Mini 455 - Mafia in Theoville - Game Over who won?

[YogurtBandit]

I figured you would say that, but you were at lynch -3 . I didn't perceive that you were close to being lynched, nor did anyone ask for a claim.

Yes, but I felt you were going overboard with your cop claim.

OK, now we're getting somewhere. What do you mean by this? Can you give examples? Do you still feel the same way? Why or why not?

Ah!Alot of questions

I mean that you were getting cocky and sarcastic. Like you said "Oh all the doc protection is mine" and stuff. I dont feel the same, because When I claimed, you opened up more and then etc etc and it lead to two cops.

[YagamiLight]

I claimed because there was a bandwagon on me.

You say here that you claimed on prupose, but on page 7 post 159 you say...

Well, I was planning on claiming later, but I guess I kind of did.<snip>

I'm surprised no one else noticed this, given that he is changeing his story from saying, "well I didn't really mean to tell you guys that," to, "yeah, I did that because of the band wagon on me."

[Adel]

Good catch!

How did of a contradiction do you think it is?

I think it lends more weight to the earlier theory (and I can't remember who the credit goes to for this- Guardian?) that YB made a fake-claim to confuse the doctor and draw protection off of Guardian. Lies are harder to keep track of than truth.

I'm not convinced just by this yet.

Can I make a suggestion, and get a fair hearing for it? Can we all brainstorm the best case against YB? I'm not proposing a bandwagon, just a cooperative collection of the evidence against him? I've never voted for him, nor have I been very suspicious of him, but I have could easily missed something more damning. Is there anything else?

If there isn't, then that one contradiction of his isn't much worse than my "do something scummy" line.

[Adel]

How

did

much

of a contradiction do you think it is?

[YogurtBandit]

Good catch!

How did of a contradiction do you think it is?

I think it lends more weight to the earlier theory (and I can't remember who the credit goes to for this- Guardian?) that YB made a fake-claim to confuse the doctor and draw protection off of Guardian. Lies are harder to keep track of than truth.

I'm not convinced just by this yet.

Can I make a suggestion, and get a fair hearing for it? Can we all brainstorm the best case against YB? I'm not proposing a bandwagon, just a cooperative collection of the evidence against him? I've never voted for him, nor have I been very suspicious of him, but I have could easily missed something more damning. Is there anything else?

If there isn't, then that one contradiction of his isn't much worse than my "do something scummy" line.

Oh how nice, Adel is congratulating her Scum Buddy. Ithink you two are scum. You can bet my investigation is going to be on you. Think. Just think.

YL- that is not what I said. I said that at first I didnt mean to claim, I meant to destroy Guardians claim, but It turned into a claim.

[Guardian]

YL, thank goodness you posted

after

YB! I noticed this contradiction - my question was leading in such a way to see if

YB

would notice the contradiction - and he didn't! He then went on to answer another round of my questions presupposed by the contradiction. I am not sure to what extent this is scummy, but you are most right I did catch him in a contradiction there.

Now I know how MeMe felt when she asked Nekka about a post restriction and I outed it; YB posted just in time for YL to not out that I was trying to get him to contradict what he had said earlier even more.

Adel, I could actually get behind brainstorming a case on YB. He has been fluffposting a lot, seemed like he was considering counter claiming and then a few pages/days later actually did so, and I am still dubious as to whether there are two cops in the game. He even admitted (again thank goodness before YL posted) that he was annoyed that I was going to draw doc protection for the night. I officially

FoS: YogurtBandit

.

[YagamiLight]

So I'm scum for pointing out a contradiction? which you did again here...

Good catch!

How did of a contradiction do you think it is?

I think it lends more weight to the earlier theory (and I can't remember who the credit goes to for this- Guardian?) that YB made a fake-claim to confuse the doctor and draw protection off of Guardian. Lies are harder to keep track of than truth.

I'm not convinced just by this yet.

Can I make a suggestion, and get a fair hearing for it? Can we all brainstorm the best case against YB? I'm not proposing a bandwagon, just a cooperative collection of the evidence against him? I've never voted for him, nor have I been very suspicious of him, but I have could easily missed something more damning. Is there anything else?

If there isn't, then that one contradiction of his isn't much worse than my "do something scummy" line.

Oh how nice, Adel is congratulating her Scum Buddy. Ithink you two are scum. You can bet my investigation is going to be on you. Think. Just think.

YL- that is not what I said.

I said that at first I didnt mean to claim, I meant to destroy Guardians claim, but It turned into a claim

.

You once again state you didn't claim on purpose in my emphasis there, while a couple posts ago you said

I claimed because there was a bandwagon on me.

Which indicates you did it on purpose. Now it seems like you can't decide which it was.

[Adel]

The overreaction is more damning to me than the contradiction.

FoS:YogurtBandit

It is what you said. He quoted you fairly.

I mess up my words and end up with something people understand to mean something other than what I intended on a regular basis. That is life, and the risks you run by posting.

Now I'm going to take a deep breath and take a long look at YB's posts in context in thread.

[DogMom]

So, you basically confirm that the only reason you find him scummy is for lurking. You don't really care about any of his actions, you are just trying to look useful by calling out a lurker. You say as much in that post. You, in fact, have no reason other than him not posting as much as everyone else to think he is scummy.

Nope. I've stated it. I think he's scummy for watching the thread, constantly by his own admission, and supposedly having nothing to say. Ever. After 13-14 pages of stuff, I'd have expected him to have something to say, but he doesn't.
I find that suspicious. I also find it very suspicious that he doesn't say much, no posts at all, except to say how very very suspicious Nanook is, then all of a sudden he pops in to change his vote. The part I don't care about isn't "any of his actions" - it's the fact that he's very very happy with Nanook, has no interest whatsoever in actually contributing to the thread / game, even though he supposedly is constantly following it, then pops in to change his vote, with virtually no input. Then he disappeared again.
Should he start posting useful content, I'll unvote him, simple as that.

You

definitely

are squirming, even though I am the only one being actively suspicious of you. Why is that? Also, when you crossed out that NanoS had voted for your scum partners, what did you mean by that? Has he not yet voted for your scum partners?

You

definitely

are reaching. At least you're getting more subtle about putting words in peoples' mouths. What did I mean by crossing out the last bit? I meant "disregard this part of the sentence". I have no scum partners, so it'd be impossible for him to vote for any.

Look, at this point this is, as far as I can tell, two townies shouting at each other and kicking a lot of dust for nothing. I think it's getting distracting and it's adding to the noise in the thread, and isn't being at all helpful to town.

[Adel]

Look, at this point this is, as far as I can tell, two townies shouting at each other and kicking a lot of dust for nothing. I think it's getting distracting and it's adding to the noise in the thread, and isn't being at all helpful to town.

Yep, so keep it down you two.

[Streeflo]

You

definitely

are reaching.

Guardian seems to have a habit of that. It happened 3 times in this thread alone. > >

[DogMom]

I claimed because there was a bandwagon on me.

You say here that you claimed on prupose, but on page 7 post 159 you say...

Well, I was planning on claiming later, but I guess I kind of did.<snip>

I'm surprised no one else noticed this, given that he is changeing his story from saying, "well I didn't really mean to tell you guys that," to, "yeah, I did that because of the band wagon on me."

Iiiinnnnnnteresting. Interesting, indeed.

Back to the thread, to look over YB's posts, with this in mind. I think Adel has a good suggestion - reviewing the thread, but not necessarily bandwagoning him.

Hm. His first 5 posts are random-vote followed by 4 fluff posts.

I don't like his interaction with ChaosOmega re: Nekka-Lucifer. A second vote on someone on page 1 is hardly a "bandwagon", and then removes his vote on N-L (who had 2 votes) to place a vote on ChaosOmega (bringing him to 2 votes). He says his "had a reason". Not much of one.

He spends some time trying to make "voting without a reason" into a scumtell.
He says, after Adel's vote-diagram-thingy that the votes all "look like noise". So...if they look like noise, why was CO's vote for N-L so significant?
He asks for a "summary of the day". I still don't like that.

He later on set up the possibility for 2 Cops / 2 Docs. Hm...I dunno. He could easily have been paving the way for his cop-claim here, removing peoples' suspicion of him when he did claim.
A contradiction:
Post 121, he says that "Guardian never claimed cop". Yet, in his Very next post, he says Guardian

must be scum for

claiming cop so early!

So which is it - did he claim cop or did he NOT claim cop???

Next he says he believes Guardian is - no, wait, I'll give you his exact words, because this is inherently contradictory and I want y'all to have the contradiction straight from him:

Im investigating someone else, some one I think is Scummy.I do think you are, but I also think you are Cop

I checked the Wiki, on the "Cop" role. There's nothing in there that indicates that COP can also be SCUM.
Then comes the other contradictory post, saying he claimed because there was a bandwagon on him. No, he didn't. He soft-claimed...sorta...but didn't intend to...but maybe he did...
And fercryinoutloud, claiming at Lynch-3?

In sum:
Problems / contradictions I've found with YB's posts:
1) He doesn't like ChaosOmega putting a second vote on someone, yet he turns around and does it.
2) Says that Guardian never claimed cop, then says in his next post that Guardian claimed cop.
3) Says he thinks Guardian is scum, but also that Guardian is Cop.
4) He initially says he didn't intend to claim, but later says he actually DID intend to claim because he had a bandwagon on him.

Don't like it. I don't like it at all. And all this contradiction makes me want to vote YOU more than Nano"no, really, I'm ALWAYS reading the thread but I'm not finding anything really important enough to comment on"sauromo, so

unvote: Nanosauromo

FoS: YogurtBandit

(FoS-not-vote because of Adel's request. I don't want this to turn into a mindless bandwagon, I want to wait and think about it.)

[DogMom]

Look, at this point this is, as far as I can tell, two townies shouting at each other and kicking a lot of dust for nothing. I think it's getting distracting and it's adding to the noise in the thread, and isn't being at all helpful to town.

Yep, so keep it down you two.

You

definitely

are reaching.

Guardian seems to have a habit of that. It happened 3 times in this thread alone. > >

So I've noticed.

[Erotomachia]

I noticed that theopor_COD thanked Kelly Chen for "checking the setup." That made me think that it's perhaps not such a simple setup. So I think two cops are certainly a possibility. That's why for now I trust both Guardian and YogurtBandit.

YogurtBandit has certainly behaved strangely, but I think he may have just made some mistakes out of confusion and uncertainty.

[Erotomachia]

Can I make a suggestion, and get a fair hearing for it? Can we all brainstorm the best case against YB?

What? Why should we all focus on him? This seems like a very strange suggestion.

I'm not too impressed with the "case" against YogurtBandit. With comments like these, it looks like an exaggeration:

I checked the Wiki, on the "Cop" role. There's nothing in there that indicates that COP can also be SCUM.

I think you're taking the quote far too literally and trying to put words into his mouth.

Still waiting to hear from Nanosauromo.

[Erotomachia]

I'm sorry, the second quote is by DogMom, not Adel.

[Nanosauromo]

EBWODP: Arg, bloody quote tags!

then pops in to change his vote, with virtually no input.

Okay, I'll explain my actions then.

In the beginning, Nanookthewolf simply seemed scummy because he voted along with Gaurdian, following Gaurdian's "logic" but not explaining what this "logic" was. For a while, he seemed like the scummiest guy around, and thus I kept my vote on him.

But then Adel came along. His catch-22 of "Do something scummy or I will be forced to think you are scum." tipped off my scum detector. He now seemed more scummy than Nanook. He was now my prime candidate for a lynch. His pressuring of people to vote quickly reinforced my belief.

With that said, Theo, can we get a vote count?

yeh sure, give me ten mins. I deleted your previous duplicated post

[theopor_COD]

Votecount 7.

Adel 2 - Nanosauromo, ChaosOmega
Nanosauromo 2 - MeMe, Erotomachia
ChaosOmega 2 - Adel, Guardian

Not voting the rest.
Deadline 1 week and 9 hours or so.

[Streeflo]

I noticed that theopor_COD thanked Kelly Chen for "checking the setup."

That made me think that it's perhaps not such a simple setup. So I think two cops are certainly a possibility.

That's why for now I trust both Guardian and YogurtBandit.

YogurtBandit has certainly behaved strangely, but I think he may have just made some mistakes out of confusion and uncertainty.

Outguessing mod. BAADD!!

I checked the Wiki, on the "Cop" role. There's nothing in there that indicates that COP can also be SCUM.

I think you're taking the quote far too literally and trying to put words into his mouth.

Some of your points are valid DogMom, for example claiming while at L-3 and the multiple contradictions. However, it looks to me like what Erotomachia said, confusion and uncertainty. I don't like this contradiction though, it looks like he was trying to get a point across and was misunderstood. Something you can understand because of Guardian's suspicion on you, right?

[YagamiLight]

It seems to me that he got overly defensive on my pointing out the contradiction, immediatly saying thatI must be scum for it. The thing is, it is more than a simple mistake going from saying you did not mean to claim to saying you claimed because of a bandwagon.

[YagamiLight]

ebwodp
in short I just want to hear his explanation for the contradiction now.

[DogMom]

I noticed that theopor_COD thanked Kelly Chen for "checking the setup."

That made me think that it's perhaps not such a simple setup. So I think two cops are certainly a possibility.

That's why for now I trust both Guardian and YogurtBandit.

YogurtBandit has certainly behaved strangely, but I think he may have just made some mistakes out of confusion and uncertainty.

Outguessing mod. BAADD!!

I checked the Wiki, on the "Cop" role. There's nothing in there that indicates that COP can also be SCUM.

I think you're taking the quote far too literally and trying to put words into his mouth.

Some of your points are valid DogMom, for example claiming while at L-3 and the multiple contradictions. However, it looks to me like what Erotomachia said, confusion and uncertainty. I don't like this contradiction though, it looks like he was trying to get a point across and was misunderstood. Something you can understand because of Guardian's suspicion on you, right?

Oh, absolutely I can, which is another reason I haven't voted him. He very well could've been trying to get a point across, and was misunderstood. I'm waiting to see what he has to say about all of it.

He really could be confused and uncertain, just like the rest of us. I just don't like the

pattern

- but then again, if he IS a cop, then I'd obviously rather keep him around.

[DogMom]

EBWODP: Arg, bloody quote tags!

then pops in to change his vote, with virtually no input.

Okay, I'll explain my actions then.

In the beginning, Nanookthewolf simply seemed scummy because he voted along with Gaurdian, following Gaurdian's "logic" but not explaining what this "logic" was. For a while, he seemed like the scummiest guy around, and thus I kept my vote on him.

But then Adel came along. His catch-22 of "Do something scummy or I will be forced to think you are scum." tipped off my scum detector. He now seemed more scummy than Nanook. He was now my prime candidate for a lynch. His pressuring of people to vote quickly reinforced my belief.

With that said, Theo, can we get a vote count?

yeh sure, give me ten mins. I deleted your previous duplicated post

Thank you muchly!

So...what do you think of YogurtBandit / Guardian / etc. ?

[Nanosauromo]

Gaurdian's leaning towards scum, due to the scummy Nanook following his lead. I'm not familiar with breadcrumbing, but it seems like he started doing it way too early.

As for Yogurt (one of my favorite words, BTW), I haven't formed a clear opinion on him yet.

[Adel]

Nanook: Would you be willing to weigh in on all of this? We haven't heard much from you other than the cop stuff.

Nanook?

Are you out there?