Open 42 - Friends and Enemies - (Game Over) before 495

[Simenon]

Mod Edit: Vote Count

No current votes. 4 to lynch.

It's stupid because:

1. It makes you look like a non-mason, which is a bad thing because it lowers the chances for the other mason to go free
2. There's no reason to doubt my claim unless you are a mason and I'm not in your mason group.

Unless you can provide a reason that makes sense, no you should not be questioning my claim out loud.

[Phate]

Your claim? The only thing you've claimed is town. And I'm saying that since you've been wrong twice in a row, it's possible that you're scum. How that means I look like a nonmason and simultaneously implies that I'm a mason and you're a nonmason is beyond me.

[Simenon]

The only thing you've claimed is town

Read my first post.

[Phate]

Ah. Completely missed that. I maintain, though - you could be scum, claiming mason. We don't get any more mislynches.

[Simenon]

I know that.

But how does that refute post 400?

[Phate]

As I understand it, you told me that noting your possible scummitude was stupid because it either made me look like a nonmason or like I was subtly counterclaiming.

My comment was intended to convince the town to try lynching ChaosOmega instead of Lemming. Mentioning the fact that you've been wrong twice in a row now and that we have no more free mislynches helps support my point.

But at any rate, would you support a CO lynch? And while we're here, where IS CO? He should post soon.

[Simenon]

and there always is the possibility that you're scum distracting us so you can kill us all tonight.

A mason wouldn't say this. Therefore, it opens the possibility that you are a townie and not a mason.

If everybody but the mason said this, then we'd be screwed to an extent.

See my point?

[Phate]

I do see your point.

But that's WIFOM. If I were a Mason and you weren't, I might say it to cast doubt on your masonry, or I might not and just press a case against you, knowing you're scum and counterclaiming only when necessary. If I were Mafia, I might say it to cast doubt on your masonry by impersonating a mason and implying you were scum, or I might not because that's what the town would expect me to do. If I were town, I might say it because I didn't think of all the possible consequences and I missed the line where you claimed mason, or I might not because I did and I didn't.

I need a second opinion. I keep bouncing back and forth between "Oh, awesome, he wants to help me" and "He's scum lulling me into a false sense of security." What does someone else think?

[Simenon]

That's silly. Comments like "I keep bouncing back and forth between 'oh, awesome, he wants to help me' and 'he's scum lulling me into a false sense of security" would not be necessary if you were a mason. And I sincerely hope you would be smart enough to counter claim in this position (if I wasn't a mason of course).

[Simenon]

WIFOM comments like "huh, i wonder if you are scum" would not be necessary either.

[ChaosOmega]

And while we're here, where IS CO? He should post soon.

FOS: Phate

While I agree that everybody posting is a good thing, there are 3 other people in addition to me who haven't posted yet in day 3. Any reason why you're asking only me?

[Shanba]

methinks it's cause he thinks you're scum.

[Phate]

Shanbathinks correctly. FoS me all you like - you're only reinforcing my opinion.

Simenon, I do see your point, and I'd like to discuss it further with you after the game.

[ChaosOmega]

You have to think at least 1 other person who hasn't posted yet is scum. Seeing as you're so sure I'm scum, you should want the people who you are more on the fence about to start posting as well.

[Phate]

And I merely made an offhand comment that you hadn't posted. I didn't make a calculated statement, a la "ChaosOmega needs to post, and no one else does. Furthermore, his lack of posting is scummy while no one else's is." I just said "Where is CO, anyway? He needs to post."

Odd that you always seem to misinterpret my words in the most suspicious way possible.

Vote: ChaosOmega

[Simenon]

*waves hi*

Nobody else has posted yet, and you are willing to make a lylo vote?

[Phate]

Unvote

Thank you, I missed that. I'm mixed up with another game I'm playing in where there are only two scum.

HoS ChaosOmega

[Lemming1607]

hey all sorry for not contributing much. I work 16 hour days all weekend and won't be able to contribute much until sunday.

At this point I think it's silly not to believe Simenon is a mason, especially with no counter claim. I also agree a mass roleclaim is silly, since all it will do is out the other mason, assuming the scum say vanilla townie as well.

Anyways, Simenon is correct, we are at lylo and need to be careful with votes. 2 masons, 2 townies, and 3 scum left.

I will post again probably sunday. Sorry guys but I got debt to pay

[Samruc]

Since we're at LyLo, I would roleclaim if I was a Mason at this point

We will be at LyLo for the rest of the game, but that still doesn't make me think masons should claim unless they need to.

***

Ok, so we have one claimed mason, who I will not counterclaim. I know I'm not scum, and I feel pretty sure that Per is not scum. Out of the remaining four, three has to be scum. I'm leaning towards Lemming and CO, and not sure about Shanba and Phate.

I know we are at LyLo, so I won't place a vote yet, but if I do it will probably be for Lemming. I guess

HoS: Lemming

. Especially for his hammer, putting Sammich at L-1, and also for this quote:

Any argument based on what scum do is WIFOM honestly, because then you have people like Sammich who come out and accuse people.

This looks very much like a scum-slip to me - first he talks about what scum do, and then gives Sammich as a contradicting example, unconsciously using his knowledge(?) that Sammich is town...

[Simenon]

Lemming has voted Sammich since september 23rd. The only time he has shifted his vote was to "end the long ass" day one (voting crub). In fact, excluding random votes, he has only voted protown players (including myself here). His interactions with Sammich were rather bitter in nature.

Samruc has also consistently voted Sammich. This comment:

Phate, if you really want that discussion with Lemming now, I'll give it a few days, but I'm gonna put Sammich back where he belongs if we start getting nowhere.

continues to spook me. I also think his jump off of Sammich, while perhaps reasonable, perhaps is indicative of a scum.

I simply cannot read Shanba. His posts are incredibly elusive, his voting record hard to comprehend. I want him to clarify who he suspects right now.

Chaos is hard to read. He has only posted nine times in 47 days. His bolded suspicion indicators include SirT, Crub, and Phate. At first his suspicions seem incohesive, but then you see it's because he barely posts. I'm not sure where to place him right now.

Per has posted thirteen times in the last 62 days. He votes and foses lemming, sir t, crub and... that's all for the next 27 days.

Per, Samruc, and Lemming are the players I have down as scum. The fact that Samruc is suddenly inclined to lynching Lemming and Lemming not expressing suspicion on anybody is a good indicator that we need to lynch one of them today.

[Phate]

I would rather a CO lynch, but if we can't get that, I'd settle for a Lemming lynch. I could be wrong, but my intuition tells me that Per's lurking has nothing to do with being scum.

CO feels slimy. I'm surprised you have him as neutral and Per as scum.

On the other hand, after trying to fit the puzzle pieces together a la logic puzzle, I'm having the last scum come down to Per or Samruc, and I don't think it's Samruc.

Those who haven't posted yet need to.

[Shanba]

I simply cannot read Shanba. His posts are incredibly elusive, his voting record hard to comprehend. I want him to clarify who he suspects right now.

Sammich. No, I'm only partly joking. I'm findng it very difficult to move to a worldview where he isn't scum.

However, I ave thought about it, and if you forced me to pick I would choose phate and Samruc as my townie (still just about would pick Phate despite his somewhat erratic play today). That leaves Lemming, CO and Per. Not sure which of those I suspect most, though - and samruc is nearly with them down there. I'd have to reread if you want anything more coherent.

[Phate]

Mod: Prod Per, please/

Mod Edit: Done.

[Simenon]

Here are the records in full from the Mafia Distillery. I'll interpret what they mean later.

Also note Jex voted Lemming last.

per votes jex in post 14
per unvotes in post 105
per votes lemming fos sir t in post 105
per suspects sir t in post 105
per unvotes in post 262
per votes crub in post 263

lemming1607 votes samruc in post 7
lemming1607 unvotes in post 44
lemming1607 votes shanba in post 44
lemming1607 unvotes in post 53
lemming1607 votes crub in post 77
lemming1607 unvotes in post 89
lemming1607 votes yogurtbandit in post 96
lemming1607 unvotes in post 143
lemming1607 votes simenon in post 164
lemming1607 unvotes in post 230
lemming1607 votes sammich in post 230
lemming1607 unvotes in post 265
lemming1607 votes crub in post 265
lemming1607 suspects sammich in post 290
lemming1607 votes sammich in post 354

shanba votes polter in post 10
shanba unvotes in post 31
shanba votes emptyger in post 31
shanba unvotes in post 37
shanba votes dairy milk product guy in post 37
shanba unvotes in post 65
shanba votes sirt in post 65
shanba unvotes in post 67
shanba votes yb in post 67
shanba unvotes in post 98
shanba unvotes in post 98
shanba votes lemming in post 98
shanba unvotes in post 101
shanba votes srt in post 101
shanba unvotes in post 217
shanba votes sammich in post 217
shanba unvotes in post 246
shanba votes alsleet in post 246
shanba unvotes in post 251
shanba votes sammich in post 251
shanba unvotes in post 256
shanba votes crub in post 256
shanba votes sammich in post 289

chaosomega unvotes in post 139
chaosomega votes crub in post 139
chaosomega suspects sir tornado in post 139
chaosomega unvotes in post 207
chaosomega votes samruc in post 207
chaosomega unvotes in post 254
chaosomega votes crub in post 254
chaosomega votes alsleet in post 304
chaosomega suspects phate in post 410

phate votes sammich in post 383
phate votes chaosomega in post 414
phate unvotes in post 416

samruc votes emptyger in post 8
samruc unvotes in post 12
samruc votes simenon in post 12
samruc suspects lemming1607 in post 19
samruc suspects shanba in post 54
samruc unvotes in post 88
samruc votes yogurtbandit in post 88
samruc unvotes in post 136
samruc suspects crub in post 136
samruc votes sammich in post 210
samruc votes sammich in post 285
samruc unvotes in post 358
samruc suspects lemming in post 418
phate suspects chaosomega in post 416

simenon votes yogurtbandit in post 6
simenon unvotes in post 11
simenon votes samruc in post 11
simenon unvotes in post 42
simenon votes yogurt in post 42
simenon unvotes in post 76
simenon votes count in post 76
simenon votes sanba in post 76
simenon unvotes in post 84
simenon votes yogurtbandit in post 84
simenon unvotes in post 104
simenon votes sirt in post 104
simenon unvotes in post 146
simenon votes crub in post 146
simenon votes sammich in post 269
simenon unvotes in post 321
simenon votes alsleet in post 321
simenon unvotes in post 339
simenon votes sammich in post 339

[Samruc]

Sim, what happened between these posts?

Which leaves it out of 4. I'm leaning Samruc or Per to be the final townie.

No, it leaves it out of five. Silly me. That means two confirmed. A combination of Samruc/Per/Phate sounds pretty good to me.

And now:

Per, Samruc, and Lemming are the players I have down as scum.

The first ones implies a way different scum-team (Shanba, Lemming and CO)...