Newbie 476: Slow, slow, slow, then FAST and over. Damn.

[MeMe]

The "About 20.5 hours to deadline"

Vote Count

Holy

(2):

mith, lionden_56

havok95

(1):

jmar

Korlash

(1):

Sir Tornado

lionden_56

(1):

Holy

not voting

(2):

havok95, Korlash

Four votes are necessary prior to deadline -- three'll do

at

deadline.

[lionden_56]

Guys, we're almost out of time here.
Quick, someone do something suspicious so we can bandwagon you... :-p

Seriously, though...a stalemate really doesn't help the town here.

[Korlash]

Ok fine... if you want me to make a vote fine.

Vote: Korlash

His apparent unwillingness to vote clearly shows he is scum because we all know that killing a towny day one is sooo much better then a no lynch! Admit it scum!

I really, really don't like this. What you think you read and what you actually read are very different, and those differences are vitally important to a game such as this.

Ok... Don't get me wrong... but what you think you read and what you read should be the exact same thing. Maybe what you think the person meant and what he/she actually meant are two different things. That is why you ask them what the hell they meant!

I just do not get what your trying to say here Lionden. I honestly do not understand you. Can you explain this to me? See, I think I just read something that made no sense followed by a vote. So in my mind, you seem like your trying to push Holy's death with no support. So I am asking you to clarify it. I do not assume you are scum for this, I assume there is a misunderstanding which I want cleared up.

And that is my biggest reason for not lynching/voting Holy. As far I see it. You all have been hounding her for mistakes. (Which is good) then she gives her excuse/reasons for it. (Also good) then you... what? say her reasons are not good enough? Say they are bad reasons? What? Show me why you think she SHOULD BE lynched. I have not seen (that I can remember off hand) one solid piece of evidence you three have made against her. Why should I make a list of not lynching reasons. You should be making me a list of reasons to lynch!

Now, as for a lynch whatever. There is more then enough of you people who disagree with me that my vote is not needed.

Unvote:

If you can come to a reasonable candidate amongst yourselves, please by all means vote them, lynch them, whatever. But don't come crying to me if it bites us in the ass.

Also what is the point in just voting somebody? how does that change anything at all? Give me one good reason why I have to have a vote? does it benefit town to have a meaningless vote on a random person? No. Does it help us in our lynch candidate? no. Does it give you more info come tomorrow? no. If you can convince me I am wrong here before the deadline I will place vote. If not, my no vote stays.

[lionden_56]

What I meant with "please don't discuss this" is: please don't discuss about what actually I thought I read at that time because the

essence

is not that far from the actual text, that's all, yet...we still discussing it ;.;

I don't like it because of the above quote. She tried to pass off an extremely sketchy line by giving an even sketchier answer. The "essence" of it wasn't that different? Mafia is played as a game of absolutes. If you quote something out of context, you're instantly pegged as scummy. So how does completely mis-stating something and then saying "well, the 'essence' was close enough" somehow get around that? Especially after saying "oh, please don't talk about my misquotation."

If just feels like she's trying to hide.

[Holy]

Quick, someone do something suspicious so we can bandwagon you... :-p

This unnecessary comment only make me feel more firmed with my vote.

A good townie, always demand more discussion for his/her sureness of someone scummy-ness, but lionden_56 showed a way too eager lynch, he seems doesn't care at all if you might be lynching an innocent townie. He really not actually put an effort in finding scum.

[lionden_56]

no one can take a joke anymore...

[Korlash]

Wow... The first time I read Holy's thing I think I understood it completely differently. Now i cannot even remember what I thought it meant. Man... I still do not see that as a lynch material evidence. (Mainly because if I cannot figure out what she actually said then... I cannot figure out the degree of scuminess it may or may not imply. ><)

and @ Holy: I have tried many many times to explain how my feelings on a matter has changed and tell the players "Do not quote me on this for I do not feel that way any more!" Yet they always quote me and use it as an attack... *sigh* It is best to simply say "My feelings have changed!" and leave it at that...

Lionden I have to ask you, do you have more reasons or is it mainly that one quote? If so can you at least post a few of your other reasons. I would appreciate being able to take this with other things you have seen so I can better see your point. All this talk about appeasement really makes me want to try and come up with a likely candidate come deadline... just so you guys are happy... ><'

[Korlash]

Quick, someone do something suspicious so we can bandwagon you... :-p

yeah that was a joke Holy. He does not actually mean for it to happen. Besides the unlikeliness of anyone doing anything scummy now seems... well unlikely...

[Holy]

The "essence" of it wasn't that different? Mafia is played as a game of absolutes. If you quote something out of context, you're instantly pegged as scummy. So how does completely mis-stating something and then saying "well, the 'essence' was close enough" somehow get around that? Especially after saying "oh, please don't talk about my misquotation."

If just feels like she's trying to hide.

The essence is> I've read that you're stating your suspects. What I thought you're also saying is, you would give more thoughts about it soon.
Is that so hard to understand my failure??? You just want to make this become more complicated...

[Holy]

no one can take a joke anymore...

Hehehe, it's because of the deadline... :p

[Holy]

Lionden I have to ask you, do you have more reasons or is it mainly that one quote? If so can you at least post a few of your other reasons. I would appreciate being able to take this with other things you have seen so I can better see your point.

@Korlash: It seems sometimes you could wording it better than me, I already ask and ask to him over and over again for that^ - I just feel something doesn't right about him, he already FOS me before that one quote case with not really clear reasons, he just said he didn't bought it (if I'm not mistake).

Oh, my chatting here to you, I hope that won't drag you along with me.

All this talk about appeasement really makes me want to try and come up with a likely candidate come deadline... just so you guys are happy... ><'

I believe you won't do that just to make someone happy... If you do that, it means at least you feel that person is your best bet, even if it was me.

[Korlash]

So far i have seen nothing vote worthy from you Holy. I can see these guy's few tiny points yes, but it still does not constitute a lynch, and this is why i specifically hate deadlines! they force us to make rash decisions we would other wise not do, like lynching for unlcear or slightly insufficient reasons.

[mith]

Korlash, you're strawmanning my position like mad. I just woke up, and I don't feel in a ranty mood, so I will just say:

Right now, Holy has

two freaking votes

. There are two others besides you with one. If you think either of those players are more suspicious than Holy, then it would be in your interest to vote for them, if you are innocent.

(On the other hand, if you are, say, scum with Holy, or if you are scum with someone else, know she's innocent, and want to play the "Don't come crying to me" game - close relative to the "I told you so" game - then your play here makes perfect sense.)

More on Holy after breakfast. Was going to post more last night, but I took a Benadryl and fell asleep. Doh.

[mith]

Right. Holy.

My problem with your post (138) is

not

that you're unsure. That's just a fact of Mafia.

My problem is the

inconsistency

(I'll emphasize that word again, because it's the key one) between your

reasons

and your

impressions of alignment

. Either on their own would be fine - there's nothing wrong with saying "Well, him I find more scummy, him and him I find more townie, and these three could be either", and there's nothing wrong with saying "Well, you lot have made good posts, you lot have made neutral or not-very-many posts, and you're a confusing WIFOM fiend" - but together, in your post, the two just don't add up.

I simply don't feel you have given that much thought into who the scum are - and that the minor inconsistencies and contradictions point to this - while attempting to give the impression of being a helpful innocent, and so I think you are scum yourself.

I am fairly confident that at least one of Holy and Korlash is scum. Maybe both. And once again I am stuck with a conflict between my brain (screaming that Korlash is scummy has hell in his last few postS) and my heart/gut/whatever (still saying that Holy is scum). I'm sticking with the latter this time (and I must admit, it's mostly because in my experience, me changing my mind at the last minute is a terrible idea).

I should be on for at least the next few hours, so if there are any developments, I'll take them into account.

[Sir Tornado]

There are, apparantly, only 6 more hours to deadline, and I'd prefer some lynch to no lynch today, so, I will

unvote

and

vote Holy

.

I still think Korlash is more scummier than Holy. His self vote increases my conviction in his scumminess. It seemed to me, that he is merely trying to play for a no lynch. His attempts to stall a Holy lynch make him look much worse in my eyes.

If someone votes Korlash before the deadline, I will switch my vote to him if I am online and if it will get him lynched.

[Holy]

Right. Holy.

My problem with your post (138) is

not

that you're unsure. That's just a fact of Mafia.

My problem is the

inconsistency

(I'll emphasize that word again, because it's the key one) between your

reasons

and your

impressions of alignment

. Either on their own would be fine - there's nothing wrong with saying "Well, him I find more scummy, him and him I find more townie, and these three could be either", and there's nothing wrong with saying "Well, you lot have made good posts, you lot have made neutral or not-very-many posts, and you're a confusing WIFOM fiend" - but together, in your post, the two just don't add up.

Don't add up then. Inconsistency => Unsureness => it's an OR.
I'm sorry mith...^^^

Where's jmar's hammer...

[jmar]

I don't have a lot of time to post, and I want to get in before the deadline, so I'm just gonna do what I said I was gonna do before.

Unvote, Vote: Holy

. I'm late for class, so sorry I can't post full reasons and everything but it's pretty much the same as what I've said already.

[Korlash]

2 things, well 3,
A) "Korlash, you're strawmanning my position like mad." I never even mentioned your name in the last page. How can I be strwmanning (need to look that one up i think) you in anyway. I am not trying to destroy your case here, I am merely asking you to tell me what your case is. How can i strawman your position if I have no idea what it is?

2) "If someone votes Korlash before the deadline, I will switch my vote to him if I am online and if it will get him lynched."

It will put me at two votes moron, not enough for a lynch. Dur...

and next) "Right now, Holy has two freaking votes. There are two others besides you with one. If you think either of those players are more suspicious than Holy, then it would be in your interest to vote for them, if you are innocent. "

Have you not been listening to my "I don't think anyone has enough evidence to blah blah blah..."? It's not just Holy I am against lynching right now. Stop pushing so hard for me to vote, you clearly see your going to get your damn lynch without me.

And I know that no matter what the outcome may be, you guys are going to hold this against me so i will make it very clear now. I am not pushing for a no lynch. All my statements on not lynching is only to state my reason for not voting, and why I do not feel like a vote right now is "needed" by me. I have said numerous times that if you all agree that a lynch is best all the more to you. Yes I am against a lynch because of the deadline, but I also understand the importance of lynching someone. I just personally feel Holy is not the best choice here. and seeing as how I only have 6 hours to convince you otherwise I guess it's not going to happen...

So... Going against everything I believe in, because you all insist it will make a difference... which it wont... My pick for best lynch today woudl be either Jmar, or Sir Torny. But seeing as how neither of them have a vote, I suppose I am still not doing what you said to. Oh well,

Vote: Jmar

At least Mith was kind enough to explain his reasons for voting Holy. I know I only asked last night so this is kinda an ass attack of me but I do not feel your in any danger of being lynched so I could care less. granted if in some way you end up being killed I will probably shoot myself in the he-... um... foot... but I see it as too unlikely.

Happy now Mith? theres my F***ing vote...

[mith]

That was hammer, so I'll save my comments for tomorrow. Sweet dreams, all.

[Korlash]

wow... nevermind... I really need to preview the new posts before I hit submit...

Now I do feel like an ass... Well I am sorry for my attitude in the above post but you have to realize I do not think Holy was the best candidate for our lynch today. But I am kinda happy you guys chose to actual lynch instead of deadline kill. So no matter how you look at it you guys did what I asked so I support your decision. I hope you guys are right.

And yeah... What Mith said...

[MeMe]

Vote Count

Holy

(4):

mith, lionden_56, Sir Tornado, jmar

lionden_56

(1):

Holy

not voting

(2):

havok95, Korlash

Holy

's dead. She was a

Townie

.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Night choices are due by

11:15 a.m. Monday, October 29

. If they come in earlier, the thread can open earlier.

[MeMe]

Everyone mourn

Dr. mith

. Alright, that's enough. Avenge him!

Five alive means three to lynch.

[Korlash]

;_; not Mith...

I think i should say a few words...

I hardly knew him... But I knew he was a kinda nice guy who was always there when it was possible to be. I learned much from his expertise. How to talk good, spel Rigt, and even to post useful stuff...

We will all miss you.... Sniff... DAMN YOU MAFIA!

Ok who gets his stuff? I want the CD player!!!

Seriously... Does that mean Mith was the Doc? That kinda makes this suck worse... *cries*

[lionden_56]

talk about nothing going right for us...remember guys, we're at Lylo, so be extremely careful with your votes.

[Korlash]

>.>
<.<
Pssst... Lionden... are you sure we can trust these guys? They are kinda creepy don't you think... Sir Tornado kinda reminds me of PC back on MDV... Well a little bit PC a little Syphon...

So... Now that yesterday is all cleared up time to move on... try to get on with our lives... hang Jmar... Get cake... =P

seriously I don't know where to go from here... I am inclined to believe Havok is town simply because he did not vote. Then again he could have known Holy was town and did not want to be in on her lynch... The same can be said about me... so because I am town I kinda assume he is too...

So in my view two out of you three who voted Holy are the scum... But because of the deadline everything is topsy turvy... ;_; did I mention my hate of deadlines?

Also why Mith? I mean wasn't he a bit too... whats the word... Obvious? I would think the mafia would have wanted to use him as a scapegoat/avoid the doctor protection... ehh... this means a dang reread doesn't it? crap...