Secret Society Mafia - Game Over

[Wraith]

Yeah yeah, what's up. /confirm

[Wraith]

Sup dawgs

Vote: David Xanatos

Because he is always plotting something devious.

[Wraith]

I'm kind of sick right now. Sorry if I don't post much in the next couple of days.

[Wraith]

I'm sympathizing with Otolia here because until this post:

Vote Ludi

Too many posts I don't like, spamming, strangeness.

There really hasn't been much to go on. The Baby Spice case is good though, especially because the posted quoted here is a serious vote made for randomvote reasons, which is not justifiable.

Unvote Vote: Baby Spice

[Wraith]

Sorry I've been falling behind guys, I have a lot of obligations on and off-site.

[Wraith]

I'm going to declare

V/LA

until Fall Break, which is next weekend. Hopefully by then I'll be out of another game or something, and I promise I'll catch back up.

[Wraith]

Okay, sometime this weekend I will do a full reread. Minus my own modding this game will be my first priority.

[Wraith]

Back in this game, bitches. Here are my steam-of-reading notes:

End of Page 5

-I can see the logic of the IceGuy wagon early on. Policy lynching is not that great in general
-Attacks against TheJakalope early on were rather meh and kind of smells like a chainsaw revving to me
-I think I later made it clear that Baby Spice's first post was ew, especially since it wasn't really a randomvote
-Elaborating on BS: she elaborates that ML was spamming and denying that he was spamming; however spamming is really not that bad, especially early game. It's fluff you want to watch out for.
-I don't know why Muffin suggests a cult in a non-bastard game. Cults are a bastard mechanic and besides I'm pretty sure the Secret Societies are neighborhoods
-Don't really understand ML's sudden switch over to StefanB
-I do agree with Alabaska that scum do not get into early squabbles. It's bad for business in that it draws early attention down on you.
-Self-voting in RVS is a null-tell and should not contribute to someone's scumreads
-I still don't understand why BS is pushing the spamming case on Ludi

FoS: Baby Spice

End of Page 10

-Yos had it spot on in the first post of page 6. To me BS comes off in her pushing Ludiwagon as somewhat fluffy - trying to push a wagon for BS reasons and appearing to scumhunt (c wut i did thar)
-Seeing Post 128 by BBmolla made me feel uneasy so I checked his ISO; lo and behold his 8-10 posts are almost all one-liners. Really smells like fluff/active lurking to me.
-In fact, I'm going to elaborate a little why I really don't like BBmolla at this point:

VOTE: Muffin

For being in like every game with me.

RVS. Okay...

Muffin are you scum?

Out of the blue and pretty stupid. It also appears to follow on to a RANDOMVOTE. A number of people, like Ludi, Dry-Fit, and Maxous, question the point of such a question. BBmolla's next post is:

Still waiting for Muffin's response.

Why? What could you have possibly gotten out of that question? "Yes"? Not long after:

Well you're in a bit of a dilemma if you can't participate until I answer you, because that just makes me not want to answer whatever question you asked.

Then don't.

My whole point in asking was to see your reaction, however, I also managed to get a lot of responses from others as well which I find to be interesting.

What the hell sort of question is that?

I don't get the point of this

BBmolla needs to step it up or he's gonna feel my wrath.

I don't like either Dry or Ludi's responses to a question that wasn't even directed towards them. Maxous was simply looking for intention, while Dry/Magister's response was simply to bring attention to it and act as if me asking that was the most absurd and unreasonable thing ever said, which I find odd. Why were your responses so aggressive?

He attacks Ludi, Maxous, and Dry-Fit for questioning the point of a stupid question. Reeks to me of trying to seem like he's scumhunting. Back to your normal programming:

-BS reappears to address Yos's accusations. Something I want to know: Why is spamming bad? What constitutes "spamming"? Why not "fluff-posting"?
-The back-and-forth between BS and Yos continues. I disagree with BS: "spamming" does not hide things. Abundance of posting either gives more information or it is completely useless. Not in-between.
-I haven't liked the back-and-forth between MoI and Ludi. Reading at this point I believe both were/are town and MoI's flip confirms the former.
-Peregrine's Post 162 rubs me the wrong way. It's like he was out of the loop and suddenly reappeared to buddy MoI, voting DX basically because "he self-voted also MoI thinks he's scum" when MoI had pretty let that ship sail and gone after ML. Smells like fluff/buddying to me.
-I can however understand Peregrine's skepticism on the BS-wagon, considering how fast it did gain steam. Nevertheless I feel he's only selectively quoting part of the Yos's case he wants to address, not all of it. He missed the main point in the midst of the ad hominem.
-Post 181 by sorgster is very bad. Considering how his earlier 3 posts had been just as long and descriptive makes me think he's trying to pull the same thing as Peregrine: slipping onto the bandwagon behind a strong, obvtown player. He also go on the same line as Baby Spice, saying that ML's posts are "fluffy" when in fact they have been much more proactive than his own.
-Elaborating, the short exchange between ML and sorgster definitely puts me more on ML's side. I think he had it spot on.
-Bogre's first post is hideous as well, even though it's on a wagon I agree with.
-Apparently GW claimed Miller in Post 200. Considering pressure had started to come down on him in the previous page I really, really question this claim.

Why didn't you claim immediately if this were true?

Okay I need to catch up.

FoS BBmolla

for reasons above,

FoS: PeregrineV

for gut reasons,

FoS: sorgster

for bad wagoning.

FoS: Bogre

for even worse wagoning.

FoS GW

for a very clumsy, late Miller claim.

-GW should have claimed Miller immediately, but at least it wasn't after a cop guilty.
-I do like GW's catch-up post in 232.
-At this point in my reading I can't understand why IceGuy got lynched. Sure he's lurking and meh but there were better options.
-I have a problem with BS's return in 242. She says that Ludi misrepped her by defining spamming "differently" from her. Yet I fail to see the difference between:

Multiple one liner posts and outright fluff posts

assuming you mean "spamming" to be posting without content

Here's my definition of "fluff": Posting in such a way to appear to be contributing content while not actually contributing content at all. Alternatively, appearing to be active while not actually contributing.

-Up to this point I was pretty much ignoring Otolia but by 245 I'm really starting to sympathize with MoI. Up to page 5 or so I was also kind of meh about this game with nothing happening but by this point (page 10) there is plenty to talk about. You're just not making the effort.
-248 is really, really bad. I think Otolia is town (IMO scum would not admit to being useless and lurky) but you are not acting like a townie should. I also think Otolia is not a PR.

Anyways I'm going to break here and continue soon.

[Wraith]

End of Page 15

-I am not a fan of sageamagoo's opening post. MoI especially was obvtown at this point. Even though her view of BS is understandable if it had been that alone I wouldn't have a problem. But she is actually taking BS's side.
-At this point I feel there are three major factions pushing lynches: BS, ML/Yos, and MoI. ML/Yos and BS are pushing wagons on each other and MoI has become distracted by Otolia's lurking/bad play.
-sorgster's vote on Otolia is horrible. He jumps from the Ludiwagon to the Otoliawagon effortlessly and without more reason than "MoI calls for more votes"
-Ghostlin is little better but he actually outlines his dislike for Otolia acting anti-town.
-This rapidly-forming Otolia wagon does not feel right to me.
-I am baffled by Muffin's IceGuy vote in 275. It comes out of nowhere and noone appears to call him on it
-IceGuy actually has a pretty good point about StefanB. If we look at the Magister Ludi and Otolia similarly I think we'll find similar correlation between certain players.
-I disagree with GW's 288. As opposed to other lurky players (BBMOLLA COMES TO MIND) IceGuy is actually making some good points in his limited posting.
-At this point even I can see that the IceGuy wagon was BLATANTLY scum-driven.

Why did Muffin vote IceGuy out of the blue? Why did no one call him on it?

While GW's attack on IceGuy was the catalyst for the wagon I am feeling very uneasy about Muffin's earlier, unjustified vote.
-

FoS: TheJakalope

for this post, specifically:

Muffin has had plenty of explanation, and it was quite enough for me.

This is wrong on so many levels. I personally did a quick re-skim of Muffin's ISO up to the point of his vote on IceGuy. Muffin originally called IceGuy scum early on, presumably for his rather bad vote in RVS. Nevertheless, Muffin FAILS TO EXPLAIN WHY HE BELIEVES THIS. Furthermore he continues to call IceGuy scum in subsequent posts but continually FAILS TO EXPLAIN WHY HE HOLDS SUCH VIEWS.

FoS: Muffin

as well.

-Lo and behold StefanB jumps from the Otolia wagon to the IceGuy wagon. I wonder, did IceGuy have a point?
-At this point this town is full of sheep. Sorgster, StefanB, TheJakalope, Ghostlin, EtherealCookie. I could go on if I took more time to re-read every single votecount. Some, as said, are townsheep, others are opportunistic scum.
-sageamagoo quotes a MASSIVE WoT to say three lines of text in response. Then jumps onto the IceGuy wagon, who wasn't the subject of the massive WoT she quoted.
-

BBMOLLA APPEARS AFTER ABOUT 9 PAGES OF LURKING TO VOTE FOR ICEGUY

His justification? "This is wagon I can get behind. Also I need to reread the topic." DING DING DING WEEYOO WEEYOO
-Dry-Fit appears to be behind the times and joins the Otolia wagon 3 pages too late.
-I might agree that Stefan's votes alone look very bad compared to his ISO but it baffles me that Yos doesn't see the IceGuy wagon as terrible. I thought he had more sense.
-At this point, MoI, ML, and DY are obvtown. Yos is leaning town.
-Holy crap IceGuy saw the same thing as me in regards to BBMolla. WHY DID WE LYNCH THIS GUY AGAIN?
-ROFL at TheJakalope's 361. Both flipped town, neither were scum. HOWEVER, something does not feel right about that to me. I have a gut feeling that says scum are trying to frame TheJakalope, despite his scummy-as-shit ISO.

Vote: BBmolla

This is quite obviously the best lynch for me at this point. I haven't even reached the end of D1 and I'm starting to get a clearer picture of the situation. Taking another break, this is actually quite tiring.

[Wraith]

Vote: Jackalope

This will be the lynch for today. He is just making blunt statements that sometimes do not even make sense.

I disagree. My gut still tells me that he is being framed. Besides there are better lynches at this point. Like BBmolla.

[Wraith]

Ghostlin, if you vigged EC then why wasn't there a second scumkill?

[Wraith]

Specifically, the post where he said "Out of EC and IceGuy, one is scum, but not both." Both flipped town, which is why the EC nightkill smelled like framing to me. Now that Ghostlin claimed it as a vigkill I'm not so sure. Still I'd rather lynch BBmolla than Jakalope at this point.

[Wraith]

Busy schedule today but I'll say this real quick:

Lynch Priorities (For Me)

BBmolla
sorgster
Baby Spice
TheJakalope

Possibly subject to change. Also why are people voting DX? Lurking?

[Wraith]

I really feel like town is putting priority on "lynch all lurkers because they are lurking" over "lynch all scum who happen to be lurking." I don't think Alabaska is scum. I was out of the loop all of D1 but a "lynch all lurkers" wagon didn't form on me.

[Wraith]

The fact that DX had suspicion on MoI is null. While scum don't kill their suspects, MoI has a reputation as a strong town player, and was obvtown. Therefore, null.

As for IceGuy's lynching, isn't there a role whose vote decreases the amount of votes required to lynch the target it's voting on? Either that or a double-secret doublevoter.

Hang on, you actually have a point about the nature of a double-scumteam game. I suppose MoI could plausibly have been killed for that reason.

[Wraith]

Wraith: I vote for Alabaska for besides lurking beeing on a dead wagon and fosing but not voting. He was besides you (and you were VLA) the only one still on BabySpice the time of the lynching. It feels strange.
Why do you feel the need to point that out now and exspecially about Alabaska when he isn't the first lurker voted today? (not even the first one to get 2 votes)
Why do you feel the need to defend him and not others?
On your lynchlist are lurkers!!
The role your are searching for is called hated townie, and I am quite sure, if that were in his rolePM IceGuy would have claimed.

Maxous: If we have a doublevoter, which I at the moment think makes more sense than the scumpower to make someone a hated townie (to far of), there is no proof that it was David. The votecount doesn't show the extravote and Davids that's L-1, does look at last normal enough. For everythink we know everone on the waggon could have been the doublevoter, it wouldn't show. Am I missing somethink here?

There were some town-feeling posts from Alabaska early in D1. I believe I noted one or two in my notes. And like I said, I try to go for "scum who happen to be lurking" over "lurkers who are lurking." In this case, BBmolla and sorgster in particular lurk for long periods of time and reappear when the next big wagon starts, usually just jumping on without bothering to explain why. I find wagoning such as BBmolla's "sup guys just gonna vote for this wagon cuz it's good. also i haven't read the thread" especially egregious.

[Wraith]

QUICK QUESTION

MY SHIFT KEY SUDDENLY STARTED FUNCTIONING AS CTRL THIS MORNING FOR SOME DAMN REASON AND NOW I CAN'T USE PUNCTUATION, AND AM TOO LAZY TO SHIFT CAPS ON AND OFF OVER AND OVER

ANYONE KNOW HOW TO FIX THIS

[Wraith]

So now the space and caps lock key on my desktop keyboard are malfunctioning too so I'm guessing it's completely fucked.

Anyways DY is probably town. Scum likely would have pushed a wagon on me solely for the "LOL WRAITH LURKED DAY 1" but DY seems like he's actually put some thought into why I am scum.

[Wraith]

@BBmolla: he's insignificant atm.

@whisper: It came off as defending before anyone was attacking

@Otolia: So your to say if I read the next 5 pages, you would suddenly be obvtown?

Insignificant? Have you thought that

that is exactly the way scum want to be seen by the town?

[Wraith]

@BBmolla: he's insignificant atm.

@whisper: It came off as defending before anyone was attacking

@Otolia: So your to say if I read the next 5 pages, you would suddenly be obvtown?

Insignificant? Have you thought that

that is exactly the way scum want to be seen by the town?

Wait, totally misread that post.

[Wraith]

I'm really not feeling scum!Dry-Fit, to be honest. Yeah he's heavily lurking and some of his attacks on people don't look too good in hindsight, but if he was scum why did he avoid the easily-excused IceGuy wagon? Easy mislynch, and easy to just say "oh well he WAS scummy at the time. Why are you looking at me instead of all the others who were on that wagon?" If we're going to lynch a lurky player today then I'd much rather it be someone who wagoned onto IceGuy, and wagoned badly, because I feel that's a much better chance of hitting scum. Candidates in that category: TheJakalope, StefanB, sageamagoo, BBmolla, DX (not necessarily in that order)

And as for an Otolia-wagon, of course it won't go anywhere. I really disagree with MoI's crusade against Otolia for apathy, because

being apathetic and then outright admitting you are being apathetic is bad play, especially as scum

. Yeah, Otolia is playing really, really badly, but he's badtown, not badscum. I strongly feel that scum would not have admitted to "yeah guys, I just don't feel like doing anything in this game, I'm just going to sit here and do nothing." It's also a reason I believe Otolia is just VT.

[Wraith]

@Stefan: I kind of lumped everyone I thought had a bad excuse for wagoning IceGuy into that post. The lurky players are specifically TheJakalope, BBmolla, and DX.

Like I've said I'm also open to lynching sorgster but he wasn't on the IceGuy wagon.

[Wraith]

Ok since my vote is rotting on Sorgster and no one believes he is scum. UNVOTE:

I'll make my vote later tonight. probably going to be Jakalope. Never fulfilled my request for his activity and then places the most convenient vote ever on DF. Wisth both Sorgster and Jakalope on DF makes me nervous about his wagon >_>

Are you reading? I very much believe sorgster is scum. It's just that I think BBmolla is scum more.

[Wraith]

Then you can tell me why DF is town.

Um, no, point is that you were saying that OS was presuming Dry-Fit is town, which is not the case, and if you actually read what OS wrote, you'd see this.

What exactly is your read on Jak?

You are not reading.

I looked back over Alabaska's ISO and realized I was giving him too much credit for a single post. You were right in that half his ISO is "I'm actually here, not lurking!" just before lurking some more.

However I can't understand how you can hold a scumread on Alabaska while not having one on Jakalope. Jakalope might have posted more but his ISO is not much worse.

[Wraith]

However I can't understand how you can hold a scumread on Alabaska while not having one on Jakalope. Jakalope might have posted more but his ISO is not much worse.

How would you respond to the notion that Alabaska probably knows better, whereas theJak appears to be a VI?

I haven't played with either, I think, so I wouldn't know.

[Wraith]

@Ghost: I'd be willing to lynch Jak today. I was about to switch my vote when DF jumped over here with me. I suppose I COULD get on with an Alabaska lynch too, but I'd really rather lynch one of my other suspects.

@Fonz: Honestly? Possibly, but right now I'm more willing to bet on scum.

[Wraith]

@Ghost: Misread that. Honestly I'm not feeling a Dry-Fit lynch today. If he doesn't improve sure, but there are better lynches IMO.

However, I'm starting to feel like I'm becoming fixated on a particular type of player, that being the "lurky scum" type. I think it would be a stretch for BBmolla, Alabaska, and Jak to ALL be scum, but I feel strongly that 2 are scum, and certain that 1 is.

[Wraith]

So after Toasty, we have Alabaska doing walls of the past. Great !

@PeregrineV

: What are your conclusions on the 'votecount' you did ? Do you see patterns or anything valuable ? If not, was it useful at all ?

I think we are heading in a wall right now. Neither Dry-Fit nor TheJakalope are defending themselves actively. For me it means that they are not town PR because those are most likely feeling the burden of responsibility (particularly for newer players), so it leaves us with them being scum or VT. Since we can't agree on one of them, I suggest switching all our votes on somebody else (like sorgster for example) at once. Remember that the day is dawning soon.

If one of these wagons flips scum I know where my vote will be next.

Your logic is silly. We have 10 people not on either of the leading wagons.

If it nears deadline and we're still in deadlock, we'll just make them choose one of the wagons.

With that being said, I would be willing to switch to sorgster if needed. I'd prefer Dry-Fit though.

Really don't like this post. Otolia's logic may be a little...meh, but I see where such an opinion would come from, and that's definitely not a reason to lynch him. And I, for one, am not going to be pressured onto a wagon I don't support (though I would support the Jak wagon if deadline came to deadline)

I also really don't like Dry-Fit's last post. He attacks:

-Yos: him having a scumread on Yos reeks of OMGUS. Yos is one of my stronger townreads and I don't think anyone really has a scumread on him
-Otolia: who has come under fire for his apathy and recently for other reasons
-Alabaska: under siege for extreme lurking and general scumminess

My sensors indicate intense deposits of self-preservation

[Wraith]

@Ghost: I'm still very much turned off from an Otolia-lynch. The original fire got started because he came out and said "I really don't care about this game right now" which is really something I don't feel scum would do, ever. The fact that he continued to go "Meh, whatever. Seriously, I don't care right now" even as the fire grew helped him in my eyes. Scum try to avoid attention and fire at all costs, not throw wood on it.

[Wraith]

Also, there are probably some people here who are only looking for one scumteam instead of two. There is a reason for that.

Personally I don't care which scumteam is which until I get a damn scumflip. So I'm just looking for "scum"

[Wraith]

This is my first game with multiple scums and I lurk because it would be easiest for scum to be active and keep killing each other leaving for an easy town victory.

...

Ok, what?

Scum are probably going to lurk, to hope to not be noticed by either the town OR by the other scumteam, in order to avoid lynches AND nightkills. The "active scum" strategy, which basically involves a scum being really visible and trying to look really pro-town, is more risky in a game where there's another scum group killing anyone who looks really pro-town, so scum are probably going to try to fly under the radar for the most part. Town are going to be more active, because they need to actually find and lynch scum in order to win.

You look more like lurker-scum then like town so far. I still don't even really know if you've really read the entire game.

Also, there are probably some people here who are only looking for one scumteam instead of two. There is a reason for that.

Ok; if you think that someone is scum who's only looking for one scumteam because he already knows who the other one is, I could see that being a plausable scumtell; not a very strong one, perhaps, but I could at least see where you're coming from. Who do you think is doing that, exactly?

I was under the impression that scum wanted to kill the other scumteam and then take over. Not sure who is doing that. I've been mostly skimming this thread.

Dude, nobody is looking for TWO DIFFERENT scumteams because we haven't had any SCUMFLIPS to work with. Right now they're ALL scum to town and it doesn't matter which one we lynch at this point.

[Wraith]

Okay, I have not payed proper attention to this before for some reason.
BB molla - how is Jackolope being framed?
I don't see any explanation for that at all. You said you agreed with the theory...what theory?

@Wraith: Sorgster means people on one scumteam are only going to be hunting the other scumteam etc. so you can catch the guys by seeing if they are only focusing on that etc.

Yeah, I understand that. But what's stupid is that he's trying to apply it to "certain" people in the game when EVERYONE in the game is doing it.

[Wraith]

What are your reads on the following:
TheJakalope
TheFonz
Yosarian2
David Xanatos

Framed town, obvious scapegoat.
Probable town.
Town.
Null leaning scum

In a game with 2 scum teams, why do you think there was only one (non-vig) kill last night?

Stop role fishing.

How is that rolefishing?

[Wraith]

[quote="In

In a game with 2 scum teams, why do you think there was only one (non-vig) kill last night?

Stop role fishing.

How is that rolefishing?

How can I answer this without it pertaining to roles? Why would I know anything, and even if I did, how would I say so without outing my role?

It's rolefishing.

Dude, if you really have a PR you just outed yourself FOR NO REASON. Peregrine was asking you "yo why do you think this happened" not "BBMOLLA YOU ROLEBLOCK SOMEONE?"

Seriously, you have no idea how much that came out of left field.

Pedit: Holy Alabaska is going a little crazy. And to respond - it's not WIFOM unless you're debating/promoting either side. I strongly believe that scum would avoid doing such things, and scum that do are just bad, and therefore few and far between.

[Wraith]

Holy shit. I'm on page 32. sorgster's #768 is the funniest fucking thing I've ever read.

I ignored that post because I simply couldn't understand what it said. It didn't sound like a complete sentence the first 4 times I read it.

I read it a 5th time and fell out of my chair.

[Wraith]

I actually disagree with this entirely--it is still rolefishing, just not rolefishing on Ghosty in particular. The obv answer to your parenthetical question is that there is a confirmed doc in the setup, so what point is there to Wraith asking that exact question from a pro-town standpoint? Wraith should still be on your radar.

Well if you noticed Ghostlin replied to my post saying "MoI probably Doc'd a target" and that's pretty much what I assumed happened.

[Wraith]

No, I assumed that's what happened because he suggested it, and it was a sensible conclusion

[Wraith]

Peregrine what did I claim. I'm still waiting for an answer.

What are you trying to do here? I really don't understand.

Peregrine and myself, at least, believe you softclaimed a PR. That doesn't mean we know exactly what you softclaimed. So if you yourself know that you never hardclaimed or even softclaimed a

specific

role then why are you asking? Because Peregrine avoiding an unanswerable question isn't scummy, and it seems to me that you are trying to make it so.

[Wraith]

Peregrine what did I claim. I'm still waiting for an answer.

What are you trying to do here? I really don't understand.

Peregrine and myself, at least, believe you softclaimed a PR. That doesn't mean we know exactly what you softclaimed. So if you yourself know that you never hardclaimed or even softclaimed a

specific

role then why are you asking? Because Peregrine avoiding an unanswerable question isn't scummy, and it seems to me that you are trying to make it so.

No. Peregrine said I claimed. So me "softclaiming" makes me a good lynch target?

I'm not gonna say anything more. It was rolefishing and still is.

Softclaiming as town was bad. Softclaiming as scum would be in an attempt to not get lynched.

I am voting you because
1. Your part of one of the groups in 741.
2. Unnecessary softclaim in 789.

Now, unless a bunch of people ISO you are find you scummy in the next two days, you probably won't be lynched.
But, I find you scummy enough for now to keep my vote on you.

refusing to speculate≠softclaim. i think you are missing an "if" in that post. the way it is worded, at least to my interpretation, is him saying that

if

he had a role, revealing any knowledge of why the nightkill didn't occur would be tantamount to claiming, which even you agree would have been a bad idea.

I think you and I (and Peregrine?) have a different way of viewing "refusal to speculate." If someone asked me that question (I would have answered but) and I didn't want to speculate, then I would have said "I don't know dude. Can't speculate without tons of WIFOM." But BBmolla immediately jumped to the conclusion that he was "rolefishing" instead. Why did he think that? You tell me.

[Wraith]

Vote: BBmolla

Not surprised about the Jak flip, but now I'm mad at myself for not having him higher up on the lynch-list.

Anyways still drunk.

[Wraith]

Well, your posts today pretty much amount to:

"I'm in a mason group that confirms me not being a werewolf"

Whoopty-doo. Doesn't mean anything.

"Dry-Fit case is good, but other people have established it well enough that anything I might actually contribute would be redundant"

Perfect! An excuse to continue not contributing!

"Well I know I'm not a werewolf, but there's no guarantee about members not being scum"

Aw, you took the words right out of my mouth.

So basically, this is why you are still a good lynch for today:

-You got roleblocked and there was only one kill
-You being in a secret society does not confirm you as town, and in fact makes it very possible you are scum because I wouldn't be surprised if there was a scum mason in your original group
-You continue to not really do anything useful, in fact making excuses as to why you don't have to do anything useful while supporting an easy bandwagon
-Your defense basically amounts to "yo bros im a mason MUST BE CONFIRMED trololol!" and "y u no read posts bro?"

I mean, it's like you're hanging yourself with the scrap of rope you've been given.

[Wraith]

Prod-dodge. Had a crazy weekend. Have to catch up today or tomorrow.

[Wraith]

I still think sorgster is undeniably, horribly, really really scummy. I want him lynched. But there's always tomorrow if we have a CC.

[Wraith]

To be quite honest, atm I don't think Max is scum.

Think about it logically guys, how many of you had a legit town read on me? Why would a scum roleblocker block me over someone much townier?

That doesn't make much sense.

I said I doubted the roleblock at first and have reasoning, but now it's possible but I have no way of knowing.

VOTE: David X

In my opinion, this is a better lynch guys. I think me and Max are both town.

The bolded is actually a valid point.

[Wraith]

I don't much care about Max when I still have my top two, already-established scum reads to worry about.

[Wraith]

To be quite honest, atm I don't think Max is scum.

Think about it logically guys, how many of you had a legit town read on me? Why would a scum roleblocker block me over someone much townier?

That doesn't make much sense.

I said I doubted the roleblock at first and have reasoning, but now it's possible but I have no way of knowing.

VOTE: David X

In my opinion, this is a better lynch guys. I think me and Max are both town.

Not really...I had a null and might of not blocked him. You're presuming that there's only two kinds of reads in this world: town and scum.

The bolded is actually a valid point.

You appear to have added an extra line to my quoted post. Mistake in quotes?

[Wraith]

Fonz seems to have a fascinating habit of taking the words out of my mouth.

[Wraith]

As much as I still want a fullclaim out of BBM (I still think he's scummy) I'm not going to get one. That and his activity due to being almost lynched has actually been better than his play on both previous days. So for now

Unvote Vote: Sorgster

My second-highest scumread. It's as if the town is actually listening to me for once!

[Wraith]

I claim vanilla townie.

Why can't an otholia or bogre wagon get started? Also,I doubt I'm the only one who isn't posting much.

Because the Otolia-wagon was for pretty bad reasons and Bogre is just lurking, which is typical Bogre (although I'll turn my attention to him soon).

My scumdar is overheating, here.

[Wraith]

Vote: sorgster

He is still worth a lynch. The only reason I didn't immediately join the Max wagon was because I wasn't on between the result claim and the lynch. I think sorgster is part of the other scumteam.

As for TheFonz, lynching him for "ignoring the Max wagon" is terrible reasoning. In a one-scumteam game that could be a lynchable offense, but in two-scumteam there can be competing wagons that are both scum. I believe this was the case. I myself pretty much "ignored" the Max wagon the whole day, but only because I was after BBmolla and sorgster. Now that BB has satisfactorily proven his innocence to me, I'm going after just sorgster today, unless some result changes my mind.

Predit: That's sound reasoning on PeregrineV I think. Though I think DF is a viable lynch today I still think sorgster is better.

[Wraith]

Otolia has been apathetic, not anti-town. I strongly believe scum won't run around shouting "I REALLY DON'T CARE ABOUT THIS GAME I'M DELIBERATELY NOT READING"

[Wraith]

Sorry I've been absent, I should probably start declaring V/LAs as weekends come up. I have some homework to catch up on first and I'll get to the 3 or so pages I've missed/skimmed later if I can. If not today then it'll probably have to wait until Sunday.

[Wraith]

Seriously, can someone explain how that post of DX's could in any way be interpreted as showing insider knowledge? It completely escapes me.

1. It doesn't. I think GW is trying to say that DX knew Max was a roleblocker before he claimed, despite that post coming after Maxous was outed.

2. David actually does have insider knowledge, because he has been revealed as part of a secret society already.

3. I don't know why GW is trying to portray David as Maxous's buddy, because that's simply not possible. David is confirmed not-wolf.

What does strike me as insider knowledge is this pair of posts:

Who did you roleblock last night, and (given that there was only one kill), why didn't you reveal it immediately?

And you revealed this...why?
Seriously.

I roleblocked BBmolla.
And yeah, it slightly increased my suspicion, but it's not as if there are'nt any other numerous reasons a kill would of been prevented.
It was nothing worth claiming for.

I might be missing the context here, but judging by the reaction from Maxous he didn't say anything about being a roleblocker before TT outed him.

FoS: ToastyToast

[Wraith]

@Stefan: Insider knowledge doesn't necessarily mean scumbuddy.

[Wraith]

Geez, I guess I didn't think that through enough, because y'all are right.

[Wraith]

Who did you roleblock last night, and (given that there was only one kill), why didn't you reveal it immediately?

And you revealed this...why?
Seriously.

I roleblocked BBmolla.
And yeah, it slightly increased my suspicion, but it's not as if there are'nt any other numerous reasons a kill would of been prevented.
It was nothing worth claiming for.

This was quoted by wraith a few posts ago. Showed toasty knew maxous was a roleblocker before maxous claimed. I can't see any other reason than scumbuddies for this.

Well that's wrong and I was wrong. Stefan pointed out this: Why would Toasty out his own scumbuddy for no reason after he'd already lost another D1? Answer: He wouldn't. So unless TT is a scum investigative role for the Mafia Team, he's definitely not wolf, at least.

[Wraith]

Who did you roleblock last night, and (given that there was only one kill), why didn't you reveal it immediately?

And you revealed this...why?
Seriously.

I roleblocked BBmolla.
And yeah, it slightly increased my suspicion, but it's not as if there are'nt any other numerous reasons a kill would of been prevented.
It was nothing worth claiming for.

This was quoted by wraith a few posts ago. Showed toasty knew maxous was a roleblocker before maxous claimed. I can't see any other reason than scumbuddies for this.

Uh Sorgster, Toasty claimed a role known as follower (Voyeur in mafiadiscusion), that's not exactly new. So my former post for it not beeing likly that they are scumpartners.

Ah, that was the context I overlooked. Totally forgot about his claim.

[Wraith]

@TT: No, I was paying attention yesterday because I remember people talking about a Voyeur, but I just totally forgot it was your claim.

[Wraith]

Actually, strike the above. What the fuck did I even do yesterday? If I'd seen your claim for realz I probably would have been on Max like that *snaps fingers*

My head hurts now.

[Wraith]

Wow, Wraith, your latest series of posts are pretty bad. If I read you correctly, you forgot that Toasty claimed his role?

How many claims have there been in the game total? How many yesterday?

Why was Max lynched? How did the wagon on him first form?

In hindsight I had crazy tunnel vision yesterday, and either ignored a lot of "chaff" or forgot about it.

I thought the Max-wagon had formed basically from the ole "dude's scummy cuz posting" reasoning. And he was lynched because GW revealed he was confirmed werewolf.

[Wraith]

@Peregrine: Man I just deleted what just typed out because it was stupid. Basically my defense here is "I had tunnel vision" which is more a problem than a defense. So can we leave it at that?

Oh, and GW=Town, sorgster=Scum, Oversoul=OnTheFence

[Wraith]

He's been so lurky that even I am considering jumping onto this lurkerlynch.

[Wraith]

Unvote Vote: Dry-Fit

This for me is scumminess vs lurkiness, and I'll take scumminess over the latter today.

[Wraith]

Hey, Dry-Fit:

1. This setup contains both Mafia and Werewolves.
a. They have daytalk.

[Wraith]

Unvote Vote: DX

Damn it, I hate when it comes down to this.

[Wraith]

Vote: sorgster

I'd really, really, really like to see this scumbag hang today, please.

[Wraith]

I'm no longer completely convinced BBMolla is scum. Despite this I don't think he should survive until endgame. HOWEVER, BBmolla is not the lynch for today, it should either be Dry-Fit or sorgster. While both are acceptable to me, I prefer the latter.

[Wraith]

I'm starting to get mad. Sorgster has been narrowly dodging being lynched for 4 days now.

[Wraith]

The counter wagons on me have had 2 scum flips so that's good.

You mean DX and Dry-Fit? Because we all know those turned out well.