously fake breadcrumbing for a vig role claim later. I also don't like fates play in this game but fate is just a troll so it's a null-tell.

[themanhimself]

Hrm, is that the case? I'll admit, my flavor knowledge is rusty from the four year long break I took mafia. Since I've come back I've only played in one game with an SK and that one stabbed.

[themanhimself]

pass bomb to Ant

[themanhimself]

pass bomb to antb

[themanhimself]

His comments about Jack were pure bussing and if he is a bomb immune townie then I took no risk. That was a no-lose choice I just made there

[themanhimself]

I'm the Bomb Squad Hero. I would have imagine that would mean I could defuse a bomb once or twice, instead my armour makes me immune to a single explosion.

Was Immune even...

There, now if the bomb doesn't go off, we basically have a confirmed townie, YOU'RE WELCOME

[themanhimself]

I read over it and I'm pretty sure that its time based

[themanhimself]

Are you kidding me NS?

I'll set up specific

times

before the game starts which will be explosion

times

. Any player who has a bomb in their possession when the explosion

time

hits will be killed. The

times

will be preset within the context of a game playing until the maximum allotted

time

(it's important to me that the players don't think this is just the Mod influencing the game, I plan to literally draw up all the explosion

times

before the game even begins).

This and the fact that he never says post count

and

the fact that bombs can go off at night pretty definitively rule out post count detonation as a plausible theory.
VOTE: Nobody Special for FoS'ing me and misrepping me over something he clearly didn't read or think through and for trying to lead the town astray with obviously false theories.

[themanhimself]

What don't you believe buddy?

That's some seriously poor phrasing.

[themanhimself]

NS, what are your top three scumreads?

[themanhimself]

Pre-Game Status

Role PMs being created, randomized, and assigned.

Role PMs going out. All players must confirm and may ask questions about their role or the game. Players with access to QTs may talk during this period. All players may discuss the game in the thread. The game will begin when I receive at least 12 out of 14 confirmations.

All confirmations are in,

explosion times are set,

and the game will begin.

Okay, I guess we were both wrong. Whatever. Can we move on now.

By what nonsense logic does that make both of us wrong? I said that and you disagreed, that makes you wrong and me right

[themanhimself]

What don't you believe buddy?

I don't believe that now is the time to out the vig. Yes, if either of them were killed by a vig, then the person that did it is an idiot, but do we really want to risk making someone an easy mislynch or nightkill target?

Fair enough. I still disagree. But moreover I don't think it was done by a vig. I was hoping a foolish zealous SK might quick claim.

Regardless I don't think you'll be seeing anyone claiming vig this game.

That actually occurred to me after saying a vig-claim was stupid and I felt like kind of an idiot

[themanhimself]

Well you weren't expecting it so in that regard it is similar to the Spanish inquisition

[themanhimself]

All caps, damn, guess fate must be right

[themanhimself]

Oh, no question that's a bad vote from SC. The reasons contradict each other - if he didn't think it through, he's not "trying" to lead the town astray with false theories.

NS has something he wants the town to believe and he said that that was the only conclusion one could draw from the facts without looking at the facts. Why wouldn't he look at the facts if he was going to propagate this theory? He doesn't care whether or not the facts support it, he has something he wants the town to believe and so he's going to push it regardless of the facts. It's lazy scum. If he was town then he wouldn't have said that only one conclusion could be drawn from a set of facts that he didn't even examine. I'm not saying townies don't get lazy and skim, I'm saying that when they do, they don't start calling people scummy over things they didn't read.

[themanhimself]

Benmage, why aren't you voting NS if you think he's scummy?

[themanhimself]

ALL YOU POST IS BULLSHIT

Is the pot calling the kettle troll-y?

[themanhimself]

PRODUCE ACTUAL CONTENT

Doctor heal thyfate

[themanhimself]

The quick-hammer is a fair point but I think it was a surprise to most of us that that vote was a hammer, I had no intention of hammering anybody.

As for my current vote, how do we know when the next bomb is coming back? Or even when this one is going off? I don't want us to quicklynch anyone but the more votes we get the more information we have to go off of, the more ties we can make and later in the endgame after some flips, the easier it will be to find scum. NS is at a third of what it takes to lynch, the same as me and katsuki making him tied for first place but still four votes away. Also worthy of note, Fate is also voting for someone and yet you seem to be buddying up to him pretty well. I don't see either of you as scummy but if you're gonna call me out for voting someone (which is fair enough) then at least do it to fate too.

ITS PLAYERS LIKE YOU THAT MAKE ME THINK IM BETTER AT THIS GAME THAN I AM, AND THEN I LOSE WHEN IM AGAINST A REAL FUCKIN CHALLENGE.

Occam's razor says it's more likely you just suck at mafia.

[themanhimself]

I don't see either of you as scummy but if you're gonna call me out for voting someone (which is fair enough) then at least do it to fate too.

I'm not calling you out just for voting. I'm calling you out for bandwagoning in 349. Voting as a concrete gesture of dislike is fair enough; voting to try to secure a lynch is absolutely not what we want at this juncture.

Ah, I see what you're saying. My bad for not explaining #349 when I posted it. That wasn't to get benmage on a wagon, it was because benmage is my number two suspect and calling someone out without voting them is textbook bussing. I wasn't encouraging him to vote NS, I was literally trying to find out why he wasn't.

[themanhimself]

KEEP UP THE AD HOM THOUGH, ITS FUNNY TO SEE YOU TRY TO DO WHAT I DO

So you're admitting to using ad hom?

[themanhimself]

I'm pretty happy with my vote for now. I'm also suspicious of benmage and to a lesser extent fate, hito and SC

[themanhimself]

I hate when mafiosa are totally, totally right. Fate, ad hom truce? We just play a good game of mafia?

[themanhimself]

I think mass claiming is gonna be a good move in this game, because the flavor in my role makes me think scum are gonna have a hard time guessing what flavor to use. Because of this I think we should make the scummiest players claim first, so if they are scum they can't get an idea of what they should be claiming from the obv-town players.

I see advantages and disadvantages to the endless day. The advantage is we can still move the game ahead without NK's that would presumably hit townies. The disadvantage is that the bomb mechanic is pretty much a mystery to us right now, wew don't know when the next ones coming or how long it will take to go off. I also don't want to see the game stall while we wait for a bomb, that's no fun.

I've explained my read on NS pretty thoroughly. Benmage is up there because of his comments about the vig and when he tried to pay it off like that was intentional I got majorly scummy vibes. SC is up there because he did jump on my NS vote a little too quickly, I hadn't fully explained my case yet so I can't say I entirely understand why he did that. Fate was just annoying me, I think (s)he's probably town.

[themanhimself]

^What happened to that scumread on me?

I don't think I ever had a scumread on you

[themanhimself]

Took me a minute to find the cougar in there but I see it now

[themanhimself]

I had hito as a scum read for the same reason as fate, he was defending fate and I was annoyed by fate. I don't see either of them as particularly scummy.

I'm very interested to see what happens with the Antb situation. Seeing as how the mod has acknowledged that Antb can't pass it I'm theorizing a few possible roles, no sense revealing them yet but it might help prove or disprove fake claims later. Speaking of which, are we going for the mass claim?

[themanhimself]

I think NS should go first. I don't see any reason to wait, the bomb could go off any minute so we might as well be ready for when the next one comes around

[themanhimself]

I want to hear some flavor from benmage, these last few posts were kind of paranoid and I don't like it at all

[themanhimself]

You know what... yeah...

I'm a VT

, and I'm not advocating the mass claim until the next boom. I think if its less than a week we can expect a second bomb...otherwise we shouldn't assume so. I think waiting for the next boom gives us a much better gauge of our next move. I think Ant has sufficient information to go off based on peoples play rather than claim to know what to do with the bomb after it blows.

Why say you don't advocate claiming and then claim in the same sentence?

[themanhimself]

Why say you don't advocate claiming and then claim in the same sentence?

Presumably to prove he's not advocating delay just so scum can make a more informed fakeclaim.

I'm saying that he's playing both sides of the field. He's paranoid about backlash from the town concerning his own actions so he's hedging his bets and not actually picking a side. If it turns out that massclaiming was the right thing to do, he can protect himself by showing that he was the first to claim. If it turns out to be the wrong thing then he can protect himself by saying he didn't support it. It's equivalent to active-lurking, he's talking but he's not saying anything because if he says something it could incriminate him.

[themanhimself]

Cept Benmage didn't real claim

Even more fence-sitting

[themanhimself]

Not you fate, more fence sitting from benmage, he even claims without claiming

[themanhimself]

I was the one that said he claimed without claiming, not him.

You're nitpicking is terribad

What are you smoking? I'M AGREEING WITH YOU

[themanhimself]

Nvm, found it...interesting it doesn't appear the scum had fakeclaims. Odd.

MOD

have you ever run a game where scum had fakeclaim/safeclaims?

Exactly, if scum don't have fake claims then that increases our odds of being able to sort out the town claims from the scum claims. Yet you oppose claiming....... yet you claimed. And the claim you made had no flavor which you yourself are in the midst of proving is the most important part of the claim. What is going on here? You're playing like a madman.
UNVOTE: Nobody special
VOTE: Benmage

[themanhimself]

Hrm.

Since we got the two scummiest players out of the way, I'll go next. I'm the Governor of Oregon, Randall Weeks. I'm a progressive who supports change and believes the transton towers represents the best of what oregon has to offer for the future

[themanhimself]

VT

[themanhimself]

You know what... yeah...

I'm a VT

coughscumwillclaimVTcoughcanweendthisnowcoughcough

See how I can make you argue with yourself without even taking your quotes out of context? That's bad

[themanhimself]

I'm really thinking that now might be a good time use Hito's ability. The game is kind of stalling, we need to know whether it's worth it to wait for the bomb to go off

[themanhimself]

Did you forget that I blew scum up?

Did you forget that there's such a thing as bussing?

It's not even bussing, that would have been better play. The simple fact is that Jack legitimately wanted the bomb and he had some reason for that. Since he was scum, it must have been anti-town reason. Therefore passing the bomb to him is either a nullread or scumtell depending on the player. With you, I'm going with scumtell.

[themanhimself]

Would any1 not have passed it to Jack in my shoes?? Exactly. Thats my point.

Pass the bomb to Benmage

I would be totally alright with that if it wasn't exactly what he wants. I feel like he's scum trying to get control of the bomb so he can use it in his scummy ways. He's already said he won't pass it until right before the deadline (again, this makes no sense) and then give it to whomever he wants, so giving him the bomb is basically making a scummy player into a day-vig.

So...... clearly not true at all.

If I'm doing a good job of rereading, only themanhimself and hitorogoshi were playing with the idea of massclaiming before I caved in support of it. Two ≠ many.

So that supports my claim even more. That i was the sole

strong

voice of opposition.

And then totally backtracked in the middle of a sentence about how you didn't want claims.

I voted you because you claimed VT without any sort of pressure, yet were supposedly against massclaiming. The bit about asking the mod if he's run a theme game before came later.

And since reading my points on why...which seemed relatively obvious at the time...and make logical sense..but are now spelled out, what do you think?

There's been no coherence to any of your posts.

Infact

SC

, lets hear your top 2 scum suspects and potential SK.

Don't try and change the subject and push the guilt onto someone else.

[themanhimself]

I'd like to hear from Fate on the AntB is claimed scum thing. Also, this is taking way too damn long, I vote that hito uses his ability.

[themanhimself]

Also, is that a claim from everyone except fate because if so I have a pertinent question

[themanhimself]

Ok, a fairly valid viewpoint on the power use, what about AntB being confirmed scum?

[themanhimself]

Alright, that doesn't confirm AntB as town but it definitely helps

[themanhimself]

So, if everyone is done claiming, how come no one's role or flavor mentions Langston & Soarer?

[themanhimself]

pass bomb to benmage

Just wanted to get that out of the way, content coming

[themanhimself]

@themanhimself: Your role doesn't either, unless your fakeclaiming or haven't revealed all possible information... and what's your question to fate? | lean scum

But mine has nothing to do with the transton tower, a few people claimed roles related to that and it seems like somehow Langston & Soarer should have been involved in one of them.

[themanhimself]

pass bomb to benmage

Being called a VI by a VI is fairly insulting but I'll let it go.

I'm not pushing fate claiming because I think it's already understood that I want a fate claim and that fate won't do it, so I'm not wasting my breath on it and risking another ad hom war.

[themanhimself]

Since benmage is

confident tmh is town

I'm gonna go ahead and

pass bomb to benmage

. That's my last pass so passing back to me is officially a lynch at this point.

[themanhimself]

VOTE: benmage

[themanhimself]

Benmage is basically confirmed scum. Could we get the lord of bombs to throw me a bone here?

[themanhimself]

Yeah, just like all townies.

[themanhimself]

Boy I hope you're town

[themanhimself]

If you're town then when I flip you realize you were incredibly wrong and hurt the odds of winning the game for everyone, thereby making you the useless one. If you're scum then you're right on track so I can't fault you.

[themanhimself]

If we quicklynch obvscum benmage and get started on D3 before the 15th, I get three more passes and can avoid this lunatic's wrath

[themanhimself]

I'm confused as to why there are people still voting for me.

[themanhimself]

The same reason one ever policy lynches a VI when the games on the line you can't trust them with their vote to make the right decision. (Even moreso this game with the bombing mechanics) it's also why it is better to policy lynch early when we can afford to do so.

Not to mention I suck at reading idiots and tmh could very well flip scum. His eagerness to live and total stubbornness is making that possibility stronger.

This is idiotic, the only person who's called me a VI is you and you're the second most inflammatory person in the game behind fate who is the only other person who has seriously called out my play this game. You're throwing around accusations because you made a ridiculous decision and have to cover yourself for it. No one policy lynches people they consider to be VIs, much less without a consensus and particularly when they admit they find that person to be town!

How is eagerness to live a scum quality? Its the goal of all factions to stay alive, by the very concept of the game that's a null-tell.

[themanhimself]

The ridiculous decision was passing the bomb to me after everyone had mass-claimed you idiot

[themanhimself]

Youre the one who bombed someone you found to be town. I passed it to you because you said I was town right before that and I thought surely even scum wouldn't bomb someone

they just admitted was town

.

[themanhimself]

Yeah, well, it's game over for me anyway so 'bah', go town. I'll keep reading the thread but my vote isn't leaving benmage